The Search for a Midfielder

[Jonno]

I gave an opinion on McTominay, to me he looks like Cleverley or Gibson, a solid, run of the mill player that will have a decent career, promoting youth is fine but they have to actually be good enough, I don't see anything from McTominay that seperates him from the players I mentioned, most youth players that pop up in our side end up moving on to have a lower level career than being main players for United, that's just reality.

As for the rest, I don't give a shit about 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, cups or points, it's progress at the expense of turning our club over to this poisonous man and his ugly footballing methods. I don't complain about the results, whether we win or lose it's the same soul destroying experience under Mourinho, the man is toxic and it's not worth selling the clubs soul to him in the desperate hope he can bludgeon his way to a PL title IMO, it would be hollow done his way.

I thought I could sense an agenda here.

I feel sorry for you at this stage being so dead-set against the manager, because Mourinho is here to stay and he's going to win many trophies here.

I'm excited for the future, because I've watched some god-awful football under Moyes and LVG for 3 years so I've really enjoyed this re-build and this transformation of weak mentalities and floating around the top half of the table.

And on McTomminay, it's incredibly lazy to liken him to other United academy midfielders like Gibson and Cleverley. You've only seen him 20 times and you don't know the full extent of his potential, and neither do I. But truth is, if one of the most successful managers currently in the game believes in him then I'm willing to give him a chance.

Strange that a fan so passionate about seeing the 'United way' is so quick to completely shut down the mere thought of our latest academy prospect having a chance to succeed in our first team.

Gibson was an incredibly average player who packed a good shot and a decent hollywood pass. What has McTomminay done to suggest that he is anything near similar to Gibson, apart from play the same position? Cleverley was incredibly short and lightweight who liked to play a quick, nimble, short passing game. What has the 6 foot 4 strong young McTomminay done to suggest that he is anything near similar to Cleverley, apart from play the same position?

Very lazy to compare them.

 

[Jonno]

Best post I’ve saw in a long time.

Thank you, so good to see another realist on here. Place has gone mad.

 

[Devil may care]

I thought I could sense an agenda here.

I feel sorry for you at this stage being so dead-set against the manager, because Mourinho is here to stay and he's going to win many trophies here.

I'm excited for the future, because I've watched some god-awful football under Moyes and LVG for 3 years so I've really enjoyed this re-build and this transformation of weak mentalities and floating around the top half of the table.

There's no agenda, Mourinho is just like LvG, he has turned United into a chore to watch IMO, you are happy because results are better and that is your core point of focus, if that is what you care about then cool, I'm not trying to change your mind or label you with lazy terms.

I do disagree that he'll be here for a long time, he's outclassed by Pep these days and his attitude and nature will always lead to an implosion, hopefully you get one of the cups you covet before he crashes, but I'd count more on bagging the minor stuff until his fuse lights and we have to replace him.

 

[Canagel]

If Chelsea don’t get Champions League football next season then would a move for Kante be a good idea ? Been seeing reports for a few days about clubs being interested in him especially PSG.

No Champions League football I think will see Hazard and Courtois both leave but I think if it’s possible to get Kante then surely we should go all out for him ? Can you imagine a trio of Kante, Matic and Pogba starting for us ?.

Nice idea but we need someone more creative than Kante if we're buying only 1 midfielder. If we bought Kante it would be to replace Matic actually. I wouldn't mind that at all. He is a much better DM than Matic. But since we're probably going to buy just 1 midfielder he has to be more creative, able to control games and be more of a goal threat. Thiago for example.

 

[Ekeke]

But he would certainly be good enough to be our 6th choice central midfielder behind Pogba, Herrera, Matic, (New signing), Fellaini?

Oh sorry, had the person you were responding to ignored so I only saw your post and thought it was in response to the thread in general rather than what you quoted

 

[Jonno]

Oh sorry, had the person you were responding to ignored so I only saw your post and thought it was in response to the thread in general rather than what you quoted

Oh haha! Maybe I should also be ignoring the same person hey.

 

[Ali Dia]

Thiago hands down if possible. Threat going forward but seems to like playing a little deeper and is actually quite responsible defensively. Watched a good bit of him this season and still think he can get better in the role, and his ceiling is higher than the other midfielders. Even last night he looked like the perfect player to act as a go between for Matic and Pogba.

I muppeted so hard for him and then Vidal. Both would have talismanic players for us. I think the ship has probably sailed but Thiago would still be an interesting signing.

 

[Jonno]

There's no agenda, Mourinho is just like LvG, he has turned United into a chore to watch IMO, you are happy because results are better and that is your core point of focus, if that is what you care about then cool, I'm not trying to change your mind or label you with lazy terms.

I do disagree that he'll be here for a long time, he's outclassed by Pep these days and his attitude and nature will always lead to an implosion, hopefully you get one of the cups you covet before he crashes, but I'd count more on bagging the minor stuff until his fuse lights and we have to replace him.

Completely outclassed by Pep? Because Pep took over a much better team, spent more money improving the much better team and won more than United? How is that outclassed? City have had a great season, a record breaking season - is that Mourinho's fault? Do you think they inherited squads of equal ability? City had a strategic recruitment policy for about 3 seasons before Pep even arrived. He inherited a squad of peak players like KDB, Fernandinho, Kompany, Aguero, Silva, Sterling, etc etc etc, ready for fine tuning. Compare that to Rooney, Depay, Januzaj, Schneiderlin. etc that Mourinho inherited.... a squad broken from 1 expired regime and 2 failed regimes and had to replace an entire spine whilst still winning cups.

You're basing this implosion prediction on managing Chelsea and Real Madrid..... two clubs who continuously turn over their managers. He has won everything, everywhere and has said openly he wants a long term project.

Woodward has already extended his contract once, given him countless public praise, Mourinho himself has said he wants to stay here as long as possible, all the noises and signs are pointing towards a long stay.

Sorry mate, but this "poisonous man" as you described him is here to "destroy" Manchester United by improving their squad each summer, winning trophies and progressively improving their league position.

 

[Rozay]

Completely outclassed by Pep? Because Pep took over a much better team, spent more money improving the much better team and won more than United? How is that outclassed? City have had a great season, a record breaking season - is that Mourinho's fault? Do you think they inherited squads of equal ability? City had a strategic recruitment policy for about 3 seasons before Pep even arrived. He inherited a squad of peak players like KDB, Fernandinho, Kompany, Aguero, Silva, Sterling, etc etc etc, ready for fine tuning. Compare that to Rooney, Depay, Januzaj, Schneiderlin. etc that Mourinho inherited.... a squad broken from 1 expired regime and 2 failed regimes and had to replace an entire spine whilst still winning cups.

You're basing this implosion prediction on managing Chelsea and Real Madrid..... two clubs who continuously turn over their managers. He has won everything, everywhere and has said openly he wants a long term project.

Woodward has already extended his contract once, given him countless public praise, Mourinho himself has said he wants to stay here as long as possible, all the noises and signs are pointing towards a long stay.

Sorry mate, but this "poisonous man" as you described him is here to "destroy" Manchester United by improving their squad each summer, winning trophies and progressively improving their league position.

I agree with your general sentiment on Jose, but the difference between him and Pep this season is pretty easy to call, and I would put it in the ‘extremel unlikely’ category that Jose would have City playing the same way. He may win the league if their jobs were swapped, but probably by nowhere near the same margin.

The difference between Jose and Pep this season hasn’t been Kevin de Bruyne! There is an attacking verve and intent that we don’t have, that the likes of Pep and Klopp clearly prioritise over Jose. I’m not confident that if we signed, I dunno, Mbappé to play right side, that we will be as exciting going forward as City or Liverpool.

I haven’t given up hope of winning titles next season, I just think it will be without matching the level of dominance Pep has shown.

 

[Gordon S]

Completely outclassed by Pep? Because Pep took over a much better team, spent more money improving the much better team and won more than United? How is that outclassed? City have had a great season, a record breaking season - is that Mourinho's fault? Do you think they inherited squads of equal ability? City had a strategic recruitment policy for about 3 seasons before Pep even arrived. He inherited a squad of peak players like KDB, Fernandinho, Kompany, Aguero, Silva, Sterling, etc etc etc, ready for fine tuning. Compare that to Rooney, Depay, Januzaj, Schneiderlin. etc that Mourinho inherited.... a squad broken from 1 expired regime and 2 failed regimes and had to replace an entire spine whilst still winning cups.

You're basing this implosion prediction on managing Chelsea and Real Madrid..... two clubs who continuously turn over their managers. He has won everything, everywhere and has said openly he wants a long term project.

Woodward has already extended his contract once, given him countless public praise, Mourinho himself has said he wants to stay here as long as possible, all the noises and signs are pointing towards a long stay.

Sorry mate, but this "poisonous man" as you described him is here to "destroy" Manchester United by improving their squad each summer, winning trophies and progressively improving their league position.

Don't think you have to compare us with City to see our football is slow and laboured. Even if we're picking up points at a good rate, we're just not that easy on the eyes.

Pretty sure Mourinho is concentrating almost entirely on results at the moment, but i can't imagine he is happy with the way we play most games. He knows he has to make us play better next season.

He didn't inherit a very good, well balanced squad, but he's had 4 transfer windows and almost full backing from the club to fix that problem. Mourinho is not doing bad at all and probably needs more time but at the same time he hasn't done enough to escape criticism.

 

[Kaos]

I thought I could sense an agenda here.

I feel sorry for you at this stage being so dead-set against the manager, because Mourinho is here to stay and he's going to win many trophies here.

I'm excited for the future, because I've watched some god-awful football under Moyes and LVG for 3 years so I've really enjoyed this re-build and this transformation of weak mentalities and floating around the top half of the table.

And on McTomminay, it's incredibly lazy to liken him to other United academy midfielders like Gibson and Cleverley. You've only seen him 20 times and you don't know the full extent of his potential, and neither do I. But truth is, if one of the most successful managers currently in the game believes in him then I'm willing to give him a chance.

Strange that a fan so passionate about seeing the 'United way' is so quick to completely shut down the mere thought of our latest academy prospect having a chance to succeed in our first team.

Gibson was an incredibly average player who packed a good shot and a decent hollywood pass. What has McTomminay done to suggest that he is anything near similar to Gibson, apart from play the same position? Cleverley was incredibly short and lightweight who liked to play a quick, nimble, short passing game. What has the 6 foot 4 strong young McTomminay done to suggest that he is anything near similar to Cleverley, apart from play the same position?

Very lazy to compare them.

There’s not a lot I disagree with there but I do think the poster you quote does have a point about Mourinho’s play style.

There’s no doubting his winning mentality but his approach to the game is disappointing to say the least. A club with our resources should not have to pick between attractive football or success. And the concerning thing is it looks like Mourinho is too stubborn to his own detriment where instead of adapting he simply doubles down. Our games against Sevilla and West Brom exemplify that, As does his unapologetic response to those calamities.

He deserves credit for stabilising the club but unless he adapts I don’t feel excited with the prospect of him our long term vision, especially if we’re going to be offloading our more exciting talents to make room for the archetypal Mourinho players (ala Salah, KdB etc).

 

[ManuMou]

I think Paul Scholes is coming back

 

[Ramshock]

We finished 6th last season under the same manager. People were expecting to at least challenge for the title properly instead of giving up on it before New Year. Also, progressing further in CL ( knocking Sevilla out) was quite a realistic expectation as well. After having bought 6-7 players was it not? What if we sign more players and spend more that City this summer and still fall short in the league, will it be acceptable too? If we are having a decent season, then Pool are having a brilliant one.

Some people just cant see the wood for the trees

 

[sunama]

Funny that, because you are disregarding McTomminay at the age of 21, 1 year into his Manchester United senior career, yet you're harping away on here that we don't resemble Manchester United, a side who are famous for promoting youth. We're also in our 3rd cup final in barely 2 seasons, as side famous for being in cup finals.

I thought Manchester United promoted youth, scored late goals and won trophies? Sure the football isn't as attacking as many would like, but Mourinho is getting the results and winning trophies. We haven't won the Premier League yet, but if you can't see the re-building and progress he has made in the Premier League then you need to take a much closer look. We're going to break the 80 points barrier, are you ignorant to that? The way you described us in your last post you make us sound like a 15th place Pulis side. We're firmly in 2nd place, have recently beaten every side around us and are in yet another cup final. Yet you're throwing your toys out of the pram because we haven't scored 100 goals and got 95 points.

United fans that 'expect' us to play scintillating football, winning the Premier League every year 'because we're Manchester United' and 'because we once had Fergie' are simply spoilt. Born in 1987, all I've ever seen is United dominate, but I'm also a realist and know that we have no divine right to win anything. You're comparing Mourinho's United to Fergies finest and you should be comparing it to the one he took over, LVG's which had Rooney as a central midfielder, Depay on the wing, Schneiderlin and Schweinsteiger as our central midfielders, Darmian and Rojo as our wingbacks and ask yourself why we are 'only 2nd' in the Premier League. See the progress.

Excellent!!!
I shall be re-quoting this post several times.

It really does seem that several of the posters on here have become spoilt and demand immediate results.
They are quick to praise opponents, but berate our own club, players and manager.
The praise I see heaped on MCFC and LFC is sickening. Do these people understand the concept of supporting a club? Praising your opponent should be the last thing any supporter should be doing.
Under Fergie we had a siege mentality. Us vs everybody else. These newer fans need to understand this.

 

[sunama]

We finished 6th last season under the same manager. People were expecting to at least challenge for the title properly instead of giving up on it before New Year. Also, progressing further in CL ( knocking Sevilla out) was quite a realistic expectation as well. After having bought 6-7 players was it not? What if we sign more players and spend more that City this summer and still fall short in the league, will it be acceptable too? If we are having a decent season, then Pool are having a brilliant one.

You do realise that MCFC have broken all sorts of records?
In effect, you are saying that because Jose and our players have not broken EPL records that they have done a terrible job.

We have progressed and for the first time in many years, have got 2nd place.
We also progressed further in the CL. I accept that Jose screwed that Sevilla game up, but that one game forced him to reconsider his strategy. Since then we have beaten all our closest rivals.
LFC, who everyone rates highly got beaten by us. At Anfield, where they score stacks of goals - they could not score again us.
MCFC - people on this forum, worship at Pep's altar (and IMO, this should carry a suspension, it's becoming so irritating) - they got smashed in the 2nd half, in their own stadium! I don't think they ever envisaged that any team could come back at them like we did.
Poch - the guy who many want to replace Jose, with immediate effect. He got beat as well, in what was effectively a home game for them.
We have won 7 out of our last 8 league games, which is insanely good, when you consider our performances in the league, during the last 4-5 years.

Next year, the only progression we can make is to win the title (or get very very close) and go deep into the CL knockout stages. And I fully expect us to achieve on both accounts.

This negative narrative that our manager is crap, our players are crap and the club is crap, needs to stop. We've had a good season and Jose is clearly putting a team together which has the mentality required to win the league.

 

[Devil may care]

Completely outclassed by Pep? Because Pep took over a much better team, spent more money improving the much better team and won more than United? How is that outclassed? City have had a great season, a record breaking season - is that Mourinho's fault? Do you think they inherited squads of equal ability? City had a strategic recruitment policy for about 3 seasons before Pep even arrived. He inherited a squad of peak players like KDB, Fernandinho, Kompany, Aguero, Silva, Sterling, etc etc etc, ready for fine tuning. Compare that to Rooney, Depay, Januzaj, Schneiderlin. etc that Mourinho inherited.... a squad broken from 1 expired regime and 2 failed regimes and had to replace an entire spine whilst still winning cups.

You're basing this implosion prediction on managing Chelsea and Real Madrid..... two clubs who continuously turn over their managers. He has won everything, everywhere and has said openly he wants a long term project.

Woodward has already extended his contract once, given him countless public praise, Mourinho himself has said he wants to stay here as long as possible, all the noises and signs are pointing towards a long stay.

Sorry mate, but this "poisonous man" as you described him is here to "destroy" Manchester United by improving their squad each summer, winning trophies and progressively improving their league position.

Guardiola has a trio of kids playing like world beaters up front, meanwhile Mourinho has struggled to get the best from Pogba and Martial who are equally as talented and manged to take a player like Herrera who was our player of the season last season and completely marginalize him while trying to shoehorn Pogba into a system he doesn't function well in. Pep's entire style of play invigorates young talents and inspires them, same with Klopp and Poch, Mourinho destroys flair players confidence and he'd rather rely on shite like Fellaini and ugly, negative football than trying to inbue the team with a footballing ethos.

We extended his contract by one year, that doesn't mean anything, his implosion is based off his nature, he's a narcissist who blames everyone but himself for everything that goes wrong, when we fail to do anything but fish for the secondary pots while playing shite football again next season his meltdown will come, I'm far from the only fan that cares more about the way we play than about a few points progression under his horrific style of play, and those like you that only care about trophies will soon turn when all we win are the secondary pots.

 

[J_XO]

Koke on the right of a midfield three anyone?

 

[Jonno]

Guardiola has a trio of kids playing like world beaters up front, meanwhile Mourinho has struggled to get the best from Pogba and Martial who are equally as talented and manged to take a player like Herrera who was our player of the season last season and completely marginalize him while trying to shoehorn Pogba into a system he doesn't function well in.

You can be the most talented player on the planet but if you're mentality isn't right then you won't succeed I'm afraid. The problems I've seen Pogba faced with this season seem to stem from his own attitude and persona. The fact we see him regularly pop up in the final 3rd of the pitch means he IS allowed license to drive forward into attacking areas, it's just that he doesn't always apply himself. The fact he tries audacious turns in the middle of the pitch and often gets tackled stems back to his mentality in match situations. Nothing to do with Mourinho at all. You don't see McTomminay play like that, and he's been practically moulded by Mourinho.

So your agrument that Pep gets the best out of his players and Mourinho doesn't get the best out of his is a flawed argument. You're completely ignoring the fact that our squad isn't as good as theirs. Yet we still find ourselves breaking the 80 point barrier for the first time in 5 years - so he's clearly getting the best out of the majority of the squad.

Mourinho destroys flair players confidence and he'd rather rely on shite like Fellaini and ugly, negative football than trying to inbue the team with a footballing ethos.

I seem to rember Hazard playing pretty well under Mourinho, and Oscar, and Lampard, and Ronaldo, and countless other flair players. All of which have not been 'destroyed'. Example, if Mhiki was so good, why isn't he firing Arsenal up to 2nd in the league? They play expansive, shackle-free attacking football, yet he only turns up once a month.

We extended his contract by one year, that doesn't mean anything,

Lol, so you actually believe after that extension he's gone? Lets revisit this when he's still here my friend.

his implosion is based off his nature, he's a narcissist who blames everyone but himself for everything that goes wrong, when we fail to do anything but fish for the secondary pots while playing shite football again next season his meltdown will come, I'm far from the only fan that cares more about the way we play than about a few points progression under his horrific style of play, and those like you that only care about trophies will soon turn when all we win are the secondary pots.

Of course I care about the way we play, but I care about winning FIRST. Style of play SECOND. Sadly you care about style of play first and winning second. You're perfectly entitled to that opinion, but this is why we will never agree.

 

[Jonno]

I agree with your general sentiment on Jose, but the difference between him and Pep this season is pretty easy to call, and I would put it in the ‘extremel unlikely’ category that Jose would have City playing the same way. He may win the league if their jobs were swapped, but probably by nowhere near the same margin.

The difference between Jose and Pep this season hasn’t been Kevin de Bruyne! There is an attacking verve and intent that we don’t have, that the likes of Pep and Klopp clearly prioritise over Jose. I’m not confident that if we signed, I dunno, Mbappé to play right side, that we will be as exciting going forward as City or Liverpool.

I haven’t given up hope of winning titles next season, I just think it will be without matching the level of dominance Pep has shown.

Don't think you have to compare us with City to see our football is slow and laboured. Even if we're picking up points at a good rate, we're just not that easy on the eyes.

Pretty sure Mourinho is concentrating almost entirely on results at the moment, but i can't imagine he is happy with the way we play most games. He knows he has to make us play better next season.

He didn't inherit a very good, well balanced squad, but he's had 4 transfer windows and almost full backing from the club to fix that problem. Mourinho is not doing bad at all and probably needs more time but at the same time he hasn't done enough to escape criticism.

There’s not a lot I disagree with there but I do think the poster you quote does have a point about Mourinho’s play style.

There’s no doubting his winning mentality but his approach to the game is disappointing to say the least. A club with our resources should not have to pick between attractive football or success. And the concerning thing is it looks like Mourinho is too stubborn to his own detriment where instead of adapting he simply doubles down. Our games against Sevilla and West Brom exemplify that, As does his unapologetic response to those calamities.

He deserves credit for stabilising the club but unless he adapts I don’t feel excited with the prospect of him our long term vision, especially if we’re going to be offloading our more exciting talents to make room for the archetypal Mourinho players (ala Salah, KdB etc).

Good posts. I'm not claiming we play excellent football by any means, i'm trying to argue with one or two posters who seem to have a genuinely bitter agenda against Mourinho, who actually want him to fail and United to fail.

I think we need to take stock on the past 5 years and realise that this is exactly what we need right now. 3-4 years back at the top of the PL, winning trophies even if the football isn't great.

Results have to come first right now and performances later. Without Mourinho coming in and drastically improving our results we'd probably be on par with Chelsea and Arsenal right about now.

 

[Rozay]

Good posts. I'm not claiming we play excellent football by any means, i'm trying to argue with one or two posters who seem to have a genuinely bitter agenda against Mourinho, who actually want him to fail and United to fail.

I think we need to take stock on the past 5 years and realise that this is exactly what we need right now. 3-4 years back at the top of the PL, winning trophies even if the football isn't great.

Results have to come first right now and performances later. Without Mourinho coming in and drastically improving our results we'd probably be on par with Chelsea and Arsenal right about now.

That’s true, although when you play as we do, without any clear sight of a long term vision in terms of playing style, the only mitigation can be trophies, and probably major trophies at that. We did win the FA Cup under Van Gaal after all.

I mean, Klopp has come in and not put results before football, so to speak, he came with a vision of what he wanted to build. He signed and sold accordingly, and the team has gotten better and better every year, and they look like they can go on and fight for the league next season. The additions of VVD and Keita have been deliberate and shows method, they are the positions everyone has called. GK will likely be next. Our signings of Mkhitaryan and Lindelof haven’t indicated much of a plan to me, even Sanchez. We change formation and players positions every few games, there appears to be a lack of vision.

Again, I agree that results are first, but I’m not certain I’d back us as the top team likely to achieve the better results longer term based on how we have all approached it. If we win the PL in the meantime then great, but we’ve not done that either, so I’d prefer 3rd or 4th with clear direction than a 2nd that still seems to leave more questions than answers.

 

[Devil may care]

You can be the most talented player on the planet but if you're mentality isn't right then you won't succeed I'm afraid. The problems I've seen Pogba faced with this season seem to stem from his own attitude and persona. The fact we see him regularly pop up in the final 3rd of the pitch means he IS allowed license to drive forward into attacking areas, it's just that he doesn't always apply himself. The fact he tries audacious turns in the middle of the pitch and often gets tackled stems back to his mentality in match situations. Nothing to do with Mourinho at all. You don't see McTomminay play like that, and he's been practically moulded by Mourinho.

So your agrument that Pep gets the best out of his players and Mourinho doesn't get the best out of his is a flawed argument. You're completely ignoring the fact that our squad isn't as good as theirs. Yet we still find ourselves breaking the 80 point barrier for the first time in 5 years - so he's clearly getting the best out of the majority of the squad.

My argument isn't flawed, Allegri showed how to use Pogba and then Mourinho ignored it all and has spent most of the last 2 years trying to shoehorn him into a role he can't play, that is on him, not Pogba, and yes McTominay never takes any risks and passes it sideways most of the time, a good dog soldier, that sounds exactly like I'd expect a player molded by Mourinho to look, a soulless drone. Meanwhile Pep took a kid from Brazil and another kid from Germany and not only blooded them into the league but turned them into top talents and mainstays in his team that have ran away with the title, and took a headless chicken like Sterling and managed to get 20 goals out of him, while at the same time Mourinho chipped away at Martial's confidence constantly to the point we'll probably lose him.

I seem to rember Hazard playing pretty well under Mourinho, and Oscar, and Lampard, and Ronaldo, and countless other flair players. All of which have not been 'destroyed'. Example, if Mhiki was so good, why isn't he firing Arsenal up to 2nd in the league? They play expansive, shackle-free attacking football, yet he only turns up once a month.

Hazard also fell apart under Mourinho* and Ronaldo is one of the greatest players of all time, he has performed under every manager he's had, he's that good, and he fell out with Mourinho as well. Oscar and Lampard aren't flair players, Lampard was an excellent goal scorer, but not a creative, exciting talent, and Oscar was never more than medicore anyway, compare that to how he botched Salah, De Bruyne, crippled Hazard's confidence and is now doing the same to Martial, all of them have the same flaw for him, they aren't worker bee's.

*I know Hazard takes responsibility but that is because he's mild mannered and avoids confrontation, you only have to look at how he went back to being himself when Conte took over to see where the problem was with his plummet in form.

Lol, so you actually believe after that extension he's gone? Lets revisit this when he's still here my friend.

I don't think he'll see out next season, nevermind the extension, there are a lot of United fans that are tired of his shit attitude and awful football already, another season without a PL challenge and even those like yourself will also turn and when that happens he'll do what he always does, start fights and cause drama and then he'll go.

Of course I care about the way we play, but I care about winning FIRST. Style of play SECOND. Sadly you care about style of play first and winning second. You're perfectly entitled to that opinion, but this is why we will never agree.

I don't think there's anything sad about it personally, I think football is about more than winning, I want to actually enjoy my teams games, I feel the same when we win, lose of draw under Mourinho, it's the same garbage no matter the result 90% of the time, Mourinho is the equivelant of the old saying "He has a face for radio" Mourinho has football for teletext and no title is worth that IMO, the idea that we have to put up with his shit to get back to the top is nonsense.

 

[Jonno]

Allegri showed how to use Pogba and then Mourinho ignored it all and has spent most of the last 2 years trying to shoehorn him into a role he can't play, that is on him, not Pogba, and yes McTominay never takes any risks and passes it sideways most of the time, a good dog soldier, that sounds exactly like I'd expect a player molded by Mourinho to look, a soulless drone.

Pogba was part of an unreal winning machine in Juventus and Allegri, he was playing alongside Pirlo and they complimented each other fantastically well. This is my point, Mourinho inherited a poor squad and playing Pogba alongside Herrera whilst a good player, will simply never compare to alongside a peak Pirlo.

So you're criticising Mourinho for having a dog soldier in his side? Pep doesn't have a dog soldier in his side? I think he does. Poch in his Spurs side? yep, certain he does. But you're going to criticise Mourinho for having this type of player, yeah?

Meanwhile Pep took a kid from Brazil and another kid from Germany and not only blooded them into the league but turned them into top talents and mainstays in his team that have ran away with the title, and took a headless chicken like Sterling and managed to get 20 goals out of him, while at the same time Mourinho chipped away at Martial's confidence constantly to the point we'll probably lose him.

Lol, "took a kid from Brazil". Jesus was regarded as one of the greatest talents IN Brazil at the time, he didn't go and find him in an orphanage or on the streets. Mourinho 'took a kid from Everton' and built the team around him and he's going to hit around 30 goals this season, more than the kid Pep took from Brazil. What's your point? Sterling has managed to get 20 goals, he's played well, he was playing well at Liverpool and has naturally progressed now he's a few years older.

Hazard also fell apart under Mourinho* and Ronaldo is one of the greatest players of all time, he has performed under every manager he's had, he's that good, and he fell out with Mourinho as well. Oscar and Lampard aren't flair players, Lampard was an excellent goal scorer, but not a creative, exciting talent, and Oscar was never more than medicore anyway, compare that to how he botched Salah, De Bruyne, crippled Hazard's confidence and is now doing the same to Martial, all of them have the same flaw for him, they aren't worker bee's.

*I know Hazard takes responsibility but that is because he's mild mannered and avoids confrontation, you only have to look at how he went back to being himself when Conte took over to see where the problem was with his plummet in form.

Hazard also fell apart under Conte. I get your points that Mourinho doesn't like too many fancy players, but I don't care. After 5 years of p!ss poor progress, I see a route to the top. He's building a quality squad, a winning machine and it's exactly what we've needed since Fergie retired.

I don't think there's anything sad about it personally, I think football is about more than winning, I want to actually enjoy my teams games, I feel the same when we win, lose of draw under Mourinho, it's the same garbage no matter the result 90% of the time, Mourinho is the equivelant of the old saying "He has a face for radio" Mourinho has football for teletext and no title is worth that IMO, the idea that we have to put up with his shit to get back to the top is nonsense.

I feel for your section of fans who are in for a long ride of bitterness and spite towards the very club you love.

I don't understand the divide, sure, discontent is normal with football playing style, but this amount of agenda against a manager genuinely doing his best to take us to the top? Fans wanting us to fail so we can change manager? It's very Arsenal TV like.

I can assure you when Chelsea won their first title in 50 years they weren't saying their title wasn't worth winning. That too for Porto and Inters CL triumphs. Pretty sure their fans were lining the streets while their equivalent version of you was tapping away on their forums trying to spin a negative on it.

The bottom line of our week long debate is:

You prioritise style of play over winning trophies.
I prioritise winning trophies over style of play.
I am discontent with the style of play, but I'm a realist and accept it at this stage of Uniteds rebuild
You will do anything to try and bring Mourinho's reign down an will ignore the positives.

 

[Devil may care]

Pogba was part of an unreal winning machine in Juventus and Allegri, he was playing alongside Pirlo and they complimented each other fantastically well. This is my point, Mourinho inherited a poor squad and playing Pogba alongside Herrera whilst a good player, will simply never compare to alongside a peak Pirlo.

So you're criticising Mourinho for having a dog soldier in his side? Pep doesn't have a dog soldier in his side? I think he does. Poch in his Spurs side? yep, certain he does. But you're going to criticise Mourinho for having this type of player, yeah?

He's constantly resisted playing a 3 man midfield that everyone knows is what Pogba needs, and instead has tried to force a square peg into a round hole and thus Pogba has faltered, it has zero to do with needing Pirlo.

No, I am saying that it's typical that he'll have issues with a CM like Pogba and that the CM he "created" is a dog solider, he'd have 11 of them if he could.

Lol, "took a kid from Brazil". Jesus was regarded as one of the greatest talents IN Brazil at the time, he didn't go and find him in an orphanage or on the streets. Mourinho 'took a kid from Everton' and built the team around him and he's going to hit around 30 goals this season, more than the kid Pep took from Brazil. What's your point? Sterling has managed to get 20 goals, he's played well, he was playing well at Liverpool and has naturally progressed now he's a few years older.

Yes, he was a kid from Brazil, there's a dozen new Neymar's every year coming out of there, and most of them fail when they get to top leagues, Pep has nurtured and coached this kid into being a top PL forward, that's not comparable to taking a 24 year old giant who has been in this league for 5 years and getting a few more goals out of him, and yes, lets not ignore what Guardiola has gotten out of Sane with patience and support in compared to what Mourinho has done to Martial.

I feel for your section of fans who are in for a long ride of bitterness and spite towards the very club you love.

I don't understand the divide, sure, discontent is normal with football playing style, but this amount of agenda against a manager genuinely doing his best to take us to the top? Fans wanting us to fail so we can change manager? It's very Arsenal TV like.

I can assure you when Chelsea won their first title in 50 years they weren't saying their title wasn't worth winning. That too for Porto and Inters CL triumphs. Pretty sure their fans were lining the streets while their equivalent version of you was tapping away on their forums trying to spin a negative on it.

The bottom line of our week long debate is:

You prioritise style of play over winning trophies.
I prioritise winning trophies over style of play.
I am discontent with the style of play, but I'm a realist and accept it at this stage of Uniteds rebuild
You will do anything to try and bring Mourinho's reign down an will ignore the positives.

You don't need to feel bad, and I don't give a shit about how Inter or Porto fans felt, or a oil daddy club like Chelsea, all of whom were despereate for a sniff of some glory. I've seen United win 13 PL titles and 2 CL's, I can die happy on that, I don't need another one to enjoy my club, I enjoyed my club when we were well in Liverpool's shadow because I enjoyed watching us play.

There are no positives because I don't value winning at all costs, that is the bottom line, Liverpool may well win a CL in a couple of weeks with a lot less investment than us, a poorer squad and having had to sell their second best player halfway through the season, and they have done it while playing brilliant football, this notion that we have to accept having shit shoveled down our throat by Mourinho because he might get you a PL trophy is just a complete falsehood, we don't have to compromise the club to his whims to get back to the top.

 

[Canagel]

Pogba was part of an unreal winning machine in Juventus and Allegri, he was playing alongside Pirlo and they complimented each other fantastically well. This is my point, Mourinho inherited a poor squad and playing Pogba alongside Herrera whilst a good player, will simply never compare to alongside a peak Pirlo.

So you're criticising Mourinho for having a dog soldier in his side? Pep doesn't have a dog soldier in his side? I think he does. Poch in his Spurs side? yep, certain he does. But you're going to criticise Mourinho for having this type of player, yeah?



Lol, "took a kid from Brazil". Jesus was regarded as one of the greatest talents IN Brazil at the time, he didn't go and find him in an orphanage or on the streets. Mourinho 'took a kid from Everton' and built the team around him and he's going to hit around 30 goals this season, more than the kid Pep took from Brazil. What's your point? Sterling has managed to get 20 goals, he's played well, he was playing well at Liverpool and has naturally progressed now he's a few years older.





Hazard also fell apart under Conte. I get your points that Mourinho doesn't like too many fancy players, but I don't care. After 5 years of p!ss poor progress, I see a route to the top. He's building a quality squad, a winning machine and it's exactly what we've needed since Fergie retired.



I feel for your section of fans who are in for a long ride of bitterness and spite towards the very club you love.

I don't understand the divide, sure, discontent is normal with football playing style, but this amount of agenda against a manager genuinely doing his best to take us to the top? Fans wanting us to fail so we can change manager? It's very Arsenal TV like.

I can assure you when Chelsea won their first title in 50 years they weren't saying their title wasn't worth winning. That too for Porto and Inters CL triumphs. Pretty sure their fans were lining the streets while their equivalent version of you was tapping away on their forums trying to spin a negative on it.

The bottom line of our week long debate is:

You prioritise style of play over winning trophies.
I prioritise winning trophies over style of play.
I am discontent with the style of play, but I'm a realist and accept it at this stage of Uniteds rebuild
You will do anything to try and bring Mourinho's reign down an will ignore the positives.

Why does it have to be one or the other? The two are not mutually exclusive. A club of our stature and resources should be expected to produce both and the fans frustration at this stage is understandable. We've spent a shiteload of money but the inconsistency in terms of style of play is very strange. At this stage we should have a clearer idea of what kind of team we are and what our strengths are but only recently are we starting to see some changes and continuity in the lineups. Like the move to 4-3-3 to get best from Pogba etc. That should've been done ages ago. Nobody here wants Jose to fail. We all want him to succeed and win trophies and the progress in terms of results is clear for all to see but it's not unfair to expect an improvement in our style of football given the outlay on players since he arrived. That's all.

 

[Jonno]

He's constantly resisted playing a 3 man midfield that everyone knows is what Pogba needs, and instead has tried to force a square peg into a round hole and thus Pogba has faltered, it has zero to do with needing Pirlo.

No, you were portraying that Pogba has digressed because of Mourinho. I believe it's because he's signed for a team with less ability than the peak-Juventus side winning Leagues and Champions Leagues. Quite unfair to compare the two.

No, I am saying that it's typical that he'll have issues with a CM like Pogba and that the CM he "created" is a dog solider, he'd have 11 of them if he could.

If he would have 11 dog soldiers then why would he sign Pogba who you've gone on to explain, isn't a dog soldier and play him in a midfield three? Why didn't he spend that 90m on 3 of these dog soldiers that you keep banging on about?

You're insinuating that Mourinho is holding Pogba back, why is he? He gets to play in his coveted 3 man midfield, he gets license to bomb forward and influence attacking play, and he only produces 1 game in every 4. Consistent tactics, inconsistent player performance. Not the managers fault.

Yes, he was a kid from Brazil, there's a dozen new Neymar's every year coming out of there, and most of them fail when they get to top leagues, Pep has nurtured and coached this kid into being a top PL forward, that's not comparable to taking a 24 year old giant who has been in this league for 5 years and getting a few more goals out of him, and yes, lets not ignore what Guardiola has gotten out of Sane with patience and support in compared to what Mourinho has done to Martial.

He was scoring for fun in Brazil, quite easy to send some scouts to Brazil and find a 19 year old top scorer and think "lets take a punt on him"

And anyway, he's scored 12 goals all season, Wayne friggin Rooney has got 10 goals and he can barely jog. Hardly turned him into a world beater has he.

Martial is another, who walks around the pitch looking like he can't be bothered, produces 1-2 moments of brilliance every now and then and then vanishes in games. He was doing that before Mourinho arrived here. You should be grateful we have a manager who weeds out these types of personalities.

You don't need to feel bad, and I don't give a shit about how Inter or Porto fans felt, or a oil daddy club like Chelsea, all of whom were despereate for a sniff of some glory. I've seen United win 13 PL titles and 2 CL's, I can die happy on that, I don't need another one to enjoy my club, I enjoyed my club when we were well in Liverpool's shadow because I enjoyed watching us play.

I insist on feeling bad, honestly, because I'm a content fan right now. Not content with the style of play no, it could be much better. But content completely at the progress made, and you're bitterly dissapointed.

So did you celebrate when we got to the FA Cup final? Won the Europa Cup? Not my preference of trophies to be winning, but it's the start of his reign and he's the first United manager to ever win something in his first year. And would you celebrate if he took us to our 21st Premier League title??? Or would you, like you said "react the same way if we won drew or lost"? This is intriguing, it's actually like you don't currently support the club. I am actually baffled i'm speaking to a Man United fan who doesn't care if we win or lose because of our manager.

There are no positives because I don't value winning at all costs, that is the bottom line, Liverpool may well win a CL in a couple of weeks with a lot less investment than us, a poorer squad and having had to sell their second best player halfway through the season, and they have done it while playing brilliant football, this notion that we have to accept having shit shoveled down our throat by Mourinho because he might get you a PL trophy is just a complete falsehood, we don't have to compromise the club to his whims to get back to the top.

Ask Arsenal fans if they value winning at all costs after the last 10 years they've had to endure under Wenger and his refusal to win at all costs. They would have loved to have Mourinho at Arsenal this past few years.

So on Liverpool being in a CL final and it being Mourinho's fault apparently - So did you want Fergie out when Arsenal got to a CL final? When Liverpool got to 2 CL finals, with far less investment and poorer squads, selling their best players? Na didn't think so.

And Liverpool have won nothing under Klopp, they may very well lose to the favourites. He doesn't have the ability to win cup finals, he bottles it because his very 1 dimensional naive attacking football gets them into trouble in the end. They've also been extremely lucky that Salah went full beast-mode on him following the sale of Coutinho. Without Salah they'd probably be about 5th in the PL and no CL final.

They can't keep up with us in the league and will likely finish 4th. They also couldn't beat us recently despite being in the form of their lives, and Salah was in Ashley Young's pocket for 90 minutes. A player completely re-born under Mourinho - again, I expect you won't credit him for that.

 

[Devil may care]

No, you were portraying that Pogba has digressed because of Mourinho. I believe it's because he's signed for a team with less ability than the peak-Juventus side winning Leagues and Champions Leagues. Quite unfair to compare the two.

He has regressed under Mourinho because Mourinho keeps shunting him about and trying to make him into something he isn't.

If he would have 11 dog soldiers then why would he sign Pogba who you've gone on to explain, isn't a dog soldier and play him in a midfield three? Why didn't he spend that 90m on 3 of these dog soldiers that you keep banging on about?

He's tried to turn him into one.

You're insinuating that Mourinho is holding Pogba back, why is he? He gets to play in his coveted 3 man midfield, he gets license to bomb forward and influence attacking play, and he only produces 1 game in every 4. Consistent tactics, inconsistent player performance. Not the managers fault.

Bullshit, we have only recently started using the 4-3-3 with any regularity, we have more often than not used 4-2-3-1 with Pogba in a double pivot, there is no consistency of tactics with Mourinho, our system changes regularly and his tactics merely involve trying to stop the other teams strengths.

He was scoring for fun in Brazil, quite easy to send some scouts to Brazil and find a 19 year old top scorer and think "lets take a punt on him"

And anyway, he's scored 12 goals all season, Wayne friggin Rooney has got 10 goals and he can barely jog. Hardly turned him into a world beater has he.

Scoring for fun in Brazil means jackshit, and there is more to being a top forward than just goals, his whole game has progressed under Guardiola.

Martial is another, who walks around the pitch looking like he can't be bothered, produces 1-2 moments of brilliance every now and then and then vanishes in games. He was doing that before Mourinho arrived here. You should be grateful we have a manager who weeds out these types of personalities.

That's simply not true, Martial has produced on numerous occassions for us, look at his stats and his ratio is one of, if not the best, at the club from our attackers, and this whole "he sulks, he's lazy" bullshit is just another Jose fanboy created myth purely because he doesn't run around like a dopey dog chasing a car. The only thing I'd be grateful to Mourinho for is if he takes the PSG job, not for drivng gifted young flair players out of the club because they aren't one of his dog soldiers.

I insist on feeling bad, honestly, because I'm a content fan right now. Not content with the style of play no, it could be much better. But content completely at the progress made, and you're bitterly dissapointed.

Well if you inisist, then go ahead, keep feeling bad if that makes you feel...err....good?

So did you celebrate when we got to the FA Cup final? Won the Europa Cup? Not my preference of trophies to be winning, but it's the start of his reign and he's the first United manager to ever win something in his first year. And would you celebrate if he took us to our 21st Premier League title??? Or would you, like you said "react the same way if we won drew or lost"? This is intriguing, it's actually like you don't currently support the club. I am actually baffled i'm speaking to a Man United fan who doesn't care if we win or lose because of our manager.

Nope to all of the above, I don't care if we win or lose because how we play is utterly dire and completely down to the manager we have, we don't even resemble Manchester United right now, we are Mourinho United.

Ask Arsenal fans if they value winning at all costs after the last 10 years they've had to endure under Wenger and his refusal to win at all costs. They would have loved to have Mourinho at Arsenal this past few years.

You'll find fans of any club that would sell their souls when they get desperate, I'm not that desperate.

So on Liverpool being in a CL final and it being Mourinho's fault apparently - So did you want Fergie out when Arsenal got to a CL final? When Liverpool got to 2 CL finals, with far less investment and poorer squads, selling their best players? Na didn't think so.

I didn't say it was Mourinho's fault, like a few other things in the last two repsonses, you have simply concocted that yourself so you could get the Fergie line in. I said they have gotten to a CL final playing brilliant football, while spending less than half what your boy Mourinho has spent and while losing their second best player in January, thus proving you can have progression without serving up garbage football week after week and then blaming it on everything but the man that is shovelling that style at us because it's who he is.

 

[ash_86]

So obvious today that we needed someone next to Pogba who can dictate the play. Remember when RVP mentioned about the entire team 'ticking' when Scholes came out of retirement? That's how long we've been trying to find someone in similar mould.

 

[Rory 7]

So obvious today that we needed someone next to Pogba who can dictate the play. Remember when RVP mentioned about the entire team 'ticking' when Scholes came out of retirement? That's how long we've been trying to find someone in similar mould.

Really?

 

[ash_86]

Really?

We don't need a playmaker? what do you suggest?

 

[Rory 7]

We don't need a playmaker? what do you suggest?

I don’t know what to suggest. I’m just surprised at the idea of needing anyone beside Pogba at this point.

 

[GM K]

There's no agenda, Mourinho is just like LvG, he has turned United into a chore to watch IMO, you are happy because results are better and that is your core point of focus, if that is what you care about then cool, I'm not trying to change your mind or label you with lazy terms.

I do disagree that he'll be here for a long time, he's outclassed by Pep these days and his attitude and nature will always lead to an implosion, hopefully you get one of the cups you covet before he crashes, but I'd count more on bagging the minor stuff until his fuse lights and we have to replace him.

Chill mate. Step by step. Our play will improve. We are already making progress. The apprehension is understandable but we need to see the big picture. All the stats are improving. Last things to tick: win the PL, advance further in the CL and improve our style.

 

[Devil may care]

Chill mate. Step by step. Our play will improve. We are already making progress. The apprehension is understandable but we need to see the big picture. All the stats are improving. Last things to tick: win the PL, advance further in the CL and improve our style.

Rather than go back over myself mate I will just say I've covered my thoughts and feelings in depth, Mourinho is poisonous in my view, a self serving narcissist who will eventually alienate everyone and we'll have the same drama Real and Chelsea had, that's my feelings and a slight uptick in points wont change that, there is zero excuse for the horrid way we play, it's simply who he is, we don't look like a team that has an ounce of attacking coaching, and whenever we have a good result he's out there taking shots at our critics and acting billy big balls, and when we lose he cites his resume, rumbles on about our clubs past failures and throws players he doesn't like under the bus and suddenly those saying the players aren't good enough, are right, it's like Donald Trump with better hair.

 

[GM K]

Rather than go back over myself mate I will just say I've covered my thoughts and feelings in depth, Mourinho is poisonous in my view, a self serving narcissist who will eventually alienate everyone and we'll have the same drama Real and Chelsea had, that's my feelings and a slight uptick in points wont change that, there is zero excuse for the horrid way we play, it's simply who he is, we don't look like a team that has an ounce of attacking coaching, and whenever we have a good result he's out there taking shots at our critics and acting billy big balls, and when we lose he cites his resume, rumbles on about our clubs past failures and throws players he doesn't like under the bus and suddenly those saying the players aren't good enough, are right, it's like Donald Trump with better hair.

Oh, you sure have strong feelings about Jose. That's fair enough. But there's still not much to worry about for Manchester United in this scenario. Despite all the problems, Mourinho left Real and Chelsea with a core set of players that went on to do well for those clubs. He took Madrid from 8 years of being knocked out in the 2nd round of the CL to three semi final appearances and after he left, they won the La Decima We know the Chelsea story. Even though I get the expressed concerns, I really struggle to see how United will lose out in all this. We are already developing a strong core and climbing up the table again. Whenever Jose leaves, we'll be in a good position to build on whatever he has done. The United brand is too strong for a Jose Mourinho to hurt. Relax and enjoy the ride. I am pretty sure that if he serves up bad football next season, messes up the dressing room and we fail to win any of the big ears, he'll be gone by the following summer. But if he proved people wrong and delivers, then that will be fine. Either way, I see the club winning.

 

[ravi2]

Rather than go back over myself mate I will just say I've covered my thoughts and feelings in depth, Mourinho is poisonous in my view, a self serving narcissist who will eventually alienate everyone and we'll have the same drama Real and Chelsea had, that's my feelings and a slight uptick in points wont change that, there is zero excuse for the horrid way we play, it's simply who he is, we don't look like a team that has an ounce of attacking coaching, and whenever we have a good result he's out there taking shots at our critics and acting billy big balls, and when we lose he cites his resume, rumbles on about our clubs past failures and throws players he doesn't like under the bus and suddenly those saying the players aren't good enough, are right, it's like Donald Trump with better hair.

Your posts make me like Mourinho more.

 

[Devil may care]

Oh, you sure have strong feelings about Jose. That's fair enough. But there's still not much to worry about for Manchester United in this scenario. Despite all the problems, Mourinho left Real and Chelsea with a core set of players that went on to do well for those clubs. He took Madrid from 8 years of being knocked out in the 2nd round of the CL to three semi final appearances and after he left, they won the La Decima We know the Chelsea story. Even though I get the expressed concerns, I really struggle to see how United will lose out in all this. We are already developing a strong core and climbing up the table again. Whenever Jose leaves, we'll be in a good position to build on whatever he has done. The United brand is too strong for a Jose Mourinho to hurt. Relax and enjoy the ride. I am pretty sure that if he serves up bad football next season, messes up the dressing room and we fail to win any of the big ears, he'll be gone by the following summer. But if he proved people wrong and delivers, then that will be fine. Either way, I see the club winning.

Just to clarify, I am not worried about the club in that regard, it has survived worse things than Mourinho, but I see nothing to enjoy in the ride personally, watching us under him is worse than under LvG IMO, he's stripping away the very pleasure that has usually came with watching Manchester Unitred regardless of the era or how well we were doing.

Your posts make me like Mourinho more.

I don't know why but you're welcome.

 

[Andersons Dietician]

I see nothing to enjoy in the ride personally, watching us under him is worse than under LvG IMO, he's stripping away the very pleasure that has usually came with watching Manchester Unitred regardless of the era or how well we were doing.

Feel the same, every good victory we have just feels hollow, it’s soulless and depressing with very little to get excited about. Hopefully next year is different but now rather than looking forward to games it now feels like a chore to watch them.

 

[GM K]

Feel the same, every good victory we have just feels hollow, it’s soulless and depressing with very little to get excited about. Hopefully next year is different but now rather than looking forward to games it now feels like a chore to watch them.

I agree. It does feel like a chore watching them many times.

 

[haram]

I see nothing to enjoy in the ride personally, watching us under him is worse than under LvG IMO

How can anyone say this?

 

[TheFlagStaysDown]

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Mourinho extending Fellaini a contract would be similar in my eyes when Moyes extended Rooney - pointless, we need to move on, it is not about the money he doesn't deserve, it is about him being absolutely worng profile of a player for our club if we wanna move forward..

 

[Devil may care]

How can anyone say this?

Quite easily, both teams were garbage to watch, but with LvG there was a buzz about the young players and I knew we'd be shot of him quickly as the board value the CL money above all else, so there was an end to his dreadful reign in sight, plus he wasn't as unlikable and toxic as Mourinho IMO.