Ralf Rangnick's consultancy role has been scrapped

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RedPed

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Because he was one of the best of his generation in putting together top rate squads and United squandered the chance of using his expertise.

He could of been a fantastic asset alongside ETH who as good a manager as he is just doesn't have the same experience.
:lol:
 

Son

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Because he was one of the best of his generation in putting together top rate squads and United squandered the chance of using his expertise.

He could of been a fantastic asset alongside ETH who as good a manager as he is just doesn't have the same experience.
He’s never managed or led a club to great things has he? No big league titles, no CL’s what’s he won?

There was a reason why some larger football personalities questioned him no matter his ideas. At United as Fergie said to his coach. “You’re gonna need more than that to succeed here son”.

United was a different level to what he was used too was plain as day. He can talk the talk but didn’t do a whole lot.

I remember us smashing his “great” Schalke side with Anderson and a 40 year old Ryan Giggs tearing them apart btw.
 

Dion

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The only thing the club said publicly on the matter was a vague consultancy role. So you can hardly say everyone knew what he would be doing.

Well he would be consulting the DOF, that's what consultants do.
Precisely! And you hire consultants to fill skill and knowledge gaps in your current permanent staff. I'm glad we can finally find common ground.

Well none of can know what was said in private and it how it transpired doesn't necessarily mean that ETH thought he could do everything better than Ralf. But in his first press conference Erik didn't say too much on what Rangnick's role working with him will be beyond that was for the club to decide, Ralf's role was scrapped shortly after. Then there were multiple stories that after speaking to Rangnick, Ten Hag informed the club they're idea's didn't mesh, as reportedly Rangnick didn't think we should pursue Eredivisie players as he didn't rate them and Ten Hag obviously disagreed seeing as we signed 3 of them.

It seems pretty obvious when you connect those dots.
I don't think any of this is remotely contentious is it? I said the same thing in the post above. It's certainly a high right strategy putting all your eggs in the manager basket of course.
 

Dion

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I've changed my stance and I now fully support this e-fight. Seeing some froth at the mouth with this thread being bumped is actually quite enjoyable. Keep it going lads!
I'm always quite amused by people complaining about what others decide to talk about, there's currently a thread full of farming puns which I have zero interest in, but if @BenitoSTARR wants to spend his evening in there that's his call and I'd not go in there and make fun of him for it. Each to their own I suppose.
 

Robbie Boy

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I'm always quite amused by people complaining about what others decide to talk about, there's currently a thread full of farming puns which I have zero interest in, but if @BenitoSTARR wants to spend his evening in there that's his call and I'd not go in there and make fun of him for it. Each to their own I suppose.
Ah cheer up; it's a joke ffs.
 

afrocentricity

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Because he was one of the best of his generation in putting together top rate squads and United squandered the chance of using his expertise.

He could of been a fantastic asset alongside ETH who as good a manager as he is just doesn't have the same experience.
Are we talking about the same guy?
 

stevoc

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Precisely! And you hire consultants to fill skill and knowledge gaps in your current permanent staff. I'm glad we can finally find common ground.


I don't think any of this is remotely contentious is it? I said the same thing in the post above. It's certainly a high right strategy putting all your eggs in the manager basket of course.
I've been saying basically the same thing from the start mate to be fair. The only point I was making was that Ralf wasn't being brought into be the DOF, de facto DOF or anything of that nature.
 

BenitoSTARR

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I'm always quite amused by people complaining about what others decide to talk about, there's currently a thread full of farming puns which I have zero interest in, but if @BenitoSTARR wants to spend his evening in there that's his call and I'd not go in there and make fun of him for it. Each to their own I suppose.
I’m not complaining. It’s amusing to see a rock and a hard place live in a thread.

For what it’s worth joking aside I have absolutely no idea what either of your positions are on Ralf Rangnick so where are you up to at the moment? Who thinks what?
You seem to be imagining it, are you looking to watch? :lol:

Though it may involve a trip to Hull.
I’ve PM’d you an address. :lol:

Love a good mass debate. And you both seem to enjoy debating en masse together.

Are you for or against Ralf?
 

stevoc

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I’m not complaining. It’s amusing to see a rock and a hard place live in a thread.

For what it’s worth joking aside I have absolutely no idea what either of your positions are on Ralf Rangnick so where are you up to at the moment? Who thinks what?

I’ve PM’d you an address. :lol:

Love a good mass debate. And you both seem to enjoy debating en masse together.

Are you for or against Ralf?
Who doesn't?

I've no problem with Ralf, he's a great chap I'm lead to believe.
 

Real Name

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Because he was one of the best of his generation in putting together top rate squads and United squandered the chance of using his expertise.

He could of been a fantastic asset alongside ETH who as good a manager as he is just doesn't have the same experience.
What?
 

horsechoker

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He could of been a fantastic asset alongside ETH who as good a manager as he is just doesn't have the same experience.
It was ETH who let him go. I imagine he ETH thought he was incompatible with his ideas or that he needed to draw a line under RR's time at the club, I don't think the players cared much for RR so getting rid probably helped ETH in the dressing room.
 

Forevergiggs1

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He’s never managed or led a club to great things has he? No big league titles, no CL’s what’s he won?

There was a reason why some larger football personalities questioned him no matter his ideas. At United as Fergie said to his coach. “You’re gonna need more than that to succeed here son”.

United was a different level to what he was used too was plain as day. He can talk the talk but didn’t do a whole lot.

I remember us smashing his “great” Schalke side with Anderson and a 40 year old Ryan Giggs tearing them apart btw.
I'm not talking about his managerial career but more on what he's achieved on the sporting director side of things. If I have to explain what those achievements are then people just won't get it. You only have to look at managers he's influenced to understand his standing in the game.

Yes, of course United is a big step up but for whatever reason he wasn't given his chance to shine in what he's actually good at. Like I said before. ETH has the potential to be a great manager but he can't do it all by himself as he doesn't have the experience and having someone like Rangnick by his side could of made the difference.

Maybe it was a clash of egos between the 2 on why Rangnick was let go and if that was one of ETHs conditions to become manager then I'm glad we made it but that doesn't change the fact I think Rangnick could of had a positive effect on the club as a whole.
 

Forevergiggs1

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It was ETH who let him go. I imagine he ETH thought he was incompatible with his ideas or that he needed to draw a line under RR's time at the club, I don't think the players cared much for RR so getting rid probably helped ETH in the dressing room.
I do agree with you here but outside of the Dutch league ETH just doesn't have the experience whereas I would guess that Rangnick still has a pretty good scouting network which could of been used to our advantage.

Given the choice of having one or the other of course I'm going for ETH all day long. I just find it a little vexing that because they aren't compatible we aren't going to see how it could of turned out.

It is amusing though that when details first came out that we were looking for a DOF Rangnicks name was near the top of a lot of peoples list but when he failed at a job he wasn't qualified for the knives came out and that was the end of Ralf.
 

Iker Quesadillas

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If I have to explain what those achievements are then people just won't get it. You only have to look at managers he's influenced to understand his standing in the game.
Feels like this has been brought up before and, like most things related to Rangnick, it's wildly exaggerated.
 

RedPed

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Feels like this has been brought up before and, like most things related to Rangnick, it's wildly exaggerated.
It really makes you wonder why this guy is not being headhunted by every powerful club in the world the way some people blow smoke up his arse. By their logic, Newcastle are mad not to have him on their books right now.
 

Iker Quesadillas

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In May of last year Rangnick said this:

The most important thing is we find player for whom [United] is the best next sporting step in their career. They shouldn't want to come because it's Manchester United, because maybe they get a good contract here. It should be for developing their career and taking their next best step. If that happens you have a completely different level of energy and motivation. This is what we did at Red Bull and I think we fared well with that.
This doesn't really fit Casemiro or Eriksen. It also doesn't fit Frenkie De Jong, who Ten Hag really wanted to sign, nor does it fit Rabiot and Arnautovic. I think that indicates where the discrepancies were between them.
 

Withnail

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Did he really ask to buy Julian Alvarez?
No he claimed, at the end of the window when it was confirmed we'd be missing Greenwood on top of injuries in the forward line, that he was told players weren't available at that stage and then listed three players who made moves, Valahovic, Alvarez and Luis Diaz. It was a bit disingenuous and self-serving as we only knew we were in trouble near the end of the window and couldn't have gotten any of those players given how advanced those deals were.
 

Dion

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I've been saying basically the same thing from the start mate to be fair. The only point I was making was that Ralf wasn't being brought into be the DOF, de facto DOF or anything of that nature.
My point being if we both agree a relatively junior and largely unqualified person was promoted to DoF and someone vastly more experienced was hired on big money to consult with him whether you call that 'help', 'de facto doing the job' 'consulting' etc. is largely a semantic difference. Either way Rangnick was brought in because our current DoF wasn't deemed enough and that didn't change until EtH came in and decided he could do that better than Rangnick anyway.
 

Zen

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All I can say on this Ralf guy is that I'm glad we're finally at a point where other clubs are signing players who weren't on his never ending list of players to buy. fecking hell, it was basically everyone that was bought in January and Summer 2022. But he was genius for having a massive list of players!

On top of that he just looked up United forums and spoke what they wanted to hear. Kudos PR on his side to hide his nowhere near the level coaching ability to be fair, he's got a few fair massive loyalists due to it. Used us for money in reality.
 

Abraxas

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In May of last year Rangnick said this:



This doesn't really fit Casemiro or Eriksen. It also doesn't fit Frenkie De Jong, who Ten Hag really wanted to sign, nor does it fit Rabiot and Arnautovic. I think that indicates where the discrepancies were between them.
I doubt this was particularly important to ETH's decision making. It's hard to say for sure what ETH's thought process was because he hasn't made it public and will have no reason to because it is a total irrelevance at this point, but it probably wasn't a quote about potential players. I don't even think ETH would particularly disagree with that statement in general, he simply wanted one or two bits of experience and class which isn't incompatible with the idea that we should target hungry players with improvement in them generally.

A far more likely scenario to me is that ETH is his own man and wanted overall control, particularly early on before he knows who and what he can trust at the club in terms of recruitment. In which case you wouldn't need a dossier from Ralf, which would tally with the fact he didn't even analyse what Ralf put forward. Plus if Ralf pissed the hierarchy and players off by constantly going off piste in press conferences it makes him a pretty difficult man to get into bed with. You don't really want an association with a guy that made a horlicks of things, even if it was in a different capacity.
 

stevoc

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My point being if we both agree a relatively junior and largely unqualified person was promoted to DoF and someone vastly more experienced was hired on big money to consult with him whether you call that 'help', 'de facto doing the job' 'consulting' etc. is largely a semantic difference. Either way Rangnick was brought in because our current DoF wasn't deemed enough and that didn't change until EtH came in and decided he could do that better than Rangnick anyway.
I can't say I agree with the second bolded part. For me Rangnick was brought in as an experienced coach to be short term manager when there were few options available and that was it basically. There was no set plan for what he would be doing after that beyond some vague role surrounding recruitment a few days a month. If Solskjaer hadn't been sacked then Ralf wouldn't have been at the club in any role, between that and him getting the boot and a payoff before his consultancy gig even started. It doesn't point to there being any grand plan to give Rangnick any prominent role at the club.

As for Murtagh being unqualified that's your theory not mine, I don't know if he is. I haven't made my mind up on whether or not he's been good in the role given he's been in the position a relatively short time. And in that time the club has had two CEO's, 3 managers and is in the process of being sold. Time will tell I suppose.
 

stevoc

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In May of last year Rangnick said this:



This doesn't really fit Casemiro or Eriksen. It also doesn't fit Frenkie De Jong, who Ten Hag really wanted to sign, nor does it fit Rabiot and Arnautovic. I think that indicates where the discrepancies were between them.
He almost sounds like his vision for United's recruitment would be similar to Ajax or Dortmund, a stepping stone club that signs young talent and then develops them to sell on at a profit.
 

Dion

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I can't say I agree with the second bolded part. For me Rangnick was brought in as an experienced coach to be short term manager when there were few options available and that was it basically. There was no set plan for what he would be doing after that beyond some vague role surrounding recruitment a few days a month. If Solskjaer hadn't been sacked then Ralf wouldn't have been at the club in any role, between that and him getting the boot and a payoff before his consultancy gig even started. It doesn't point to there being any grand plan to give Rangnick any prominent role at the club.
Solskjaer had his own scouts and was hands on with everything, especially recruitment. He was as involved in transfers as EtH is, I wouldn't have been remotely surprised if Murtaugh was appointed so as not to step on Solskjaer's toes too much (although that is pure speculation).

As for Murtagh being unqualified that's your theory not mine, I don't know if he is. I haven't made my mind up on whether or not he's been good in the role given he's been in the position a relatively short time. And in that time the club has had two CEO's, 3 managers and is in the process of being sold. Time will tell I suppose.
Whether he's good or not is still up for question, he was objectively unqualified and inexperienced in any traditional definition of the word though.
 
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