mancan92
Full Member
3 very good strikers who all had a good game but only 1 real world class striker who made the difference.
The last time Rooney was considered a borderline world class player was when he was playing as an out and out striker four odd years ago. He's not going to get consistent games there with RVP around and if we do bring in Cavani, it'll obviously be even harder.We all know he needs a run of games to get any sort of form going. International tournaments dont really suit him. Too big a gap between the intensity of competitive football and the start of the WC. Also he wasn't helped by missing a few games right at the end of the PL season.
I actually have high hopes that LVG can get him back to his best-a borderline world class player.
I don't know how bad the criticism was in the immediate aftermath as i got bored of Mark Saggers scream down the radio [you accept that phone-ins will try to drum up calls but it was all too forced], however it is hard to imagine that he could be ignored after yesterday's performance. From very early on Gerrard's decision making left a lot to be desired, not in the least providing the sort of composure one would expect of a senior player.Gerrard's diplomatic immunity from English press criticism is bad enough but Sturridge seems just as immune from what I've seen today. I thought he was absolutely atrocious. An Ashley Young of a performance, relentless diving included.
Really?Suarez showed the difference between a world class forward and a very good one. Scored two great goals from 3 chances (the second goal was from a half chance though and the wasted chance wasn't a clear cut one by any means)) whereas Rooney had 5-6 chances vs Italy and Uruguay and managed to score a tap in. It was a typical Rooney performance from the last 2 seasons, i.e. a good performance but not good enough to make a real difference when it really matters.
Think that England played better against Italy who have a superior team to Uruguay. Last night Rooney performed better than against Italy but apparently at the expense of the performances of the other players. The fact that the other attacking players were dire (actually Sturridge did a great job for the goal) had arguably something to do with the fact that Rooney's link up play was dire, except for the half chance he created for Sturridge.
You think Rooney was creative last night? OK.Really?
What else can we find to blame Rooney for?
Nonsense. Against Italy he had one chance. Against Uruguay he had, at best, three. That's if you include the free kick from outside the box, which is a whole new definition of a "missed chance"Suarez showed the difference between a world class forward and a very good one. Scored two great goals from 3 chances (the second goal was from a half chance though and the wasted chance wasn't a clear cut one by any means)) whereas Rooney had 5-6 chances vs Italy and Uruguay and managed to score a tap in. It was a typical Rooney performance from the last 2 seasons, i.e. a good performance but not good enough to make a real difference when it really matters.
Think that England played better against Italy who have a superior team to Uruguay. Last night Rooney performed better than against Italy but apparently at the expense of the performances of the other players. The fact that the other attacking players were dire (actually Sturridge did a great job for the goal and won the free kick from which Rooney could have scored) had arguably something to do with the fact that Rooney's link up play was dire, except for the half chance he created for Sturridge.
Those 5 chances:Against Uruguay he had 4 chances. 1. the free kick (a very good chance for free kick specialists, Suarez would be happy to take a free kick from such a distance), 2. the header, 3. the wasted chance he had within the penalty box in the second half, and 4. the chance from which he scored. Including the chance vs Italy that makes 5 good chances. He managed to score a tap-in from the easiest one. He's great isn't he?
RVP and Suarez all had fitness concerns going into the tournament but they've still managed to be decisive. Why does he constantly require long periods to get up to speed? Suarez had a potbelly yesterday but he was still useful.We all know he needs a run of games to get any sort of form going. International tournaments dont really suit him. Too big a gap between the intensity of competitive football and the start of the WC. Also he wasn't helped by missing a few games right at the end of the PL season.
I actually have high hopes that LVG can get him back to his best-a borderline world class player.
I know that all kind of excuses could be made for the fact that Rooney failed to make a real difference in those games. The other attacking players don't pretend to be world class and to be paid as such. People expect more from Rooney, being the most dangerous player for England when your competition are the likes of Sturridge and Welbeck isn't a great deal. Fans and pundits expect from Rooney to perform as one of the best attacking players in the world. And he's failed to do it so far.Those 5 chances:
1. The shot Vs Italy which he dragged wide. Could have done better, but it was by no means an easy one.
2. The free kick Vs Uruguay. The taker is never favourite in these situations, and most don't go in. Rooney missed by inches.
3. The header. Such was the height of the ball that it was always difficult to get any real direction on it. Could have done better, but as a miss, it wasn't utterly outrageous.
4. The left footed shot Vs Uruguay. Should've scored, even if it was on his weaker foot. Produced a good save from the 'keeper, but okay, let's say it was a bad miss.
5. The actual goal. Harder to miss than score from that position, and he did score.
Of the 5 chances then, i'd say only two were clear cut, and he scored one of them. On another day he might have bagged 1 or 2 more, but he didn't. So there you go.
Was still England's most dangerous attacking player over the two games though. Made more key passes than any other England player, created more chances than any other England, and is the only player to have scored *and* assisted.
England's problem at this tournament was not Wayne Rooney.
No, it's just that so much of the criticism is unfair, ill informed, and borne of a clear agenda against him.Any criticism of Rooney leads to you being branded a Hater or chatting rubbish.
He can do no wrong for some and is afforded excuse after excuse after excuse. It is almost pointless to discuss any of his performances.
To give anyone else credit is considered "rawkish" and disloyal.
What? He made a "real difference" in both of those games, by any definition.I know that all kind of excuses could be made for the fact that Rooney failed to make a real difference in those games. The other attacking players don't pretend to be world class and to be paid as such. People expect more from Rooney, being the most dangerous player for England when your competition are the likes of Sturridge and Welbeck isn't a great deal. Fans and pundits expect from Rooney to perform as one of the best attacking players in the world. And he's failed to do it so far.
Most of the reason we were so awful in the first half was because Rooney was playing far too forward and leaving a massive gap between the forward line and midfield so Uruguay could pick up the second balls with no pressure whatsoever. Also meant Rooney saw little to none of the ball too.I would have dropped him and replaced him with someone better on the wing, i thought Sterling deserved to be given a shot at the no.10 role again as he did it very well against Italy it has to be said.
Rooney keeps dropping deep and doesn't stay up front as much as he should tbh.
Yes, that's right, he made a real difference by missing good chances and thus allowing the opposition to win both games.What? He made a "real difference" in both of those games, by any definition.
exactly the response I expected. you don't agree with what I say thus I am the one chatting rubbish.To be fair markhad, you do chat rubbish on any subject relating to Rooney. You are the polar opposite of JohnMUFC so you haven't got much room to complain.
If all your posts on Rooney are "carefully thought out posts" then perhaps you need to stop thinking. No one is name calling you, I am just saying your posts on Rooney are shite. As bad as the John who goes too far in the opposite direction. You complain about everyone making excuses for Rooney, only to blame him for everything under the sun in the next breath (or line). You pretty much admitted to hating Rooney so I'm not sure why I am even debating with you.exactly the response I expected. you don't agree with what I say thus I am the one chatting rubbish.
When I post a comment it is carefully thought out and not done as an emotional response.
I do not call fellow poster names or try to ridicule them because opinions should be respected.
Wow. An attacking player can only make a "real difference" in a game his team wins? That's a new one to me.Yes, that's right, he made a real difference by missing good chances and thus allowing the opposition to win both games.
On a serious note, you make a real difference when you make vital contributions which win the game for your team. Rooney's misses kinda cancelled his contributions. He was at fault for the loss vs Italy and should have done a bit better with his chances vs Uruguay. I'll leave it at that.
Never ever said I hated him. I once used the word dislike but taken in context it referred to all the hype surrounding him.If all your posts on Rooney are "carefully thought out posts" then perhaps you need to stop thinking. No one is name calling you, I am just saying your posts on Rooney are shite. As bad as the John who goes too far in the opposite direction. You complain about everyone making excuses for Rooney, only to blame him for everything under the sun in the next breath (or line). You pretty much admitted to hating Rooney so I'm not sure why I am even debating with you.
I believe this is the reason that people sometimes go the other way and overly criticise Rooney. You'll have people saying "he has scored 30+ goals every season he has played consistently as a number 9", therefore "he is a World Class number 9" or as you have skewing his abysmal record in major tournaments for his Country to actually look incredibly impressive.And while i'm at it - and maybe this is me playing devil's advocate somehwat - there is much talk about Rooney's abysmal record at tournament level.
But it is just a fact that he went into the 2006 and 2010 tournaments off the back of major injury. Fergie is adamant he should never have gone in 2006 after the metatarsal break, and he'd badly sprained his ankle in 2010, meaning he couldn't train properly for weeks afterwards.
His record with no fitness issues hanging over him at major tournaments is:
Played: 8
Goals: 6
Assists: 1
And in one of those games, he went off injured after 20 minutes or so. It's not too shabby at all.
So England lose because of Gerrard being absolute shite and there is article which still finds to talk mostly about Rooney? Shocker.Wayne Rooney broke his World Cup duck - but could not lift himself to the level that this game demanded
http://www.standard.co.uk/sport/foo...-but-defensive-woes-cost-england-9550570.html
Posters like him are only worth ignoring because of the bollocks they talk. Better to smash head against wall than arguing with them. Add to that this guy writes in bullet-points style. Absolutely awful to read in every manner.If all your posts on Rooney are "carefully thought out posts" then perhaps you need to stop thinking. No one is name calling you, I am just saying your posts on Rooney are shite. As bad as the John who goes too far in the opposite direction. You complain about everyone making excuses for Rooney, only to blame him for everything under the sun in the next breath (or line). You pretty much admitted to hating Rooney so I'm not sure why I am even debating with you.