The "England have had it easy" narrative

Redlambs said:
I'm sorry, google doesn't translate gibberish. Any chance you could make more sense?




Yeah, feck Croatia and their shit team England should have walked all over. What was I thinking eh?
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Translation - your players are bang average beating Sweden had everyone deluded to their ability

Croatia - see point 1 with all your great players why would you not fancy beating Croatia unless the delusion is real and as I said all along players are bang average

Having 1 game against Croatia to get to a final and playing how you did was abysmal
 
Well whatever about people's thoughts on England's pathway to the semi's, I'd imagine that with a civil war this acrimonious seemingly breaking out, we'll probably need a massive group hugging session before the start of the season. :lol:
 
There was not enough quality in the end. Kane needs balls, his game is not made on creating magic himself. Midfield is good, but no world beaters, and the defense is good when things go well but under pressure and when grit is most needed they are prone to mistakes. This system was ideal for England and the togetherness is what drove this team forward (Im not english by the way).

A semi final and a potential third place would be a massive step up and that should be applauded in the end.
 
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We were given a ridiculously easy run to the semi finals. Whilst it was nice that we stayed in the World Cup a bit longer and won a few extra games, it still masked our obvious deficiencies across the whole team.

We weren't amazing, nor abysmal.

I'd say we played to our level and went as far as we could.

The disappointment comes when you analyse how weak the side of the draw we were on was and the likelihood of such an event occurring again.
 
rpitchfo said:
I can’t find a reason to critique the defence. Thought they all did well generally. Our entire team was set up for sterling tonight and he had the ball and the chances but had no end product. You can lead a horse to water....
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I think Sterling's been our poorest player, but our system doesn't work because it asks the centrebacks to do things they just aren't very good at. You can't use centrebacks to compensate for having no midfield...especially when all of them are far too slow on the ball. When you have world class midfielders playing directly against your back line it's never likely to end well. When you have world class midfielders playing directly against your back line, and one of your back line rolling the ball under his foot while he's fecking pointing where he's going to pass it, you have major problems.

It wasn't all set up foor Sterling. He has pace and their defneders don't so his movement was always going to cause problems and be an outlet. Why you play someone with such poor end product in a central role like that I'm not sure but swapping him with Rashford for example, wouldn't have fixed a broken system. The second half onwards the ball wasn't getting to areas of the pitch where it mattered who was up top.
 
LazyRed-Ninja said:
There was not enough quality in the end. Kane needs balls, he game is not made on creating magic himself. Midfield is good, but no world beaters, and the defense is good when things go well but under pressure and when grit is most needed they are prone to mistakes. This system was ideal for England and the togetherness is what drove this team forward (Im not english by the way).

A semi final and a potential third place would be a massive step up and that should be applauded in the end.
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Do you really think midfield is good?

Henderson is awful on the ball you couldn’t retain it for 5 passes second half.

Alli sterling and lingard are not footballers in that sense of controlling tempo at all they are all good at getting on the end of a supply in the box yet for England they look poor because they have zero supply from
Henderson
 
automaticflare said:
Translation - your players are bang average beating Sweden had everyone deluded to their ability

Croatia - see point 1 with all your great players why would you not fancy beating Croatia unless the delusion is real and as I said all along players are bang average

Having 1 game against Croatia to get to a final and playing how you did was abysmal and a bottle job
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So yeah, you are just talking utter shit.

Unless, of course, you can point to a single post of mine where I've ever said we have such great players? Or where I said beating Sweden proves we are so brilliant?

Or are you making all that up to prove some half-arsed point about England expectations. Btw where are you from exactly?
 
noodlehair said:
I think Sterling's been our poorest player, but our system doesn't work because it asks the centrebacks to do things they just aren't very good at. You can't use centrebacks to compensate for having no midfield...especially when all of them are far too slow on the ball. When you have world class midfielders playing directly against your back line it's never likely to end well. When you have world class midfielders playing directly against your back line, and one of your back line rolling the ball under his foot while he's fecking pointing where he's going to pass it, you have major problems.

It wasn't all set up foor Sterling. He has pace and their defneders don't so his movement was always going to cause problems and be an outlet. Why you play someone with such poor end product in a central role like that I'm not sure but swapping him with Rashford for example, wouldn't have fixed a broken system. The second half onwards the ball wasn't getting to areas of the pitch where it mattered who was up top.
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Agree on the center halves part, I think your midfield is awful and that was exposed the 2 times you played against a decent side
 
automaticflare said:
Do you really think midfield is good?

Henderson is awful on the ball you couldn’t retain it for 5 passes second half.

Alli sterling and lingard are not footballers in that sense of controlling tempo at all they are all good at getting on the end of a supply in the box yet for England they look poor because they have zero supply from
Henderson
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I actually intended not to use the word good to be fair- they were good in this system but they are no world beaters as anyone with a rational mind here would agree with.
 
OutOfTowner said:
Well whatever about people's thoughts on England's pathway to the semi's, I'd imagine that with a civil war this acrimonious seemingly breaking out, we'll probably need a massive group hugging session before the start of the season. :lol:
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Have no fear, the real enemy returns then.
 
first proper challenge against a 2nd tier side they failed which is about where they are

they had the energy on Croatia and went fo r it - which is exactly what i would have done

Belief sapped from them when they conceded though- maybe a realisation that in terms of quality they arent that good

the lack of goals in open play are a reflection of quality
 
Redlambs said:
So yeah, you are just talking utter shit.

Unless, of course, you can point to a single post of mine where I've ever said we have such great players? Or where I said beating Sweden proves we are so brilliant?

Or are you making all that up to prove some half-arsed point about England expectations. Btw where are you from exactly?
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Not really pointing fingers here at you the general perception was as I stated. Majority of people thought players were better than they were after the Sweden game which has media and a lot of fans talking about finals instead of worrying about Croatia.

Modric said as such in his interview too.

One game over inflated expectations and now after the game it is all seeetness and light well we didn’t really expect to beat Croatia anyways, great tournament etc etc

Almost bi polar
 
automaticflare said:
Not really pointing fingers here at you the general perception was as I stated. Majority of people thought players were better than they were after the Sweden game which has media and a lot of fans talking about finals instead of worrying about Croatia.

Modric said as such in his interview too.

One game over inflated expectations and now after the game it is all seeetness and light well we didn’t really expect to beat Croatia anyways, great tournament etc etc

Bi polar
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So you are making assumptions all round and posting them as facts? Go you.

You didn't answer my question either, but hey I didn't honestly expect you to.
 
I guess the people that were writing 4 paragraph essays on how Colombia and Sweden are tougher than Germany, Brazil etc have disappeared huh?
 
automaticflare said:
Not really pointing fingers here at you the general perception was as I stated. Majority of people thought players were better than they were after the Sweden game which has media and a lot of fans talking about finals instead of worrying about Croatia.

Modric said as such in his interview too.

One game over inflated expectations and now after the game it is all seeetness and light well we didn’t really expect to beat Croatia anyways, great tournament etc etc

Almost bi polar
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Southgate was the only one talking sense after every game, trying to keep expectations in check and keeping the pressure off the players. Got to laugh at the media who all declared Southgate to be very wise, only to completely ignore everything he said, and whip up all the "It's Coming Home" stuff instead.
 
Redlambs said:
So you are making assumptions all round and posting them as facts? Go you.

You didn't answer my question either, but hey I didn't honestly expect you to.
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It is a fact that majority of people’s expecatations were changed after losing to Belgium and beating Sweden that is a fact

Expectations changed is the problem
Much like united v Liverpool where based on nothing they have best players on the planet etc etc but can’t believe we beat them.

Excitement is different than expectations I can see how folks get obviously excited about a semi final of a World Cup, not to be sniffed at but when you get there by beating pnaman, Tunisia, losing to Belgium beating Colombia on penos and then Sweden what was achieved? Anyone you played half decent beat you yet expectations soared: I can’t explain that phenomenon. It is like scouse logic outbreaks in all of England when it is World Cup time.

So just like when united beat Liverpool after listening to weeks of shit in the lead up and I slag my mates off I will do the same here
 
automaticflare said:
Not really pointing fingers here at you the general perception was as I stated. Majority of people thought players were better than they were after the Sweden game which has media and a lot of fans talking about finals instead of worrying about Croatia.

Modric said as such in his interview too.

One game over inflated expectations and now after the game it is all seeetness and light well we didn’t really expect to beat Croatia anyways, great tournament etc etc

Almost bi polar
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What a load of bollocks. What fans aren't going to dream of a final after getting to a semi final of the WC.

Yes, the players and staff need to focus one game at a time but fans don't have that restriction.

Reality is most England fans understood the limitations of the team and hoped for some luck to get us into the final and beyond.
 
Fluctuation0161 said:
What a load of bollocks. What fans aren't going to dream of a final after getting to a semi final of the WC.

Yes, the players and staff need to focus one gave at a time but fans don't have that restriction.

Reality is most England fans understood the limitations of the team and hoped for some luck to get us into the final and beyond.
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That’s not true your expectations changed in the majority after surprisingly enough losing to Belgium
 
shaky said:
Southgate was the only one talking sense after every game, trying to keep expectations in check and keeping the pressure off the players. Got to laugh at the media who all declared Southgate to be very wise, only to completely ignore everything he said, and whip up all the "It's Coming Home" stuff instead.
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I found that hilarious. Glad I wasn’t only one who noticed it. I think at one point Ian Wright complained about Southgate not being on the bandwagon like all other fans. Crazy
 
automaticflare said:
It is a fact that majority of people’s expecatations were changed after beating Sweden that is a fact

Expectations changed is the problem
Much like united v Liverpool where based on nothing they have best players on the planet etc etc but can’t believe we beat them.

Excitement is different than expectations I can see how folks get obviously excited about a semi final of a World Cup, not to be sniffed at but when you get there by beating pnaman, Tunisia, losing to Belgium beating Colombia on penos and then Sweden what was achieved? Anyone you played half decent beat you yet expectations soared: I can’t explain that phenomenon. It is like scouse logic outbreaks in all of England when it is World Cup time.

So just like when united beat Liverpool after listening to weeks of shit in the lead up and I slag my mates off I will do the same here
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You don't understand the meaning of the word "fact". I also highly doubt your mates are a fair representation of what the "majority" of England fans think when pissed up down the pub giving each other stick.

Why is it so hard for you to say where you are from btw? Are you ashamed of it, or is it just easier to hide behind complete anonymity when spouting nonsense?
 
Redlambs said:
You don't understand the meaning of the word "fact". I also highly doubt your mates are a fair representation of what the "majority" of England fans think when pissed up down the pub giving each other stick.

Why is it so hard for you to say where you are from btw? Are you ashamed of it, or is it just easier to hide behind complete anonymity when spouting nonsense?
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Facts my friend facts doesn’t matter where I am from really does it
 
automaticflare said:
That’s not true your expectations changed in the majority after surprisingly enough losing to Belgium
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I disagree.

I'd concede that people were more hopeful after beating Sweden. But general consensus was that we've had such low expectations for England for so long we were enjoying being surprised.
 
Fluctuation0161 said:
I disagree.

I'd concede that people were more hopeful after beating Sweden. But general consensus was that we've had such low expectations for England for so long we were enjoying being surprised.
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Once again the only people who seem to care about what the English media say are people who aren't actually English.

Nobody I know even came close to giving us a shot at getting this far, at best we were hopeful of actually doing something tonight, but not a single one of us could even bring ourselves to stick even a tenner on it :lol:
 
The england squad went to russia with certain expectations and now its coming home having surpassed them. Time will tell if there has been a turning point, naturally questions remain having only beaten panama tunisia and sweden in normal time. But theyve done what was arguably their biggest goal which was to engage the public again and start turning the negative tide associated with their team. They can come home happy , if a little heaetbroken wondering if theyl ever have such a good chance again
 
Red4Ever said:
Not anymore they didn’t

Though I thought a tired Croatia team were there to be beaten.

Well done England but the suspicion was a decent team would beat them
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People keep saying this, but Croatia didn't look that tired to me. Towards the end a couple of their players were struggling, but so were a few England ones, it happens in extra time. They pressed extremely well throughout the game and generally looked like they had decent energy levels, it was nothing like the exhausted Croatian side many were predicting. It obviously helps that they saw a lot of the ball and were able to press in stages, but I certainly didn't see a team out there who looked off their feet.

Think we need to give Croatia more credit too, they're more than a 'decent' team and are in a world cup final. Sure, they've had a few less than great performances along the way, but they dismantled Argentina in the groups and showed great mental strength to win two shootouts and come from behind against England. People are declaring France the winners but I don't see it, this Croatian team has some serious talent in midfield (Modric is incredible) and the likes of Perisic and Mandzukic have the tools to hurt any side. It's a side with a great spirit and plenty of talent, no shame in losing to them.
 
SquishyMcSquish said:
People keep saying this, but Croatia didn't look that tired to me. Towards the end a couple of their players were struggling, but so were a few England ones, it happens in extra time. They pressed extremely well throughout the game and generally looked like they had decent energy levels, it was nothing like the exhausted Croatian side many were predicting. It obviously helps that they saw a lot of the ball and were able to press in stages, but I certainly didn't see a team out there who looked off their feet.

Think we need to give Croatia more credit too, they're more than a 'decent' team and are in a world cup final. Sure, they've had a few less than great performances along the way, but they dismantled Argentina in the groups and showed great mental strength to win two shootouts and come from behind against England. People are declaring France the winners but I don't see it, this Croatian team has some serious talent in midfield (Modric is incredible) and the likes of Perisic and Mandzukic have the tools to hurt any side. It's a side with a great spirit and plenty of talent, no shame in losing to them.
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Yup

Croatia must have been tired though
Amazing resilience

Full marks to them
 
SquishyMcSquish said:
People keep saying this, but Croatia didn't look that tired to me. Towards the end a couple of their players were struggling, but so were a few England ones, it happens in extra time. They pressed extremely well throughout the game and generally looked like they had decent energy levels, it was nothing like the exhausted Croatian side many were predicting. It obviously helps that they saw a lot of the ball and were able to press in stages, but I certainly didn't see a team out there who looked off their feet.

Think we need to give Croatia more credit too, they're more than a 'decent' team and are in a world cup final. Sure, they've had a few less than great performances along the way, but they dismantled Argentina in the groups and showed great mental strength to win two shootouts and come from behind against England. People are declaring France the winners but I don't see it, this Croatian team has some serious talent in midfield (Modric is incredible) and the likes of Perisic and Mandzukic have the tools to hurt any side. It's a side with a great spirit and plenty of talent, no shame in losing to them.
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Think most people accept after tonight that Croatia should give France a game much better than England could.
 
Massive Spanner said:
It's the English media love in that does it for me. We'd never hear the fecking end of it if they did win it.
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Its the same on every country, the only difference is that the England football media has huge influence around the World.
 
I thought England would've beaten France because they would share posession more. Croatia loss must sting much more because of that huahauhua.
 
There's talk of it being a young team, they'll learn mature, etc

I hate to tell you but it's a load of balls

It's a bang average team at best,(vast)majority of the goals came from set pieces/pens

Some of the absolute tripe that has come from the pundits/experts and commentators about how England are the better team, how they just need to have patience/just not get emotionally involved/keep doing what they're doing is absolute nonsense.

Listing to Guy Mowbray portraying them as one of the greatest footballing teams to Grace our screens was truly mind boggling, 'look at them stroking the ball around it's hard to believe this is England' vs Sweden as they knock a few passes about in their own half as if it's Barca picking Real Madrid apart...

Gary Neville playing the constant tune that England are the better team and it's fine when it's clear they're not any better than who they're playing (Colombia/Croatia/Belgium)

Gems from the likes of Lee Dixon tonight at half time ''Croatia aren't a good team' give me strength

TL;DR

Having a few big lads that cause people issues on corners and free kicks doesn't make you a good footballing team
 
buckooo1978 said:
first proper challenge against a 2nd tier side they failed which is about where they are

they had the energy on Croatia and went fo r it - which is exactly what i would have done

Belief sapped from them when they conceded though- maybe a realisation that in terms of quality they arent that good

the lack of goals in open play are a reflection of quality
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2nd tier side according to who?
 
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