We actually don't need a midfielder! | Post your starting XI and bench with potential positions you think we'll sign! CHECK OP!

Craig Ward

Full Member
Joined
Dec 30, 2016
Messages
1,515
If your talking about “work rate”,then yes,Fred and Mctominay work harder for the team.But would I pick Fred ahead of a fully fit Pogba?definitely not..,Even when Pogba plays poorly he invariably creates 2-3 good chances for the strikers...
While Pogba can be a creative player and has played some eye catching through balls, when he is played deep he is a liability. He offers no defensive ethic and is really tactically unaware and wasteful on the ball.

His bad points playing from deep outweigh the positives of his creative flair for me. He's an extremely over rated footballer
 

7even

Resident moaner, hypocrite and moron
Joined
Jun 4, 2006
Messages
3,840
Location
Lifetime vacation
The most important element first: Pogba wants to leave and should leave. Obvious that he does not want to be here, and the things Raiola has said over the last months has been on PP behalf (acting as the bad guy to get his player a move). Don't see a point in hard balling this as it would likely detract potential star players from coming here. Especially players from France. Despite this, it should be said that on his day or is in the right situation, he is almost unplayable and our best player. Sadly, the combination of our status and ability as a team and PPs abilities have so far shown to be a mismatch. Get what we can (+ £100m) from either Juventus or Real Madrid.

Our current two starting midfielders in Fred and McT are not good enough on the ball as a pair in games where we are playing against a deep sitting team. They are both, arguably, better as disruptive players, i.e. when the team is not on the ball. Matic can perform somewhat in both situations, but should not play many games over a short period based on the last few seasons and his sudden drop in form after an intensive schedule.

Dependent on what is available on the market, I would consider buying two midfielders that are more comfortable on the ball.
The options we should look at are Partey, Tonali, Zakaria and Phillips. In my opinion, these four are better players than our current options for central or defensive midfielders, especially in games where we play against a deep sitting team.
1. Partey is the safest and best option. Only question should be if he is willing to join us. If he is, then we should activate his clause.
2. Tonali is the best passer (his range and ability to spot opportunities from deep is impressive), and can operate in a number of midfield roles.
3. Zakaria is the most dynamic player(difficult to evaluate non-holding type of midfielders in the Bundesliga due to how intensive and gung-hoo the league has been the last two seasons). Potential high upside, but also some uncertainty on how he would suit the league.
4. Phillips is extremely good at playing through the first line of pressing, but if Leeds gets promoted he will stay.

If we sell PP, we should aim to get two midfielders. Partey should be on top of that list together with Tonali.

The obvious, at least to me, main target for this summer should be Sancho. buying him would also mean that there is less pressure on our midfielders to act as creative players, but they should still be able to transition the ball into areas where Bruno and hopefully Sancho operates.

Dependent on money spent and available we should also consider improving our left-back (Telles or Grimaldo?) and central defender (Ake).

Outgoings:
1. Sanchez. Pay him off if needed.
2. Lingard. Same.
3. Jones. £10m?
4. PP. +£100m.
5. Pereira. £10m?
6. Smalling. £20m to Roma.
(DDG could be sold, dependent on Henderson and what we can get for him.)

In:
1. Sancho. + £100m
2. Partey. £40m clause. (Phillips)
3. Tonali. Brescia going down to Serie B.(Zakaria)

LB(Grimaldo/Telles), CB(Ake) and striker(Ighalo?) and some performing championship player(Eze or Benrahma) should be dependent on what we can afford and availability/cost of the player.

Starting 11(Additional potential changes):

DDG (Henderson)
AWB - Maguire - Lindelof(Ake) - Shaw(Telles/Grimaldo)
Tonali - Partey
Sancho
- Bruno - Rashford
Martial​
A very good post but I think you’re a little bit optimistic regarding in and outgoing players.

Buying Bruno in January was a master stroke but it will also affect our summers transfer budget. Secondly it will be very difficult to sell all our deadwood in one window. Expect only two of Rojo/Jones/Smalling to be sold and don’t be surprised if both Sanchez and Pereira will stay another season. Maybe some of them will go out on loan but with a delayed season and probably a shortened summer window we have to be realistic.

I want Pogba to stay but all outside noises tells me that he’s gone so ...

This is my prediction

Pogba - out (€90)
Lingard - out (£20)
Jones - out (£15)
Rojo - out(€2)
Smalling squad or out on loan
Pereira - squad
Sanchez - loan

Sancho - in (€90)
Ighalo - permanent 2 year deal (€15)
Belingham - in (£15+15)
Grealish - in (£50)
 

Fosu-Mens

Full Member
Joined
Apr 11, 2016
Messages
3,764
Location
Fred | 2019/20 Performances
A very good post but I think you’re a little bit optimistic regarding in and outgoing players.

Buying Bruno in January was a master stroke but it will also affect our summers transfer budget. Secondly it will be very difficult to sell all our deadwood in one window. Expect only two of Rojo/Jones/Smalling to be sold and don’t be surprised if both Sanchez and Pereira will stay another season. Maybe some of them will go out on loan but with a delayed season and probably a shortened summer window we have to be realistic.

I want Pogba to stay but all outside noises tells me that he’s gone so ...

This is my prediction

Pogba - out (€90)
Lingard - out (£20)
Jones - out (£15)
Rojo - out(€2)
Smalling squad or out on loan
Pereira - squad
Sanchez - loan

Sancho - in (€90)
Ighalo - permanent 2 year deal (€15)
Belingham - in (£15+15)
Grealish - in (£50)
I might be optimistic about some of the transfer dealings, but due you think we could actually get £20m for Lingard? I have him in the same spot as Sanchez: They would need to be given a financial incentive to leave and we will not get £££ for them. Still worth it though.

I agree that the cost of Bruno will impact our spending power this summer, however, we have a large number of players that are deadwood, we have enough cash reserves, and we have already lightened the wage budget considerably. Dependent on the final financial impact of the virus (Corona), we should able to make some investments this summer.

Bellingham will go to BVB.
Ighalo, I don't mind dependent on length and cost of the contract.
Grealish for £40-£50m would be a good deal, but this is dependent on Villa getting relegated. His ability to play in many positions and ability to create chances makes him an asset in most squads. Still, he is clearly best in the final third, and we need midfielders that can bring the ball into the final third, given that our starting fullbacks and central midfielders are not exactly good at this.
 

7even

Resident moaner, hypocrite and moron
Joined
Jun 4, 2006
Messages
3,840
Location
Lifetime vacation
I might be optimistic about some of the transfer dealings, but due you think we could actually get £20m for Lingard? I have him in the same spot as Sanchez: They would need to be given a financial incentive to leave and we will not get £££ for them. Still worth it though.

I agree that the cost of Bruno will impact our spending power this summer, however, we have a large number of players that are deadwood, we have enough cash reserves, and we have already lightened the wage budget considerably. Dependent on the final financial impact of the virus (Corona), we should able to make some investments this summer.

Bellingham will go to BVB.
Ighalo, I don't mind dependent on length and cost of the contract.
Grealish for £40-£50m would be a good deal, but this is dependent on Villa getting relegated. His ability to play in many positions and ability to create chances makes him an asset in most squads. Still, he is clearly best in the final third, and we need midfielders that can bring the ball into the final third, given that our starting fullbacks and central midfielders are not exactly good at this.
You make a lot of sense but from my understanding from listening to our manager and Ed our rebuilding is a 3 year project. Buy definitive starters even if they cost a fortune. Use the rest of the money to squad players (James), special talents (Bellingham) or stop gaps (Ighalo)

Year 1. Defense. (Maguire and AWB + James ) Promote Greenwood and Williams to the first team. Send Rojo and Smalling on loan. Marginalize Jones. Hopefully next season sell or loan out all of them.

Year 2. Offense. (Bruno, Sancho and someone like Grealish) Promote a young midfielder like Hannibal Mejbri to the first team this or next season. Invest in a young special talent like Bellingham. Off load Lingard and Pogba. Try to sell or loan out Sanchez and Pereira.

Year 3. Midfield. (DM + CM) Off load Matic and Mata (contract ends) Promote one or two academy players.


We talk about net spending of approximately £100/year. If Ole Gunnar can continue find ready made starters like he has in the past then we will have a hell of a team in two years, probably ready to challenge any other PL team in front of us.
 

Fosu-Mens

Full Member
Joined
Apr 11, 2016
Messages
3,764
Location
Fred | 2019/20 Performances
You make a lot of sense but from my understanding from listening to our manager and Ed our rebuilding is a 3 year project. Buy definitive starters even if they cost a fortune. Use the rest of the money to squad players (James), special talents (Bellingham) or stop gaps (Ighalo)

Year 1. Defense. (Maguire and AWB + James ) Promote Greenwood and Williams to the first team. Send Rojo and Smalling on loan. Marginalize Jones. Hopefully next season sell or loan out all of them.

Year 2. Offense. (Bruno, Sancho and someone like Grealish) Promote a young midfielder like Hannibal Mejbri to the first team this or next season. Invest in a young special talent like Bellingham. Off load Lingard and Pogba. Try to sell or loan out Sanchez and Pereira.

Year 3. Midfield. (DM + CM) Off load Matic and Mata (contract ends) Promote one or two academy players.


We talk about net spending of approximately £100/year. If Ole Gunnar can continue find ready made starters like he has in the past then we will have a hell of a team in two years, probably ready to challenge any other PL team in front of us.
I think this annual change regarding investment in different positions should rather be based on what players are available. I.e. no point in spending £££ on players in positions where there are no decent options for a fair price --> Partey will most likely not have this £40m clause next summer. Tonali will leave Brescia after this season. Given that Juventus has not confirmed a transfer, Milan is a sh*tshow and Inter are already stacked, one can hope that he is available. If he is, then we should go after him. Spending £30-40m on Tonali is a no-brainer.

Partey is far better than our current options for only £40m and bossed Liverpool's midfield in the ECL. He is a definitive starter. I doubt we will be able to buy a player of his quality in his position/role for the same cost next season. He could be our Fernandinho.
 

lex talionis

Full Member
Joined
Jul 25, 2017
Messages
975
Unknowns:

Whether Pogba remains a United man in 20/21
What our transfer budget will be this summer
Whether McTominay can be molded into a proper DM
Whether Matic will have the stamina to play at a high level in 20/21

Let's assume Pogba remains a United man, that we will have 200m for summer spending, that McTominay will NOT be molded into a DM, that Matic will be a squad man rather than regular starter and that Garner will be eased into first team duty on cup games and the like.

Unless we see McTominay as the answer to the DM question and I'm not sure that we can, we need to be thinking about a proper DM to help a back line that at times is exposed too much.

I think we're all in agreement that Sancho is the first name on the transfer sheet. After that, the hole that most clearly needs to be addressed -- assuming Pogba remains -- is DM. Sure, we could go with Matic and McTominay but if we have the cash for me the right answer is bringing in Partey. I'd love to bring in a top CB as well but after we spend 120m on Sancho I don't think we'll have enough left in the bank for two more top players. And as I like Tuanzebe and Bailly impressed on his return, I'd go with a DM before a CB.

The following squad can compete with Liverpool next season:

De Gea (Romero, Grant) (Henderson, a situation that I don't have a good answer to)
AWB (Dalot) Maguire (Tuanzebe) Lindelof (Bailly) Shaw (Williams)
Fernandes (McTominay, Pereira) Partey (Matic, Garner) Pogba (Fred)
Sancho (Greenwood) Martial (Ighalo) Rashford (James)

With Mata, Jones, Lingard, Gomez, Chong and Garner filling out the roster (hopefully Lingard being sold but I doubt that will happen). Fosu-Mensah was immense prospect at one time, but his future at OT doesn't look bright now after his ACL injury. Levitt looks an outstanding prospect but he's probably not going to be ready for regular first team action next season.

The huge assumptions supporting the audacious claim that we can compete with Liverpool next season are the following:

That Sancho comes in and maintains his incredible form from Dortmund.
That Pogba remains and resumes normal world class form.
That Fernandes continues his fantastic form.
That Martial and Rashford kick into the next gear we have every right to expect they should.
That De Gea returns to his best of breed form from 3-4 seasons ago.

We'll see if all that happens, but given that it appears Ole has found himself as a manager and if Sancho does come to OT and if we can witness for at least one season a Bruno/Pogba partnership, 20/21 should be a pretty decent side.
 

Nikelesh Reddy

Full Member
Joined
Sep 10, 2017
Messages
1,583
While Pogba can be a creative player and has played some eye catching through balls, when he is played deep he is a liability. He offers no defensive ethic and is really tactically unaware and wasteful on the ball.

His bad points playing from deep outweigh the positives of his creative flair for me. He's an extremely over rated footballer
That’s an important caveat,”if played deep”.I wouldn’t play him deep at all...I would play him as a box to box number 8....In that position he contributes much more than Fred,I think that’s indisputable...