he never was，unfortunately
Was prime Rooney really the 3rd best player in the world?
- Thread starter MalaysianRed7
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Don't think its that twisted. 3rd best player in the world almost never able to win PL player of the year award?
People tend to argue that Sneidjer should have won it in 2010 and Ribery in 2013.
There's always controversy about it, but there wasn't any with Rooney.
No shame really winning it it's extremely hard. Rooney was class, but we don't need to pretend or mithyfy him and something he wasn't.
No never, quite a few ahead of him.
I dunno. kakas peak seems to be the point deduction season when they gave up on the league and simply focused on 3 games every 7 weeks.
it’s not discussed enough but his Ballon Dor really was a robbery imo. The entire team just didn’t try in Serie A
Well they did deduct them something like 15 points, so the league was pretty much lost for them. But the way he played in that champions league I don't think there was anybody else who could claim the ballon besides him.
Aside peps Barcelona.
Nay
Whilst I agree the bolded is the major factor I also think you massively under appareciate how important Rooney was in that period.
Berbatov and Nani are the epitome of inconsistency and frustration and Valencia was more of a workhorse than a free-scoring winger, the squad was hard working with a GOAT manager of course, but Rooney was pretty much the only magic on that pitch in that period and he turned up every week.
Aside from Ronnie and Messi you can take any of the other players you mentioned out of their respective sides and they wouldn’t be hugely missed, not in the same way we would without Rooney.
He did win it. Just once, is your argument.
But it's like the argument, if Scholes was that good why did he barely get an individual award?
Why do people care about this?
Rooney was Englands biggest star and Man Utd's after Ronaldo left. Scholes never had that profile. And Scholes was never touted as the worlds 3rd best or England's best/2nd best.
I don't rate Robben higher than Ronaldo in the general sense (even I am not that biased). What I mean is, Robben on his day just doesn't need teammates to decide a game, whereas Ronaldo, especially later in his career is very dependant on supply.
Bale is very similar, though for me definitely a step below Robben. Especially the way he squandered quite a good bit of his peak years playing golf whereas Robben always worked insanely hard to get his perpetually failing body back in shape and form.
As I said though, Biased
Well agree on Bale but disagree on Ronaldo. I’d say given he played in less system heavy teams he’s probably the most influential individual players ever seen in this generation. Still remember Robben and Duff terrorising the PL all those years ago, how time flies.I don't rate Robben higher than Ronaldo in the general sense (even I am not that biased). What I mean is, Robben on his day just doesn't need teammates to decide a game, whereas Ronaldo, especially later in his career is very dependant on supply.
Bale is very similar, though for me definitely a step below Robben. Especially the way he squandered quite a good bit of his peak years playing golf whereas Robben always worked insanely hard to get his perpetually failing body back in shape and form.
As I said though, Biased
I don't underappreciate how important Rooney was which is why I have him in contention as one of the top 5 players at his peak, suggesting that I under appreciate him in that context borders on ridiculous. Again the issue is that you are being hyperbolic for no good reason. You decided to underrate the contribution of his teammates for no good reason, United in 09/10 arguably had the best defense in the world, they were arguably the most solid team in the world, Carrick, Fletcher and Scholes were playing at a high level. Rooney was the best player in a very good team, he didn't carry the team but he was the centerpiece of our attack and did it brilliantly.
But even if we say that he was carrying the team in 09/10, that season the third best player isn't definitively Rooney. It's a season where the likes of Milito, Lucio, Sneijder, Eto'o, Xavi, Iniesta were all in contention for best performer out of all players including Messi and Ronaldo.
No he wasn't. There could have been parts of the season when he was for two or three months but you can say that about quite a few players. Rooney only had one world class full season for us and that was 2009/10 and he was not the third best player in the world then as Xavi, Iniesta and Sneijder were better that year. Its debatable if he should have even won the PFA player of the year as Drogba was every bit as good as him that season.
Rooney was a fantastic player though and mostly top 10 through 2006-2012.
Rooney was a fantastic player though and mostly top 10 through 2006-2012.
This. Ronaldo really should have won it that year.
Once upon a time? Possibly.
I remember Rooney being quite poor in the semi final and final of the CL the year we won it. He was pretty anonymous at the nou camp, missed the second leg due to injury and got subbed off in the final after a sloppy performance. You can't be called 3rd best player in the world with performances like that when it matters most.
I'm a Ronaldo fan and he has had finals in Cl's and Euros where he hasn't really done anything but he was leading them up to that point. It's the same with Rooney as a "third best player" level minus maybe one extra performance or two.
Unfortunately nowhere near, maybe in top 10 on a good day. However, to be fair he was arguably the second most talented English player of all time -the first being Paul Gascoigne -and could play in any outfield position on the park if asked to by SAF.
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I’m not being hyperbolic, I’ve agreed it was a solid team but what I’ve pointed out is attacking wise it was bereft of the options we had previously.
Rooney was our attack in that sense, and rightly deserves extra praise for that.
I don’t have to downplay the squad at that time to make that point or be hyperbolic as you claim.
Feck sake. Name 10 players who were nailed on playing better than Rooney was in his peak.
The underrating is criminal.
You were being hyperbolic when you said that he was carrying the team and tried to undermine his teammates. And Rooney get deserved extra praised by being in the conversation for top to 5-10 in the world, that's high praise.
There was a short period before RVP, Falcao, Lewa, Robben, Ribery etc and when the old guard was fading (Totti, Henry, Kaka, Sheva) that Rooney and Iniesta were probably competing for the 3rd best player. Iniesta hold on for years while Rooney started declining by 2011. Even though he was immense in 2011-2012, Saf saw that he could not lead us to a title in a way RVP did. So yeah maybe for few months in the end of 2009 was.
Again your misinterpreting what I’ve said, I clearly meant in an attacking sense. I’ve been pretty clear and only responded on squad quality that you have posed in your own replies, like Berbatov and Nani being hugely inconsistent (shock horror!) and Valencia being workman-like rather than any sort of goal scoring dominant winger. Nothing excessive there, just accurate and goes with my point that Rooney had it all to do in order to bring us consistent attacking threat in the most difficult league of all.
It’s an obvious observation for anybody who watched that team in that period. Its more to do with the manager of course but Rooney was the difference for us in a team way less talented (attacking wise) than it had been previously. If you don’t want to acknowledge that then good for you.
Robben first top season was 09/10 and Xavi was generally better than Iniesta in particular during the 2008/2011 period and it's also when Eto'o was ridiculously good for Barcelona. Football fans were blessed with many world class players at their best without actual deep in quality.
Come on.
I don't know if I' misinterpreting what you said or if you are moving the goalpost as the conversation goes. You said that he carried us to the level of Barcelona if you were talking about the attack then it makes little sense since we weren't at the level of Barcelona or even Chelsea from an attacking point of view, we had a top defense and midfield though. And no one didn't acknowledge that he was our best attacking player, I literally labeled him as the brilliant centerpiece of our attack.
And none of it is that significant when it comes to who was the third best player in the world, it doesn't give Rooney a particular edge over other players, particularly when if we use your rating of the PL, someone like Drogba would be in the conversation, the same would be true for Tevez who was even more important for a poorer version of City.
He wasn't because United has been shit since SAF left and the fans online now think we've always been shit and rather underrate our best players. Trying to be so objective that they think it's impossible for our record scorer to be anywhere the the best in the world.
I said essentially that he ‘carried us’ in an attacking sense, I mean he’s not a goalkeeper or defender is he, but in more than just scoring goals, in his all round attacking abilities, he was the driving force of the team during a time where we had far less attacking options than previously, in the wake of losing our best player in Ronaldo. That he was comfortably the best player in the league at that time and in my opinion for that period the 3rd best player behind Ronaldo and Messi.
Drogba and Tevez are in the conversation as you rightly pointed out, in a goal scoring sense, but Rooney was the best all round player in the league at that time, no doubt about that imo.
There was a time when Rooney was one of the best players in Europe. He was an unreal talent.
Iniesta was leagues better than Rooney, it's not even close.
In their later period yes I agree. But from 2006 till 2010, I wouldn't say Iniesta was leagues better.
Yes.
Voodoo hex upon all slanderers and naysayers.
Voodoo hex upon all slanderers and naysayers.
technically he was a couple of levels above Rooney and his importance to that Barcelona team....He was just a lot better as a footballer. In fact he is one of the best pure footballers I’ve seen.
Iniesta, in terms of technique, is better also than Ronaldo.But that doesn't make him a better player. Up until 2007, Rooney was as important as Ronaldo for us. I think people tend to underestimate how good he was due to the fact that he became a championship player after 2015.
I guess you're the same person who also thinks Jorghino is 3rd best player in the world according to Ballon d'Or voting this year. I couldn't care less about popularity contests or such things.
A 31-year-old Drogba went to AFCON for 6 weeks and a 24-year-old Rooney still ended up with inferior stats than Drogba despite having extra advantage lmfao.
Chelsea was an amazing team that season, but it doesn't take anything away from Drogba as the clear-cut best player in England from 09/10 season. And like I said, nobody with a straight face would think he was ever 3rd best player at point of his career. Do you also discredit Messi's & Cristiano's stats while playing for ridiculously stacked teams? Barca & Madrid used to score a crap ton of goals in every game throughout 2010s.
At the end of the day, a striker is judged by goals + assists. Lewandowski, thanks to his stats, is clearly a better player than Rooney ever was despite the latter has better "all-around game". Wayne Rooney isn't even on same echelon as
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