FFS how often do I have to repeat that point on this forum? Haaland and Sancho played 1.5 seasons together, Sancho had 4 strong seasons at Dortmund. Attributing Sancho's stats to Haaland is something lot's of people do on here and it just shows how clueless you are. Just spamming nonsense on here and just proving that you just don't care about having an interest in what your own player did before he came to you.
Should ETH have a say on INEOS transfers or accept whatever he is given?
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This gets repeatedly attributed here as EtH doing all of this for Sancho and helping him, but do we actually know that Sancho really needed that, or wanted it, or enjoyed it? He wasn't pulling any trees but it was not that EtH's pet who replaced him in the starting lineup was doing any better. So if Sancho was against it, suddenly finding yourself training alone in a different country while a championship-level player is starting week after week in that position doesn't necessarily bring you any joy, or confidence.
Screw Sancho though, he is the EtH of managers. Doesn't do much right, but is highly rated.
not really worth getting so worked up over
I had a bad day yesterday and had to have a go at just someone
Obviously needs to be a collaborative process, there’s no point in forcing a player on a manager that doesn’t want him and will just bench him, equally we shouldn’t be letting managers bring in players without them going through proper scrutiny, an acid test of any new recruitment system is, would it have signed Antony.
I wonder how much we paid for it as a club too. A bit convenient that he sent him to the Netherlands to the same amateur clubs/coaches that he had personal links with - like the players we have to buy through his sons agency.
Whenever I see this thread I think about the story concerning LVG and Neuer, LVG was allegedly agaisnt the signing of Neuer because he was happy with Kraft.
Would be stupid to not include him, ultimately he's the manager so signing a player he might not want, or doesn't fit with his tactics, will just be a continuation of the poor transfer policies we've had, same as giving the manager carte blanche on signings as well. There has to be a consencus amongst the decision makers before signing high profile players.
LVG and Kroos here as well.
I don't think that's relevant. If the squads composition doesn't suit the manager anymore - you just get another manager. They're way cheaper to replace than multi-£100m squads.
The average player you sign will play under multiple managers. Players for big fees are signed for 5+ year contracts while nobody in football is stupid enough to give a manager anything longer than a 3 year deal (maybe Klopp being an exception).
What should happen is, the owner and new team should be saying to ETH this is how we want you to play and get the team playing… then they should do the scouting of players that fit in with the philosophy the team is playing and give ETH a few options that they’ve found. Have a way of playing and stick to it… sign players that can play the way you want them too.
David Moyes wanted Thiago didn’t he, we ended up with Fellaini
Moyes didn't want Thiago. He hadn't personally scouted him so we let him go. Same thing with Ander HerreraDavid Moyes wanted Thiago didn’t he, we ended up with Fellaini
We was strongly linked with him though. We had to settle with Fellaini. LVG wanted a lot of good players but we couldn’t get them so we had to settle for his 2nd 3rd choice targets.
Yes, because the groundwork was done by the club only for Moyes to come and piss on it. Moyes spent the summer chasing Fabregas who had no intention of leaving that summer, then settled for panic buying Fellaini and a last ditch attempt at Herrera.
LVG either wanted absolute dogshit like Ron Vlaar or completely unattainable players likes of Arjen Robben and Thomas Miller
Yeah sorry we couldn't get him those players in their prime from Bayern fecking Munich.
LVGs best signings at the club were Shaw, Herrera and Martial - and those 3 had little to do with him. They were club signings and Giggs has more to do with Martial than him.
What tactics?
That’s the player I was thinking of. Not Thiago. I knew Moyes was chasing a midfielder all summer but had to settle with a deadline day move for Fellaini. Ye I remember Herrera and shaw being scouted and wanted before LVG arrived so he just had to accept them. Martial seemed very much like an LVG player. LVG loved his young players, he gave a lot of youth a chance with us. One player LVG did want though and we should be gutted we didn’t get him was Mane. Unfortunately Liverpool beat us to his signing.Yes, because the groundwork was done by the club only for Moyes to come and piss on it. Moyes spent the summer chasing Fabregas who had no intention of leaving that summer, then settled for panic buying Fellaini and a last ditch attempt at Herrera.
LVG either wanted absolute dogshit like Ron Vlaar or completely unattainable players likes of Arjen Robben and Thomas Miller
Yeah sorry we couldn't get him those players in their prime from Bayern fecking Munich.
LVGs best signings at the club were Shaw, Herrera and Martial - and those 3 had little to do with him. They were club signings and Giggs has more to do with Martial than him.
He's a manager. You want him involved in the process but ultimately signings shouldn't be his decisions. If the club can sign Mbappé and Ten Hag says No, club should tell him Tough and sign him anyways. And then ORDER him to play Mbappé
He can't work under those conditions? Sack him. There are plenty of great managers that do
He can't work under those conditions? Sack him. There are plenty of great managers that do
Fair enough - hope today is better!I had a bad day yesterday and had to have a go at just someone
What was the deal with Giggs and Martial?Yes, because the groundwork was done by the club only for Moyes to come and piss on it. Moyes spent the summer chasing Fabregas who had no intention of leaving that summer, then settled for panic buying Fellaini and a last ditch attempt at Herrera.
LVG either wanted absolute dogshit like Ron Vlaar or completely unattainable players likes of Arjen Robben and Thomas Miller
Yeah sorry we couldn't get him those players in their prime from Bayern fecking Munich.
LVGs best signings at the club were Shaw, Herrera and Martial - and those 3 had little to do with him. They were club signings and Giggs has more to do with Martial than him.
Giggs scouted him - this was also confirmed by Giggs in an interview with the Stretford Eng Paddock
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.da...hester-united-ryan-giggs-anthony-17232856.amp
Then Louis Van Gaal said he was recruited for the next manager - the plan at the time was for Giggs to takeover after Louis.
https://www.skysports.com/football/...nthony-martial-bought-for-next-manager-not-me
I'm sure its been already discussed but, Roberto de Zerbi never heard of Joao Pedro prior to Brightons scouting team recommending him.
Maybe it is the way.
Maybe it is the way.
I tend to agree. If your manager isn't Klopp/Guardiola level then you are better off having a clear division of responsibility where Football director determines the overall strategy, Recruitment director buys players that fit the strategy, Manager/Head Coach is chosen due to being a good fit for the strategy and understands their role is simply to win matches using the players chosen for them.
A key element of the overall strategy should be transfer policy. Do we buy young players, star players on the decline, refuse to pay huge fees, target several players for one position then go for the best deal, bring in lots of players on loan and so on ?
If the Manager/Head Coach doesn't get results they get fired under this system. If the Recruitment director doesn't have a decent success rate then they get fired. If the Football director keeps choosing managers/head coaches who make stupid decisions then they get fired.
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Cheers! Never heard that.
He should not have any influence on transfers beside recommendation. He can say for example I like this player, but that should be one of 50 inputs in decision, and not important one. Sporting director should know the way we want to play and which characteristics players in those positions should have, and should look for players like that who also have good attitude and will respect the shirt and fans while working hard on and off the pitch. TH or any other coach should work with what is given to him. He should be able to say OK, this one did not work, I can not work with him, I want replacement for him in that position and that is it.
Moyes turned him down.David Moyes wanted Thiago didn’t he, we ended up with Fellaini
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In a perfect world - the manager and the sporting director will work together to find the right players. The time when a manager could make decision all by himself is over - at least in successful clubs. But at the same time - you cant have a situation where the top management signs players the manager doesn't want
Fair enough. Think it was actually Fabregas I meant, was saying to someone els earlier. It was Fabregas he chased all summer but we ended up with Fellaini.
Of course he should have some say in who the club targets and signs, but his judgement of players and their worth so far has been extremely questionable, so I'm not sure how much influence he will be allowed!
Pep surely?
Pep himself doesn't sign long term contracts IIRC. Might be wrong
Yep, he usually does 2-3 years contracts.
For me it depends.
If there is a relatively low risk transfer that ETH is convinced will make a big difference to our season and is available in January, it may be one they would look at.
But generally speaking, I presume they want to improve our structure having identified the ridiculous sums we have wasted. Which ultimately means not putting all faith in a manager. But we probably haven't got the exact staff and acumen in place that they want to achieve that with, so it's easier said than done.
So it's probably something they'll look at on a case by case basis depending on the market. I don't think they're just going to hand over a cheque book to ETH, no.
If there is a relatively low risk transfer that ETH is convinced will make a big difference to our season and is available in January, it may be one they would look at.
But generally speaking, I presume they want to improve our structure having identified the ridiculous sums we have wasted. Which ultimately means not putting all faith in a manager. But we probably haven't got the exact staff and acumen in place that they want to achieve that with, so it's easier said than done.
So it's probably something they'll look at on a case by case basis depending on the market. I don't think they're just going to hand over a cheque book to ETH, no.
Very good question, so difficult to answer. Should he have a say we run the risk of getting a player for his philosophy which says we're somewhat committing to his future. If the club buys a player and it doesn't work out, we get a backlash akin to the Glazers ie we don't know what we're doing so it's very risky. That being said if a low risk player who can help is available for a reasonable price then we can't afford to miss the chance otherwise Europe is a very unlikely possibility. Cutting wages seems to be the priority so to me it looks like we're making space for at least a loan.
Sure you can. Look at Real Madrid
As far as this window is concerned, I imagine the only business done will be either on the extremely cheap(especially loan deals) or can't miss opportunities - like say if Mbappé were available. For the former, I imagine Ten Hag would be involved to the degree of asking him what roles he feels need strenghtening. For the latter you don't need the manager's input
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