"Philosophy"

[noodlehair]

I want this word banned from all football related speak forever.

What does this actually mean in football management terms?

I know in the eyes of the internet football artistry experts and various stuck up managers, it's all about a manager's prefered style of play, beliefs, ambitions, tactical nouse, etc...whatever. If you're not being a pretentious gimp though this could just be covered by the term "tactics" or even "management", couldn't it?

It just seems to me to be a word Van Gaal and others (but especially Van Gaal) use as a kind of excuse word. So they can be stubborn idiots about things and it somehow not be their fault when it repeatedly doesn't work.

For example, Van Gaal picks 3-5-2...a formation that doesn't suit his team or allow them to play well, but because the philosophy and the philosophy can't be wrong, it somehow becomes the players fault for not adapting to the formation like a bunch of supermen, rather than the manager's fault for picking a formation he already KNOWS wont work.

It's not Wenger's fault that his philosophy negates the need for any midfield or defensive discipline, it's the players' fault.

It's a load of shite is what it is. Stupid people playing at being clever, or clever people playing at trying to treat everyone else like they're stupid.

A few years ago you'd never hear anyone say it, then Pep popped up at Barca and now everyone has a philosophy, and everyone's philosophy is the right philosophy, which means everyone must by definition have the same philosophy...which they don't. It's completely ridiculous.

I'm sick of it.

 

[sincher]

I'm more stoic about it personally.

 

[Raoul]

Its just a word used to describe his methodology. Shouldn't bother you.

 

[Ole's_toe_poke]

It's just a word dude.

 

[bosnian_red]

Think Van Gaal just says "philosophy" because it's the easiest way to tie in his whole management style or whatever word you like and probably the first word that came to his mind when trying to translate it over to English, and then since the whole English press keep banging on about it, he's stuck with it. Really don't think there's anything more in it or that Van Gaal is trying to be more clever then everyone or something like that. Just a word though. Would you get pissed off if he said "style" time and time again?

 

[Essaux]

Well, Van Gaal always talks about football in terms like these. I don't see anything wrong with it.

He wants his team to play his brand of football and he calls it his "philosophy".

 

[Essaux]

Think Van Gaal just says "philosophy" because it's the easiest way to tie in his whole management style or whatever word you like and probably the first word that came to his mind when trying to translate it over to English, and then since the whole English press keep banging on about it, he's stuck with it. Really don't think there's anything more in it or that Van Gaal is trying to be more clever then everyone or something like that. Just a word though. Would you get pissed off if he said "style" time and time again?

I also think this is true. Van Gaal's English is still very basic, and he probably thought of the word "philosophy" as a way of explaining his preferred football system etc. I don't think he means anything with it in order to sound "clever" or such things.

 

[2 man midfield]

Noted that Koeman used it too, maybe it's a Dutch thing.

 

[adexkola]

I still have not seen the results of this philosophy.

 

[JPRouve]

Some coaches believe in certain theories, and put together, they are their philosophies.

 

[Raoul]

I still have not seen the results of this philosophy.

We're a third into the season. What results are you looking for ?

 

[bosnian_red]

I still have not seen the results of this philosophy.

Winning, playing youth players and most of the time dominating possession? Despite the fact that we have a crazy amount of injuries all season?

 

[Raw]

I think it's just something Van Gaal says because his English isn't very good so he can't think of a better word to describe his style of management.

 

[adexkola]

We're a third into the season. What results are you looking for ?

I was hoping to see some transformation in the way we play football, not necessarily results. I don't see that yet.

 

[Theonas]

Some managers are very pragmatic in the sense that they treat each game as it comes and deal with it independently (man-marking opponents danger men, playing on the weaknesses of their left back, etc ...). Others focus on developing a style of play that they try to replicate all the time so they want to be dominant and in control. Obviously it's not black and white and one is no better or worse than the other but I fail to see what is there to be offended by there.

 

[Theonas]

I was hoping to see some transformation in the way we play football, not necessarily results. I don't see that yet.

There has been. It has not been consistent and there have been a lot of times when we weren't capable of imposing ourselves enough to show it but when you look at the big picture, it has been 4 months! that's 4 months with a club that has been doing things differently for a gazillion years. It's not outrageous if it takes 1 year or two, let alone 4 months.

 

[Dr Baltar]

The word he uses is filoshifee & he's allowed to use it because he's been a manager for years & years so you'd hope he has some idea of what he thinks is the right way to do things by now (whether or not he's right is a different matter).
The younger managers sound ridiculous saying it but to be fair the main culprit is Brenton & he's a massive wally.

 

[Raoul]

I was hoping to see some transformation in the way we play football, not necessarily results. I don't see that yet.

A transformation would probably require the availability of healthy players, which he hasn't had.

 

[Rado_N]

Think Van Gaal just says "philosophy" because it's the easiest way to tie in his whole management style or whatever word you like and probably the first word that came to his mind when trying to translate it over to English, and then since the whole English press keep banging on about it, he's stuck with it. Really don't think there's anything more in it or that Van Gaal is trying to be more clever then everyone or something like that. Just a word though. Would you get pissed off if he said "style" time and time again?

This is pretty much it in a nutshell.

 

[The Man Himself]

I applaud caf's ability to find something negative out of nothing in anything.

 

[peterstorey]

It's more about weltanschauung.

 

[Raoul]

I applaud caf's ability to find something negative out of nothing in anything.

In fairness its just a small sub section of individuals.

 

[Rado_N]

I applaud caf's ability to find something negative out of nothing in anything.

Noodle could find a downside to winning a 10 week rollover jackpot on the lottery.

 

[The Man Himself]

Noodle could find a downside to winning a 10 week rollover jackpot on the lottery.

In fairness its just a small sub section of individuals.

Yeah overall positivity is returning which is heartening. Except match day threads that is.

 

[JPRouve]

Noodle could find a downside to winning a 10 week rollover jackpot on the lottery.

Gambling or playing with money is a bad habit.

 

[pocco]

The term got used on here a lot last season. Was pretty cringeworthy.

I agree with the OP though. I've said in the past that I think managers hide behind this term and sometimes you get the feeling that when their team plays well, they suddenly pass it off as their 'philosophy'.

 

[Mockney]

I'd be more onside with the term if we seemed to be trying the play the same way from match to match. For example, if the philosophy means "trying to pass the ball a lot" I'd understand if we avoided a formation that maximises the arial and wing play strengths of some of our least technical players.

As we're definitely not avoiding that, I don't really get it.

 

[Raoul]

The term got used on here a lot last season. Was pretty cringeworthy.

I agree with the OP though. I've said in the past that I think managers hide behind this term and sometimes you get the feeling that when their team plays well, they suddenly pass it off as their 'philosophy'.

I don't think Van Gaal is hiding behind anything. He just uses the term to describe his approach to the game and its been completely overanalyzed by fans and pundits.

 

[JPRouve]

I'd be more onside with the term if we seemed to be trying the play the same way from match to match. For example, if the philosophy means "trying to pass the ball a lot" I'd understand if we avoided a formation that maximises the arial and wing play strengths of some of our least technical players.

As we're definitely not avoiding that, I don't really get it.

The weird thing is that normally LVG uses the same 14 players and the same formation but stopped doing that with us.

 

[Dion]

He just uses the term to describe his approach to the game and its been completely overanalyzed by fans and pundits.

This. It should be stickied at the top of the forum really.

 

[Micha]

Think Van Gaal just says "philosophy" because it's the easiest way to tie in his whole management style or whatever word you like and probably the first word that came to his mind when trying to translate it over to English, and then since the whole English press keep banging on about it, he's stuck with it. Really don't think there's anything more in it or that Van Gaal is trying to be more clever then everyone or something like that. Just a word though. Would you get pissed off if he said "style" time and time again?

That is what he means. The word "philosophy" sounds more fancy and attracts more attention and discussion though.

 

[pocco]

I don't think Van Gaal is hiding behind anything. He just uses the term to describe his approach to the game and its been completely overanalyzed by fans and pundits.

But he doesn't describe anything about his approach to the game. He's not given much insight into that at all really.

 

[SteveJ]

It's more about weltanschauung.

 

[pocco]

Plus the basic style and tactics of our game seem to change on a game by game basis.

This might have been someone trying to wind me up, but somebody mentioned an interview of LVGs in which he said he doesn't even fully understand his philosophy himself.

 

[Raoul]

But he doesn't describe anything about his approach to the game. He's not given much insight into that at all really.

He's elaborated on his preferred formation and tactics plenty of times in recent months.

 

[Raoul]

Plus the basic style and tactics of our game seem to change on a game by game basis.

This might have been someone trying to wind me up, but somebody mentioned an interview of LVGs in which he said he doesn't even fully understand his philosophy himself.

That tends to happen during an injury crisis.

 

[pocco]

That tends to happen during an injury crisis.

It's varied in every club he's managed.

 

[Raoul]

It's varied in every club he's managed.

Not sure what that's supposed to imply. We're in 3rd despite being in a major injury crisis where each of the players we bought during the summer have intermittently not been available. That's actually quite an accomplishment when you consider the lack of starting XI options he's had.

 

[Keeps It tidy]

One of my issues with the way "philosophy" is used in Football speak it almost always refer to a club attempting a short passing possession game.

 

[peterstorey]

One of my issues with the way "philosophy" is used in Football speak it almost always refer to a club attempting a short passing possession game.

Well no one's calling 'kick it long son' a philosophy