As much as I think we’ve been screwed over this season that Lindelof pen is 100%. The dopey Cnut moved his arm towards the ball.
VAR and Refs | General Discussion | May 15: Premier League clubs to vote on proposal to scrap VAR from next season
- Thread starter Samid
- Start date
-
In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
You might be related to Alan Shearer then. The ball clearly hit his thigh, you can see both his quad moving and his short going up from the contact. Even without that, the trajectory of the ball alone tells you there must have been contact with a "hard" surface to go upward this fast.
The evidence is pretty clear, the Arsenal players don't tell the ref it doesn't hit his arm. They're asking for offside. You can also see from the behind angle the ball pushes his arm back.
It really isnt, Victor was trying to move his arm out of the way and if the arm wasnt there the ball would have hit his body anyway so its not like he has stopped it going to another West Ham player or in to the net.
Whilst it went in our favour, the Lindelof one was an absolutely shocking decision. They seem to have gone entirely on the basis of the stupid “silhouette” rule, rather than any form of common sense that he moves his hand towards the ball. Its a great example of why trying to make things too prescriptive jist doesn’t work.
You have video evidence that the ball hit his thigh first but you're interested in what the players ask for ?
From the back angle,you can see his arm go from right to left, and no movement towards his goal which a ball coming in full speed would do. Basic physics, please never find yourself in a VAR room.but that’s not the rule is it. He moved his arm towards the ball and it hit it …
It’s about as stone wall handball as you get
https://theathletic.com/4498406/2023/05/08/referee-var-audio-tv-programme/
I doubt we'll hear the audio from the most scandalous ones but at least that's a start.
The Premier League and PGMOL will make audio from on-field officials and Video Assistant Referees (VAR) public for the first time as part of a one-off television pilot.
The audio will consist of officials discussing important decisions from across the 2022-23 Premier League season and will be broadcast before the conclusion of the campaign.
PGMOL chief refereeing officer Howard Webb will also feature on the show to explain the footage to viewers.
Although the pilot is a one off, it is with a view to releasing officials’ audio more frequently from 2023-24 onwards.
The programme will aim to continue to increase the openness and transparency of officiating – areas Webb targeted to improve following his appointment to the revamped PGMOL leadership team.
The 51-year-old former Premier League referee was named PGMOL’s new chief refereeing officer, a freshly created role that sees him responsible for raising standards across the Premier League and EFL, as part of a number of new appointments to the PGMOL leadership team in December.
“We want to engage with people, and manage expectations a bit better than I think might have been done before, and be receptive to feedback,” Webb said in December.
“As it stands at the minute, clearly there’s a feeling that the perception could be better, and the level of transparency could be better.”
The programme will air via the Premier League’s broadcast partners.
The audio will consist of officials discussing important decisions from across the 2022-23 Premier League season and will be broadcast before the conclusion of the campaign.
PGMOL chief refereeing officer Howard Webb will also feature on the show to explain the footage to viewers.
Although the pilot is a one off, it is with a view to releasing officials’ audio more frequently from 2023-24 onwards.
The programme will aim to continue to increase the openness and transparency of officiating – areas Webb targeted to improve following his appointment to the revamped PGMOL leadership team.
The 51-year-old former Premier League referee was named PGMOL’s new chief refereeing officer, a freshly created role that sees him responsible for raising standards across the Premier League and EFL, as part of a number of new appointments to the PGMOL leadership team in December.
“We want to engage with people, and manage expectations a bit better than I think might have been done before, and be receptive to feedback,” Webb said in December.
“As it stands at the minute, clearly there’s a feeling that the perception could be better, and the level of transparency could be better.”
The programme will air via the Premier League’s broadcast partners.
I doubt we'll hear the audio from the most scandalous ones but at least that's a start.
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
mit should have been a pen
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Looks like someone made that visual using paint on Windows 98.
not watching the game, but, in the Milan CL game, the VAR overturning the penalty was unanimously the correct decision on the thread. apparently it was unanimously the wrong decision in commentary, and then this:
system has got to go. they will never let it work.
very rare for an ex-ref on tv to criticise anything, so i think it's telling that they're criticising a var overturn.
system has got to go. they will never let it work.
That kind of sums up the idiocy of VAR in a nutshell. It is NOT designed for the ref to get another look if the VAR team feel he may have made a mistake. It is only designed to come into play if he's made a clear and obvious error.
For me that's never a pen, so good job on VAR, but then that's not VAR working how it's designed. It's such a farce.
For me that's never a pen, so good job on VAR, but then that's not VAR working how it's designed. It's such a farce.
In my book that is a clear and obvious error.
Blatant dive and he should have been booked for it.
On first viewing it maybe did look like a penalty, was quite a convincing fall but when the replay was seen it was clearly seen to be a dive.
= var doing it’s job correctly.
can you imagine the outrage if that was given against us?
Just shows that the people in charge are not interested in getting the right decision, which is currently my biggest problem since I thought that would be the aim of VAR.
It was a clear dive. The commentary I was watching saw it as that too.
All the analysis saying it should have been a penalty miss an important thing. He was touched on the shirt but went down like his legs had been taken. It was a dive plain and simple and referees who can't see that shouldn't be refereeing.
It's a rare case of VAR being used in the right way, but instead they're all complaining about it undermining the referee's original decision.
Either way it’s another controversial decision on an incident that splits opinions. Which was something VAR was supposed to eradicate, not create.
It hasn’t created it though has it? It would have split opinions with or without VAR. What VAR has done in this case is allow the referee to have a second look at a difficult incident and he has decided that it’s not a foul. Excellent use of VAR.
But it’s still not cut and dried, is it? This is one of the rare occasions where VAR has done what it’s supposed to do and we still have differing opinions on the incident itself.
VAR is not creating these problems, the referees are.
It was an excellent use of it. It should be "We think you might have got it wrong or missed something. Have another look".
Instead we have "you couldn't possibly make a mistake. We will only step in if you didnt see it".
VAR is creating problems. It was set up under false pretences. That we would consistently get the "correct" decision. This hasn't happened because in all the most controversial decisions there rarely is a "correct" decision and opinions will never be congruent (even a really obvious call like last night's incident has split opinions) And when technology which is supposed to remove human error fails to do what it promised then you will inevitably get accusations of bias and corruption. Which has happened throughout this season. The VAR fans keep saying "it's not VAR it's the referees" which completely ignores the fact that VAR could only ever be a tool used by, you guessed it, referees.
But that’s always going to be the case with football. The idea of VAR should be to improve decisions, not to remove debate. The reality is that we get far fewer terrible decisions now but they are obviously focussed on even more when they do occur because they are being made wrongly even with the benefit of video assistance.
Agree completely with this. The focus should be on getting the correct decision, rather than protecting the on-field referee from criticism. It’s just about changing the tone/focus and it will work much better.
The sooner we have AI behind VAR instead of cowpat brains like Marriner the better.
I don’t know about “far fewer” terrible decisions. We probably do get less but, as you say, they create much more controversy and they’re infinitely more annoying. All of which means that, on balance, VAR has made officiating feel a lot worse than it has ever been before. No matter what the actual stats show.
I'm quite sure we get more correct decisions than we did before. The increased focus on the quality of referees is because we now all have the benefit of ultra high quality replays with which to question their decisions.
If you want any more proof that the referees are out to protect themselves, look at how they stopped showing so many angles of incidents once they realised they were being used to analyse and criticise them.
Definite handball by the Leeds player there and a clear pen, that was the same as the Luke Shaw one against Brighton
Just watching PSG v AC Ajaccio and after Hakimi scored the 2nd goal and bizarely VAR sent the ref over to the pitchside monitor to review it for a handball by Mbappe even though it clearly wasnt handball and even if it was it wasnt delibrate so it wouldnt have mattered anyway because it wasnt him who scored.
VAR watching Anderson punch Lerma in the face and then saying it was okay because it wasn't a swinging arm.
So Andersen punches Lerma and breaks his nose, VAR look at it and take no action.
What is the point of VAR exactly?
What is the point of VAR exactly?
To justify the bad decision's that the on-field ref has already made.
I don’t understand how grown men can consistently feck up watching a replay of something that just happened.
I can’t believe they gave that Kane penalty. The laws changed so that if a player draws the contact it’s not a foul, Kane falls into Martinez.
Kane is one of, if not the, biggest cheats in England
Kane is one of, if not the, biggest cheats in England
If he comes to us that would not be given
Wait what?! Why is this barely being reported in the press?VAR watching Anderson punch Lerma in the face and then saying it was okay because it wasn't a swinging arm.
Can't find a video of it anywhere.
Because calling it a ‘punch’ is over-egging the matter somewhat!
And it definitely isn’t red card worthy.
Lerma should be knighted for ploughing on for the rest of the 90 montes with a broken nose too
It's shown at the start of these highlights. Not the most violent of things, but he's hit him right on the nose with a closed fist.