Some good observations but who wants to mirror the old Serie A sort of play any longer? Is that really going to thrill the fanbase? Technical football, it's the era we live in and England has some catching up to do, still
Why is La Liga so far ahead in Europe?
- Thread starter Kasper
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It needs to be asked also - how does it happen that la liga, which has much less money than the epl outside the big two, keeps picking up Europa league trophies whilst English sides keep doing diddly squat outside of rafa doing his thing one year with Chelsea of all teams.
It's pathetic that England has done nothing in that competition for yonks.
It's pathetic that England has done nothing in that competition for yonks.
I don't think English clubs care about the Europa League to be honest. Maybe that'll change as the winner has a guaranteed place in next seasons Champions League.
nearly all teams rotate in the early stages of the Europa league but take it far more seriously in the later stages.
The odd time an English club do reach those stages they still fail. They are not good enough to win the Europa league
Note also that Spain is regularly among the top 2 in almost every major sport - they seem to live for sport there.
Up there in Handball, Basketball, Football, Tennis for years.
Perhaps it's the outdoor life? They are mad for sports there though in my experience. My father in law will watch absolutely anything on TV, for example
Up there in Handball, Basketball, Football, Tennis for years.
Perhaps it's the outdoor life? They are mad for sports there though in my experience. My father in law will watch absolutely anything on TV, for example
Indians have the cricketing side of it taken care of. Waiting for you Englishmen to do something about Football.Note also that Spain is regularly among the top 2 in almost every major sport - they seem to live for sport there.
Up there in Handball, Basketball, Football, Tennis for years.
Perhaps it's the outdoor life? They are mad for sports there though in my experience. My father in law will watch absolutely anything on TV, for example
Exactly they use their minds to both defend and attack lol
Spanish teams are much better at playing through the middle than English teams. I watch PL games regularly and sometimes I'm really surprised by how much of their gameplay is based on wing-play and crosses. I hardly see good through balls being given in the box through the middle. Basically that Ayew pass when Gomis scored the 2-1 against United, that's the kind of football Spanish teams are better at and it's so much more threatening than consistently crossing the ball.
A lot of it is that La Liga arguably has the best attacking players in the world playing there, none of them Spanish however.
IMO 3 reasons:
1) European clubs aren't so stupid as to claim that getting out of European competition is somehow a good thing. Look at the English clubs' attitude to the Europa League and compare that to how Spanish clubs feel about it.
2) This logic that the Premier League is somehow harder than all other domestic leagues. Each league has its own characteristic. Competitive mid-table teams aren't exclusive to the Premier League.
3) Technical standards of English players are far inferior to that of European players.
1) European clubs aren't so stupid as to claim that getting out of European competition is somehow a good thing. Look at the English clubs' attitude to the Europa League and compare that to how Spanish clubs feel about it.
2) This logic that the Premier League is somehow harder than all other domestic leagues. Each league has its own characteristic. Competitive mid-table teams aren't exclusive to the Premier League.
3) Technical standards of English players are far inferior to that of European players.
I would say that is something City do not know how to do or are not bothered about. I don't think their attacking players have worked as hard defensively as some of the other big teams in the CL over the last few years. I remember Thomas Muller said this in October 2013 about City after Bayern played them at the Etihad.
"Manchester had two attackers who - and I exaggerate a bit - sat in their deckchairs on the halfway line when we were in possession," Muller told Kicker. "No attacker is allowed to do that at Bayern or the Germany team."
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I don't. I have to point out thought that I am lumping all approaches that aim to stop the opposition rather than take the game to them in the same category. But it seems every time Pellegrini or Wenger try to have a pro active approach, they're told they're naïve which is incredibly discouraging about the future of football in this country. I am a big fan of managers who aim to impose their style and dominate even if it's a big reach which is why I would never want Mourinho or Rafa here.
Bingo.
My opinion is that without a big pot of TV money there's very little reason for Spanish teams to try and topple the duopoly that exists. I remember the year we played Bilbao in the Europa League they played out of their skins against us but either side of those games lost two games by large margins in the league. Did it really matter if they finished 6th, 7th or 15th?
As a case in point, Sevilla are currently 18th in the league having drawn 2 and lost 1, and last night they beat Monchengladbach 3-0.
On the other hand, what's more important to Southampton, Swansea and co? To progress in Europe, or to ensure they remain in a more egalitarian league whose rewards greatly outweigh any financial benefit the Europa League can offer.
As a case in point, Sevilla are currently 18th in the league having drawn 2 and lost 1, and last night they beat Monchengladbach 3-0.
On the other hand, what's more important to Southampton, Swansea and co? To progress in Europe, or to ensure they remain in a more egalitarian league whose rewards greatly outweigh any financial benefit the Europa League can offer.
Plus three of the four managers of the PL clubs in the CL have had success in La Liga.
Success in the prem clouds the judgement of those running prem teams, how can they possibly improve? Look at chelsea, they were doing really well in the prem last season, and people immediately thought they were a quality side. They clearly weren't but that was the consensus. Again Man city has obvious holes in the team, yet the consensus is that they should be near Europes best. You can get away with incompetent midfields in the prem(don't we know that?) But you can't in europe. You can get away with poor passing of the ball from the back in the prem, but not in europe.
La liga is better technically and tactically. Teams try to play, some don't but they recognise true quality. All you need in the prem is a couple decent matches and pool is yanking you to Anfield. The standards in La liga are much higher than that. Also the teams without money spend it better than prem teams. While prem teams go around splashing outrageous dosh like 50mill quid on the de Bruyne's of this world, they spend their limited money better.
La liga is better technically and tactically. Teams try to play, some don't but they recognise true quality. All you need in the prem is a couple decent matches and pool is yanking you to Anfield. The standards in La liga are much higher than that. Also the teams without money spend it better than prem teams. While prem teams go around splashing outrageous dosh like 50mill quid on the de Bruyne's of this world, they spend their limited money better.
2 team league. Imagine we only had one other premier league club for competition and were able to hoover up all the young talent.
A decade later and still hearing the same antiquated argument. Last I checked, England hasn't done much in International football and their players are far removed from the highest quality players in the game. Catch up or stay behind
Well sometimes it's teams that drop into the Europa league from the CL that go on to win the former.
You missed Atletico winning the league the season before last obviously. They would be better than anyone on the PL
Seville and Valenica would both finish very high too
But they don't have the ability to continually attract and keep talent. We have 4 teams competing for top individuals, and due to the extra money across the league, we can't pick up players on the cheap in order to take a punt.
In Spain the best will more likely than not end up at the top 2.
Top 4 and CL access in La Liga is not a closed shop like in the premiership, so Spanish sides have an incentive to build up European experience and UEFA rating over time in the EL. City's exploits in Europe in particular show how hard it is to run before one can walk. Teams like Southampton and West Ham have nothing to gain from doing grunt work in Europe. Tottenham and Liverpool on the other hand are damned if they do, and damned if they don't, now the Italians are pushing up the rankings and the PL is about to lose a spot.
I think culture is part of it, Spanish sides are happy to play late at night on Sunday, which is obviously better for Thursdays, and they just take it more seriously in general?
Imagine 5 teams from one league in the Group stages of Champions League, oh wait
Gripping stuff. Please tell me more.
In Brazil they stopped playing like Brazil long time ago, I remember watching all the games from Brazil on any WC just because they were amazing, Neymar would be in the bench -if- on those teams.
Must be a reason why they can't, is not because money. Why any top player prefers to go to RM and Barca? City, United and PSG had the money, actually more than the 2 Spanish clubs.
Jamie Carragher has all your answers.
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It used to be only Real and Barca, but Sevilla are pretty consistent in League Europa, Atletico under Simeone and the year before that winning EL. On top of that there is Valencia which is a pretty solid side. Villareal are also not to be underestimated. All in all La Liga have 5-6 pretty good top sides which makes the league pretty compatible too.
It's a period of course like it how was the English teams before that and the Calccio in the 90's.
It's a period of course like it how was the English teams before that and the Calccio in the 90's.
Valencia are average but they are probably significantly better than Liverpool or Tottenham.
Sevilla are a very good side and they will cause City a lot of trouble in their Champions League group. You don't win Europa League twice in a row if you're not very good.
Barcelona and Real Madrid are absolute miles ahead of any Premier League side at the minute and it's not a distance that's going to be caught up in 2 or 3 years I imagine. Atletico are also better than any PL side currently, they've added some serious depth recently and should have great tactical flexibility this season.
English football fans are too arrogant about their league and its competitiveness which is only driving the issue further. The fact that Crystal Palace can beat Chelsea is not really a testament to how strong the league is but points to the fact that top English clubs are very weak at the minute. If you took Palace's equivalent from Spain - say Villarreal or Athletic - they'd cause trouble to English top clubs as well. Conversely, if you took Real Madrid or Barcelona and put them against Palace or Villa they wouldn't know what hit them (the PL sides).
I mean, West Ham went out to Astra while Southampton bowed out to Mitjylland. When has this last happened to Spanish sides in Europe?
True for Barca would not say that about Real. They were almost put to the sword by Schalke and lost to Juventus. I think one of the PL clubs can eliminate them in the right circumstances.
Nah, top form Real Madrid are huge distance ahead of any top form PL team. Obviously if you meet them during difficult period for them you might get some joy but other than that they belong to the very top tier of football sides currently. All of their first team players would start at all Premier League clubs probably (Navas aside). Definitely all of the front 4 (Benzema, James, Ronaldo, Bale), their midfield (Kroos and Modric), their central defenders (Pepe and Ramos) and their full backs (Carvajal and Marcelo). It's very difficult to argue that any of them would not start at any PL club, isn't it?
How many PL players would challenge for a spot in Real Madrid team on the other hand? Top form Sterling (at a massive huge push) and Aguero maybe, maybe top form Hazard, none of United players, none of Arsenal players. Maybe the entire Tottenham team.
On paper they look like the best but, that has been the case for a long time. They are a pretty unbalanced side that lack depth.
Real's only issue last year was a lack of balance in central midfield. That is still a problem but there's only two or three teams across Europe capable of exposing it.
Aye. They lack a defensive midfielder, someone like Schneiderlin would be a perfect match for them.
Not really. They were smashing everything before them until Modric got injured. That was their problem, not balance.
For all the talk of Madrid being this big bad side, their trophy cabinet and actual accomplishments doesn't quite match the reputation.
It's not as if Barca are putting them out of Europe every season bar one for the last 11/12 years.
It's not as if Barca are putting them out of Europe every season bar one for the last 11/12 years.
Even with Modric in they're still a little top-heavy. And ridiculously so when he's absent.