Uno Draft: QF - Skizzo vs. GodShaveTheQueen

Who will win the match based on all the players at their peaks?


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Invictus

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Skizzo .................................................................. GodShaveTheQueen

..............




TEAM Skizzo TACTICS


Formation - 523/532 Direct

In goal remains one of the greatest keepers of all time, Peter Schmeichel. The Great Dane was a huge presence in the penalty box, and the dressing room, and he'd help marshall the back line here again.

Coming in to the team, with a defensive shuffle, is Matthias Sammer. The German will take up his all-encompassing libero role, working out of the back line and helping the midfield by charging up as he see's fit.
Sliding in next to him is Paolo Maldini and Claudio Gentile. The two italians are of the "defense-first" mindset, and would offer a fantastic base and cover for Sammer to do his thing.

Tommy Gemmell and Manfred Kaltz take up the full back/wing back spots. Both were comfortable going forward and contributing to the attacking phases of the game, while not being a liability defensively.

The midfield two is made up of Fernando Redondo and Roy Keane. Complementing each other with class, physicality and work rate, they bring everything you'd want in a midfield to wrestle control of the game and let the rest of the team flourish offensively.

Socrates plays in the hole between the midfield and the attackers, looking to be the creative force and link player, while getting on the score sheet himself with the movement of the front two creating space for him.

The front two are both new additions, with Roberto Baggio playing off Alan Shearer. The italian was always at home playing off a traditional number 9 of sorts, and would love the link up play with Socrates and the movement and ability to play off Shearer. Shearer would look to put the ball in the net, hold up the ball with his back to goal, and get on the end of service from Baggio/Socrates and Gemmell/Kaltz.




TEAM GodShaveTheQueen TACTICS

Formation: 4-4-2

What makes a good 4-4-2?

1. Great partnerships all across the pitch
2. Multiple roles and responsibilities for the players

So how does my team look with respect to the above points?

The centre backs - Tresor and Ruggeri are as complimentary a partnership as it gets. You have a silky smooth brilliant ball playing CB and then a tough rugged stopper who was great physically and in the air. All good 4-4-2's are built with such a pair.

The wings - The most crucial aspect of a 4-4-2. You'd want two super balanced wings where both the fullback and winger contribute to both the attack and defense. Zanetti/Jair and Irwin/Bale are pairs where both the players will attack together and defend together. There will be constant doubling both while going forward and while defending. I couldn't have been more pleased with the pairs. I had no trouble in dropping Rummenigge once I realized what I could build.

The midfield - You need a holder/DM with a play maker who runs the whole team. Scholes in a 4-4-2 is love. Its what we had all fallen in love to for 2 decades. And in Stiles you have the player to do the dirty work and then put it on a platter for Scholes to run the game. Scholes had good defensive work rate as well. Not the greatest of tackler, but is worki rate and positioning in the midfield was top notch. Of course, you also need wingers who would help with the midfield battle and Jair/Bale would be top notch support.

The forwards - Ah, all 4-4-2's deserve a scary front 2. And a complimentary one at that. I have an absolutely brilliant complete striker, a GOAT in Eusebio and the perfect No.9 to compliment him in Van Nistelrooy. Building a perfect 4-4-2 front pairing is not easy. For example I had Rummenigge who is a better player than Ruud, but the balance and completeness my current pair has is more crucial than the more tempting pair in Eusebio and Rummenigge.
 

GodShaveTheQueen

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Thanks @Invictus and good luck to you too @Skizzo

I don't care how many votes I win this or lose this by, I am absolutely in love with the team I have built this round :drool:

Completely worth dropping Kalle.
 

GodShaveTheQueen

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Bale on the left?
Yes, like in his Tottenham days. I never liked him on the right.

Bale, Jair and Eusebio can all have a valid claim to be among the fastest of each of their generations. That with Scholes' passing range seemed perfect.
 

Moby

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I never liked him on the right.
Definitely his career peak though.

Fun fact, actually watched him live once where he played the first half on the left and stank the place with the usual knock and run, switched to the right in the second half and created absolute havoc.

For me he went from a very good player to a proper match winner the moment he was switched to the right.
 

GodShaveTheQueen

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Definitely his career peak though.

Fun fact, actually watched him live once where he played the first half on the left and stank the place with the usual knock and run, switched to the right in the second half and created absolute havoc.

For me he went from a very good player to a proper match winner the moment he was switched to the right.
I won't argue on that comparison because I am very biased and critical of his right side game. Besides, how good or bad he was on the right shouldn't have any bearing on this game.

At Spurs though, he was always left sided and central and it was his game there that lead to the 100 mn valuation. Who could forget him ripping Maicon apart :drool:

I'll let you be the judge of his quality on the left, but as a positional and tactical fit in a 4-4-2, for me, he is at the right spot to shine in the right company.
 

Himannv

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Definitely his career peak though.

Fun fact, actually watched him live once where he played the first half on the left and stank the place with the usual knock and run, switched to the right in the second half and created absolute havoc.

For me he went from a very good player to a proper match winner the moment he was switched to the right.
I felt his peak was towards the latter part of his Spurs stay where he more or less played in a free role and scored a fair few from central areas.
 

Skizzo

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The Divine Ponytail



his dribbling
his assists
his goals

Baggio’s career began in Vicenza, where he made his debut as a 15-year-old. At the time, the club was part of Italy’s Seria C. At the age of 18 he was named Best Player of the division. Several clubs took notice and Fiorentina was the first to act. However, two days before he was supposed to join the team, Roberto Baggio tore his ACL making a sliding tackle. The injury threatened to derail his career as Fiorentina could’ve annulled the contract. Luckily for Baggio, it didn’t. Despite the injury, the contract was signed and La Viola paid for all the medical costs related to his operation. The injury was so severe that doctors were pessimistic about his chances of ever wearing a football jersey again. The recovery process took 18 months, but Baggio beat the odds.

As that wasn’t testing enough, soon after making his debut for his new club, Baggio hurt his knee again and required another surgery. Not many people know that he was allergic to painkillers, so he felt every single one of the 220 stitches used during the procedure. He missed most of that season as well. Only destiny can write the scenario that followed. Roberto played in Fiorentina’s last game of the season against eventual champions Napoli and scored a free-kick equalizer that saved the team from relegation – a sign of hope for a player in desperate need of one.

The “Ticking Timebomb”, as he was sometimes described due to his propensity to burst into moments of virtuosity at any given time, fell enamored with The Purple because of everything the club had done for him. Nevertheless, in 1990 Baggio was sold to one of Fiorentina’s rivals, Juventus, for over €9 million, the world record transfer for a footballer at the time. Fiorentina was forced to sell because of excessive spending used for renovating their stadium ahead of the 1990 World Cup. Simply put, they needed the money and Baggio was collateral damage.

He spent almost the entirety of his career wearing number 10. His preferred role was as an attacking midfielder/creator, but he was rarely used in the position because of the formations used by managers in Italy at the time. Defense has always been a priority in Italy and Baggio was an Italian trapped in a Brazilian body. His idol was Brazilian legend Zico. He loved to dribble and enjoyed attraction, something Italian coaches frowned upon. It often caused friction.

Baggio had his best statistical season while playing for Juventus. In 1993 he scored a total of 39 goals in all competitions, was voted World Player of the Year and won the Ballon d’Or (a trophy he would auction off to raise money for Italian flood victims in 1994). He played as a second striker behind Ravanelli and Vialli in a season in which Juve won the UEFA Cup. The following season, Marcelo Lippi became in charge of Juventus (replacing Giovanni Trapattoni) and he wanted to install a more team-minded style of play, making it less dependent on Baggio. Another knee injury forced him to miss three months and allowed Del Piero to take over Juventus’ #10 role. After finishing second behind Milan in the previous season, Juventus won the Scudetto in 1995. Baggio played sparingly during both campaigns.

With the emergence of Del Piero, Lippi no longer needed The Divine Ponytail and let him leave to arch rivals AC Milan. There, he won the title with Milan as well, but also struggled with injuries. As you can notice, coaches were being changed like diapers in Italy. Capello was replaced by Oscar Tabarez, who was then replaced by Arrigo Sacchi. Milan’s decision to hire Sacchi was baffling, as he and Baggio had fallen out during the 1994 World Cup. He didn’t last long either. Capello was brought back, but he didn’t want Baggio, who agreed a deal with Parma. Ancelotti, who was Parma’s manager at the time, didn’t want him either and vetoed the deal. Eventually, Baggio joined Bologna.

He started his Bologna career by cutting off his signature ponytail as a symbol of a new beginning. In 1997/98 Baggio set a personal best for league goals in a season with 22. Known for his vision, passing ability and creativity, Roberto Baggio was anything but a common player for the era, especially for Italy. Fans loved that and were infatuated with his uniqueness. He could play in any offensive position and was equally good as a scorer and as a passer. His ball control, balance, body feints, acceleration over short distances and sudden changes of direction made him a nightmare for defenders.

After one successful season in Bologna, he joined Inter. The team was in disarray and changed three managers during his first season there. The following season, Inter appointed Marcelo Lippi, a coach who already deemed him unnecessary in Juve. Consequently, Baggio spent most of the season on the bench. After that, he joined Brescia, his favorite club growing up. His knees caused him to miss extended periods of time throughout his career and that was the case in Brescia as well. Nevertheless, he helped the team to its best ever finish in two consecutive seasons. Baggio’s number 10 shirt was retired by Brescia in his honor, and he is considered the club’s greatest ever player. Before Baggio had joined Brescia, they had never been able to avoid relegation after being newly promoted to Serie A, in over 40 years. During the four years under Baggio, Brescia recorded their best ever Serie A run and were never relegated.

On the international level, he is the only Italian player ever to score in three World Cups. The set piece specialist scored many crucial goals, but will unfortunately always be remembered for his decisive miss in the penalty roulette during the 1994 World Cup final against Brazil. In 2010, Baggio was appointed president of the technical sector of the Italian Football Federation. In 2013, Baggio stepped down from the position, stating that the federation had ignored his ideas about improving the system and focusing on youth talent. Roberto Baggio has also been renowned for his charity work and is a UN Good Will Ambassador.

Baggio’s career was one of a true warrior. There were times he couldn’t walk for days after matches because of his knee problems. He missed a penalty that will haunt him forever. He played in a league he didn’t belong for coaches who didn’t fully appreciate his skill set. He battled physical and emotional pain. All of that makes him even greater and puts a seal on his football legend status.

David Platt said:
One game stands out in particular, one against Ancona which we won 5–1. Baggio scored four goals in the first 20 minutes and killed the game off. I don’t think I’ve seen a better performance from any player in any game I’ve ever played in. For half an hour, he was on fire. As footballers go, he’s a genius.
Ronaldo said:
He’s fantastic. You know that I have always played with many great footballers, but nobody is like him, so clever, such a good person and such strong player.
Brian Laudrup said:
He’s without doubt the most skilful number ten in the modern game, the archetypal playmaker, if you like, who can create chances and score goals.
Paul Ince said:
He has so many strengths and it is hard, almost impossible to find a weakness. He is one of the most exciting and gifted players you could wish to see. Even when he is closely marked he has the ability to make space for himself with a trick or a dummy.
Pep Guardiola said:
It’s true that in Barcelona I had been lucky enough to play with great players, but Baggio was special in so many ways. I played with Laudrup, Romario, Koeman, Ronaldo, Stoichkov but I never saw anyone like Baggio.
 

willhse456

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Can see why you put Bale on the left as it suits the system better, but I'm not sure if he's the right player for it. It takes away one of his main attributes which is cutting inside and shooting from range.
 

GodShaveTheQueen

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Can see why you put Bale on the left as it suits the system better, but I'm not sure if he's the right player for it. It takes away one of his main attributes which is cutting inside and shooting from range.
As I mentioned, I am playing his Spurs version. I rate that version very high and expect him to be judged on that.

And of course, you sometimes can't always fit all attributes in the system. The system is bigger than the player :)

Besides, when I have RvN and Eusebio to take care of scoring, I can afford to lose a few of Bale's long rangers, don't you think?

His Spurs version had great work rate and he contributed to the midfield battle as well which were my biggest requirements of the wingers here. So as you said, you can see why he seems perfect to me there personally :)
 

Skizzo

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Where the game can be won:

  • Firstly, Sammer. With Keane and Redondo, we already have a good chance of winning a midfield battle. With Sammer able to step up into the midfield and help overload, it will leave too much for Scholes and Stiles to do.
  • Socrates floating between the lines without a proper DM there will cause all sorts of problems. Does Stiles drop deeper to pick him up? If so, Scholes is overrun. Does someone step out from the back? If so, Baggio/Shearer can exploit that space.
  • Defensive advantage. Maldini-Sammer-Gentile in front of Schmeichel is fairly airtight in terms of limiting the ability of Ruud and Eusebio to run at us and hurt us.
 

GodShaveTheQueen

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Maldini is sort of conveniently positioned to keep an eye on Eusebio.
Maldini hardly had any weaknesses but I think if he ever did find something difficult, it was dealing with fast tricky dribbling strikers like R9.

Eusebio is as near as it gets to Fenomeno stylistically and I for one don't see it being a close and shut case. It will be a lively battle sure, but not everything with Maldini in the middle would be marked as shut I hope.

Lets not forget Maldini will have to cover out wide as well and not just Eusebio

@Skizzo do you have more info on Gemmell?
Want to know this as well. I was planning to research him later today, but a 60's full back in a 3-5-2 that demands gung ho wing backs doesn't sit well with me.

Still, I don't know the player and will let Skizzo explain. I will watch him a little later today and put my thoughts as well.
 
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GodShaveTheQueen

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Firstly, Sammer. With Keane and Redondo, we already have a good chance of winning a midfield battle. With Sammer able to step up into the midfield and help overload, it will leave too much for Scholes and Stiles to do.
To answer this, a 4-4-2 demands great midfield support from the wingers and I have that in abundance here. So they should be counted as well to not make it a numbers battle.

Secondly, Tresor quite often stepped up as well in possession into the midfield. Not as gung ho as Sammer but definitely made his presence felt.

Socrates floating between the lines without a proper DM there will cause all sorts of problems. Does Stiles drop deeper to pick him up? If so, Scholes is overrun. Does someone step out from the back? If so, Baggio/Shearer can exploit that space.
While there can always be man marking with a No.10 and DM, a 4-4-2 essentially works on zonal marking. You have 2 lines of 4 all defending their zones and helping each other out. Its not a case of Socrates and Stiles cancel each other out, so its the battle of the rest. Scholes himself was good positionally with his midfield defending responsibilities

Defensive advantage. Maldini-Sammer-Gentile in front of Schmeichel is fairly airtight in terms of limiting the ability of Ruud and Eusebio to run at us and hurt us.
How about the wingbacks being overloaded 2 vs 1 and on counters where even the 1 can be caught up field against such a pacy team? Surely Maldini and Gentile will step out leaving behind big gaps.
 

Šjor Bepo

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also prefer Bale left wing version
 

Skizzo

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Maldini is sort of conveniently positioned to keep an eye on Eusebio.

@Skizzo do you have more info on Gemmell?
One of the famed Lisbon Lions, he was one of the first to play the full back role in a modern way. He contributed to the attack, and had a good shot on him, which led him to become the penalty taker. Scored over 60 goals, although about half were penalties. First british player to score in two European Cup finals, one of which was the tying goal in the European Cup win against Inter Milan


The end of that video also has his "incident" with Helmut Haller too :lol:

In the space of a month, Gemmell was part of a Scotland team who earned the title as ‘unofficial world champions’ by humiliating World Cup holders England at Wembley — and then played a starring, not to mention scoring, role as Celtic became the first British side to win the European Cup.

In a matter of weeks, he achieved more than many players do in an entire career. Overall, he ended his playing days — which also included spells at Nottingham Forest and Dundee — with just the six league titles, three Scottish Cup winners’ medals and five League Cup triumphs to his name. Oh, plus a winners’ and runners-up medal from Europe’s most prestigious club competition.

Forever a Celtic legend, always to be remembered for that equaliser as Jock Stein’s team of local boys rallied to defeat Inter Milan and make history at the Estadio Nacional, Gemmell was undoubtedly one of the finest footballers Scotland has ever produced.

A wing-back before anyone had even coined the term, rated by many as the best left-back in the world during his prime years, Gemmell’s swashbuckling style seemed to epitomise the attacking intent so crucial to Mr Stein’s ambitions and designs.

The sight of him galloping forward to link with his strikers must have seemed so revolutionary at the time. This was part of how Stein wanted his Celtic team to play, to entertain, to demoralise the opposition. And Tommy was just the man to do it.


No less a figure than Gordon Strachan emphasised the ground-breaking nature of Gemmell’s career in his reaction to the news yesterday, the Scotland head coach declaring: ‘Tommy was a joy to watch on the pitch. And, as a pioneer of the attacking full-back role, he was years ahead of his time.

‘Throughout his career, he earned the respect and admiration of his fellow professionals and fans alike, and his contributions to Scottish football cannot be overstated.’

Now, the modern game is full of defenders who can lope up and down the wing. The best have always done so to great effect. And the lad from Craigneuk was definitely one of the best.

Just consider that big-game record for a moment. A striker who scored in two European Cup finals would be considered to have enjoyed a stellar career. A defender achieving this distinction? It tells you everything about not only Gemmell’s quality — but his winning mentality.

When Celtic needed him, he delivered. Never more so than in that famous final, his thunderous shot setting them on their way to making history.

So, yes, Tommy used to recall Stein getting angry with him from time to time, the giant of man management prone to bellowing: ‘Just remember — you’re a defender first and foremost!’

As for how often the pair used to lock horns, they certainly had their share of run-ins; he famously told his gaffer to ‘F*** off’ in the moments after his equaliser in Lisbon, vocally disagreeing with touchline instructions to simply play for extra-time in searing heat.

Yet Stein was the man who first declared him to be ‘the greatest left-back in the world’. However often they fell out, however baffling the man management style of the great guru might have been to a player occasionally dropped without explanation, Gemmell never lost his admiration for the boss.

Adored by fans, he was equally popular among team-mates, with the great Bertie Auld — left ‘heartbroken’ by the loss of a pal he referred to simply as ‘The Big Man’ — leading tributes yesterday.

‘As a footballer, I rated him the best left-back in the world,’ said Auld. ‘As a human being, he was up there, too.’

Legend Denis Law added: ‘I have lost a dear friend. I switched on the television this morning to be confronted with the sad news and my heart sank.

‘Maybe Scotland didn’t get through to World Cup Finals and suchlike in our day, but we had a damn good team. And Tommy Gemmell was part of that, you better believe it. He was a special, big guy. Nothing flustered him, on or off the park.

‘Tommy was great company and, in a lot of people’s opinion, mine included, he was the finest left-back of his generation.

‘He could have gone to any team in the world, but he decided to remain loyal to Celtic when he was in his prime.

‘Tommy Gemmell was a fabulous player and a great guy. I can pay him no higher compliment.’

The scarves, cards, jerseys and assorted other mementoes laid outside Celtic Park to mark Gemmell’s passing reflected not merely his popularity as a great character, but his importance in the club’s finest hour.

He was a footballer who helped to change the way the game was played, even down to making playing on his ‘wrong’ side look like an advantage, allowing him to cut inside and shoot with that howitzer of a right boot.

Watch both of his European Cup final goals — against Inter in ’67 and Feyenoord in the defeat three years later — and you can’t fail to appreciate the purity of the strike; his shots were as good as anything the modern game might offer.

Of course, other footage of Tommy in action survives in this digital era. Including one incident that he learned to laugh about over the years. Even if the fact that it cost him a small fortune in fines — and a place in a League Cup final — made it anything but funny at the time.

The sight of Gemmell extracting severe retribution on West Germany’s Helmut Haller — ‘When I booted him up the arse!’ was how Tommy later referred to the moment of madness — retains the power to make grown men guffaw.

To recap, Haller had clipped Gemmell’s heels just as he was about to shoot from his favourite range, a yard or two outside the box. Scotland were trailing 3-2 in the World Cup qualifier in Hamburg, with a place in the 1970 tournament in Mexico at stake, and tensions were running high.

The rampaging full-back, whose grand total of only 18 international caps remains something of a scandal, promptly turned around, chased Haller and… well, administered his boot to the posterior region of the retreating German. As priceless as the moment itself was, the great Archie Macpherson declared: ‘Well, that was uncalled for…’


So many of the moments from Gemmell’s career are captured only in grainy black-and-white footage, accompanied by commentary that sounds restrained — and terribly civilised — to modern ears.

Everyone’s thoughts are with Gemmell’s family at this difficult time.

It is to be hoped that the outpouring of love from football’s extended family helps them in some way.

With that half-century anniversary of Lisbon to come later this year, Gemmell’ s life — and his contribution to such an era-defining triumph — is sure to be celebrated with gusto, his status and importance lost on no one with a knowledge of modern history.

As Celtic chief executive Peter Lawwell put it yesterday: ‘Tommy was one of the massive figures in Celtic’s history. A true great. A true legend.’
 

GodShaveTheQueen

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I think my biggest tactical advantage lies in having great wide attackers and attacking full backs. That and the 4-4-2 is the kryptonite of a 3-5-2.

Not only does it pull the wide CBs leaving huge gaps for the two strikers (as good as RVN and Eusebio) up front to exploit.

It also restricts width creation from the opposition without always running the risk of being getting overrun on the counters.
 
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Skizzo

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I think my biggest tactical advantage lies in having great wide attackers and attacking full backs. That is the kryptonite of a 3-5-2.

Not only does it pull the wide CB leaving huge gaps for the two strikers (as good as RVN and Eusebio) up front to exploit.

It also restricts width creation from the opposition without always running the risk of being getting overrun on the counters.
Why would it need to pull anyone wide?

Gemmell and Kaltz are both going to be on the defensive side first as opposed to all out attack. You won't have sustained possession with my fullbacks high up the pitch behind Bale/Jair. On the occasions that Maldini may have to step out left, Redondo/Sammer is there centrally to cover.

As for width creation, if anything, our central threat limits your ability to spread play. You need to rely on both Bale and Jair coming centrally to limit our ability to play through you, otherwise a central core of Sammer-Redondo-Keane-Socrates-Baggio would run through that central area. Tresor stepping out of defense would only help so much.
 

GodShaveTheQueen

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Why would it need to pull anyone wide?

Gemmell and Kaltz are both going to be on the defensive side first as opposed to all out attack.
So they are defending alone in 2 vs 1 battles?

And how about when they are caught upfield on counters? Maldini and Gentile won't step out?

As for width creation, if anything, our central threat limits your ability to spread play
Oh boy Skizzo, careful. The draft game will be over soon but statements like that with Scholes in the midfield will be remembered forever and label you a traitor.
 

Skizzo

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So they are defending alone in 2 vs 1 battles?

And how about when they are caught upfield on counters? Maldini and Gentile won't step out?
Less dangerous than Tresor stepping out and Baggio being in behind, or Socrates playing in the space between your midfield two and center backs.



Oh boy Skizzo, careful. The draft game will be over soon but statements like that with Scholes in the midfield will be remembered forever and label you a traitor.
It's the hip thing to do to rag on the CO92 now, I'm with the in crowd!

just kidding, but obviously I'm not discounting Scholes passing range or ability to knock a ball onto your pacy players, however, with Keane hounding him and his space to operate in condensed, and a defense of Maldini-Sammer-Gentile to mop up, I don't mind him trying to ping a few long balls as if trying to hit someone taking a whizz on a tree.
 

GodShaveTheQueen

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Less dangerous than Tresor stepping out and Baggio being in behind, or Socrates playing in the space between your midfield two and center backs.
I disagree, your attack is still in a condensed space.

Mine spans across the whole pitch with so much more ease in opening up gaps.
just kidding, but obviously I'm not discounting Scholes passing range or ability to knock a ball onto your pacy players, however, with Keane hounding him and his space to operate in condensed, and a defense of Maldini-Sammer-Gentile to mop up, I don't mind him trying to ping a few long balls as if trying to hit someone taking a whizz on a tree.
Again, when you mention Keane on Scholes or Stiles on Socrates, you discount the essence of the midfield in a 4-4-2. It never is a 1 vs 1 battle. You have to see that Keane himself would be pressurized by the hard working wingers as well. Its not just Scholes against the Skizzo mafia.
 

Edgar Allan Pillow

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Fantastic match. Great teams.

Feeel Skizzo is placed just right to counter GSTQs threats. Zanetti-Jair-Eusebio is just mouthwatering, but then it can rarely get better than Sammer-Maldini plus Gemmell (whom I rare quite highly after reading up on British/Irish draft).

Socrates-Baggio-Shearer is a well balanced and wonderful partnership and I think Stiles (who I also rate highly) would still find it a bit difficult to handle.
 

GodShaveTheQueen

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It's the hip thing to do to rag on the CO92 now, I'm with the in crowd!
Its not a C092 thing. Most United fans put Scholes on a much higher pedestal as a player as compared to anyone in the CO92.

He was something else. I can spam the thread with Gifs but if I need to do that to sell Scholes on redcafe, it would be a shame.

He constantly dominated midfields and set the tempo on his own. At the later stages with players of much lesser quality around.
 
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Skizzo

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Its not a C092 thing. Most United fans put Scholes on a much higher pedentalas a player as compared to anyone in the CO92.

He was something else. I can spam the thread with Gifs but if I need to do that to sell Scholes on redcafe, it would be a shame.

He constantly dominated midfields and set the tempo on his own. At the later stages with players of much lesser quality around.
And like I said, I rate Scholes highly, however, he’s not up just against anyone, and both Redondo and Keane have individually taken over games, as has Sammer. It’s no slight on Scholes to say he’d be up against it here.
 

GodShaveTheQueen

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And like I said, I rate Scholes highly, however, he’s not up just against anyone, and both Redondo and Keane have individually taken over games, as has Sammer. It’s no slight on Scholes to say he’d be up against it here.
I don't disagree with that. All I defend is that my team wouldn't find it tough to hold on to the ball or spread it around.

A 4-4-2 as I said for me is not just a 2 man midfield. Many people don't see it that way in drafts. Fair fecks to them. I see it differently :)
 

Skizzo

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I don't disagree with that. All I defend is that my team wouldn't find it tough to hold on to the ball or spread it around.

A 4-4-2 as I said for me is not just a 2 man midfield. Many people don't see it that way in drafts. Fair fecks to them. I see it differently :)
And that’s the beauty of the drafts (although also the infuriating thing at times too :lol: )

Everyone can see the same thing slightly differently and interpret it as such
 

GodShaveTheQueen

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The below two are Scholesy's all touch and actions compilation from 2007-08 UCL semifinals 1st and 2nd leg courtesy Mr. @Šjor Bepo

The midfields he was against? Iniesta-Xavi-Deco-Yaya

Man United midfield? Scholes-Carrick with Park supporting from one wing. The other wing had Rooney in one game and Nani in another.

We of course won the tie with a Scholes screamer.

We would have lost those games if they were run in drafts though. Carrick and Scholes against those 4? That is game over ain't it? :)


 

oneniltothearsenal

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Great sides from Skizz and Shave. I think these might have been the two most improved sides through reinforcements. Both sides eliminated their weak spot and played to their strengths.

Definitely his career peak though.

Fun fact, actually watched him live once where he played the first half on the left and stank the place with the usual knock and run, switched to the right in the second half and created absolute havoc.

For me he went from a very good player to a proper match winner the moment he was switched to the right.
For me his career peak was his final year at Spurs where he played on the left.
 

Skizzo

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The below is Redondo’s highlights from 99-00 Champions League

The midfields he was against? A 442 with Beckham-Keane-Scholes-Giggs

Real Madrid midfield? Redondo-Helguera with Mcmanaman supporting on the wing. The other wing had Solari.

We of course lost the tie with Redondo stealing the show with outrageous skill before laying on an assist, and leading Sir Alex to praise him.

Madrid would have lost those games if they were run in drafts though. Helguera and Redondo against those 4? That is game over ain't it? :)

 

Šjor Bepo

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Scholes performance at Nou Camp was a defensive masterclass
 

GodShaveTheQueen

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Madrid would have lost those games if they were run in drafts though. Helguera and Redondo against those 4? That is game over ain't it? :)
That is exactly the point, good sir. Its not about whether Redondo is better or Scholes is.

Its about not just dismissing any midfield because of the numbers you see from the picture. You need to look at how others around contribute too

This is exactly what your 1st post on the subject does.

Firstly, Sammer. With Keane and Redondo, we already have a good chance of winning a midfield battle. With Sammer able to step up into the midfield and help overload, it will leave too much for Scholes and Stiles to do.
 

GodShaveTheQueen

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And don't copy my posts man, took me a while to sound dramatic enough :lol:
 

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On Bale: In a 4-4-2 I would have him on the left too. Another option would have been in the center, playing off the CF, but that position is of course occupied by a certain Eusebio. The inverted RW role is something for a 4-3-3, plus I don't think Bale ever liked that too much himself. His time at Real has been a mixed episode imo (injuries playing a major part there, of course), and his great EURO tournament was in the free role again.

Interesting match, team A is ridiculously stacked in the center, team B has a clear avantage (and plenty of pace) on the wings. For me it's probably about who can better support the areas where the opposition has an advantage, while simultaneously stay threatening where the own advantage lies, if that makes sense.

@GodShaveTheQueen
Will you play on the counter much?


[Edited out a statement on present-day Bale, as I'm not 100% sure and it's not very important]
 

GodShaveTheQueen

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GodShaveTheQueen
Will you play on the counter much?
No mate, I expect to have a good amount of ball and build up play. It would be a boring game and cowardly of me if I play on the counter against a 5-3-2.

I call it a 5-3-2 instead of a 3-5-2 as against wings like mine where there is a super fast winger and attacking full back, the wingback's are pretty much going to be pointless in attack or suicidal if they are adventurous.

Coming back to the question, while I will have counter attacking opportunities, we will still try and play positive football and take the game to the opposition.

As I have reiterated before, I don't expect this to be a possession starved game for me with the support and workrate I will have from my wingers, as was designed. So holding onto the ball should not be a problem.

The transition from midfield to attack is planned to be swift since I have the best sprayer in Scholes and the fastest players on the pitch in Bale, Jair and Eusebio.

So yea, in short, quick direct attacking football to start off with and ready for counter attacking when the opposition is on the ball.
 

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I will have to think about this some more but respect @GodShaveTheQueen for producing the first old school 442 in a draft match. Most of the 442s have a creative second striker rather like I had with Raul so it can be more of a 4411 out of possession but this is much closer to the big man little man front two. I haven't seen that since Heskey and Owen