What do we still need? Aka The never ending story

[jesperjaap]

Personally not buying into a lot of the recent press links, or maybe not wanting too. Dont see Nunez/Osimhen/Milinkovic-Savic as viable targets at all, too expensive. I jsut dont see DeJong coming here either even if and may be some truth, we are in for him.

Think a lot of the Dutch links are lazy journalism or based on what he was after in charge of Ajax.

Know little of him, but getting a srong feeling he does want Timber and Antony, thats half the £200m budget gone straight away right there.

Personally dont seen other big money signings/names outside of that unless we sign just one central midfielder and are puttign faith in Garner or Hannibal to step uo next year.

I think in the first window, outside of that will be maybe a right back, one or two central midfielders and a striker.

Think in one or two of those positions maybe a surprise or two and maybe Ragnicks knowledge of German football or Ten Hags knowledge of the Dutch league or even of data from Ajax scouts, we may see a surprise or two. Also feel there may be some interest in Kamara and/or Ekitike as ability and value wise both make a lot of sense.

 

[Paul778]

Was really hoping there would have been some basically done deals already in place by now. There were some briefs earlier this week that United are aiming to complete their incomings by the end of june. The makes sense and is somewhat obvious - if ETH really hopes to get these playing in his style he needs everyone having a full preseason and being on the tour..

However, thats less than six weeks to make 5-6 signings (and probably shift some during this time as well). Given this period is typically the time when our teams/management go on holiday AND also the time when our target players and their management go on holiday, this is really pushing things. Especially when you are horse trading and possibly looking/chasing 1st, 2nd and maybe 3rd choice options for each position

Maybe some things are waiting until after the last game and ETG being properly in place next week.

 

[Red_Orchestra]

Please no more defenders, as poor as they are, we have to focus on the central midfield.

 

[croadyman]

Please no more defenders, as poor as they are, we have to focus on the central midfield.

Yeah De Jong and energetic DM is vital

 

[jesperjaap]

Witten purely in anger about how utterly shite this group of players are:

Out
Grant
Henderson £20M
Jones £5M
Bailly £20M
Lindelof £20M
Maguire £45M
Dalot £5M
Telles £5M
Bissaka £25M
Williams £10M
Tuanzabe £5M
Pogba
Mata
Lingard
Pereira £5M
Fred £35M
McTominay £25M
Fernandes £45M
Matic
VDB £25M
MArtial £20M
Rashford £50M
Cavani

Feck the lot of them

£365m

GK DeGea Heaton
LB Shaw Alvaro Fernandes
CB Varane Mengi Ketchup £5M
CB Timber £45M Gvardiol £55M
RB Laird Gusto £20M
DM Garner Bissouma £25M
CM Enzo Fernandes £17M Dejong £63M
AM Hannibal Nkunku £60M
LW Sancho Garnacho eLANGA
RW Pellestri Amad Antony £50M
CF Ronaldo Giouri £50M

£390M

DeGea
Gusto Timber Gvardiol Shaw

DeJong Bissouma

Nkunku

Antony Sancho

Ronaldo

 

[Lee565]

Any players worth picking up from Burnley with them relegated and big financial repercussions for them due the loan the new owners took out which will leave them in big debt

 

[davidmichael]

Well we can effectively rule out Philips and Raphinha now Leeds have stayed up but the positions we need to sort remain the same which is two midfielders, a right winger, a centre back and a right back then call up Laird, Mengi, Garner, Mejbri and Shoretire from the reserves.

 

[jesperjaap]

Any players worth picking up from Burnley with them relegated and big financial repercussions for them due the loan the new owners took out which will leave them in big debt

No, they have some good players for mid table sides I feel Cornet, Pope, Tarkowski, Mee, McNeill....outside of that tbh I think they are mainly championship players and thats why Dyche did so well keeping them in the premiership for so long, travesty he was sacked. Not sure they stayed up anyway as the new temporary manager did a good job but there are no stars

 

[jesperjaap]

Well we can effectively rule out Philips and Raphinha now Leeds have stayed up but the positions we need to sort remain the same which is two midfielders, a right winger, a centre back and a right back then call up Laird, Mengi, Garner, Mejbri and Shoretire from the reserves.

Personally never wanted Phillips, Raphina I think is a good player but I do feel is a touch of as he is in the premiership and we see him regularly been put forward when there are a few on the continent at similar prices maybe better options.

I do think we are putting too much faith in our young players. Are a few talented ones amongst them but not sure any are ready to really challenge first team spots even amongst this shower of shite, but they are needed to bolster the squad if we are ruthless enough to move on anywhere near the number probably should consider to.

Think if even 1 or 2 out of the likes of Amad, Pellestri, Garnacho, Hannibal can make some sort of breakthrough next season that is a result

 

[Coops73]

A.fecking.Miracle.

 

[croadyman]

Well we can effectively rule out Philips and Raphinha now Leeds have stayed up but the positions we need to sort remain the same which is two midfielders, a right winger, a centre back and a right back then call up Laird, Mengi, Garner, Mejbri and Shoretire from the reserves.

Striker too

 

[croadyman]

Need RB, Timber, DM, De Jong, RW and Nunez, however will get max of 4 in my opinion. Personally I could see Timber, De Jong, Nunez and unknown DM but know it's not enough

 

[Paul778]

I would argue we need more than 5 players this window to get top four next year for one fogotten reason...

Next year we go back to five substitutes. All of the teams competing for top four will not only have a strong first 11 but multiple strong options from the bench

 

[golden_blunder]

McNeil anyone?

 

[::sonny::]

Another target missed

United the slowest club in the market

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

 

[golden_blunder]

Another target missed

United the slowest club in the market

Tweet

— Twitter API (@user) date

Huh? Every man and his dog knew he was going to Liverpool. It’s literally been everywhere for the last year.

 

[Banana Republic]

Carvalho is costing them £5m plus add-ones that will/could take it to £7.7m eventually.

A lot of good young talent will be available across Europe and at home for similar fees, up to £20m or so.

Utd need a deep rebuild, which means the right sort of proven talent will cost more, but we can’t spaff away all the kitty on expensive players, who may or may not work out for us in the end.

 

[IRN-BRUno]

McNeil anyone?

37 starts + 3 sub appearances this season, 0 goals and 1 assist

Nowhere near good enough

 

[glaspalast]

Witten purely in anger about how utterly shite this group of players are:

Out

McTominay £25M

[In

Bissouma £25M

your list of players to buy and sell makes sense

your valuations are delusional

 

[Sea-Cow]

Does everyone else think we somehow need to buy 4 new starting defenders for next year?

If Varane is going to be constantly injured, or mentally checked out, then I honestly think we need 2 new immediate starting CBs. Not younger prospects that we "hope" can one day play a role, but two new legit day one starters that can come in and take Harry and Victor's places.

And the fullback situation on both sides is just depressing. Those two we had out yesterday were both simply awful, both defending and in possession.

 

[jesperjaap]

your list of players to buy and sell makes sense

your valuations are delusional

Let me guess, its the value of the players out

 

[croadyman]

Maybe it's just me but feels like a real lack of solid links to any DM's at all, at least there has been names for CB but the rest very quiet

 

[golden_blunder]

If Madrid get the lad from Monaco, would they be open to selling Casemiro?

 

[LawCharltonBest]

All the top teams have either already signed someone or very close to their first signing

And this feels like a summer where you’re going to need to act fast

United slowest off the mark again

 

[dutchred]

All the top teams have either already signed someone or very close to their first signing

And this feels like a summer where you’re going to need to act fast

United slowest off the mark again

The new manager is just in place. He needs to speak to some of the coaches and Ralf. Give him a couple of weeks

 

[SparkedIntoLife]

Ten Hag's early media comments suggest there won't be the wholesale changes that many are expecting/hoping. Although I'm a bit disappointed by it instinctively, logically I know it makes sense for ETH to distance himself from Ralf Rangnick's scorched earth rhetoric. He'll want to coach these players, get their confidence up or at least raise their value so they can be sold for decent value. Also, we might want root and branch overhaul but the reality is there's positions that, due to contracts expiring, we have big holes in the squad.

I feel some of the more dominant press briefings do have merit. There's been lots of talk the transfer budget is £140m. I think this is probably spot on as a starting kitty. Some agents have apparently been told that United have a transfer budget of only £20m. My view is that this is a pertinent figure as there's 2 key starting 11 positions we need filling due to squad gaps - DM/CM and RW/ST. These will be signings around the £50m/£60m mark I'd suppose. My thinking is that any other position we might want to sign someone in would be capped at around the £20m mark (i.e. a youngster or hidden gem type budget signing, maybe from Rangnick's list). The exception would be Timber who is so heavily linked that there's got to be something serious in it. He'll be more like £35m I guess.

Some players have so many rumours surrounding them that they will be sold that there's got to be fire to all that smoke - Henderson, Bailly, Jones, Telles, Wan-Bissaka, Williams, Pereira, Tuanzebe and Chong. No expiring contracts will be renewed so goodbye to Pogba, Lingard, Cavani, Matic, Grant and Mata. Realistically, we won't get much more than £50m for these players combined so that'd make our transfer budget £190m or thereabouts.

Surprisingly, I think Martial could be the big career revival story of next season. He's been out of United and been humbled, having failed spectacularly at Sevilla. I say the change of scenery does him good. We're super low on strikers so ETH might be wise to put his arm round him and give him confidence. If he works his socks off this pre season, there's still an incredibly talented player in there. His problem has always been in his mindset but failing elsewhere might be a real eye opener that he needs to sort himself out.

I can see Elanga, Fernandez and Mejbri being loaned out.

Here's my guess for next season. I haven't gone with conventional wingers as I think we'll have a fairly fluid 4213 -

Goalkeepers: de Gea, Johnstone, Heaton
Right Backs: Singo, Dalot
Left Backs: Shaw, Malacia
Centre Backs: Varane, Maguire, Timber, Lindelof
Central Midfielders: de Jong, Fred, McTominay, Garner
Attacking Midfielders: Fernandes, van de Beek
Forwards: Ronaldo, Sancho, Nkunku, Martial, Rashford, Garnacho

Johnstone - Free, Singo - 20m, Malacia - 15m, Timber - 35m, de Jong - 60m, Nkunku - 60m = 190m (140m starting budget plus £50m in sales)

Note that I see Timber being nurtured into Maguire's successor. I even think Maguire could be sold in January if he has a decent World Cup. However, Timber will also play many games as a DM and RB in my view. I can see him playing most games next season.

 

[Murder on Zidane's Floor]

What about Saliba and Demiral?

Two CBs we could get for not that much, less than Maguire cost. Ship out Bailly, Vic and Jones be left with Saliba, Demi, Varane, Maguire and Mengi back form loan?

 

[Woziak]

Witten purely in anger about how utterly shite this group of players are:

Out
Grant
Henderson £20M
Jones £5M
Bailly £20M
Lindelof £20M
Maguire £45M
Dalot £5M
Telles £5M
Bissaka £25M
Williams £10M
Tuanzabe £5M
Pogba
Mata
Lingard
Pereira £5M
Fred £35M
McTominay £25M
Fernandes £45M
Matic
VDB £25M
MArtial £20M
Rashford £50M
Cavani

Feck the lot of them

£365m

GK DeGea Heaton
LB Shaw Alvaro Fernandes
CB Varane Mengi Ketchup £5M
CB Timber £45M Gvardiol £55M
RB Laird Gusto £20M
DM Garner Bissouma £25M
CM Enzo Fernandes £17M Dejong £63M
AM Hannibal Nkunku £60M
LW Sancho Garnacho eLANGA
RW Pellestri Amad Antony £50M
CF Ronaldo Giouri £50M

£390M

DeGea
Gusto Timber Gvardiol Shaw

DeJong Bissouma

Nkunku

Antony Sancho

Ronaldo

Wonderful dream but never going to happen in a billion years with our owners !

 

[Woziak]

We as united fans continue to put ourselves through this every year, however I do feel ETH has had his eye on this job all season with the understanding that the real budget was £140m plus what he could recoup on player sales. This additional £20M will be the result of getting Pogba, Cavani, Mata, Lingard and Matic off the wage bill, A potential saving of 1 million pounds per week in wages which can then be monetised into budget before player sales.

I’m not convinced that every player we don’t like as fans, will be a player that Eric doesn’t like as well!
Like he said he has huge plans which means he probably has 3 phases of change.
Phase One: 22/23 (one season)

This is the most drastic change and we will definitely move out the obvious suspects this summer; Pogba, Cavani, Matic, Mata, Lingard plus player sales of ; Martial, Baily, D Henderson, A Pereira, Wan Bissaka, P Jones, B Williams, plus loan out F Pellistri, H Mejbri, C Savage, E Laird and a few others,
Realistically I can only see D Henderson maybe £30M and A Martial £25M recouping decent money plus another £35M for all the other players combined so 80-90m max meaning we have a true budget of £220-230M. The key here is I said two transfer windows for this budget so we need 7-8 players instantly, I think we will bring in 5-6 in the summer then 1-2 in the winter to achieve Phase 1 objective which is Top 4 and A cup win, preferably the Europa League which guarantees Champions league for Season of 23/34.
The squad I hope we have ;

D De Gea, S Johnstone * (F), T Heaton(3)
Defence
T Meunier * (15M) J Timber * (30m), D Dalot, V Lindelof, A Tuanzebe( ETH will improve), R Varane, H Maguire, L Shaw, A Telles (9)
Midfield
N Kante *(15M), J Garner, N De Jong * (60m), Fred, Mctominay, Bruno,DVB
C Erikssen (Free) (8)
Attack
M Rashford, A Elanga, * Antony (50M), A Diallo or T Chong, C Ronaldo, J Sancho, D Nunez * (60M) (7)
That’s a Total of £230 million Gross or £140m net and a squad of 27 with a view that 5 subs are now the norm in the PL and more game changing options are required plus potentially 17 games in Europa League.

Phase 2 - Season 23/24-24/25 (2)
ETH will have assessed the squad and I can easily see H Maguire, C Ronaldo, D De Gea, and Fred leaving with Europes best as options as upgrades. ETH will want to have united competing in a top 3 during these two seasons and have a consistent squad which gets 80-85 points and regularly wins cups or gets to finals. Expect to see Charlie McCann, Dialo and Ganaucho as regulars in this squad plus we will buy 2 top quality destructive CDM’s to replace Ngolo providing we buy him this summer. I think next summer we find the best young ball playing goal keeper maybe the Ajax GK but we will make a change in that department. Watch as the youth team and the women teams try to play the 4-1-2-3 formation and fluid movement system changes in game .

Phase 3 - 25-26 to 27-29 ( 3 seasons)
I expect a premier league Title during this period and a complete Stadium upgrade 85,000-90,000 capacity which is the envy of Europe.

A man can dream right, after all it’s called the ‘Theatre of Dreams’ for a reason!

 

[glaspalast]

Let me guess, its the value of the players out

both

 

[Devil may care]

We seem to be looking for 2 midfielders, one ball winner and one to dictate the game as well as a defender and a forward, and the same list of names have continued to circle. De Jong is the key one as he's levels above the options for his role, the rest is a fairly even mix.

CB - Timber/Torres
CM #1 - De Jong/Neves/Phillips
CM #2 - Kante/Fernandez/Kone
FW - Nunez/Nkunku/Richarlison

 

[croadyman]

We seem to be looking for 2 midfielders, one ball winner and one to dictate the game as well as a defender and a forward, and the same list of names have continued to circle. De Jong is the key one as he's levels above the options for his role, the rest is a fairly even mix.

CB - Timber/Torres
CM #1 - De Jong/Neves/Phillips
CM #2 - Kante/Fernandez/Kone
FW - Nunez/Nkunku/Richarlison

Seems very quiet on midfield targets outside of De Jong, maybe Utd are keeping it well under wraps

 

[Hughie77]

ETH, has hopefully been appointed to go in a direction, that's not what's it been.
I hope he can identify targets of a age that can come and improve with time as well.
I won't like to see the 30 + aged player again coming in. We only have Ronny now, but that guy defies logic .

A CB I can see coming in, 2 CMs if not at least 1, and 1 striker. And that's only because Martial we still have, Rashford both could player as a striker.. we cannot pin our attack solely on Ronny.
I can see at least 4 Quality signings coming in they have to be ready to go signings with improvement to get better.

 

[croadyman]

Priority order for me is DM, De Jong, Timber as RB and Nunez. Yes I know it still leaves issues at CB and RW but won't sign 6

 

[Devil may care]

Seems very quiet on midfield targets outside of De Jong, maybe Utd are keeping it well under wraps

I think De Jong is the big one this summer, it's the glamour signing and will likely be the most expensive transfer any club makes this window, so all the focus is there. We've seen various links to Kante, Enzo Fernandez, Kone and Laimer, all of which should be maximum £30M and won't be as difficult to get done as De Jong, so the stories aren't picking up much momentum as the jounos just want to keep writing De Jong articles at the moment. I expect if we get De Jong signed in the next few weeks we'll start to see the other stories come to the fore as they surely can't expect the poor bugger to come here and partner Fred or McTominay, that'd be a deal breaker for me if I was him.

 

[croadyman]

I think De Jong is the big one this summer, it's the glamour signing and will likely be the most expensive transfer any club makes this window, so all the focus is there. We've seen various links to Kante, Enzo Fernandez, Kone and Laimer, all of which should be maximum £30M and won't be as difficult to get done as De Jong, so the stories aren't picking up much momentum as the jounos just want to keep writing De Jong articles at the moment. I expect if we get De Jong signed in the next few weeks we'll start to see the other stories come to the fore as they surely can't expect the poor bugger to come here and partner Fred or McTominay, that'd be a deal breaker for me if I was him.

Yeah he deserves a better partner than them

 

[NoPace]

I think De Jong is the big one this summer, it's the glamour signing and will likely be the most expensive transfer any club makes this window, so all the focus is there. We've seen various links to Kante, Enzo Fernandez, Kone and Laimer, all of which should be maximum £30M and won't be as difficult to get done as De Jong, so the stories aren't picking up much momentum as the jounos just want to keep writing De Jong articles at the moment. I expect if we get De Jong signed in the next few weeks we'll start to see the other stories come to the fore as they surely can't expect the poor bugger to come here and partner Fred or McTominay, that'd be a deal breaker for me if I was him.

It also seems possible to me that Ten Hag has suggested some cheaper midfielders like the ones above and the club is scrambling to scout them, or that he's taking time to sort through the club's targets.

 

[bosnian_red]

I think De Jong is the big one this summer, it's the glamour signing and will likely be the most expensive transfer any club makes this window, so all the focus is there. We've seen various links to Kante, Enzo Fernandez, Kone and Laimer, all of which should be maximum £30M and won't be as difficult to get done as De Jong, so the stories aren't picking up much momentum as the jounos just want to keep writing De Jong articles at the moment. I expect if we get De Jong signed in the next few weeks we'll start to see the other stories come to the fore as they surely can't expect the poor bugger to come here and partner Fred or McTominay, that'd be a deal breaker for me if I was him.

Yeah he deserves a better partner than them

I hate how Fred gets lumped in here when he's actually a good player and far from being a problem for us. Starter for Brazil too who have much better midfielders than we do. He's very different to McTominay... And he shows it regularly too.

 

[Sea-Cow]

I hate how Fred gets lumped in here when he's actually a good player and far from being a problem for us. Starter for Brazil too who have much better midfielders than we do. He's very different to McTominay... And he shows it regularly too.

I don't think you could ever fault Fred for effort and determination. But he has games where it looks like his boots are on the wrong feet and he can't do a single thing right! Its maddening! Who know, maybe ETH can get something out of him and he can be the player we hoped to get when we signed him. But I think it is perfectly fair that his position should be up for grabs and its up for him, or Scott, to prove that they deserve playing time. Because last year wasn't good enough, and the last six months were especially not good enough.

 

[bosnian_red]

I don't think you could ever fault Fred for effort and determination. But he has games where it looks like his boots are on the wrong feet and he can't do a single thing right! Its maddening! Who know, maybe ETH can get something out of him and he can be the player we hoped to get when we signed him. But I think it is perfectly fair that his position should be up for grabs and its up for him, or Scott, to prove that they deserve playing time. Because last year wasn't good enough, and the last six months were especially not good enough.

Last year he was one of the very few players in our squad who actually performed with dignity and looked "good". Yeah he has the occasional game where he looks horrible, but I think they've become much less frequent the last few years. He was generally very good in 20/21 as well. The biggest problem was just his role in the past few years. He was asked to be key in the build up and a deep lying playmaker, that's not his game. Frenkie would be that role, which leaves space for Fred to be a box to box player and make use of his energy.
Saying that, I don't actually think they really suit each other as a partnership and feel like McTominay might suit De Jong as a partner more just because he is a more defensive player... But Fred himself I don't think is a bad player at all. He's just unlucky to get lumped in with the rest because the rest are a disaster, and as football is a team sport, he gets dragged down.