Was Sterling the worst player in terms of performance vs expectation at the world cup?
- Thread starter RedTillI'mDead
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It’s apples and oranges comparing Lewa and Sterling.
Sterling didn’t underperform that’s obviously not what I’m trying to say.
Saying his position demands certain numbers is pretty naive tbh. You’re failing to see the bigger picture. The role he played was effectively to draw players out to leave more room for Alli and Lingard to create things and lets be honest both had a relatively average tournament. That’s not down to Raheem Sterling and the role he was asked to play for the manager for the greater good of the team.
Ive seen enough of your comments to agree to disagree.
He was playing in a completely different role/team/system
I struggle to see any defence for him. But you do so if it helps you to sleep at night it is what it is!
Never seen such a clueless player in the box. Always wrong decision making.
My expectations were highly unrealistic if I wanted the second best goal scorer of the highest ever total points PL side to score a goal?
No objection. This world cup campaign ranks among the top three football disappointments of my lifetime, including CL 1999 and 2012.
My comments
You’re the one that’s moronically biased against him for whatever reason.
Strange player, he looked like he improved a lot under Guardiola, but when we watch him he looks a disaster waiting to happen, wrong decisions one after another.
This sums it up for me. I'd agree he was by far at least the biggest disappointment of the entire England squad. I'm not sure what was going on in that head of his but every time he was around the box it seemed like he suddenly was 2 steps behind everyone else. Very weird to watch.
Agree, if he had turned up to the expected level based on his prior form, Your not looking at winning the world cup, but its the difference between some extra goals at the group stage, more emphatic wins meaning more positivity and momentum and probably the x factor that was needed against Croatia when we stupidly sat back wanting to play on the counter.
He was trusted with a position of immense responsibility to be the creator in the side and botched it.
He was trusted with a position of immense responsibility to be the creator in the side and botched it.
He’s a confidence player and for England his confidence is on the floor. It’s partly a snowball effect. All the noise and derision from the press won’t help a fragile player like him. I was hoping he would score an important goal just to get the ball rolling but it wasn’t to be. I’m not sure how much longer Southgate can persist with him playing like this.
He wasn’t the worst player I don’t think. Lewandowski has a bigger reputation and didn’t show up at all. Messi scored one great goal and did little else. Given he’s the greatest for so many I think he was more disappointing.
He wasn’t the worst player I don’t think. Lewandowski has a bigger reputation and didn’t show up at all. Messi scored one great goal and did little else. Given he’s the greatest for so many I think he was more disappointing.
As a neutral, I thought Alli was England’s worst performer by a million miles. Whether it was fitness or him just being a limited footballer, he hasn’t shown up in either tournament for England.
Sterling was also poor, and people are quick to defend him because his movement and ability to get in behind (as he did to good effect against Sweden) but when he cocks up over and over again, you can’t continue to credit him for getting into the those positions because he does nothing with those opportunities.
Also, I don’t know what kind of instruction Kane was getting but he was woeful in the knockout rounds. Took his penalties well and being English there is something to be said about that but the role he was playing - him attempting to be anything other than a poacher - didn’t suit him at all, and thus he had zero impact. Everyone else was pretty good I thought. Standouts were Pickford, the back 3, and Trippier.
Sterling was also poor, and people are quick to defend him because his movement and ability to get in behind (as he did to good effect against Sweden) but when he cocks up over and over again, you can’t continue to credit him for getting into the those positions because he does nothing with those opportunities.
Also, I don’t know what kind of instruction Kane was getting but he was woeful in the knockout rounds. Took his penalties well and being English there is something to be said about that but the role he was playing - him attempting to be anything other than a poacher - didn’t suit him at all, and thus he had zero impact. Everyone else was pretty good I thought. Standouts were Pickford, the back 3, and Trippier.
I sometimes think he over-complicates to the point that having explored every option he ends up stood still with none left.
Whereas, the very best at least make sure they get a shot off or they play someone in.
But for Sterling, the delay that is usually involved closes down the opportunity that was on offer for the next guy too.
Having said that, I thought this partnership with Harry generated a lot of initial danger - but that isn't the same as scoring or efforts raining in on the opposition goal, obviously.
Huh? For England Delle Alli was worse than Sterling.
Tournament wise maybe Neymar for me. Expected him to dominate with Brazil but spent half the time rolling about on the floor like a gimp.
Oh and Germany. Hardly worth singling out Ozil because it's just Ozil.
Tournament wise maybe Neymar for me. Expected him to dominate with Brazil but spent half the time rolling about on the floor like a gimp.
Oh and Germany. Hardly worth singling out Ozil because it's just Ozil.
He's a wide player who was playing in a really crappy 3-5-2 and expected to make nearly everything happen as a striker leading the line, what exactly did people expect? England chucked long balls over the top to him constantly which he doggedly chased and mostly made the best of. He was by far our most threatening player on the ball and pretty much the only England attacking player (Aside from on occasion Lingard) who actually frightened any defenders all tournament, from open play.
Yeah, he messed up a few chances he should put away. He's a terrible finisher, but this isn't something new. He's always had zero composure in front of goal and poor technique when striking the ball. He's never going to lead the line for any team and be a success, because that isn't his game. His strength for City this season was popping up in some excellent areas, he scored a ton of tap ins from balls across the box to pad out his stats. Nothing wrong with that, but you can't look at those goals and say he's a player who leads the line. He's a support player who benefited from some fantastic players around him, he's a really good player with excellent dribbling and pace to terrify defenders, but a bit of speed does not qualify you to lead the line at a World Cup. Go look at the video of all his goals in the 2017/2018 season, does anybody see a striker? This isn't even taking in to account the massive added pressure which comes with playing for England at a World Cup, especially when you're a player who has been shredded in the past. He was never going to be calm and composed.
He basically played exactly how I expected him to, a wide forward shoved up front so he could be shoehorned in to a system which clearly never fitted him, or pretty much any of our attacking players. It's something Southgate has to work on, but it isn't Sterling's fault, you can't expect him to suddenly become a different player just because he put up some good stats in a completely different City system in a totally different role, it's ridiculous. Anyone who expected anything different from him in this role was going in with unrealistic expectations, sure you can say a few opportunities he should score regardless of positioning, but he misses plenty of chances for City too. It's just they create loads so it often doesn't get highlighted as much.
@CassiusClaymore you mention Alli as being worse and you're right, he was constantly giving the ball away and a complete non-threat. That's what you get from Dele Alli in CM though, especially in a system where the other players won't be able to carry him. I think most Spurs fans could have told you from the start that if you play Alli in that role/position he's going to offer you nothing but losing possession and looking lost. He needs to be as close to the striker as possible because he's basically a shadow striker, in that role he still won't offer that much for the 90 minutes but he will give you goals and assists. His movement in the box is world class, but again Southgate has him in a role that he's woeful in so nobody should expect anything. It's not like these guys are bonafide world stars, they aren't going to thrive wherever they are on the pitch, they are players with clearly defined strengths & weaknesses which their club managers have identified and thus best utilized them in roles that suit the strengths.
Yeah, he messed up a few chances he should put away. He's a terrible finisher, but this isn't something new. He's always had zero composure in front of goal and poor technique when striking the ball. He's never going to lead the line for any team and be a success, because that isn't his game. His strength for City this season was popping up in some excellent areas, he scored a ton of tap ins from balls across the box to pad out his stats. Nothing wrong with that, but you can't look at those goals and say he's a player who leads the line. He's a support player who benefited from some fantastic players around him, he's a really good player with excellent dribbling and pace to terrify defenders, but a bit of speed does not qualify you to lead the line at a World Cup. Go look at the video of all his goals in the 2017/2018 season, does anybody see a striker? This isn't even taking in to account the massive added pressure which comes with playing for England at a World Cup, especially when you're a player who has been shredded in the past. He was never going to be calm and composed.
He basically played exactly how I expected him to, a wide forward shoved up front so he could be shoehorned in to a system which clearly never fitted him, or pretty much any of our attacking players. It's something Southgate has to work on, but it isn't Sterling's fault, you can't expect him to suddenly become a different player just because he put up some good stats in a completely different City system in a totally different role, it's ridiculous. Anyone who expected anything different from him in this role was going in with unrealistic expectations, sure you can say a few opportunities he should score regardless of positioning, but he misses plenty of chances for City too. It's just they create loads so it often doesn't get highlighted as much.
@CassiusClaymore you mention Alli as being worse and you're right, he was constantly giving the ball away and a complete non-threat. That's what you get from Dele Alli in CM though, especially in a system where the other players won't be able to carry him. I think most Spurs fans could have told you from the start that if you play Alli in that role/position he's going to offer you nothing but losing possession and looking lost. He needs to be as close to the striker as possible because he's basically a shadow striker, in that role he still won't offer that much for the 90 minutes but he will give you goals and assists. His movement in the box is world class, but again Southgate has him in a role that he's woeful in so nobody should expect anything. It's not like these guys are bonafide world stars, they aren't going to thrive wherever they are on the pitch, they are players with clearly defined strengths & weaknesses which their club managers have identified and thus best utilized them in roles that suit the strengths.
No.
Neymar the biggest high profile let down.
In the England team itself, Alli was much worse.
Neymar the biggest high profile let down.
In the England team itself, Alli was much worse.
I liked his lay-off to Harry Kane in the match against Belgium. Outside of that, his decision making was god-awful. He kind of freezes up... stumbling and bumbling... caught in two minds.
Said it in the other thread, welbeck would have been more effective in the role Sterling had.
But isn't Sterling playing out of position and even worse in a role that exposes his weaknesses?
This.
Who has more goals for England? Emile Heskey or Sterling?
No, I wouldn't say that (even though his goal scoring record for England is terrible). But your expectations were clearly unrealistic if you ended up being so disappointed that you declared him the worst player in the tournament (relative to expectations) – which is what the OP states.
This is the obvious answer. Sterling is not a second striker and asking him to run through on goal and finish 1v1 is pointless. He is a runner that destabilises the defensive shape and needs the ball on a plate and even then he'll miss sitters regularly.
It's like asking why Alli was utter shite at the World Cup. Because he's not a no.8!
He could have done just that aswell. Had Kane not been so greedy. And squared the simple 2 yard pass to sterling to clinch the second against Croatia. England would be playing in a World Cup Final. Kane had a poor tournament. Maybe had about 15 good minutes all tournament. Yet he is looking odds on to win the golden boot. Mental
I don't get this. I thought Sterling was good overall.
Is it better to:
Make a chance out of nothing on your own, then miss it
Or
To not make that chance at all?
Internet fans seem to lean towards the latter. Those within the game appreciate the former.
There wasn't a single defender who had an easy game against Sterling, and every opposing manager had to adapt their tactics to counter Sterling's significant threat. The fact his conversion rate was poor doesn't mean he didn't pose a huge question to the teams he played against.
Is it better to:
Make a chance out of nothing on your own, then miss it
Or
To not make that chance at all?
Internet fans seem to lean towards the latter. Those within the game appreciate the former.
There wasn't a single defender who had an easy game against Sterling, and every opposing manager had to adapt their tactics to counter Sterling's significant threat. The fact his conversion rate was poor doesn't mean he didn't pose a huge question to the teams he played against.
Wasn’t great in the ball, but off the ball he was pretty decent,
44 games for England, 2 goals scored. Facts don’t lie.
Is it better to:
Make a chance out of nothing on your own, then miss it
Or
To not make that chance at all?
Scoring is the best outcome. But if you can't do that, which is the next best thing?
He was shite. Don't even know how that's up for debate. As an attacking player your off the ball movement should be good, but if you offer feck all else other than that and pace then it's not enough.
Alli was worse but he wasn't great for Spurs last season either - Lingard was a lot better than him. Sterling was so disappointing because he was great for City but very poor in an England shirt.
Next best thing is find someone who can put the ball in the net, even now and again. Sterling isn’t in that category.
Sancho looking likely to be that player if he keeps it up at Dortmund.
Who else in England could have got on the end of those chances and put the ball in the net?
Take Sterling out of the team and those chances never happen.
Exactly i struggle to see what he brings at all he's so overated. Sterling at least stretches defences and causes problems.
Nonsense. He’s England’s no.2 striker. He’s scored 2 goals in 44 games. That puts so much unnecessary pressure on the no.1 striker. You’re trying to defend the indefensible.
Yes, but even Alli scores the occasional goal. Sterling doesn’t.
Answer the question.
In terms of England. Sterling, because my hopes were high for him, it's not that he played badly, it was more that it was irritating seeing Southgate seemingly trying to play him into form without changing anything around him. Alli didn't have a great season (at least when I was watching him) so I wasn't disappointed by him, again I was more surprised to see him keep appearing, particularly as he didn't look fully fit most of the time.
DdG didn't have a nice tournament. Neymar might as well have not bothered going (in fact it would probably have better for his reputation), but there were a few Brazil players in that category. Same with Germany.
DdG didn't have a nice tournament. Neymar might as well have not bothered going (in fact it would probably have better for his reputation), but there were a few Brazil players in that category. Same with Germany.
It’s a ridiculous question. You’re asking me if it’s better to make a chance and not score or not make a chance at all. So in essence you’re asking if it’s better to not score or not score.
I have to admit Sterling does “not scoring” pretty well.