Another Macron type clown? The kunt said Ukraine has no right to exist. What diplomacy do you expect to achieve here...
Russian invasion of Ukraine | Fewer tweets, more discussion
- Thread starter Wednesday at Stoke
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It’s one thing to keep dialogue open; it is another entirely to give Putin the PR of having a European leader visit him.
Just wait until NATO member head Vicky O visits him.
Yep. At this point every Western politician needs to realise that military force is the only thing that Putin understands. There will be no solution short of his forces being decimated.
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Zalensky has been interviewed by 60 minutes. Just saw the preview… my god this war has aged him.
I thought all the high tech exports were already cut off? We shouldn’t send them anything more high tech than a pencil.
They can get parts to keep their oil and gas business going if they pay $10 million dollars per part.
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More signs that this is the direction Finland and Sweden are headed. The Finns particularly seem to be all but agreed on joining. The window between announcement/accession will have to be very short.
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Apologies for my ignorance I’m not following it too closely. Does Zelensky want NATO to get properly involved, thereby risking a full blown World War breaking out, or does he just want them to do more of the same, I.e. provide them with “kit” and “aid”?
Sorry if this sounds daft/has been discussed but what is the 'benefit' (if that's the right word) for Putin to consider peace talks?
Because ultimately won't he get done by the rest of the international community for war crimes/be killed eventually from within because it's not like sanctions would get lifted immediately and people forget about it. Would he not just go for broke as I imagine he has little else to lose?
Because ultimately won't he get done by the rest of the international community for war crimes/be killed eventually from within because it's not like sanctions would get lifted immediately and people forget about it. Would he not just go for broke as I imagine he has little else to lose?
He would like them to, even though he's understood that what he'll get right now are weapons, intelligence and supplies. But from his perspective why should he be concerned about risking a full blown world war? His country is already fighting for its life.
I'm exaggerating a bit, but just to point out that a world war doesn't rank much higher on a leader's list of concerns when their own country is already suffering significant destruction.
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Interesting read.
The BBC reports:
"German-based defence equipment manufacturer Rheinmetall is preparing to supply 50 used Leopard 1 battle tanks to Ukraine, according to Handelsblatt newspaper.
CEO Armin Papperger tells the newspaper the first tanks could be delivered in six weeks' time, with more to follow over the next three months through a subsidiary - Rheinmetall Italia - if the move is approved by the German government.
The Leopard 1, which first entered service in 1965, is the predecessor to the more modern Leopard 2 currently being fielded by Germany's armed forces.
The tanks have been returned to the company by the countries using them for upgrades.
Papperger says he believes Ukrainian soldiers could be trained to use the tanks in just a few days if they have previous military training."
"German-based defence equipment manufacturer Rheinmetall is preparing to supply 50 used Leopard 1 battle tanks to Ukraine, according to Handelsblatt newspaper.
CEO Armin Papperger tells the newspaper the first tanks could be delivered in six weeks' time, with more to follow over the next three months through a subsidiary - Rheinmetall Italia - if the move is approved by the German government.
The Leopard 1, which first entered service in 1965, is the predecessor to the more modern Leopard 2 currently being fielded by Germany's armed forces.
The tanks have been returned to the company by the countries using them for upgrades.
Papperger says he believes Ukrainian soldiers could be trained to use the tanks in just a few days if they have previous military training."
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In six week's time, the war will most likely be almost over...
If Putin gets full control of the two eastern regions that Russia partially occupied (roughly one third) before the Feb. 24th invasion, plus a fully controlled land corridor linking these across the south to Crimea, then he may well consider this enough to declare "victory" and get serious about peace talks.
It's another question as to whether Ukraine would then be willing to agree at least a ceasefire, or whether they will instead choose to continue fighting in an attempt to push the Russians back.
They will need the tanks for the next phase of the war, the Eastern Front.
Why?
The Eastern phase will start in a couple of weeks by the sounds of it. Six weeks is too long.
Its different having to defend your turf against the Russians versus having to go on the offensive and try and re-take back your territories.
But would that really be enough to take the heat off him? Let's say Ukraine agree, can the world just dust it off and forget, lift all sanctions on Russia? If they are still in place, take ages to go or the world still understandably wants him for war crimes then what's the point (for him) to agree and just stop as he'd still be screwed?
Different situation, same woefully ineffective fighting force.
Putin and Russia (while he's in power) is kinda screwed whatever happens in the Ukraine. I do hope the war ends as fast (whoever the "winner" is) as possible, The misery it inflicts is just too extensive.
Ukraine aren't willing to give up territory, the main reason being it would just encourage Russia to invade again.
"The Ukrainian leader raised the prospect of potential negotiations this week by signaling in an ABC News interview that the separatist regions’ status could be up for discussion, though made clear that he’s not prepared to meet Putin’s demands -- a point driven home by his adviser.
“We will not trade our territories -- not a single inch,” Zhovkva said."
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...eutrality-but-won-t-yield-territory-aide-says
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Unless there is a total withdrawal of all Russian forces to their pre-February 24th positions. I doubt that Ukraine would want sanctions lifted, or that the West will be willing to lift them. Personally, I'd like to see all of the sanctions kept in place until Putin and his cronies leave office (one way or another) and a less nationalist, less aggressive government takes office, even if that takes decades.
Putin is screwed now regardless of what he does. He has failed to take Kyiv, failed to remove Zelenskyy from power, and failed to conquer Ukraine. Moreover, even if he takes full control of the Eastern regions and the southern land corridor, his military will be severely weakened and will lack the capacity to continue much beyond there.
He will of course try to claim "victory", but Russia' economy is tanking and - IMO - his military will never recover back to their pre-February 24th strength.
I haven’t followed the debates in EP, but it is not only Orban against the arm deliveries. Some Western European are sounding very harsh and kind of arrogant toward the “extremist” from the East.
This is an MEP from Ireland lecturing her Bulgarian colleague.
It won’t impact the short term. There are billions in the EPF for the council to do as they please with and they will keep supporting Ukraine defence capabilities. But I am not sure how long the Unity can stand.
This is an MEP from Ireland lecturing her Bulgarian colleague.
It won’t impact the short term. There are billions in the EPF for the council to do as they please with and they will keep supporting Ukraine defence capabilities. But I am not sure how long the Unity can stand.
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For all the new-found Mearsheimer stans:
He’s either willfully ignorant of the facts on the ground or the new Sy Hersh.
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He’s either willfully ignorant of the facts on the ground or the new Sy Hersh.
To minimize the time period for Russia to do something stupid. They don’t really seem to have the resources for it, but accepting Finland into NATO in June but it not being effective until October or something gives them time to make some effort to delay it militarily.
We should invite Mearshimer to the CAF so he can post in the whataboutism thread.
Is she being thick with this quote or what?.
You'd think as an Irish person she'd understand the difference between peace at all costs and liberty. The only reason her voice can be heard in that parliament is because her ancestors took weapons to fight for their independence from the British Empire and for their liberty.
The priority for Ukraine is their survival and their liberty, not peace. They could surrender tomorrow and there'd be "peace" but they won't, cause what's the point of peace if you don't have your liberty and live under Russian yoke? And if they are to fight for their liberty against the invaders and succeed, yes they will need weapons and we'll need to keep applying maximum pressure to Russia.
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I think what she says about NATO is also quite insulting to people form Kosovo... You can be critical of NATO and still acknowledge the good it’s done.
I didn’t even think of that. But yea, Brexitiers would have dragged her out of EU.
Not if Germany keeps funding it.
This MEP is a complete nutter. Check her Wikipedia page. She's a complete fringe, extremist element of the European Parliament.
He's already a mod here, isn't he?
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The 36th Marine Brigade in Mariupol posted what is effectively a farewell message today. They are out of supplies. You have to imagine the city will now fall within a few days. Translation below, taken from Reddit:
Dear Ukrainian people. We are the 36th Navy Brigade named after the counter-admiral Mikhail Bilinsky, left Crimea without betraying the oaths of 2014 and continued to perform the duty of defense of Ukraine. From the beginning of the exit we have been defending Mariupol for 47 days. We were bombed from airplanes, we were shot from artillery, tanks and other firematerials. We kept the defense worthy by doing the impossible. But any resources have a potential to run out.
During the combat, we were once handed 50 122 guns, 20 min a little enlavs and starlink Elon Musk - spybo Elon, he had a lot of air strikes and still works. We have not been handed over any more. Without the possibility of defending themselves, the opponent gradually pushed us to the Azovmash plant, surrounded the fire and now is trying to destroy us. There was an option to bring us reserves to strengthen and boost the defense. There were options for the brigade to make a breakthrough and join their troops. We reported this to OTU East and they started planning the operation. Sodol, Delatitsky tried to do something, but their senior headquarters were closed. We reported about it in the OOS they said hold on we are working, promised a helicopter that never flew. We talked to the commander in chief who promised to unblock. We talked with a Garantee who guaranteed us either a political or military solution of the situation.
For more than a month, the Marines fought without refilling ammunition, without food, without water, almost a lacquer from the puddle and died in packs. The mountain of wounded makes up almost half of the crew. Those who have unbroken limbs and can walk, return in order. Infantry all died and gunfighters are led by gunmen, zenitich, contacts of the driver and the police. Even an orchestra. Dying but fighting. Gradually we are coming to an end. Wise generals advise taking ammunition from your enemy. Probably not extinct these Sava parquettes, so many people will die for them in vain. There were chances. There were opportunities, but due to the silliness, they were not implemented.
No one wants to communicate with us anymore because we are written. Today will probably be an extreme fight since there is no BC left. Next up into the palm of the hand. Further is death for some, but captivity for some. Dear Ukrainian people. I don't know what's next, but I really ask you to remember the Marines with a kind word and no matter how they develop further.
Do not talk badly about the Marines. They did everything possible and impossible. For we are FAITHFUL FOREVER! 11.04.2022.
During the combat, we were once handed 50 122 guns, 20 min a little enlavs and starlink Elon Musk - spybo Elon, he had a lot of air strikes and still works. We have not been handed over any more. Without the possibility of defending themselves, the opponent gradually pushed us to the Azovmash plant, surrounded the fire and now is trying to destroy us. There was an option to bring us reserves to strengthen and boost the defense. There were options for the brigade to make a breakthrough and join their troops. We reported this to OTU East and they started planning the operation. Sodol, Delatitsky tried to do something, but their senior headquarters were closed. We reported about it in the OOS they said hold on we are working, promised a helicopter that never flew. We talked to the commander in chief who promised to unblock. We talked with a Garantee who guaranteed us either a political or military solution of the situation.
For more than a month, the Marines fought without refilling ammunition, without food, without water, almost a lacquer from the puddle and died in packs. The mountain of wounded makes up almost half of the crew. Those who have unbroken limbs and can walk, return in order. Infantry all died and gunfighters are led by gunmen, zenitich, contacts of the driver and the police. Even an orchestra. Dying but fighting. Gradually we are coming to an end. Wise generals advise taking ammunition from your enemy. Probably not extinct these Sava parquettes, so many people will die for them in vain. There were chances. There were opportunities, but due to the silliness, they were not implemented.
No one wants to communicate with us anymore because we are written. Today will probably be an extreme fight since there is no BC left. Next up into the palm of the hand. Further is death for some, but captivity for some. Dear Ukrainian people. I don't know what's next, but I really ask you to remember the Marines with a kind word and no matter how they develop further.
Do not talk badly about the Marines. They did everything possible and impossible. For we are FAITHFUL FOREVER! 11.04.2022.
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The European Parliament has little say in anything though, and its individual members do not speak for nations or even not necessarily for anything other than themselves. Like in national parliaments across the EU, there are nutters voted in and those will say nutty things. I mean, Trudeau was there a few weeks ago and also attacked with all kinds of inflammatory and conspiracy nonsense:
https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/european-members-parliament-attact-trudeau-1.6397579
This person and people like her in the EP will have little or zero influence on EU and national positions.
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