Reserves Draft | Aldo Staine 14-6 EAP

[Annahnomoss]

Yeah I think that Dalglish and Rush could handle a lot more reponsibility considering the individual quality and partnership they had. I could see Brady work, but not Ceulemans as well and it just seems a bit redundant. All of those complications just to have Nadal in the midfield anyhow which just doesn't make it worth it. I would have preferred the Neal/Hughes full back combination and then let Rush/Dalglish pair do their job up front.

Even if Andrade is one of the best players on the pitch he is kind of the one player I would prefer to swap out. Nadal/Blind would complement each other well too.

 

[Moby]

How many managers am I playing against?
Two have actually drawn formations for Edgar.... Not that I am ever the one to complain against things like this, I completely welcome any questions one wants to ask about my team but actually drawing formations and stuff... hmm.

 

[Enigma_87]

Well in a game of this level the difference between 'not out of sorts' and optimum can make the difference.
I remember @Balu used Cuelemans as the AM in a false 9 formation behind Cruyff and that looked perfect to me.
Even in this game, I have no issue with Edgar's instruction of him bombing forward when Dalglish drops back, you wouldn't find me saying anything about that and that works for me. He wouldn't look that great in a deeper role in my opinion as his goal threat was an important weapon.

He could play as AM/SS/CM and can contribute in both ends, sure his physical presence is appreciated up front but in this game would be better for EAP to play him deeper because he can help out the midfield. He's very versatile and I can see why EAP went for him.

Brady can provide a width, but more of a Beckam-esque role, but again the problem lies with the back three, otherwise if it was back 4 with proper full backs I don't think that would be an issue at all seeing Brady in a leftish role.

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

Brady+Dalglish+Ceulemans are a mess together anyway, but now it's looks slightly better

Why? It's somewhat similar to a diamond just a bit more aggressive than that. They cover the wide midfield role and bridge between defence and offence. He has 2 DMs and I have 3 midfielders to attack. If Ceulemans goes forward to attack, brady will drop to CM and dictate play. When Brady goes on his mazy run, Ceulemans will stay deep. Quite a fluid formation with both fully capable of their roles.

Both Brady and Michel look bad in those outside left and outside right roles.

I simply can't fathom why you persist in false claims that they are outside and inside right, when I've oft made it clear that they play as wide midfielders. If you just going to spout false stuff all game long, it'll just get tiresome.

 

[Moby]

Why? It's somewhat similar to a diamond just a bit more aggressive than that. They cover the wide midfield role and bridge between defence and offence. He has 2 DMs and I have 3 midfielders to attack. If Ceulemans goes forward to attack, brady will drop to CM and dictate play. When Brady goes on his mazy run, Ceulemans will stay deep. Quite a fluid formation with both fully capable of their roles.



I simply can't fathom why you persist in false claims that they are outside and inside right, when I've oft made it clear that they play as wide midfielders. If you just going to spout false stuff all game long, it'll just get tiresome.

Relax, I was responding the formation harms had drawn which was a more traditional 5 man attack. At least see the post I quoted before jumping the gun. It wasn't about your setup.

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

Really don't get why my front 5 is seen as imbalanced. In a standard 4-4-2 diamond, they'd be...

...Dalglish......Rush...
......Ceulemans.........
Brady..........Michel....
.........Stiles..............

The presence of Nadal just give a bit more room for Brady and Michel to attack and gives cover for Hughes against Sagnol/Amancio.

Nothing more to that!

 

[Moby]

If Ceulemans goes forward to attack, brady will drop to CM and dictate play. When Brady goes on his mazy run, Ceulemans will stay deep. Quite a fluid formation with both fully capable of their roles.

Sounds okay if there was just a 9 ahead of them giving them that space, but there's Dalglish too which makes it congested.

 

[harms]

Really don't get why my front 5 is seen as imbalanced. In a standard 4-4-2 diamond, they'd be...

...Dalglish......Rush...
......Ceulemans.........
Brady..........Michel....
.........Stiles..............

The presence of Nadal just give a bit more room for Brady and Michel to attack and gives cover for Hughes against Sagnol/Amancio.

Nothing more to that!

Because it restricts Brady (your first pick), who should be given more freedom and Dalglish looks better as a tip of the diamond, imo

 

[Ecstatic]

UPDATED CONFIGURATION

 

[Ecstatic]

Maybe, it's more clear like that. I will ask some questions tonight

 

[Moby]

You have Dunga and Szepan on the opposite sides.

Which phase of game is that? Me with the ball or Edgar?

Makes that 3v3 I was talking about abundantly clear. Even if you classify it as a 4v5, it's a major problem as most of the times it will be a devastating counter with players moving all over the pitch and combining at pace. And I haven't added Sagnol.

 

[Ecstatic]

You have Dunga and Szepan on the opposite sides.

Which phase of game is that? Me with the ball or Edgar?

Makes that 3v3 I was talking about abundantly clear. Even if you classify it as a 4v5, it's a major problem as most of the times it will be a devastating counter with players moving all over the pitch and combining at pace. And I haven't added Sagnol.

Updated

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

Because it restricts Brady (your first pick), who should be given more freedom and Dalglish looks better as a tip of the diamond, imo

Don't think Dalglish will be better at the tip of a diamond. He's a SS at best not a typical #10. His best version was playing in the hole behind Rush and that's what he's doing here. All 3 of Brady, Michel and Ceulemans are capable of operating deeper and so will not be in the same area of Dalglish. Interchange but not overlap.

As you can see from downcast's picture above, Brady and Michel have loads of space to operate in. Pick up the ball and run in the attacking left midfield and he has a straight route to Aldo's defence. Same with Michel on the right. A quick one-two with Ceulemans will get the better off Dunga/Szepan and give them the route to goal.

 

[Ecstatic]

Edit.

 

[Moby]

Another AM for Edgar. This is frankly getting ridiculous.

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

@Edgar Allan Pillow What do you think about my changes?

It's a standard (and boring diamond) I've had built many diamonds before and here I go again

Tbh, I just made this as I wanted to experiment with MM. As @harms mentioned we've not seen this many times before and so just wanted to play around and see how best it handles against more modern formations. I told Skizzo during the previous draft that I wanted to give this a shot and here we go

 

[Ecstatic]

Another AM for Edgar. This is frankly getting ridiculous.

Please don't be paranoid because you already get my vote.

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

Another AM for Edgar. This is frankly getting ridiculous.

Relax. I wanted a 3-2-3-2 and I'm sticking by it....for now.

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

Please don't be paranoid because you already get my vote.

Wait, wut? If you are already voted then what the feck are we being pedagogical about here?

 

[Ecstatic]

Wait, wut? If you are already voted then what the feck are we being pedagogical about here?

In theory, I can still change my vote !

"Everything is possible in Football" - Zidane

 

[harms]

Another AM for Edgar. This is frankly getting ridiculous.

No one is arguing for him apart from Edgar himself and you are winning by the big margin. This is certainly not "ridiculous" or anywhere near it. Edgar fielded a strange formation and people are guessing is there a better way to field the same players.

 

[Enigma_87]

I'm not sure I've drawn EAP formation yet, but here's my shot at it.

For me the issues starts from defence in that back 3 which makes it really hard to read and imagine how those players will work together

------------Rush------------
-----Dalglish---------Michel--
----------------------------
--Brady-------Ceulemans---
-----------Stiles-------------
-----------------------------
Andrade---Hughes--Blind--Neal
------------GK-----------

4-3-3 with Michel/Neal providing the width on the right, Brady/Andrade on the left with Dalglish in a free role. This is probably the best I'd field with this set of players.

Another AM for Edgar. This is frankly getting ridiculous.

I guess most of trying to figure out what's going on in the original formation. At least that's the case with me, as I'm not sure how will everything work and why is the need of starting with 3 CB's while obviously having 2 good full back options.

 

[Pat_Mustard]

Another AM for Edgar. This is frankly getting ridiculous.

I guess when someone goes for an unusual setup people are always going to want to help them fine tune it, but when it gets to the point of multiple alternative formation graphics being posted up its went a bit too far really. Fair play to Edgar for holding true to the 3-2-3-2 though, after already drafting those Scouse bastards up front

 

[Moby]

Please don't be paranoid because you already get my vote.

But is it really fair? It's not just 1 or 2, everyone comes here drawing formations and elaborating tactics for him while I'm sitting all by myself answering to all that. Like I said I've never made a fuss about this before but it has gone past the limit now.
All fun and games of course but one man can't keep up with this. Feedback is one thing but drawing formations for him, and it's the third person doing it now.

 

[harms]

But is it really fair? It's not just 1 or 2, everyone comes here drawing formations and elaborating tactics for him while I'm sitting all by myself answering to all that. Like I said I've never made a fuss about this before but it has gone past the limit now.
All fun and games of course but one man can't keep up with this. Feedback is one thing but drawing formations for him, and it's the third person doing it now.

You don't have to answer to hypothetical formations before Edgar decides to go with it.

 

[Moby]

No one is arguing for him apart from Edgar himself and you are winning by the big margin. This is certainly not "ridiculous" or anywhere near it. Edgar fielded a strange formation and people are guessing is there a better way to field the same players.

It's fine giving feedback but drawing formations? It's his job to find faults and correct them. Not to mention it's all in one team's favour.

I mentioned this before, I'll be punished for going with a sensible setup while the other guy just threw something different.

Meh.

 

[Moby]

You don't have to answer to hypothetical formations before Edgar decides to go with it.

It's not about that, he already made a feckup at the start and got help to correct it, and it was fine by me. But it's what 5-6 people now all helping out one team? With 3 or 4 actually giving him the formations? How is that fair to me?

 

[Moby]

but when it gets to the point of multiple alternative formation graphics being posted up ts went a bit too far really.

Exactly.

It's not like I'm complaining after one or two. Check the thread.

 

[Ecstatic]

@Aldo

I understand your point of view but it's too late for EAP to change his tactical system. You can't change 2 times a line-up.

A game is interesting if the voters give their points of view. I have no reasons to be partial here.

I did vote for you because you have a more balanced team and I find odd to have 3 central defenders without 2 defensive outfield midfielders.

 

[Moby]

In theory, I can still change my vote !

And then that is followed by this.

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

everyone comes here drawing formations and elaborating tactics for him while I'm sitting all by myself answering to all that.

I'd be happy to switch places, tbh

 

[Ecstatic]

And then that is followed by this.

In theory, I can change. In practice, I have no reasons to change.

 

[Moby]

A game is interesting if the voters give their points of view.

Absolutely welcome to discuss the game and all feedback is fine. But drawing formation graphics? Might as well add your name to the OP. If you really think you had a better idea for his formation save it till the game is over. Otherwise it just isn't fair.

I mean my AM has not posted once in this thread while I'm against all this.

 

[harms]

It's not about that, he already made a feckup at the start and got help to correct it, and it was fine by me. But it's what 5-6 people now all helping out one team? With 3 or 4 actually giving him the formations? How is that fair to me?

People are making up the hypotheticals because they don't see it as a competitive game (at least me). It's fair to you because some of EAP "helpers" have already voted for you and they are just having fun. I don't know why it concerns you so much. More help is going Edgar's way and most of the criticism goes to his team also - is this fair? It's obvious that the experimental formation will raise questions about it - and if you count "the help" as an upside, you should also count a downside of all the voters that don't like the questionable experiments

 

[Edgar Allan Pillow]

It's not about that, he already made a feckup at the start and got help to correct it, and it was fine by me. But it's what 5-6 people now all helping out one team? With 3 or 4 actually giving him the formations? How is that fair to me?

Tbh it was not a feck up just a tune up and it was after you posts that I made the change. Nothing to with them all. Your insitence on positioning of Andrade and Blind triggered the change.

And most have already voted for you.

 

[Enigma_87]

It's not about that, he already made a feckup at the start and got help to correct it, and it was fine by me. But it's what 5-6 people now all helping out one team? With 3 or 4 actually giving him the formations? How is that fair to me?

I don't think it does good service to Edgar to be honest, as most don't agree with his formation, hence suggesting options. EAP's formation is pretty unorthodox which naturally opts for more attention to his set up and people trying to read it. Naturally most will tend to suggest formations that are more understandable to them and easier to read for them.

I don't see issues with your formation or at least not glaring ones. The reason why I haven't voted still is because I want to see how EAP defends his tactics and instructions. It doesn't mean I like his team better, just by trying to understand it, moreover I feel most are criticizing his team rather than helping him

 

[Pat_Mustard]

@Aldo

I understand your point of view but it's too late for EAP to change his tactical system. You can't change 2 times a line-up.

A game is interesting if the voters give their points of view. I have no reasons to be partial here.

I did vote for you because you have a more balanced team and I find odd to have 3 central defenders without 2 defensive outfield midfielders.

Sure you can, and the difficulty for Aldo is that the match is only 33% complete - Edgar still has time to win this. Its a difficult balance to strike. The feedback on Edgar's team is making for an interesting thread, but I understand why Aldo feels its too much.

 

[Moby]

People are making up the hypotheticals because they don't see it as a competitive game (at least me).

It isn't over till it's over. It's just a 5 vote lead. Even if it was more, you have to wait till it's actually over.

More help is going Edgar's way and most of the criticism goes to his team also - is this fair? It's obvious that the experimental formation will raise questions about it - and if you count "the help" as an upside, you should also count a downside of all the voters that don't like the questionable experiments

Like I said, discussion and feedback is fine but drawing formations and elaborating tactics for him is simply going too far. I wouldn't have said any of this but it's crossed the limit in this thread. It's me vs Edgar, my job to construct my team properly and his job to construct his.

We have previously banned AMs making it 2v1 when the AM has actual vested interest in arguing for that team yet here we are with half a dozen people doing one man's job for him while the other sits around watching. Sorry, but it's past the limit. Put yourself in my shoes and you'll see how frustrating it is. And no, whatever the scoreline is has nothing to do with this. I'd be saying the same whatever it was and it is actually the first time in all these years I've had to react this way in a match.

 

[Ecstatic]

@Aldo
@Edgar Allan Pillow
@Pat_Mustard

Sorry because only 33% of the game is completed
In reality, I am not in favour of tactical changes once the game has started.

People are making up the hypotheticals because they don't see it as a competitive game (at least me). It's fair to you because some of EAP "helpers" have already voted for you and they are just having fun. I don't know why it concerns you so much. More help is going Edgar's way and most of the criticism goes to his team also - is this fair? It's obvious that the experimental formation will raise questions about it - and if you count "the help" as an upside, you should also count a downside of all the voters that don't like the questionable experiments

Thanks

 

[Enigma_87]

Sure you can, and the difficulty for Aldo is that the match is only 33% complete - Edgar still has time to win this. Its a difficult balance to strike. The feedback on Edgar's team is making for an interesting thread, but I understand why Aldo feels its too much.

Yeah I can see Aldo's point because finding the right balance at the end will probably win him some votes, especially from voters that see the formation for first time and haven't followed the discussion.

Subs and formation changes are interesting topic indeed, especially when they are made. Making 1 in the first half an hour per say when seeing the other team line up is one thing, making one in the last half an hour is different of course.