Will we see a new approach and purged squad from now on?

[Murder on Zidane's Floor]

I raised this a few months ago, to be honest I've observed it for a while.

We lack pace. Really slow team all around, especially in midfield.

 

[Lash]

I raised this a few months ago, to be honest I've observed it for a while.

We lack pace. Really slow team all around, especially in midfield.

It's more that agility and acceleration to burst into small spaces. Open up the pitch and we're great and have plenty of pace. Play compact and we don't know what to do except punt into the box.

 

[cyberman]

Next manager needs to be in sync with the new football structure so we don’t need a big name or look at what big names available.
Just coherent football from week to week. Where’s Hannibal gone? Pellestri is like a toastie machine, forgotten about for most of the year about from the 2 weeks when you remember how tasty they are.

 

[Murder on Zidane's Floor]

It's more that agility and acceleration to burst into small spaces. Open up the pitch and we're great and have plenty of pace. Play compact and we don't know what to do except punt into the box.

The team is glacial;

Maguire
Lindelof
Dalot
Amrabat
McTominay
Bruno
Antony
Eriksen
Evans
Varane
Martial
de Beek
Mount
Casemiro

Grading then through FM language, they're all 14 and below pace/acceleration

 

[Mingus]

The team is glacial;

Maguire
Lindelof
Dalot
Amrabat
McTominay
Bruno
Antony
Eriksen
Evans
Varane
Martial
de Beek
Mount
Casemiro

Grading then through FM language, they're all 14 and below pace/acceleration

Not sure about this. For instance, Dalot is usually stated to be our fastest player.

Antony, Martial and Varane aren't slow either.

FM has a lot to answer for.

 

[Murder on Zidane's Floor]

Not sure about this. For instance, Dalot is usually stated to be our fastest player.

Antony, Martial and Varane aren't slow either.

FM has a lot to answer for.

Martial cannot sprint mate, he hasn't been able to sprint for a year or so. Like, are you serious.

Antony is not quick at all hence why he can't beat a full back, on the outside, ever.

Varane is awfully slow, like running through treacle.

Dalot is not our fastest player at all.

 

[DWelbz19]

The team is glacial;

Maguire
Lindelof
Dalot
Amrabat
McTominay
Bruno
Antony
Eriksen
Evans
Varane
Martial
de Beek
Mount
Casemiro

Grading then through FM language, they're all 14 and below pace/acceleration

Not just in pure sprinting either — they’re all very slow with their feet from a close control/dribbling aspect — Martial is probably the only one who isn’t from that side but as you say he basically cannot sprint anymore

 

[Insanity]

You do realise McT and Maguire are currently our best performing players??

We never seem to learn. This is the mentality because of which we have been handing out stupid contract extensions to players since Rooney got his under Moyes, and is one of the biggest reasons for our decline. It's a players body of work and quality since they joined (or were introduced to the first team in case of McT) that matters not how they have performed for the last 10 games in a shitshow. And we are 6th in the table with a -3 GD and already out of the league cup and CL too most likely. We have lost nearly 50% of the games this season and a -ve GD across competitions. It's not like they are "best performing" in a team that is flying.

Their upturn in form should be used as an opportunity to get rid of them for their maximum value. Then that money should be invested in up and coming young players with potential to become world class.

Turning the fortunes of this club around is going to be a massive job. And it'll start with not dithering and getting rid of this menagerie of mediocre players we have collected. Someone will have to come in and say enough is enough. We have seen these players for a while and despite may be a few good performances they have done nothing to show that they can be part of a club like Manchester United.

Hopefully, the cull will start from this January. By the beginning of the 2025-26 season - Martial, Sancho, AWB, Lindelof, Maguire, McTominay, de Meek, Varane, Dalot, Eriksen, Casemiro, Bruno, Rashford, Shaw, Malacia, Onana & Antony - should be part of out history, not the future.

 

[Winrar]

Rangnick was spot on when he said this team needs an open heart surgery, even if he wouldn't have been the right person for this operation.

Not sure who deserves to survive the cull aside from Licha, Garnacho, Mainoo, and MAYBE Hojlund. Tough times ahead.

 

[Sir Erik ten Hag]

Hopefully, the cull will start from this January. By the beginning of the 2025-26 season - Martial, Sancho, AWB, Lindelof, Maguire, McTominay, de Meek, Varane, Dalot, Eriksen, Casemiro, Bruno, Rashford, Shaw, Malacia, Onana & Antony - should be part of out history, not the future.

Wow you are ruthless!

 

[gajender]

Rangnick was spot on when he said this team needs an open heart surgery, even if he wouldn't have been the right person for this operation.

Not sure who deserves to survive the cull aside from Licha, Garnacho, Mainoo, and MAYBE Hojlund. Tough times ahead.

Leave aside the youngsters for the time being but we should be open to sell every Senior player , most should be actively pushed out even at losses and likes of Martinez could also leave if we can get all our money back because he also has significant flaws despite his inflated reputation here .

 

[Sky1981]

No chance

People are still idolizing Martial (although to be fair much less) and making excuses for Rashford. Some even called Bruno world class.

Standards should be set. Our job as fans is to maintain that standard.

Going to Anfield taking a 4-0 loss fearing a worse tonking... Not even in our mightiest days and RAWK worse they resort to this.

They may be poor but they had pride, at least when facing us.. it's their cup final.

While our captain taking a stupid yellow to hid his skin.

 

[oz insomniac]

Why is Martial still at the club and actually playing
Same can be said about McTominlay, 1 good game in 10 is no reason to keep selecting someone who has no true position.
Rashford has no technical ability or ball control, how is that possible after the number of years he has been coached.
Evans,Dalot , and a f ew others don’t seem EPL quality, who agrees the stupid wages and reluctance to sell them and take a loss, stupidity personified and that goes back to Woodward and now to those in the same position, again underlined by interference from the Glazers and their favouritism for players like Martial and insistence they are not moved on.
Possibly even hiring the current manager who has not shown a strength of systems , signings and selections needed at one of the biggest clubs on the world.

 

[NewGlory]

Related: who would you keep from current squad to do a real, ambitious clear-out and rebuild? Emphasis must be on talent, character, but also getting rid of lukewarm, insanely paid players

I will go first, with: no=get rid, yes - keep

1. Onana - no
2. Maguire - no
3. Lindelof - no
4. Varane - no
5. Evans - no
6. Shaw - keep
7. Malacia - maybe
8. Martinez - keep
9. AWB - maybe
10. Dalot - no
11. Reguilon - no
12. Mct - no
13. Eriksen - no
14. Mejbri - no
15. Mount - no
16. Amrabat - maybe
17. Shoretire - no
18. Mainoo - keep
19. Casemiro - no
20. DvB - no
21. Bruno Fernandes - maybe
22. Sancho - HELLS NO
23. Antony - maybe
24. Garnacho - keep
25. Pellistri - no
26. Rashford - no
27. Martial - no
28. Hojlund - keep
29. Amad Diallo - maybe
30. Gore - no

So, 6 out of 30 (20%) are a definite "keep", 5 (17%) are "maybe" and the rest (63%) need to be sold or fired.

 

[Amira]

Related: who would you keep from current squad to do a real, ambitious clear-out and rebuild? Emphasis must be on talent, character, but also getting rid of lukewarm, insanely paid players

I will go first, with: no=get rid, yes - keep

1. Onana - no
2. Maguire - no
3. Lindelof - no
4. Varane - no
5. Evans - no
6. Shaw - keep
7. Malacia - maybe
8. Martinez - keep
9. AWB - maybe
10. Dalot - no
11. Reguilon - no
12. Mct - no
13. Eriksen - no
14. Mejbri - no
15. Mount - no
16. Amrabat - maybe
17. Shoretire - no
18. Mainoo - keep
19. Casemiro - no
20. DvB - no
21. Bruno Fernandes - maybe
22. Sancho - HELLS NO
23. Antony - maybe
24. Garnacho - keep
25. Pellistri - no
26. Rashford - no
27. Martial - no
28. Hojlund - keep
29. Amad Diallo - maybe
30. Gore - no

So, 6 out of 30 (20%) are a definite "keep", 5 (17%) are "maybe" and the rest (63%) need to be sold or fired.

What is scary is that the only changes I’d make is change some maybes to no.

 

[RedRonaldo]

Related: who would you keep from current squad to do a real, ambitious clear-out and rebuild? Emphasis must be on talent, character, but also getting rid of lukewarm, insanely paid players

I will go first, with: no=get rid, yes - keep

1. Onana - no
2. Maguire - no
3. Lindelof - no
4. Varane - no
5. Evans - no
6. Shaw - keep
7. Malacia - maybe
8. Martinez - keep
9. AWB - maybe
10. Dalot - no
11. Reguilon - no
12. Mct - no
13. Eriksen - no
14. Mejbri - no
15. Mount - no
16. Amrabat - maybe
17. Shoretire - no
18. Mainoo - keep
19. Casemiro - no
20. DvB - no
21. Bruno Fernandes - maybe
22. Sancho - HELLS NO
23. Antony - maybe
24. Garnacho - keep
25. Pellistri - no
26. Rashford - no
27. Martial - no
28. Hojlund - keep
29. Amad Diallo - maybe
30. Gore - no

So, 6 out of 30 (20%) are a definite "keep", 5 (17%) are "maybe" and the rest (63%) need to be sold or fired.

In other words, keep Mainoo, Garnacho, Hojlund, Martinez and Shaw, and maybe sell the rest.

Seriously I think there are certain type of players we have to sell in order to move forward. Not that they didn't deliver, but if we want to move forward from our "counter attack" style into more of structured team play with more of build up, we just have to do it:

(all good impact players for us this season or previous, but they couldn't add anything to overall team play, yet we have to play them all the time)

1. Bruno - all over the place, not helping midfield build up play much, too wasteful at times, always look for hollywood ball instead of building up something from midfield, which ends our attack move
2. Rashford - too selfish play, so often run into defenders instead of making the right pass which ends our attack move, highly inconsistence, lazy on the pitch at times
3. Mctominay - lack of quality , hiding away too much away receiving pass from teammates, inability to build up anything in midfield
4. Maguire - too slow, inability to run into space to receive ball at the back for build up, so often slowing down tempo of play without adding anything

and also the rest of our deadwoods...

But I doubt ETH would sell them if he stays around, because:

1. Bruno - our captain, our main source of creativity, capable of scoring goals/providing assists, also works hard
2. Rashford - our top goalscorer, and when he is on form he would provide the biggest attack threats
3. Mctominay - our top goalscorer this season, biggest goal threats from midfield, works hard and have strong physical presence
4. Maguire - defend like a rock at times, sold defending when we didn't hold too high of defence line

 

[NewGlory]

In other words, keep Mainoo, Garnacho, Hojlund, Martinez and Shaw, and maybe sell the rest.

Seriously I think there are certain type of players we have to sell in order to move forward. Not that they didn't deliver, but if we want to move forward from our "counter attack" style into more of structured team play with more of build up, we just have to do it:

(all good impact players for us this season or previous, but they couldn't add anything to overall team play, yet we have to play them all the time)

1. Bruno - all over the place, not helping midfield build up play much, too wasteful at times, always look for hollywood ball instead of building up something from midfield, which ends our attack move
2. Rashford - too selfish play, so often run into defenders instead of making the right pass which ends our attack move, highly inconsistence, lazy on the pitch at times
3. Mctominay - lack of quality , hiding away too much away receiving pass from teammates, inability to build up anything in midfield
4. Maguire - too slow, inability to run into space to receive ball at the back for build up, so often slowing down tempo of play without adding anything

and also the rest of our deadwoods...

But I doubt ETH would sell them if he stays around, because:

1. Bruno - our captain, our main source of creativity, capable of scoring goals/providing assists, also works hard
2. Rashford - our top goalscorer, and when he is on form he would provide the biggest attack threats
3. Mctominay - our top goalscorer this season, biggest goal threats from midfield, works hard and have strong physical presence
4. Maguire - defend like a rock at times, sold defending when we didn't hold too high of defence line

Agree with everything you said, and very likely why Sir Jim may let Erik go, if Erik decides to be stubbornly against the clear-out and if Sir Jim's people decide to do the clear-out

 

[Lee565]

Why is Martial still at the club and actually playing
Same can be said about McTominlay, 1 good game in 10 is no reason to keep selecting someone who has no true position.
Rashford has no technical ability or ball control, how is that possible after the number of years he has been coached.
Evans,Dalot , and a f ew others don’t seem EPL quality, who agrees the stupid wages and reluctance to sell them and take a loss, stupidity personified and that goes back to Woodward and now to those in the same position, again underlined by interference from the Glazers and their favouritism for players like Martial and insistence they are not moved on.
Possibly even hiring the current manager who has not shown a strength of systems , signings and selections needed at one of the biggest clubs on the world.

Because ten hag messed up recruitment and wasted a majority of the 400 million he has had to build a side

 

[Fortitude]

If we line up the exact same way the next few games and also get hammered, he’ll have sealed his fate. It’s not imperceivable that we’ll have a cricket score against us.

 

[HookedOnAPhelan]

If we line up the exact same way the next few games and also get hammered, he’ll have sealed his fate. It’s not imperceivable that we’ll have a cricket score against us.

Liverpool thrive on the kinds of spaces we continually give away these days. I'm really worried about that one. Salah will have a field day.

 

[hobbers]

Bayindir, Shaw, Martinez, Lindelof, Mainoo, Garnacho, Eriksen, Hojlund, Diallo

9 players I would keep in the current squad, most of them only as backups.

I don’t think I’ve ever wanted to see more of the squad metaphorically culled.

 

[GreatDane]

Related: who would you keep from current squad to do a real, ambitious clear-out and rebuild? Emphasis must be on talent, character, but also getting rid of lukewarm, insanely paid players

I will go first, with: no=get rid, yes - keep

1. Onana - no
2. Maguire - no
3. Lindelof - no
4. Varane - no
5. Evans - no
6. Shaw - keep
7. Malacia - maybe
8. Martinez - keep
9. AWB - maybe
10. Dalot - no
11. Reguilon - no
12. Mct - no
13. Eriksen - no
14. Mejbri - no
15. Mount - no
16. Amrabat - maybe
17. Shoretire - no
18. Mainoo - keep
19. Casemiro - no
20. DvB - no
21. Bruno Fernandes - maybe
22. Sancho - HELLS NO
23. Antony - maybe
24. Garnacho - keep
25. Pellistri - no
26. Rashford - no
27. Martial - no
28. Hojlund - keep
29. Amad Diallo - maybe
30. Gore - no

So, 6 out of 30 (20%) are a definite "keep", 5 (17%) are "maybe" and the rest (63%) need to be sold or fired.

Bruno and Antony are a no from me, but why Gore? By all accounts he is a very interesting young player.

 

[Fortitude]

Liverpool thrive on the kinds of spaces we continually give away these days. I'm really worried about that one. Salah will have a field day.

They’ll have studied the footage and know exactly what they want to do, and they relish smashing us. I have no doubt they’ll aim to top the 7 if it’s on, and if we do absolutely nothing but go out as we have been and they score early, there’s got to be a here we go again energy for fans and players alike. Klopp talked specifically about capitalising on Palace’s low confidence so imagine what he’s thinking about us.

 

[Acquire Me]

I can agree to see a lot of players go. But Mount go after playing so little. Nah that makes no sense.

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

Wow you are ruthless!

He’s absolutely right though. Along with the names on that list that are clearly not good enough, there no point in bringing in yet another manager to have him stick Bruno in the 10 and Rashford on the left and repeat the same cycle over again. It would be far smarter to cash in on the name value of those two to really bolster funds.

 

[The_Midfielder]

I think this is just over complicating what's going on.

If you pick a system that doesn't work eventually the players lose confidence and belief in it, and eventually that leads to a lack of motivation.

I doubt there's some over complicated power struggle going on. I just think ETH has made a few big errors with his tactics and squad this season, and then been too stubborn to accept it, and then it's been compounded by injuries....and now he has a set of players whobare low on confidence and have very little reason to believe in what they are being asked to do.

The effort levels from the likes of Martial and Rashford the other night are on them and they should be dropped, because they are supposed to be professionals, but we're 20+ games into a season and even though he's been reduced to using a teenager there, ETH is still insisting on playing with only 1 midfielder. How long do people expect the team to not be affected moral or motivation wise when they are being asked to persist with something that is beyond broken. They can run around more for sure but they still aren't going to be pro active or aggressive because the belief and confidence won't be there to facilitate it.

But do you think dalot, Awb, Scott, Maguire, Amrabat ,Antony , VDB will suit any other style ?
Thats half of our starting 11
I don't see it ..

 

[noodlehair]

Turns out the new approach was to drop Martial for 1 game.

But do you think dalot, Awb, Scott, Maguire, Amrabat ,Antony , VDB will suit any other style ?
Thats half of our starting 11
I don't see it ..

Two of those play the same position, and AWB, Mctominay and Maguire have all played in a different system for Man Utd and done a lot better as a team than they are now. Same with Antony last season. VDB is a very random person to tag on the end.

I don't think you can put a system which incorporates 1 midfielder and leaves them standing in midfield on their own all game entirely on the players. Yes they can try harder or be less rubbish, but it still wouldn't work, because it's tactically stupid.

I don't think this set of players is capable of competing for a league, particularly with the injuries, but the manager should be capable of getting them to control a game at home to the likes of Bournemouth. He should also be capable of recognising when a system he puts them in doesn't work instead of still persisting with it after over 20 fecking games where its been a complete disaster in nearly every single one.

I'd love to know who the right players are for this system. Because we signed Mount and Amrabat in the summer and they most definitely aren't.

 

[NewGlory]

Bruno and Antony are a no from me, but why Gore? By all accounts he is a very interesting young player.

I may, indeed, be very wrong about Gore, but my thinking was - he is behind Mejbri in the packing order and Mejbri is not good enough. But maybe it is Erik's mistake to put Gore behind Mejbri and a new manager will make Gore into a great player. It is possible.

 

[miliebrowndivorceattorney]

In other words, keep Mainoo, Garnacho, Hojlund, Martinez and Shaw, and maybe sell the rest.

Seriously I think there are certain type of players we have to sell in order to move forward. Not that they didn't deliver, but if we want to move forward from our "counter attack" style into more of structured team play with more of build up, we just have to do it:

(all good impact players for us this season or previous, but they couldn't add anything to overall team play, yet we have to play them all the time)

1. Bruno - all over the place, not helping midfield build up play much, too wasteful at times, always look for hollywood ball instead of building up something from midfield, which ends our attack move
2. Rashford - too selfish play, so often run into defenders instead of making the right pass which ends our attack move, highly inconsistence, lazy on the pitch at times
3. Mctominay - lack of quality , hiding away too much away receiving pass from teammates, inability to build up anything in midfield
4. Maguire - too slow, inability to run into space to receive ball at the back for build up, so often slowing down tempo of play without adding anything

and also the rest of our deadwoods...

But I doubt ETH would sell them if he stays around, because:

1. Bruno - our captain, our main source of creativity, capable of scoring goals/providing assists, also works hard
2. Rashford - our top goalscorer, and when he is on form he would provide the biggest attack threats
3. Mctominay - our top goalscorer this season, biggest goal threats from midfield, works hard and have strong physical presence
4. Maguire - defend like a rock at times, sold defending when we didn't hold too high of defence line

Bruno is a nice guy but no captain, erratic and the years are coming hard and fast.

 

[GreatDane]

I may, indeed, be very wrong about Gore, but my thinking was - he is behind Mejbri in the packing order and Mejbri is not good enough. But maybe it is Erik's mistake to put Gore behind Mejbri and a new manager will make Gore into a great player. It is possible.

Fair enough. I just heard someone call him a bigger talent that Mainoo, so was curious. We'll see in time I guess.

 

[olasunkanmi owolarafe]

I can only think of us keeping 4 or 5 players from the present squad if we wish to move United back to a competitive club

 

[croadyman]

We need that dressing room purged of the bad characters and deadwood

 

[gajender]

We need that dressing room purged of the bad characters and deadwood

Mate I don't believe it's Character issue at all its always been talent or lack of it that's been the root cause of all the problems at United for past ten years and that includes every body not just the players .

 

[croadyman]

Mate I don't believe it's Character issue at all its allways been talent or lack of it that's been the root cause of all the problems at United for past ten years and that includes every body not just the players .

Oh yeah there is definite lack of talent in all areas. People comparing an INEOS reset to the one in 2013 are just wild. For a start it sounds like they have more idea than Woody and co back then

 

[gajender]

Oh yeah there is definite lack of talent in all areas. People comparing an INEOS reset to the one in 2013 are just wild. For a start it sounds like they have more idea than Woody and co back then

I am Cautiously optimistic about Ineos let's hope it's not another false dawn .

 

[Fortitude]

Spoiler

 

[Fortitude]

I am curious: if we line up as naively as we have been doing, will your attitude change in any way?

 

[Roboc7]

Roy Keane said he’d keep 7 of this squad and 2 of those were Mainoo and Garnacho. That is exactly the kind of purge this squad needs, it needs to be dismanted ruthlessly, was the same when Ole left and it’s exactly the same now.

If we continue to rely on a group of players that have been here for years and proven their not good enough like Lindelof, Dalot, Mctominay, Martial, Maguire etc etc you will just get the same results. The squad is full of players that would not get near the top sides as they just can’t perform to the level and style required, if INEOS don’t recognise that and address it they’ll fail.

 

[sunama]

As Ralf R said, "This team needs open heart surgery".
Of the 13 players who regularly get picked for the starting XI, I'd get rid of around 10 of them.
The losing mentality is buried deep inside the psyche of many of our players.

 

[The Irish Connection]

Roy Keane said he’d keep 7 of this squad and 2 of those were Mainoo and Garnacho. That is exactly the kind of purge this squad needs, it needs to be dismanted ruthlessly, was the same when Ole left and it’s exactly the same now.

If we continue to rely on a group of players that have been here for years and proven their not good enough like Lindelof, Dalot, Mctominay, Martial, Maguire etc etc you will just get the same results. The squad is full of players that would not get near the top sides as they just can’t perform to the level and style required, if INEOS don’t recognise that and address it they’ll fail.

Agree. INEOS need to be ruthless and do it as quickly as possible.