I really like Amorim and hope he turns it around, I just don’t get the blind faith and the total lack of responsibility a lot of fans on here are giving him.Amorim inherited a shitshow, and the club is close to financial meltdown - the CL will be a major lifeline and prioritising the EL has been the right decision. Saying we 'shouldn't need to' is ignoring all the relevant context.
So you do genuinely think that a decent striker wouldn't have made any difference this season? Sounds a bit like you don't want to accept any kind of mitigating factors cos you've already made your mind up on Amorim.
With regard to C, I think it's pretty clear that having a preseason - with the influx of new faces that it brings, and the time to work on systems and strategy, would be far preferable to starting mid season?
Oh, wow. 3 teams out of 150+. So what? Plus, those 3 teams are the exception, and are also nowhere near as enjoyable to watch as 423 433 teams. Not to mention, United have been playing with a back 4 for 140 years. wtf do we have to change it now just because Amorim can't play anything else.Before we go there, please remember that :-
1. Inter Milan are in the Champions League final with similar system.
2. Leverkusen won the Bundesliga with a similar system.
3. Atalanta are a very good attacking side with a similar system.
Before everyone goes system-phobic.
My view is that when you are doing something like attempting to change the entire culture of the club, (particularly at a club the size of United) it is like turning an oil tanker. We've been shite for 12 years now, and yet people were on this guy's back after 2 months! It's like renovating an old house - there is a period where you start ripping stuff out and knocking down walls and the whole place looks worse than it did before, but what you are doing is getting rid of the rotten wood, the dated kitchen and the roof that leaks, in order that you can set the house up for the next phase of its existence. That is, I believe, what Amorim is attempting to do. I don't know whether he will be successful, but I feel that a complete reset and rebuild is what is needed here - therefore I am prepared to be patient and accept that results may take a while to come.I really like Amorim and hope he turns it around, I just don’t get the blind faith and the total lack of responsibility a lot of fans on here are giving him.
He knew the mess he was getting into, if the team could score goals we’d obviously be doing better off and starting in pre season to ‘mid season’ (was after 10 games in the league iirc) obviously is better but not an excuse to seeing no improvement whatsoever.
I understand your thinking and I have no issues with giving him all of next season but at this rate I don’t expect him to get it an neither does he by the sounds of it.My view is that when you are doing something like attempting to change the entire culture of the club, (particularly at a club the size of United) it is like turning an oil tanker. We've been shite for 12 years now, and yet people were on this guy's back after 2 months! It's like renovating an old house - there is a period where you start ripping stuff out and knocking down walls and the whole place looks worse than it did before, but what you are doing is getting rid of the rotten wood, the dated kitchen and the roof that leaks, in order that you can set the house up for the next phase of its existence. That is, I believe, what Amorim is attempting to do. I don't know whether he will be successful, but I feel that a complete reset and rebuild is what is needed here - therefore I am prepared to be patient and accept that results may take a while to come.
Not in a week and a half.Then we'd get to the final and you'd be complaining that the players look "rusty".
It's the character he has. The results and performances aren't great, but his personality is earning him the goodwill a manager like Rangnick didn't have. Its also obvious just how different the system he's employing is to anything we've ever had.I really like Amorim and hope he turns it around, I just don’t get the blind faith and the total lack of responsibility a lot of fans on here are giving him.
He knew the mess he was getting into, if the team could score goals we’d obviously be doing better off and starting in pre season to ‘mid season’ (was after 10 games in the league iirc) obviously is better but not an excuse to seeing no improvement whatsoever.
It is for now, eventually you can’t ride on personality only for ever.It's the character he has. The results and performances aren't great, but his personality is earning him the goodwill a manager like Rangnick didn't have. Its also obvious just how different the system he's employing is to anything we've ever had.
Personally, I'm hoping that he has a real think this summer and plans with two systems in mind for next season. I would love to see what a 433 with similar principles looks like with him. At the same time, this should be a back up in case the system is proving to not suit the league.
Does anyone really believe that this roster built by Woodward and co, and signing a bunch of Eredevise players not suited for the EPL would be competitive. Man Utd has been built over the last 10 years on a bedrock of sand accompanied by irresponsible statements like we can do things no other club can do, and this is Disneyland.My view is that when you are doing something like attempting to change the entire culture of the club, (particularly at a club the size of United) it is like turning an oil tanker. We've been shite for 12 years now, and yet people were on this guy's back after 2 months! It's like renovating an old house - there is a period where you start ripping stuff out and knocking down walls and the whole place looks worse than it did before, but what you are doing is getting rid of the rotten wood, the dated kitchen and the roof that leaks, in order that you can set the house up for the next phase of its existence. That is, I believe, what Amorim is attempting to do. I don't know whether he will be successful, but I feel that a complete reset and rebuild is what is needed here - therefore I am prepared to be patient and accept that results may take a while to come.
Well clearly the people who run the club approached him and said they wanted to play a 3-5-2Oh, wow. 3 teams out of 150+. So what? Plus, those 3 teams are the exception, and are also nowhere near as enjoyable to watch as 423 433 teams. Not to mention, United have been playing with a back 4 for 140 years. wtf do we have to change it now just because Amorim can't play anything else.
Don't understand why we always start so cautiously. The build up to an attack is always so slow and measured. Almost always ends up with the opponent scoring instead. Only then we throw caution to the wind and start attacking more seriously.
SAF once said. I always put a team out there to win. That's in context of putting a weaker team in the lesser cup tournament. So I am upset we have lost this winning mentality.At the risk of coming off as insensitive to the outrage many here feel, the defeat is truly irrelevant. We all know which game actually matters.
At the risk of coming off as insensitive to the outrage many here feel, the defeat is truly irrelevant. We all know which game actually matters.
Not even the solid, European places pushing West Ham, but 15th placed West HamWest Ham did the double over us, feck me.
Another post that ignores the wider context. We have arguably the most important game since Fergie retired in 10 days time, and a paper thin squad - watching players fight until their bodies are depleted would be reckless in the extreme. Like it or not we are miles away from having either the squad or the mentality to be doing that just at the moment. My guess is that it will be more of the same against Chelsea, then we may actually improve against Villa depending upon how the EL final has gone.Letting off some steam. I went to the pub to see my local team play 0-0, with every body fighting until their bodies were depleted. I was fortunate enough to sit in the same pub watching Liverpool, already winning the title, running their asses off as professionals, getting 2 goals up. Then the pride struck the Arsenal players, making them claw back a 2-2. I had the pleasure of seeing Lego Pep say to the cameras that drawing against the champions makes them just as good. A draw where the temperature was high and the game was brilliant.
Meanwhile, in Manchester, at Old Trafford, West-Ham aka Moyes-ham wins 0-2.
It is not justifiable to say that this is already a forgotten PL season because he came mid-season.
This is actually terrible and humiliating.
Doesn't matter really, he could play 3-3-3-1 if it would work, but his 3 at the back doesn't, the above mentioned manager's tactics WORK, they have results, they win trophies, they are in a good spot, we aren't.Oh, wow. 3 teams out of 150+. So what? Plus, those 3 teams are the exception, and are also nowhere near as enjoyable to watch as 423 433 teams. Not to mention, United have been playing with a back 4 for 140 years. wtf do we have to change it now just because Amorim can't play anything else.
Shows how big the mountain we have to scale is.West Ham did the double over us, feck me.
There are always excuses. If its so important why is he starting Fernandes in a pointless match given without him in the final we are truly f@@@@d. Losing Yoro? Where are the young players. Were the performances any better before the semi finals? No.Another post that ignores the wider context. We have arguably the most important game since Fergie retired in 10 days time, and a paper thin squad - watching players fight until their bodies are depleted would be reckless in the extreme. Like it or not we are miles away from having either the squad or the mentality to be doing that just at the moment. My guess is that it will be more of the same against Chelsea, then we may actually improve against Villa depending upon how the EL final has gone.
In the context of this season, not really no. What's the point in getting worked up about it. Tell me?You don't care that the team you support just lost?
I think that’s the point, the players that were brought in under that ETH reign have been Mediocre at best; Hojlund, zirkzee, Ugarte, Antony, Sancho (Ole’s), Malacia, Mount, Onana, Bayindir. The only outliers are Yoro, Maz and possibly Casemiro. - yes there was a clear out (Fred, McT, Varane, Elanga, Telles, Bailly, AWB,Martial) but there haven’t been top level replacements for any of them.2 points out of the last 21 on the table !
5 losses and 2 draws in those last 7 games !
Clear out of players ?
We already had a clear out.
Only Shaw, Maguire, Lindelof, Dalot and Bruno are left from the pre-ETH era, if you discount Rashford and Sancho, who have been pushed out, and Amad who went straight out on loan when he arrived.
Lindelof (along with Eriksen) is out of contract and leaving in a few weeks, at the end of the season.
Shaw has been missing for almost all of the season with injury and even with 2 years left on his contract, could be dispensed with soon.
Maguire May be slow and occasionally gets caught out, but it’s not like he hasn’t been putting in the effort.
Bruno is Bruno, an erratic genius.
All the rest apart from recently acquired Dorgu, are ETH buys, or have come from the Academy.
.
And they're not:SIX teams have done a league double over us this season, without doubt this is the most embarrassing of the lot
He rested Bruno in the last league game and played the youngsters and they looked lost - he also took all kinds of shit from fans (and Scholesy) for playing an under-strength team, so basically he is screwed either way. Contrary to what you've said I think there was a period in Feb-March where performances were improving - lots of very tight games where we underperformed in terms of our XG and gave up silly goals due to individual errors or unstoppable strikes. Even yesterday we had better chances than West Ham and with a proficient striker it may have been a different result.There are always excuses. If its so important why is he starting Fernandes in a pointless match given without him in the final we are truly f@@@@d. Losing Yoro? Where are the young players. Were the performances any better before the semi finals? No.
Amorim doesn't seem to think so though. In fact, he's saying pretty much the exact opposite of that.At the risk of coming off as insensitive to the outrage many here feel, the defeat is truly irrelevant. We all know which game actually matters.
What he says and what he really thinks are two different things though. Quite apart from what winning the EL would mean to him personally, and for the football team, there is the matter of the difference that the extra revenue would make to the club. Clubs can make £50 million even if they don't get out of the group stage - reach the semis and you are looking at £100 million.Amorim doesn't seem to think so though. In fact, he's saying pretty much the exact opposite of that.
It is for now, eventually you can’t ride on personality only for ever.
I think it’s crazy any manager doesn’t have multiple formations that you can change to in game. There was a point a while back were it looked like we where playing a back four out of possession and a back 3 in position or vice versa I can’t remember and it looked like he was learning and tweaking things.
God that was really bad. We did create enough to score but those goals conceded, terrible. We're actually going to finish 17th...
Hard to say much about this defeat. There's no urgency when we play league games and lack of concentration is awful. Worried about next season whatever happens in EL final. Depressing times.
Also think starting Mainoo in central midfield and Bruno in 10 (instead of switching that around) was a mistake. Seems like Mainoo can be good at 10 but has problems in central midfield.
Leny Yoro
Bruno Fernandes
Mason Mount
Harry Maguire
Altay Bayindir
Harry Amass
Rasmus Hojlund
Alejandro Garnacho
Manuel Ugarte
Christian Eriksen
Noussair Mazraoui
Amad Diallo
Rasmus Hojlund
replaced by Harry Maguire
replaced by Victor Lindelof
replaced by Alejandro Garnacho
replaced by Patrick Dorgu
replaced by Christian Eriksen
