How is it drivel. In other jobs it is illegal to discriminate based on sex. why should professional sports be any different? Is it fair that a male tennis player who could beat any of the top 10 female players cannot earn the same as them? surely that is sexual discrimination. What next? maybe a Caucasian 100m event because they cannot run as fast as black athletes?
Why do we not have a women's team?
- Thread starter Jaybomb
- Start date
None of these sports are team sports, and none are particularly successful, bar tennis, and only there the women's game is subsidised due to a combination of tradition, in addition to key, progressive stakeholders who believe (rightly or wrongly) that the prize money for the men and women at the Grand Slams should be the same unquestionably.
Anyway, I'm not overly concerned about the business side of things. We could easily afford to have a women's team and I'm absolutely certain we would quickly become one of the top clubs, should we hold that ambition. It's a farce how quickly City have become the top club in England.
My opposition stems from:
A) Manchester United is a senior men's professional football club. That is our raison d'être. We are not a multi-sports club made of members. Manchester United should remain what it is. I have want or desire to see us branch out into women's football or other sports such as futsal, e-sports or any other, and I have no desire to allow other entities to play under our name.
B) The English women's game in England becoming pale imitation of the men's game is sad to see. Let it develop its own top sides and rivalries and champion them. Why are people desperate to see a landscape of Manchester United, Manchester City, Chelsea. Liverpool and Arsenal at the top? You want a side from Trafford in women's football? Form one and work your way up. Let it be a sister club, whereby United can offer them support and cooperation.
See point A, however. Don't start pretending that there's two Manchester Uniteds that are important. I don't want to see United throwing millions at the game just to fend off another Poppygate incident where you give in to the mob.
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Your concern for womens sports 'suffering' seems dishonest as you don't seem to appreciate or see the point in womens sport at all.
Your premise A seems your only argument, and it's based on a mistake - Manchester United has never been and is not specified as a mens club. It's a Football club and defined as such. As of now, there are men and women playing football at the club. A lot of things have been established for people since 1878 and due to misogynic reason only made accessible to men. This has luckily for most people changed, and football and Man Utd is one of the latest arenas where the change is establishing it self. There is one Man Utd, and it has many teams, and it is, and should be for football, not men exclusively.
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Where have you got the impression that I don't or could not care for women's sport at all, particuarly in the sense of that being because of the gender of the participants?
I'm guilty, like most, of generally being interested in sport that I have either a personal connection to or is the elite form of that sport. Due to the well documented physical differences between men and women, women's sport, in contrast to the men's respective version, tends to be slower, less physically intense and in short an elite men's team or man would consistently beat the top woman.
This is the biggest barrier women's sport faces and it is not going to go away. Likewise for paralympic sport. All things being equal, spectators want to watch the elite level, which is almost always the senior men's game. Women's sport to succeed needs to make a different offer. Mimicking the men's game will ensure its growth is severely restricted.
Let's just lay out the relative lack of disinterest in women's football in this country. Take the average attendance in 2015-16 of the 92 men's clubs in England's top four divisions and the clubs from the 2016 Women's Super League. Manchester City's Women would be 91st in the average attendance, there would be the final two League 2 clubs, and then all of the rest of the WSL teams would follow at the bottom.
I'm guilty, like most, of generally being interested in sport that I have either a personal connection to or is the elite form of that sport. Due to the well documented physical differences between men and women, women's sport, in contrast to the men's respective version, tends to be slower, less physically intense and in short an elite men's team or man would consistently beat the top woman.
This is the biggest barrier women's sport faces and it is not going to go away. Likewise for paralympic sport. All things being equal, spectators want to watch the elite level, which is almost always the senior men's game. Women's sport to succeed needs to make a different offer. Mimicking the men's game will ensure its growth is severely restricted.
Let's just lay out the relative lack of disinterest in women's football in this country. Take the average attendance in 2015-16 of the 92 men's clubs in England's top four divisions and the clubs from the 2016 Women's Super League. Manchester City's Women would be 91st in the average attendance, there would be the final two League 2 clubs, and then all of the rest of the WSL teams would follow at the bottom.
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https://www.google.no/amp/www.indep...d-refusal-field-womans-team-a7656581.html?amp
More and more media going with this, and more and more clubs as well. And since 2012 all the club has ever said is the old 'we're revieeing it'. How many years does a review take? Could it be that the reason maybe is plain old sexism in The Glazer family after all?
More and more media going with this, and more and more clubs as well. And since 2012 all the club has ever said is the old 'we're revieeing it'. How many years does a review take? Could it be that the reason maybe is plain old sexism in The Glazer family after all?
Any chance of a poll?
What in the ever-loving feck are you on about?
How is providing opportunities = discrimination based on sex?
Anyway - really glad the mainstream media is really putting United to task. If some hefty negative publicity is what it takes to get things moving, then so be it.
My guess is, if the womens team does not do well it would do more harm to the brand then good and not worth the risk for the owners.
Utds brand is the biggest in the world of sport, creating a womens team which might do badly could dent the clubs image and they would rather avoid the headache
Utds brand is the biggest in the world of sport, creating a womens team which might do badly could dent the clubs image and they would rather avoid the headache
Because it's not discrimination. Is it discrimination to separate fighters based on weight in combat sports? No, it isn't. Should we stop having age groups, and just have 8 year olds running around on the same pitch as Fellaini? Of course not, there is a physical difference that you have to account for.
As for pay, I don't follow, or have any clue about tennis, so I'm no position to comment. In football, however, wages are based, among other things, on your ability and marketability. Hence, Paul Pogba earns close to twelve times more than Jesse Lingard, despite them playing for the same team in the same league. Women know that there is much less money in women's football, and know that if they started to demand the same money as the men, women's football would quickly seize to exist on a professional and semi-professional level, and as such would likely not expect nor demand to be payed the same as the men.
If it's team sports you're after: Handball, basketball, rugby union (probably league as well), ice hockey, field hockey, bandy. Most sports, including team sports, have governing bodies that govern both men and women. Why should football be any different?
United was founded as a worker's club, but that has obviously changed, hasn't it? Or are our players still primarily employees of Lancashire and Yorkshire Railway? Why can't it change further?
And it isn't a men's club. Right now, boys and girls up to the age of 16 play under our banner, but only the boys have a chance of taking the next step and becoming Manchester United players. It would be nice if we could offer the girls the same opportunity, I think.
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Oh shit.
City's under-15s beat our youngsters 9-0 two years in a row, and this didn't exactly 'destroy our image'...so I hardly think a poorly-performing women's team would do so.
3 trophies in 1 season is not good enough, I agree. United should be winning everything in their path. Personally Im a fan of the Swansea model, avoid relegation every season and keep everyone in suspense for the big title challenge coming up.....
3 trophies in 1 season is not good enough, I agree. United should be winning everything in their path. Personally Im a fan of the Swansea model, avoid relegation every season and keep everyone in suspense for the big title challenge coming up.....
oh feck off we won two trophies and a glorified friendly.
2 trophies is a brilliant return for jose first season lets not tarnish it by being small time
In any other league in Europe, winning the super cup (the winner of the national cup vs the league winner) is considered a trophy.
Barcelona, Juve, PSG etc, have been counting it in their trophy tally for years. Why should it be any different in England? Because we call it a Charity Shield and not a "Super Cup"?
are we any other country?
no
its different because we are not another country and its always been and always will be glorified pre season friendly
if other countries fans want to be stupid and celebrate their equivalent as another trophy, thats their lookout. But we shouldnt because its stupid.
Oh and we took the piss out of Liverpool fans when they called it a trophy and tried to celebrate it as a treble.
That's absolute testicles my friend isn't it? I think most people can separate what happens to the women's team from the men's team.
What's denting United's image is the board's inertia over this issue.
Come on mate, you know it's 2 trophies3 trophies in 1 season is not good enough, I agree. United should be winning everything in their path. Personally Im a fan of the Swansea model, avoid relegation every season and keep everyone in suspense for the big title challenge coming up.....
You would think so right? Problem is most people don't. When you are dealing with a successful company, people expect it to be successful in everything they do.
It's like Nike making a sports watch, they are known for quality clothing and footwear, not electronics but you would still expect a Nike sports watch to be one of the best in its field, whereas anyone with half a brain would know, a well establish electronics company will make a far superior product.
actually I would expect a Nike watch to be shite, like the rest of their range
but i get your point
A lot of great saves in there. I think something that needs to be mentioned in regards to goalkeeping is that the international game isn't a great indication of the standard of keeping since a few countries (France, Germany, US mostly) tend to dominate player production, but you only see 1 of their keepers. To give people an idea, of the 24 teams in the 2015 Women's World Cup, only 10 teams had goalkeepers playing in a major women's league (American, German, French, Spanish, English, Swedish).
Why should United have a womens team?
The third best ranked team (Australia) were recently trounced by a bunch of 14 year old lads 7-0, and the game was ended early to save further embarrassment. The average crowds are on a par with level six in this country.
Despite these facts, the average wage is £2,500 for the women......zero for the lads, and a couple of hundred quid for the players in the sixth tier.
Not only is it worse than watching kids playing the game, it is something that will constantly need propping up financially because only a few would bother to turn up to watch. Sisters should be doing it for themselves, not leeching off United.
The third best ranked team (Australia) were recently trounced by a bunch of 14 year old lads 7-0, and the game was ended early to save further embarrassment. The average crowds are on a par with level six in this country.
Despite these facts, the average wage is £2,500 for the women......zero for the lads, and a couple of hundred quid for the players in the sixth tier.
Not only is it worse than watching kids playing the game, it is something that will constantly need propping up financially because only a few would bother to turn up to watch. Sisters should be doing it for themselves, not leeching off United.
If you'd taken the time to read the thread, you'd have seen that this has both been mentioned, and discussed. Women's teams gets beaten by u15 boys teams regularly. Believe it or not, the average 14-15-16 year old boy is bigger and stronger than the average woman, so it should come as no surprise that they are able to beat a women's team.
And why does everything regarding women's football need to be framed so negatively? Worse than watching kids play? The feck are you on about? Kids games are 10 7 year olds all running after the ball at the same time, with no care for such things as playing positions and tactics. Maybe one of them is standing alone somewhere on the pitch, looking at an airplane flying overhead. The keepers have lost focus long ago, and are probably looking at the ground, kicking at it out of sheer boredom. And you're telling me that women's games are worse than this?
Regarding financials, that has been done to death in this thread, but I'm going to guess that you haven't the foggiest regarding the financial viability of the women's game.
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Yup. I believe age 12 or 13 was when we stopped playing the equivalent boys teams at our club. Scrimmages were pretty even until then, but once they hit puberty it was just too easy for them to blow by us, and too hard for us to blow by them. The only time after that we bothered playing boys teams was in preseason when we were trying to improve our speed of play and fitness. It could be fun though, they always whined about how physical we played.
It's pointless to talk about women's vs. boy's or men's teams, because at the end of the day, no matter how technically gifted you are, the gulf in speed, strength and size is too much to overcome.
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Similar to why we do not expect Floyd Mayweather to fight Wladimir Klitschko.Yup. I believe age 12 or 13 was when we stopped playing the equivalent boys teams at our club. Scrimmages were pretty even until then, but once they hit puberty it was just too easy for them to blow by us, and too hard for us to blow by them. The only time after that we bothered playing boys teams was in preseason when we were trying to improve our speed of play and fitness. It could be fun though, they always whined about how physical we played.
Yes, get out of my schoolyard, me and the boys were playing here first.
Nice collection. Would be great to see a United keeper in such a collection one day. If not Emily who had to go to Pool to play, then maybe Isabella Schmeichel?
http://www.gettyimages.fi/photos/is...1&phrase=isabella schmeichel&sort=mostpopular
Whether united have an adult women's team or not, is one thing.
To have girls teams of all ages, which abruptly end at adult age, associated with the club is another.
Go the whole hog one way or the other, but don't have some half arsed situation which has been 'under review' for 10 years.
Pathetic.
To have girls teams of all ages, which abruptly end at adult age, associated with the club is another.
Go the whole hog one way or the other, but don't have some half arsed situation which has been 'under review' for 10 years.
Pathetic.
This is one of those threads where you get the two stereotype posters the ones making sexist jokes because they are really immature and just a lil insecure and then the self righteous posters trying to be as pc as they can hoping it will win them brownie points usually with some female who will most likely never know what they are doing and yes they are a lil insecure as well
If the interest is there and the money is right United will have a woman's team .. Let's have it they haven't missed an opportunity to bring in money and raise their profile yet
If the interest is there and the money is right United will have a woman's team .. Let's have it they haven't missed an opportunity to bring in money and raise their profile yet
Then you have the third kind. The kind who willfully simplifies the issue, despite the best efforts of a number of posters, just so they can defend the status co.
Hi, I have two daughters I'm coaching in football and who are (still) rooting for Man Utd. Which type am I and which are you?
I think that is the best reason. We already have a Girls team what is the point if they do not have a senior team to aspire to?
People are talking a lot about the financial viability of running a women's team but should it just be about the money if United want to do something for the community and get more young girls playing the sport. I'd be for it if just for those reasons and I ain't just saying it to sound right on.
Do we actually make anything from our youth setups anyway. Considering the amount that just fall by the way side every year after the time and money invested in them, I doubt it very much.
Do we actually make anything from our youth setups anyway. Considering the amount that just fall by the way side every year after the time and money invested in them, I doubt it very much.
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Another girl who highlights well that football is more about dreams and pride than about money and even trophies.
This was 2012, when Katie Zelem as far as I gather had played eight years for Man Utd. The year after, at 17, she went to Liverpool where she now plays.
No proper fan can watch that and still be trumpeting the tired BS of profiteering and finances.
Lol. I remember one game where I was wandering round my box picking mushrooms the game was so one sided.
As United say in the video: 'giving them goals, motivation and purpose - inspiring them to fulfil their potential'. So far, to go play for City, Liverpool and possibly England.