What’s the dilemma with Donny’s playing time & Ole?

[Idxomer]

He was definitely coming as a backup to Bruno, Ole specifically highlighted his creativity and scoring record after his signing.

Pogba was also playing in a 2 all throughout project restart and it didn't look there was a plan for him to play on the left or at #10.

 

[romufc]

This is the crux of the matter, players like Fred have a license to make mistakes and still get picked whilst Donny has to score hattricks, make 10 tackles and record a dozen assists in one appearance that comes once in two months. I bet Matic, after his horror show against Southampton will get a start sooner that DVB.

Its quite bizzare, he isn't trusted/wanted here and secured interest from all over Europe which the club, the same club that couldn't buy a DM before selling anyone in the summer, blocked. Why keep around if you are not going to play him especially when it comes at the opportunity cost of getting a much needed player? Doesn't make sense at all.

Exactly. How many games / goals does fred need to cost us? He has no football intelligence and he is one of the 1st choice midfielders, someone who will be 6th choice at City, Pool, Chelsea.

That's my point exactly, why keep a player that can get you £30m odd and reinvest in a DM ? It would make sense if he was a player you need, we let Dan James go for that who plays more games.

Think about this, an injured McTominay is ahead of Donny, evidence - he came on at Southampton when injured
Lingard who is not a starter, went on loan last year is ahead of Donny.

Donny had a good pre season, the Everton game we played in pre season, was very good because we had midfield control, we are missing a player who can pass the football and is press resistant in midfield, Donny is those things.

 

[elmo]

Watch us waste another year of VDB's career while we watch Ole overplay Bruno and us getting over run in midfield when we play Pogba or Matic in midfield while VDB gets less than 5 mins of playing time once every 3 weeks.

 

[sugar_kane]

I wish we had sold him so people would stop going on about him, he's been crap nearly every time he's played for us and what is worse is that he's often looked like he couldn't be bothered - unlike Fred/Lindelof who also had ropey starts to their United careers.

The pre season is also irrelevant, anyone can look great in those games. It's how he performs when it counts.

What I don't understand is why we didn't sell him if there was interest, but I suspect Ole is just trying to hold onto what he can in midfield while our depth is pretty poor.

 

[laughtersassassin]

I would like to see a player grab a chance with 8 hands once every 6 months of playing. He gets 45 mins max in a game, what do you expect him to do from CM? Score a Hat trick and get hat trick of assists whilst having 100% interceptions and tackle rate?

His agent has said nothing that isn't true, he has been patient for a year, he has been promised game time and in 3 games after having a decent pre season has 0 minutes in the league.

The reason people are calling for him to start is because Fred, Matic, Pogba have been putting up stinkers in the middle of the park. Pogba on the weekend had a poor game as CM.

He can't get the chance over Fred who is allowed to make 10 mistakes a game yet keeps getting the managers vote of confidence?

Pogba had a poor first 45 and a good second half.

Fred had a poor game.

 

[Glorio]

Exactly. How many games / goals does fred need to cost us? He has no football intelligence and he is one of the 1st choice midfielders, someone who will be 6th choice at City, Pool, Chelsea.

That's my point exactly, why keep a player that can get you £30m odd and reinvest in a DM ? It would make sense if he was a player you need, we let Dan James go for that who plays more games.

Think about this, an injured McTominay is ahead of Donny, evidence - he came on at Southampton when injured
Lingard who is not a starter, went on loan last year is ahead of Donny.

Donny had a good pre season, the Everton game we played in pre season, was very good because we had midfield control, we are missing a player who can pass the football and is press resistant in midfield, Donny is those things.

Was also very good against Wolves last season after he had a semblance of a run of games.

I want to believe though that with Fletcher and Carrick among the coaching staff, they know what they're doing with regards to midfield selections.

Seemed he was warming up, ready to come on against Wolves this season before we scored.

 

[romufc]

Was also very good against Wolves last season after he had a semblance of a run of games.

I want to believe though that with Fletcher and Carrick among the coaching staff, they know what they're doing with regards to midfield selections.

Seemed he was warming up, ready to come on against Wolves this season before we scored.

When will Ole want to use him realistically?

Leeds, winning with a great margin, brings Matic on.
Southampton, getting pressed losing brings injured McTominay on
Wolves, drawing, Fred having shocker midfiled getting bullied, does not come on.

We have had 3 scenarios in 3 games and Ole has not brought him on, its clear he does not rate him one bit.

I would be surprised if he gets more than 5 PL starts this season.

 

[Halftrack]

Watch us waste another year of VDB's career while we watch Ole overplay Bruno and us getting over run in midfield when we play Pogba or Matic in midfield while VDB gets less than 5 mins of playing time once every 3 weeks.

And preferably wait to moan about it until it's actually happened.

 

[elmo]

And preferably wait to moan about it until it's actually happened.

What do you think happened last season?

 

[VidaRed]

Who wants to bet that mct, fred, matic and mata will play more minutes than him this season ?

Scandalous.

 

[roseguy64]

Pretty clear from his agents comments that he wanted to leave to play football but United blocked any move.

If he's not given a chance after this it will reflect badly on United.

Hope he gets a chance to shine this season.

You give players far too little confidence here. They'll sign thinking it won't happen to them and that they'll win a place. Happens all the time regardless of the history. That's why Chelsea have so many players who aren't youngsters out on loan.

 

[DRJosh]

VDB should sack his agent for not finding him another club. It is clear he doesn't feature in Ole's plans.

 

[RedRonaldo]

He is behind Lingard and probably everyone else. We should have sold him if we decide to hold on to Lingard.

 

[Eli Zee]

Who wants to bet that mct, fred, matic and mata will play more minutes than him this season ?

Scandalous.

McT and Fred deserve more minutes since they play a role he can't play. There's good players in VDBs potential positions. Matic and Mata on the other hand should've been moved on long ago

 

[Crashoutcassius]

Needs to play well in the games he gets. Can't complain otherwise. Was so pedestrian in the games he got last year

 

[VivaRonaldo85]

I’m answer to the OP question, we have a bloated squad with multiple alternatives in his position and we have a manager who trusts certain players and finds it very hard not to play them. We don’t know what goes on in training but if he continues to not impress the management there, he will continue to struggle to get any meaningful game time. All in all, a very odd situation.

 

[Bebestation]

I remember when Ole tried to play VDB out wide just like he has and succeeded with Pogba.

On paper, It's hard to say Pogba has been this amazing and consistent CM for us but his saving grace has been that he hasn't had the right midfield partner; hence he has been this great creative LAM for us in recent times.

I have seen VDB used at LM, RM and CDM with arguably his strongest position CAM being the least played.

If he is part of Ole's plans then he is probably trying to utilise VDB with to some degree of versatility until we find the right players and team mates that help accommodate him.


If I understand Ole's tactics right - the CDM player that enables us to play with 2 hybrid CM/CAM on the pitch will allow VDB a quicker path in to the first team; with 3 players directly competing for 2 spots.

 

[Samid]

All this talk about him being signed as a backup is baffling. Why were we spending 40m on a backup player when we had glaring holes needing to be addressed in the starting XI?

 

[Dr Foo]

If he was signed as Bruno's backup, it would be very strange as his style is quite different to the current way we attack. He had some decent displays in the midfield pivot last few times, deserves some games to show what level he is actually at. Otherwise something is awry. It would be a pity if we can't utilise his one touch passes, playing out of tight spaces etc. I think he will click with Bruno, Pogba once he finds the groove. Hoping it is just the defensive and physical aspect that the club is preparing him for

 

[SirMattlives]

It's always amazing to me how people here piece together scraps of news claims, a few bits of evidence from isolated games and from this draw definitive conclusions about the intentions and thinking of Ole. 'It's clear Ole doe not rate him...' It's obvious blah blah blah.'....'Why did we spend that much money when he's a back up....yadda yadda'. It is not clear to anyone outside what the plan is with Donny (do we have a right to know everything?) but I do wonder if he is being groomed to play a certain way and Ole just thinks he's not quite ready yet. Anyone here really know what Ole says to Donny when they discuss his playing future? Thought not.

 

[Bastian]

Why isn't he asked about it point blank, by journalists?

"Why did you identify VDB as a player to purchase?" (to see if you jumps out of the assumption) and follow up with "why isn't he playing?"

 

[Lee565]

If bloody cleverley and Anderson were able to play in a 2 man deep midfield position during title winning seasons I can't see why donny couldn't also competently do a job there.

I could actually imagine fergie making him and fred work ok in a 2 man midfield partnership.

 

[hellhunter]

If bloody cleverley and Anderson were able to play in a 2 man deep midfield position during title winning seasons I can't see why donny couldn't also competently do a job there.

I could actually imagine fergie making him and fred work ok in a 2 man midfield partnership.

Those two were like the best midfield on the planet for a month, to be fair

 

[Polar]

I’m pretty sure Ole has a plan for VDB. I think Ole has told him to develop physically and wouldn’t integrate him before he is 100% ready for the task. At the same time VDB obviously is a player who needs time to adapt to PL.

It’s still a fair chance VDB will surprise us and become the dominant player we always wanted him to be. Mark my words Maybe 2022 will be the year of VDB?

 

[CanadianUtd]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

 

[theklr]

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

Yeah, they can «state» it all they want, only way to get into the XI is by merit.

Silly bugger.

 

[dinostar77]

The media really need to start questioning why ole wont play him but also wont sell him.

Such a waste of a talent.

 

[The United]

His agent is a bit of a loud mouth, isn't he? Unless he is a storming season this season, he will be out after this.

The way I see with his transfer is that VDS offered him to us with relatively cheap price for his hype. The club felt the need to act on it hoping something good comes out of the deal. It has not been that way.

Would not be the first player in history to come in and couldn't get play time.

What surprised me is that the fans' reaction to that is like we buy Messi and not play him at all.

 

[The United]

The media really need to start questioning why ole wont play him but also wont sell him.

Such a waste of a talent.

His agent kept talking about interests but one of the reliable journalists said there was no interest at all from anywhere on deadline day, no?

Can't really sell if no one wants to buy. And, he is still young and have long contract with United, we are not going to sell him for peanuts either.

 

[JB7]

The media really need to start questioning why ole wont play him but also wont sell him.

Such a waste of a talent.

Our fanbase need to question why there is so much hype around him given he has been fecking dreadful in the vast majority of time time he has spent on the pitch.

Perform to a better standard and he will play more minutes, it's not rocket science.

fecking "waste of talent" how about start showing the talent that supposedly exists and then it won't be wasted.

 

[2 man midfield]

I don’t watch him every day in training, so it’s on Ole to judge if he’s up to it. He clearly doesn’t think so, and based on what I saw last season I can’t say I disagree. According to Wikipedia he played 36 times last season (a lot of them off the bench I guess?) but I can’t really remember him doing anything in those 36 games to suggest he should be starting. For me the bigger question is why we bought him in the first place if he’s this under par.

 

[Bastian]

I don’t watch him every day in training, so it’s on Ole to judge if he’s up to it. He clearly doesn’t think so, and based on what I saw last season I can’t say I disagree. According to Wikipedia he played 36 times last season (a lot of them off the bench I guess?) but I can’t really remember him doing anything in those 36 games to suggest he should be starting. For me the bigger question is why we bought him in the first place if he’s this under par.

In the league he had 3 full matches. One in November (3-2 win at Southampton) and two in May (1-2 loss to Leicester, and 2-1 win at Wolves). Twice he came on at HT to play 45mins. Besides those, there are 14 appearances where he averages 11mins.

He's not had a proper run at any stage. So impossible to have a definite opinion on him. But it's quite clear that he is a pass-and-move type of player and he doesn't dwell on the ball longer than he absolutely has to.

Would be interesting to see how many touches he averages per possession. I'd be surprised if it's much more than 2 touches before he's passed the ball.

 

[Jacob]

There's no dilemma. He's got better players ahead of him in his position(s).

 

[CanadianUtd]

There's no dilemma. He's got better players ahead of him in his position(s).

then the question is, why was VDB acquired in the first place? Only 2 CMs have been got under Ole, Bruno who was first then Donny a year after. Everyone else is from before them.

If Donny isn’t better than anyone, then why was he bought as the last incoming CM?

 

[Woodzy]

His agent needs to feck off. If he's not happy he should have worked harder in the summer to get him a transfer, absolute zero point moaning now the transfer window has closed.

We obviously wouldn't sell him because we couldn't get anyone else in, but he's a backup whether he likes it or not. Every top club needs squad players for rotation, it's up to the player to prove they are better than that.

 

[Lemansky]

There's no dilemma. He's got better players ahead of him in his position(s).

This. His agent should shut it. If he wanted another solution he should have worked harder for his client during the summer. Now Donny needs to keep up the hard work and his chance will come. The complaints from his agent is doing Donny no favours.

 

[Jacob]

then the question is, why was VDB acquired in the first place? Only 2 CMs have been got under Ole, Bruno who was first then Donny a year after. Everyone else is from before them.

If Donny isn’t better than anyone, then why was he bought as the last incoming CM?

Probably because the youth wasn't good enough as squad depth. Can't remember the last academy graduate to make it in CM.

Hopefully Hannibal can do it.

 

[roonster09]

Probably because the youth wasn't good enough as squad depth. Can't remember the last academy graduate to make it in CM.

Hopefully Hannibal can do it.

Pogba, McTominay

 

[Jacob]

Pogba, McTominay

Pogba didn't step up from the academy, he had lots of senior professional experience from Juventus before he established himself with United. He came from the academy though.

Jury is still out on McTominay, will probably remains as a rotational option but certainly not a regular starter once the shopping is done.

Maybe Scholes is the latest 'proper' academy graduate in midfield.

 

[roonster09]

Pogba didn't step up from the academy, he had lots of senior professional experience from Juventus before he established himself with United. He came from the academy though.

Jury is still out on McTominay, will probably remains as a rotational option but certainly not a regular starter once the shopping is done.

Maybe Scholes is the latest 'proper' academy graduate in midfield.

Fletcher was also regular for few seasons and then had health issues.

Also on McTominay, yeah he will end up as squad option but right now he is part of first team/best team for 2 seasons. He plays in most games he is available.