Santa Barbara shooting
- Thread starter Bross
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
It should not be ignored, but I feel that is not the primary issue here. His outbursts were gender specific, though his attack was mindless violence that didn't care to target anyone in particular and was meant as way for him to garner attention that he felt he wasn't getting. It's more a culmination of his social ineptitude and the resultant loneliness.
The issues that I feel need discussion are -
(1) First and foremost the easy availability of firearms that become handy tools for these psychopaths to cause mayhem.
(2) The role social, print and digital media play in inadvertently glorifying these incidents and giving them the attention they seek. Encouraging others to copycat.
(3) Modern culture, society and our surroundings.
(4) Another important issue I feel is parenting. What were his parents and friends doing all this while when he was showing signs of distress. How come no one close to him picked on it and try to get him appropriate help?
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One thing from all of his videos which really stood out for me as a genuine moment of introspection and sadness was where he talks about doing something and as an aside says that he was of course doing it alone. He mentions not having any friends and it seems to hit him harder than any other thing he said. He clearly has an insane hatred of women, but it seems centered around this idea that once he entered college or whatever, women would/should recognize him as "superior" to mostly everyone else and he'd finally be able to have relationships/sex. Because that was his expectation and it didn't happen, he hated women for it. I'm not sure that if he had a different over-exaggerated and warped concept/expectation of something else, which wasn't centered around going to college and having girlfriends, he wouldn't have snapped and done the same thing once denied it. He seems to think love, sex, friendship etc should work on social standing rather than your personality or anything else, to the point where he can't understand how a girl he has never met before might choose to be friends with an ugly indian guy driving a shit car, it seems completely unfathomable to him. While he has a huge, insane hatred of females, it's not too far off how he considers males either, seeing them as totally beneath him and completely undeserving of a better womens recognition or affections. What is weirder is he seems to expect other males to recognize this fact - that they are lower than him and as such have double-wronged him by knowing this and pursuing women he thinks are above them.
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I'd definitely think it was trolling. One of his posts in response to some insult was this:
If it wasn't for the fact that he just killed people, that would be really funny.
Reads like something from a US sitcom, tbh.
There is no way I could read those posts on the bodybuilder forum and think it wasn't someone trolling, it just seems so outlandish and ridiculous to be genuine.
It's actually quite strange because his posts were so over the top sometimes that assuming he was trolling wasn't really far fetched and I wouldn't even have named him a good troll because the trolling was too "obvious".
Hard to take a guy serious that acts in that manner and then complains about being rejected.
Hard to take a guy serious that acts in that manner and then complains about being rejected.
Yeah pretty much, it's really weird. You'd just assume no-one could simultaneously post in the fashion that he did, yet not truly know the answer as to why people basically shunned him. Although in reality no-one actually shunned him, he just never tried to talk to anyone. In his whole manifesto the only time he mentions actively trying to speak to a girl and prompt something was by saying "hi" to one in passing, who probably didn't hear him or didn't want to return the greeting, as normal people might do.
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Someone on reddit posted a comment when one of his videos was put on r/cringe 5 days ago. They said they got a serial killer vibe from him.
A very confused woman-hater, considering most of his victims were men. He was clearly alienated from people in general, but, since his inability to form relationships with women denied him sexual release, overwhelmingly important to a 22 year old, his hostility was mostly directed at them.
It's easy to look back on it and say that people should have seen it coming, but I'm sure there's loads of individuals just like him on YouTube and on forums. Hell, down the years I'm sure this site has gotten some basket cases. His videos in particular seem so acted out too, the first impression I got from him was that God awful actor that plays Anakin Skywalker. It doesn't sound genuine at all, including his bizarre laugh.
What's the joke?
That image seems hugely distasteful given the circumstances...
I've watched a couple of his videos and, to be honest, he doesn't say anything misogynistic at all. But you can see the anger and confusion at the fact that women aren't interested in him.
Doesn't it. Kind of you not to put it in the quote, so he can delete it if he wishes. I'm not sure I would've been that nice.
He made that gem himself.
Really? Feck me...
4chan in a nutshell.
I know it says Facebook but when did anyone on facebook post something that hasn't been on 4chan/reddit before?
I didn't think anyone would assume.. 
Have you seen his book?
http://www.scribd.com/doc/225960813...s-shooting-suspect-My-Twisted-World-manifesto
Jesus christ...
Have you seen his book?
http://www.scribd.com/doc/225960813...s-shooting-suspect-My-Twisted-World-manifesto
Jesus christ...
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Incredibly, I felt a little - just a little - sorry for the kid there.
Its strange. He's eloquent, and doesn't look too half bad. How the hell did he not even get himself laid even once? He has a BMW, ffs.
A bit of American Psycho about his videos though.
A bit of American Psycho about his videos though.
Maybe he couldn't get it upIts strange. He's eloquent, and doesn't look too half bad. How the hell did he not even get himself laid even once? He has a BMW, ffs.
A bit of American Psycho about his videos though.
You don't need anything up to just kiss a girl, which he didn't even managed.
He was clearly deranged anyway - the whole 'Wah girls don't like me' thing is just one of many ways that he would've ended up doing something horrific.
RIP to those poor victims and their families. Killed because a few girls wouldn't have sex with a clear creepy pyschopath.
RIP to those poor victims and their families. Killed because a few girls wouldn't have sex with a clear creepy pyschopath.
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Sounds a bit like you're blaming the girls for not fecking him there mate.
Of course that's not what I meant! I meant to say that, what a ridiculous, wasteful reason to die, just because women were repulsed enough by this weirdo to not have sex with him.
I'll rephrase it.
Maybe because he expected people to fall for him without making any sort of effort. He seems like a bitter person who watched shows where 'alpha' guys would get all the girls by just saying "hi". I havent read his manifeast because i think it should be burnt and should never see the light of day but someone who has read it (a BBC article) mentioned his only interaction with the opposite sex was when he would approach them out of the blue. Sufficient to say unless you're Brad Pitt or have a great personality that hardly ever works.
I knew you didn't mean to say that, it just read a little like that is all
Really weird kid. He must have had some sort of narcissistic disorder. I mean, read that fecking document. That's the kind of thing you'd write as a parody. Every single sentence is "me, me, me". I have to say I felt nothing but utter contempt for him reading that.
I read his manifesto and the narcissism is dripping off every single sentence. The grandiose opinion of himself, the entitlement, the utter contempt.
He's a textbook narcissist.
He's a textbook narcissist.
It's the strangest thing I've ever read. He doesn't seem to understand people at all and hates everyone for not loving him and having a better life than him.
Just for the record, the ugly Indian in a Honda civic, may not be ugly after all. He just seems ugly to Elliot Rodger.
There's going to be a fair amount of speculation on the reason for these killings here, because none of us know the guy. I've seen people with issues (anger, emotional etc etc) just catch on to some random reasoning and take to violence. A guy I know was never interested in Hindutva, but had a lot of anger issues, and suddenly 6 months later became a hardcore Hindutva advocate, hating Muslims and Christians and resorting to violence. You'd have never guessed what he would grow up into. Based on his videos, it's clear that the guy has some extreme views of misogyny. In fact, his views are so extreme and chaotic that you have coin a new term. He's talking as if he's entitled to sex because he was born. Is that the root of his problems? I'm not sure, it's difficult to be sure. Is it possible that he was a deranged kid who caught on to sexual fantasies and believed he was entitled to sex? Again, difficult to know. I'm sure the investigators will look into all that. Could be a deranged nutcase, could be a women hater, whatever he is, he is an extreme case.
I wonder if you can have a hardcore mental view like that, if you are isolated. I thought misogyny was more a product of your environment. You grow up in an abusive household, or be a part of a group with genuine hatred of women and you develop views like that. He seems like a part of a reasonably happy family. Whatever it is, it's terrible and terrifying for the victims. It's such a tragedy. I live in US, about 40 miles off Sandy Hook, CT. It's a genuine fear for me now.
There's going to be a fair amount of speculation on the reason for these killings here, because none of us know the guy. I've seen people with issues (anger, emotional etc etc) just catch on to some random reasoning and take to violence. A guy I know was never interested in Hindutva, but had a lot of anger issues, and suddenly 6 months later became a hardcore Hindutva advocate, hating Muslims and Christians and resorting to violence. You'd have never guessed what he would grow up into. Based on his videos, it's clear that the guy has some extreme views of misogyny. In fact, his views are so extreme and chaotic that you have coin a new term. He's talking as if he's entitled to sex because he was born. Is that the root of his problems? I'm not sure, it's difficult to be sure. Is it possible that he was a deranged kid who caught on to sexual fantasies and believed he was entitled to sex? Again, difficult to know. I'm sure the investigators will look into all that. Could be a deranged nutcase, could be a women hater, whatever he is, he is an extreme case.
I wonder if you can have a hardcore mental view like that, if you are isolated. I thought misogyny was more a product of your environment. You grow up in an abusive household, or be a part of a group with genuine hatred of women and you develop views like that. He seems like a part of a reasonably happy family. Whatever it is, it's terrible and terrifying for the victims. It's such a tragedy. I live in US, about 40 miles off Sandy Hook, CT. It's a genuine fear for me now.
I've read parts of the manifesto. He eventually became envious of his little brother for his "social advantages" and contemplated killing him. Bloody hell.
Fishfingers having been a part of some of the communities I reckon he's been a member of, it's very easy to see him having developed some twisted ideas of women in his bitterness and having them affirmed by similarly bitter people with similarly bitter, shirking explanations. The PUA community is vile and manipulative, no doubt he viewed all interaction through that lens that he adopted.
I saw another comment form him on that PUhate or whatever its called before it got deleted where someone responded to one of his posts with "In before school shooting"..
I think its a valid point that his killing in some way was fueled by misogyny, but I think its more interesting to go deeper. What causes misogyny? A failure to get women yourself. And what is the cause of this? Poor social skills. THere should be more focus in kindergartens and schools to get every kid as socially well-adjusted as possible. This was not done in this case at all, in fact he was taken out of school in the 8th grade for home schooling and further isolated.
If men knew how to approach women in a non-creepy, non-needy way and just act nice and normal and get to know them and get relationships/sex that way - the normal way - then there wouldnt be misogyny. Misogyny stems from social awkwardness. When you put narcissism into the mix then you get a volatile combo. Most aspergers/autists are awkward around people, but they are more likely to become depressed than violent. With this guy's narcissistic beliefs he wouldnt blame himself and go into a normal depression as a result of his failures with women, so instead he did the only alternative left, blame everything else and then act upon that.
That's completely false. Plenty of men who are comfortable around women are misogynists.
You mean psychopaths? Theres not much we can do about them.
Everyone Ive encountered who have very negative ideas about women have been socially awkward, weird people.