Yeah, it's not an innovation. It's the same system he used at Juve, which in turn he himself learned from the myriad of Italian teams who was using it prior to him in Serie A.
Watching old football matches
- Thread starter Cantonagotmehere
- Start date
Italy v Brazil - 1994 FIFA World Cup Final.
It is exciting, if you like to watch flying tackles.
You got to see older Baresi, Maldini, and Roberto Baggio at their peak; and Dunga, Mauro Silva, Bebeto, Romario, with young Cafu as RW.
It is exciting, if you like to watch flying tackles.
You got to see older Baresi, Maldini, and Roberto Baggio at their peak; and Dunga, Mauro Silva, Bebeto, Romario, with young Cafu as RW.
Technically, that final was terrible. Baggio was barely able to walk, physically not 100%, for example. It was also very hot. The games before, though, were great. And the final had Baresi showing why many consider him the best defender ever!
Agreed that technically that final was just so so. It's between two defensive teams (yes that include Brazil) that I found it exciting. Those flying and crunching tackles were incredible. Agreed about Baresi. And he was 34 y.o. at that time already. Also, although Romario didn't score, but this game is a showcase of why he's one of the best striker of all time, imho.
He was 34 and he'd managed to get back from a meniscus tear in a month to be available for the final. Man was inhuman
Some good vids here, especially for United.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCkxAs6CizRYij3D5XXkoGqQ/videos
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCkxAs6CizRYij3D5XXkoGqQ/videos
Interestinh given you're Chelsea fan you say this as I thought the regular meet ups between Chelsea and Liverpool in those times in both league and CL were proper chess type matches. Benitez was the one manager in Mourinho's early years in prem who could effectively nulify him in cup games at least and they were proper tactical battles.
I was going to post that link Gazza above put....some geat prem games on there. Watched the start of Newcastle 2 Man. United 6 and Shearer and Keane standing next to each other awkward as feck before the teams ran out.
During lockdown last year I watched Chelsea's 4-1 win at Anfield from the 2005-06 season. The football on display would have enthralled and entertained the likes of Tony Pulis and Sam Allardyce no end.
Just an absolute shambles of football for 10-15 seconds.
Liverpool - Man Utd in 1979/80. Every player in that team tries to press and run the offside trap right near the halfway line. Liverpool player just chips it over everyone and runs onto his own ball. He's one on one with the keeper; squares to Dalglish for an open goal and somehow Dalglish spanners it wide.
Time stamped video below, but 30:34 if it doesn't.
Liverpool - Man Utd in 1979/80. Every player in that team tries to press and run the offside trap right near the halfway line. Liverpool player just chips it over everyone and runs onto his own ball. He's one on one with the keeper; squares to Dalglish for an open goal and somehow Dalglish spanners it wide.
Time stamped video below, but 30:34 if it doesn't.
Maradona, aged 19, absolutely demolishing England. He's got them all in his pocket. We won this game, but the England players couldn't touch him. This is not even a "good" game by his standards, but what a performance.
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Oh my. I honestly don't think I've ever seen a sequence like that offside "trap" before.
That pitch also deserves some recognition.
That's an incredible few seconds of football
If you wanna watch Maradona ragdoll England why not just watch 86?
Because there's a lot to be said about being 19 and that consistent in your passing, dribbling, decision making. It's also to show just how close to complete he was even at that age. This isn't anywhere near peak age Maradona destroying England. This is teenage Maradona fresh out of winning the FIFA World Youth Championship.
Watching the 1996 Charity Shield. Alex Ferguson's side played some slick, passing football. Every player seemed comfortable on the ball and the ball was moving at a good tempo. Newcastle had a win to savour over Manchester United during the 1996-97 season but they were totally outclassed at Wembley.
That was a out of this world performance. It never fails to impress me.
If managers like Fergie or Pep saw that sort of positional play, they’d fine each and every one of that team 2 weeks wages.
The whole team ran out in a straight line. Wouldn’t the midfielders and attackers be ahead of the defence beforehand anyway?
And the miss...
I was almost 15 years old when my sister's then binge-drinking boyfriend got tickets for this game. He worked for BBC as a cameraman or producer and he somehow scored some brilliant seats right at the half-way line about 7-8 rows back. I remember the walkway into the stadium and the scores of Newcastle fans eagerly chanting away because Shearer was making his debut. He was supposed to destroy us. By the halfway point the United fans were already singing, "Cheer up Kevin Keegan". Was absolutely hilarious. Those goals looked quality on TV, but in person? Nicky Butt's flying header looked like he was flying to meet the header.
Weirdly enough, I think it was the Dutch 'Total Football' team that were the first to do it. It was meant to be some kind of extreme all-out press and offside trap in one. Although wildly unsuccessful, it was the precursor to what we now know as group pressure.If managers like Fergie or Pep saw that sort of positional play, they’d fine each and every one of that team 2 weeks wages.
The whole team ran out in a straight line. Wouldn’t the midfielders and attackers be ahead of the defence beforehand anyway?
And the miss...
A good explanation of it is here
Here you go
I was watching highlights of the CL games from last night, and eventually Youtube auto play decided I wanted to watch the second leg of the Supercopa in 2011 between Barcelona and Madrid. I think this was Jose's second season at Madrid. I only watched the first half before I had to run, but a few things stood out:
Messi used to press way more. By this time he was the attacking outlet for Barcelona (set up Iniesta for the first, scored the second). Villa and Pedro didn't have the best first halves.
Real gave Barcelona a good game and made it an enjoyable spectacle, and nearly pulled off a win. I've always said Barcelona wasn't boring, it was the opponents that set up shop that made the contest boring.
Real were far more crisp in the counter attack and posed a lot of questions of Barcelona's defense. Di Maria and Ozil broke through Barca's press many times with a well timed dribble or pass. I think by this time Ronaldo was purely focused on hanging off the back line, with Benzema dropping more deep to collect the ball.
Barcelona looked more porous out of possession, and more impotent in possession than I recall them at their peak. They used to strangle teams and not give them a sniff at goal. I think if I watched this again, in retrospect I could identify more portents hinting at their surrender of the La Liga title to a more hungry Madrid, even though they did win the Supercopa eventually.
Messi used to press way more. By this time he was the attacking outlet for Barcelona (set up Iniesta for the first, scored the second). Villa and Pedro didn't have the best first halves.
Real gave Barcelona a good game and made it an enjoyable spectacle, and nearly pulled off a win. I've always said Barcelona wasn't boring, it was the opponents that set up shop that made the contest boring.
Real were far more crisp in the counter attack and posed a lot of questions of Barcelona's defense. Di Maria and Ozil broke through Barca's press many times with a well timed dribble or pass. I think by this time Ronaldo was purely focused on hanging off the back line, with Benzema dropping more deep to collect the ball.
Barcelona looked more porous out of possession, and more impotent in possession than I recall them at their peak. They used to strangle teams and not give them a sniff at goal. I think if I watched this again, in retrospect I could identify more portents hinting at their surrender of the La Liga title to a more hungry Madrid, even though they did win the Supercopa eventually.
That much is true, which is understandable given his relative age now and then. Now, it's about preserving energy so that when he has the ball he can make something happen. Also, since Messi plays almost every minute of every game, well into his 30's, that kind of constant pressing would make him more injury prone and fatigued; and if Messi is out then Barcelona are usually much worse (or have been).
That being said, as of February, Messi had the third highest number of ball recoveries and second highest ball recovery percentage, ahead of Lewandowski, Neymar, Suarez, Salah, Haaland, Mbappe, Ibra, Ronaldo, Rashford, and Benzema, so Koeman does have him pressing more than recent years.
Absolutely. People always used this rhetoric versus Barcelona. They use it now versus City. It's silly. They never blame the team putting ten men behind the ball and refusing to commit men forward as being the reason the game is boring, which is silly because that's clearly what is the cause of a boring game.
Aye, after the Dutch, Milan and Liverpool were the most effective exponents of the tactic in the 1980s. The European Cup Semi-Final between Real Madrid and Milan is probably the best example of it, where Real grew increasingly frustrated at getting caught offside every time they went forward. A few examples in the video below.Weirdly enough, I think it was the Dutch 'Total Football' team that were the first to do it. It was meant to be some kind of extreme all-out press and offside trap in one. Although wildly unsuccessful, it was the precursor to what we now know as group pressure.
A good explanation of it is here
Here you go
Found a short segment from an old show Footballer's Football talking about Utd's chances to finally win the title - Guest's featuring Edwards, Law, Wilkins...
starts at 16:00
starts at 16:00
Maradona was the best player in the world even at this age. It’s just that back then the talent was more spread out over the globe so it wasn’t immediately apparent who the best was. If you were in England, you watched English football almost exclusively.
If you watch the full game (available online), before the match starts, the commentator mentions that Maradona has recently won South American player of the year and Kevin Keegan has recently won the Ballon D’Or. Therefore, he says, this match ‘arguably features the two best players in the world’.
In reality though, Maradona was far ahead of Keegan, even though he was still a kid and KK was at his peak.
For old United stuff (mainly 90's) check these two Youtube Channels:
Red Rizal https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCCm8WsvhJdt3-4cegiDDodw
Classic Man Utd Videos and Clips https://www.youtube.com/user/Sunstroker
Red Rizal https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCCm8WsvhJdt3-4cegiDDodw
Classic Man Utd Videos and Clips https://www.youtube.com/user/Sunstroker
MOTD from almost 30 years ago
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Wonderful, there's a Goal of The Month segment too! There's weirdly so little of those from the iconic 'Life of Riley' era actually on YouTube, copyright blocks or did people simply re-record over MOTD once they'd watched it after getting in that night? It even makes me feel nostalgic and I was born in 1994.
Thanks for posting these, brings back some nice memories, just watched the first few minutes, I’ll watch the rest at some point.
footballia.net
Best site out there for old matches. I've been watching a lot of United from 2006-2009. We were fecking brilliant to watch.
Best site out there for old matches. I've been watching a lot of United from 2006-2009. We were fecking brilliant to watch.
Cantona did an episode of Andy Grays Boot Room. I’d love to watch it back but can’t find it anywhere. He spoke of his idea of how a modern midfield could work, moving as a square four.
Yeah. Memory’s hazy, but I think he loved Sacchi’s Milan midfield and pushed Ferguson to adopt the same approach to be successful in Europe.
Same user has uploaded another fascinating MOTD, very very early Premier League, the 2nd matchday in August 1992. Leeds as reigning champs, sub-League Two standard pitches, several instances of goalkeepers bungling the new backpass rulings. And a solo goal by Chelsea's Graham Stuart that has seemingly been vaporised from 'Great Prem Goals' history.
Yeah same i recorded it too at the time. cant find it though
Yes!
iirc there was a bit where Cantona and Gray analysed the Milan - Arsenal Super Cup game at the San Siro.
Focusing on Milan's midfield four and their pressing.
The 1977 FA Cup Final
I was thinking about this the other day. And that the square could be moved all over the pitch and not just midfield, where players could jump in and out at different points as the square moves up, down or left or right.
Fifa runs these coaching clinics where top managers come in and talk tactics etc.
I was on a coaching course years ago and we got to see the one where Mourinho spoke. This was when he was in his first Chelsea spell. He spoke about what he was doing. It all revolved around what he called the 4 moments of the game and the key thing being how quickly teams and players changed from one moment to the next. It wasnt one more man in midfield that did it, it was the speed with which his teams back then changed their roles, reactions, shape etc etc. Unfortunately if you google the 4 moments all you get are news stories about him talking about 4 moments that happened in a particular game as opposed to the actual 4 moments tactics.
This pdf might give you some more insights into what he was doing. https://www.researchgate.net/publication/313774247_Tactical_Periodization_Mourinho's_Best-kept_secret
Probably mentioned already but the 3-3 match with us v Liverpool back in 1988. Robson was getting overrun in mid, was at fault certainly for 1 possibly 2 of our goals, but typical Robbo he scored twice for us. We were 3-1 down and with a man down, seemingly Liverpool coasting to victory. On comes big Norman, elbows Barnes and then smashes McMahon, we are inspired, games end 3-3.