Poll - What are realistic ambitions next season if we spend 200m?

What is a realistic ambition next season if we spend 200m?


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Pfmpd

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Liverpool spent 186 or so million last summer. Fans from every other club declared we have to win the league.

So I don't understand how people are saying 200m shouldn't mean united have to win the league. Somethings not adding up or it's just double standards.

If United spend 200m, you will have to do as you all pointed out last summer, and win the league.
 

sp_107

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I can't figure out how we are in this situation after spending 700mil in last 6 years, Except Lindelöf, Shaw(Decent) and Pogba from the lot I cant pick anyone else into startingX1
 

Ødegaard

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Liverpool improved massively from one summer of big transfers. Pep did with City too.

Not sure why we suddenly can't.
Liverpool already had a good attack going with a system for transitioning into attacks that took the opponent off guard in place.
They needed someone to solidify their defense and went out and splashed 2 world record fees for players in their position in defense and got a great right-back for cheap at the same time as one of their youngsters came through doing well.
They more or less changed their back 5 with exception of one CB. They have also added more to their midfield and squad-depth in attack.

We could do it, of course. Leicester won it without spending anything, but it isn't something likely to happen.
"Realistic ambition" is in the thread title.
 

dove

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Surely this can't be right? Unless you mean comfortably top 4 but I'm not sure there is such a thing given how tight top 4 is the last few years

I can't believe the expectation after another 200m spent can be anything other than a title challenge
I am being realistic, I don't think spending another £200m will solve all our problems, especially given our transfer record.
 

Bestietom

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On top of the 200million we will also need whatever we rake in from players we need to get rid of. We need 5 players to come in atm. CB, RB, 2 Midfielders and a goalscoring RW. This only to challenge next season.

If however others were to leave we would need more players in. Yes we can promote some youth into the squad but we are seriously short of leaders in this team.
 

Red For Ever

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To have the best team, you don't need the best players in every position, you need a style of play, and the players to suit that style, playing in the right position.

As well as the highly noticeable top players, you need the water carriers, the ones who do a lot of unspectacular, but important work on the pitch, that allows the others
to shine and take the limelight, covering, pulling the opposition out of position, tracking back, being in the right place, all very important, but not so noticeable as those
making things happen, and scoring goals.

Ole has already talked about the right players in the future, the right attitude, right personality, right skills for the position, right age, right fitness.
Create the best team, all of our great teams in the past have had big high profile, top players, combined with hard-working, intelligent, reliable players.
Even personality counts, no matter how good he may be, the wrong personality can do more damage than good to a squad.

SAF, often to the surprise of supporters, never hesitated to get rid of anyone he believed did not suit the team for any reason.
Even high profile players were moved on for reasons he believed did not make the best team.
 

Bestietom

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To have the best team, you don't need the best players in every position, you need a style of play, and the players to suit that style, playing in the right position.

As well as the highly noticeable top players, you need the water carriers, the ones who do a lot of unspectacular, but important work on the pitch, that allows the others
to shine and take the limelight, covering, pulling the opposition out of position, tracking back, being in the right place, all very important, but not so noticeable as those
making things happen, and scoring goals.

Ole has already talked about the right players in the future, the right attitude, right personality, right skills for the position, right age, right fitness.
Create the best team, all of our great teams in the past have had big high profile, top players, combined with hard-working, intelligent, reliable players.
Even personality counts, no matter how good he may be, the wrong personality can do more damage than good to a squad.

SAF, often to the surprise of supporters, never hesitated to get rid of anyone he believed did not suit the team for any reason.
Even high profile players were moved on for reasons he believed did not make the best team.
Agree 100%
 

Roboc7

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Even if we spent 200 or 300m well putting it altogether and competing at level City are at would be very difficult. Next season will be about finishing in the top four and improving.

I expect us to miss out on top 4 this season which will feel like a disappointment but in reality we never should have been in race given position we were in when Ole took over.

If he could get us in top four, clear deadwood and improve the quality of the football that’s progress, expecting more is unrealistic.
 

buckooo1978

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to challenge we'd need to make about 5 signings like the 5.6 million Leicester paid for Kante or the 35 or whatever Liverpool paid for each of their front 3

top 4 for me
 

Infra-red

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I can't figure out how we are in this situation after spending 700mil in last 6 years, Except Lindelöf, Shaw(Decent) and Pogba from the lot I cant pick anyone else into startingX1
This is the nub of the issue. Even if we were to spend £200m this summer (and that's a pretty big 'if'), given the recent success (or lack thereof) of our player recruitment team, most of that money will likely go on players who'll be considering useless deadwood within 2-3 seasons. We are just woefully inept when it comes to squad building.
 

TwoSheds

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Depends who we buy and sell but we should be challenging next season. Anything less would be a failure of either board or management.
 

Eckers99

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It's not how much we spend but how we spend it.
Pretty much sums it up. The £200m, spent wisely, could ensure a title bid the season after (allowing time for players to bed in). Not sure it'd guarantee an immediate return though.
 

Leftback99

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Liverpool spent 186 or so million last summer. Fans from every other club declared we have to win the league.

So I don't understand how people are saying 200m shouldn't mean united have to win the league. Somethings not adding up or it's just double standards.

If United spend 200m, you will have to do as you all pointed out last summer, and win the league.
Maybe 'all those people' were just wrong since most expected City to win the league, just as they will be favourites next season.
 

Kapardin

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Liverpool spent 186 or so million last summer. Fans from every other club declared we have to win the league.

So I don't understand how people are saying 200m shouldn't mean united have to win the league. Somethings not adding up or it's just double standards.

If United spend 200m, you will have to do as you all pointed out last summer, and win the league.
Liverpool added to a good score of players (Firmino, Mane, Salah). Their current position is due to 3 summers of rebuilding since Klopp joined. Whereas, we don't even have such a core to build around apart from Pogba due to summers of bad spending. Likes of Rashford and Martial are not proven goalscorers yet and highly inconsistent as compared to forwards at other clubs.

200 million will get us to where Liverpool were last season I assume (to use their example) but won't make us instant title challengers. Let's first get the basics such as playing style, passing ability, guile in the final third, pressing etc right before aiming for the stars.
 

Relfy

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If we can plug the main holes in the first 11 and get our business done early then we have a chance. We need 3-4 starters to come in as our main business and then add if we can shift a few on. Ideally a CB, RB, RW and CM. Not bothered too much with big names, but more having the right players with the right attitude. I think we need a bit of a mix of youth and experience this window. A lot will depend on where we finish this season.
 
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Title ? :lol:no chance
Top 4 ? possibly.
Europa League spot ? the likeliest outcome.
200 million is not going to fix the team that much in the coming window,especially when every other major club will continue to improve.
 

breakout67

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Title ? :lol:no chance
Top 4 ? possibly.
Europa League spot ? the likeliest outcome.
200 million is not going to fix the team that much in the coming window,especially when every other major club will continue to improve.
We should really be aiming for 4 starters to come in, which will cost more than 200m. I suspect we will massively overpay for 2 starters, then the 'no value in the market' line will be fed to the press to justify not spending on more starters.
 

Josep Dowling

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We need a manager with a plan on how they want to play and formation.

Then look at our current crop of players, decide where we need to strengthen and who can play their system.

Then be given the funds to implement the changes.

I don’t think we have got past point one since Ferguson left.

At the rate we are going Wolves and Everton will overtake us. They at least have some form of direction and spend money in the transfer window.
 

kundalini

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I don't understand why Redcafe is so obsessed with transfer spending.

50% of transfer don't work (detailed research study by Paul Tomkins and a few others, in Pay As You Play book). That figure applies as much to expensive, glamour signings, as it does to value for money transfers.

Since Sir Alex retired, the club has spent a fortune on transfers. This forum (as a whole) was wildly enthusiastic about the signings of: Mata, Sanchez, Schweinsteiger, Di Maria, Falcao, Martial, Shaw, Zlatan, Pogba, Mkhitaryan, Memphis, Matic. The view on the signings of Blind, Herrera, Schneiderlin, Bailly, Lindelof, Rojo, Fred, Dalot was positive, though not as much excitement. I can't recall what the overall opinion of Darmian, Romero or Lukaku was. The only signing that the forum was against was Fellaini.

Some of those signings have been a success, some didn't make much difference, a few were a total flop. But if you look at how many made an impact in year 1, the number of clear successes is very small. Part of the reason for transfers is preparing for the future, rather than immediate contribution.

If you want to figure out what is realistic. Take the number of points we get in the 2nd half of the season, then double it. You can then adjust according to how many players you believe will perform better next season than they did this, and how many are in decline. Also whether Solskjaer's coaching team can resolve long standing issues, such as our build-up play from the back, right-side of the pitch, conceding fewer big chances, and final third creativity.

Currently we have 32 points from 14 games in the 2nd half of the season. If we were to beat Cardiff, Huddersfield and at least one other team, that would take us above 40 points. The team that finishes 3rd this season, will probably have slightly less than 80 points; the only way to beat that total is for a team to win all its remaining fixtures.

Or you could believe that spending £300m will make a big difference, £200m some improvement, £100m no impact at all.
 
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Robbo's Shoulder

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If the £200m is spent the same way money has been spent the last few years then it really won't change much, if however it's spent as part of a properly thought out transfer strategy then that along with a similar investment the following year a title challenge should be more than possible.
 

Lentwood

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Liverpool finished 4th last season on 75 points, they are now on 82 with 5 games left so could finish on 97 which is 22 points ahead of last season.

They bought VVD, Allison, Fabinho and Keita and now look where they are compared to last season.

United finished on more points last season than Liverpool did, but we only bought Fred and a kid in Dalot. The lack of investment has effected us negatively and them positively.

No wonder Liverpool are doing better than us this season.
Yes but every man and his dog knew that Liverpool were in desperate need of a GK and a CB - they spent £150m addressing those two positions

We arguably need six-eight players, you're not going to do that in one window
 
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Say if we got sancho or felix and De Ligt and Tierney for 200m that’s still a pretty major upgrade to our first 11. Is it enough to mount a title challenge? More than likely not. If we go another smart 200 the following summer we should be getting there with a good young team. I reckon we will spend 300 this summer and then 150 the following summer. The scrutiny on the glazers and Woodward is huge at the minute so they will cough up big time I reckon. It’s there for all to see we are way off and have wasted money all over the shop so I hope they’ll stick with ole now for a few years whatever happens
They've been under scrutiny since 2005. They don't give a feck - we'll have to sell before we buy big.

How people can still delude thenselves that any proper investment is coming from the Glazers amazes me.
 

VP89

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They've been under scrutiny since 2005. They don't give a feck - we'll have to sell before we buy big.

How people can still delude thenselves that any proper investment is coming from the Glazers amazes me.
They spent about 300m over 2 seasons under LVG so they can conceivably do 250m under Ole this summer noting the little spend carried over from the last transfer window.
 

M Bison

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Spending money is one thing but the biggest job Ole has next year is getting more out of existing crop of players.

There’s talent in there, it just needs realising.

Based on the game yesterday, we’re miles off and £200m wouldn’t touch the sides of what we need, but if Ole can start to get a bit more from our team as he did earlier in his reign, £200m would be more than enough to get us close to challenging.
 

AndyJ1985

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They've been under scrutiny since 2005. They don't give a feck - we'll have to sell before we buy big.

How people can still delude thenselves that any proper investment is coming from the Glazers amazes me.
We've had loads of investment. It's not the Glazer's fault most of the money has been wasted on shit players.
 

The holy trinity 68

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We can spend £500m in the summer and still won't get close to the title with this City team.

The points they finished on last season and are on course to get this season were not even obtained by SAF never mind Ole.
 

The holy trinity 68

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Yes but every man and his dog knew that Liverpool were in desperate need of a GK and a CB - they spent £150m addressing those two positions

We arguably need six-eight players, you're not going to do that in one window
So they went from 4th to 2nd and close to winning the PL by signing 2 players in important positions.

We finished 2nd less than 12 months ago so the players at our disposal have shown they are capable of performing well in the PL.

We don't need 6-8 players to compete again. We need the team to play an actual good attacking style of play and to be in unison with each other. 3 or 4 major signings and some tactical tweaks and we could actually put up a fight at the top end of the table.

I still don't think it will be enough to beat this City side, but that isn't a bad thing because they are incredible and top 3 PL sides of all time in my opinion.
 

Cheesy

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We already have one of the biggest wage budgets in world football with some of the most expensive signings in the history of the game. If we're forking out hundreds of millions again then a title challenge should obviously be the bare minimum expectation.

If we, say, finish 4th while playing good football, advance far in the CL (provided we get into it), and win a cup, then I'll be relatively happy, but it shouldn't by any means be what we're expecting. Other clubs around us have come closer to winning the title while spending a lot less, and we've seen several teams compete or win for the title after a poor season the year before. With the right additions we really should be looking to get back in the mix again.
 

M Bison

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They've been under scrutiny since 2005. They don't give a feck - we'll have to sell before we buy big.

How people can still delude thenselves that any proper investment is coming from the Glazers amazes me.
I don’t think we can complain about the level of investment over recent years, whether it’s been spent wisely or not is a different matter.
 

mav_9me

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Liverpool spent 186 or so million last summer. Fans from every other club declared we have to win the league.

So I don't understand how people are saying 200m shouldn't mean united have to win the league. Somethings not adding up or it's just double standards.

If United spend 200m, you will have to do as you all pointed out last summer, and win the league.
Firstly it's not just because you spent so much money. It's because you had a good team where you then spent a lot to fix your weak spots. You had spent very well previously and were in a position to spend on quality to supplement and because of that.

We have to first get to where you were before last summer. That's why 200 won't be enough for us to challenge.
 

Cheesy

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We can spend £500m in the summer and still won't get close to the title with this City team.

The points they finished on last season and are on course to get this season were not even obtained by SAF never mind Ole.
Liverpool have competed with them for most of the season and they aren't exactly any better off than us when it comes to spending power. Indeed, for a significant period of time they were spending a lot less until they forked out massively on VVD. City will be incredibly hard to beat but with the right additions it's got to be our aim.

And it's quite conceivable that they'll slip up soon enough. Mourinho's Chelsea between 04-06 looked infallible and generally outspent Fergie's United side massively, but with some astute signings we were able to compete again and win as they started to fall off a bit.
 

Cheesy

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I don’t think we can complain about the level of investment over recent years, whether it’s been spent wisely or not is a different matter.
Aye, the Glazers are cnuts but we've been outspending basically every other PL team apart from City in recent years and we've made some of the biggest transfers football has seen. Not to mention we have a fairly massive wage bill as well. They're a lot more generous now than they were a decade or so ago when Fergie would genuinely struggle to bring in more than one or two big names each summer (at most) even when we were winning the CL and dominating domestically.
 

crossy1686

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Money spent does not equal expectation. We could spend £1b and till not be title challenge ready if we don't buy players that have the right skill set. This notion of money spent = expectation is daft.
 

JawZ

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We have to solidify top four at the bare minimum whilst playing the type of football Ole wants us to play. Having the players we need, let's hope we play perform better week in week out so that every so often, young players from the academy can get some game time to ease their promotion into the first team.
 

Cheesy

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Money spent does not equal expectation. We could spend £1b and till not be title challenge ready if we don't buy players that have the right skill set. This notion of money spent = expectation is daft.
But it does to a certain extent - as a general rule the football clubs who win stuff are the ones who spend more money than others around them. Therefore if you spend considerable amounts of money, there's going to be a greater level of expectation for you to win. If you don't, then people are naturally going to ask why.
 

M Bison

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Aye, the Glazers are cnuts but we've been outspending basically every other PL team apart from City in recent years and we've made some of the biggest transfers football has seen. Not to mention we have a fairly massive wage bill as well. They're a lot more generous now than they were a decade or so ago when Fergie would genuinely struggle to bring in more than one or two big names each summer (at most) even when we were winning the CL and dominating domestically.
Either that, or we’re both just “deluded” :lol:
 

Toad

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200m I’d expect comfortably 3rd. But I think we need to vastly improve on at least 5 positions to challenge for the title.
 

Chairman Steve

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I voted Top 4 but really who’s to know other than the people who see the playing staff day in day out at Carrington most days.

I remember heading into 2006/07 when we sold RVN and people were wondering whether we were crazy to rely on a still youngish Rooney and Ronaldo to score those goals, next to a returning serious injury duo in Saha and OGS. Keane had also been cannoned out of the club by Sir Alex and Scholes had returned from his career threatening blurred vision issues. The sole transfer we made was Carrick. Chelsea had got in Shevchenko and Ballack who back then were in the Top 20 bracket for best players in Europe.

And that year we played arguably the best football we’ve seen since the early to mid 90s and won the league.
 

crossy1686

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But it does to a certain extent - as a general rule the football clubs who win stuff are the ones who spend more money than others around them. Therefore if you spend considerable amounts of money, there's going to be a greater level of expectation for you to win. If you don't, then people are naturally going to ask why.
In the current market it doesn't because prices just aren't sensible anymore. It used to be that when you spent £30m, you knew you were getting a quality player that had a proven track record of performing at the highest level. Now, £30m gets you a bottom half of the PL quality player. The money spent on players today, that have the ability to perform at the top half of the PL go for £70m - £250m and there's absolutely no pattern, it's all down to how much the other club think they can get for the player.

Players now don't get the chance to develop like they used to, one good season and big teams come circling due to the internet, FM, FIFA, YouTube and SQWAKA, all of which inflate the worth of the player. Getting yourself on the cover of FIFA now improves your market value by £50m.

What I'm saying is, with all these factors now in the modern game, paying £200m isn't what it used to be and we should stop piling expectation on a team because it's the most expensive team ever.

I agree with the notion that the most expensive teams are the ones that win the most trophies but there are exceptions out there where cheaper constructed teams have also had success.