The anti-Giggs sentiment

[Von Mistelroum]

He's never seemed like the brightest spark. I've personally never heard him speak intelligently about football or seen anything which suggests that he'd make a top manager. And make no mistake, Manchester United need a top manager. Not a 'possibly one for the future maybe', a top manager who has the experience and personality to motivate these players out of a sizeable decline and get us quickly back into contention.

If we appoint Ryan Giggs as our next manager, even if he has some potential as a Premier League level manager (which seems unlikely), it's not going to change things enough and will see us drop out of the top 4 for the forseeable future in my opinion. It's a huge and unnecessary risk which is likely to leave us in a Liverpool-like position.

I can't imagine the top players wanting to come and be a part of it either.

 

[Sky1981]

Only two of them might be in the Champions League. Should have added Pochettino and Ranieri

Admittedly I got this of some friends from Whatsapp... I don't know where the Simeone to Chelsea comes from, but if the above is true I can see a very interesting year for a football fans, the drama and the mind games. Winter is coming

 

[Needham]

Admittedly I got this of some friends from Whatsapp... I don't know where the Simeone to Chelsea comes from, but if the above is true I can see a very interesting year for a football fans, the drama and the mind games. Winter is coming

You mean some kind of managerial nuclear winter? At the moment Mourinho is a bit radioactive but thanks to his CV has a half life of decades ahead of him. The fallout from Pep going to city would poison the Manchester football scene if he's up against Jose. I expect Simeone to drop the F bomb in press interviews. I'll get my coat. Anyway, there will never have been a season in competitive management like it and not one of them even British let alone English.

 

[NK86]

And yet Mourinho is fine?

So you would be fine if Henry was given the job after Wenger?

 

[newgiz]

I can understand some apprehension from some in terms of him being our next manager, butsome of our set's a bit over the top.

I'm not sure I want him as manager but isn't some of the sentiment against him a bit over the top?

I'm not trolling here, but I wouldn't mind some people elaborating (sensibly) I their stance against Giggs.

This has been discussed elsewhere and as has been pointed out by several including me, I don't see why Giggs should be trusted with the job especially when considering the fact that he has zero experience managing a club at the top level. At this crucial juncture there is no room for risks.

I know someone is going to bring up the fact that he 'Knows the club inside-out' but that somehow seems to be implying only to Giggs while not to players (who incidentally have also been managers elsewhere) like Bruce,Keane or Hughes.

I don't think the sentiment against him is over the top. There are legitimate concerns and I don't see why bringing them up when discussing his credentials is wrong.Its not about Top Reds points or whatever malarchy. I would also like posters to realize just being Anti-Giggs isn't Anti-United.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Would probably be a good time to bring this up....

Rio Ferdinand has said that Giggs wanted to make him the main centre back, for the 14/15 season, if Giggs had gotten the job. . .
We know how Rio turned out that season....

If someone off the internet could see Rio was finished and Giggs couldn't, it's quite worrying.

Urgh. The thought of him making Rooney main man all over again.

 

[Sky1981]

Moyes all over again. We have been preaching about the alarm bells all over but people keep on mentioning in saf they trust, the man knows best, united way, tradition, longevity, and anything but the most important aspect of them all : whether he's good enough.

Having saf like loyalty means nothing if he doesn't possess his winning skill. The only thing that keeps saf in the job for so long is the trophy haul. Without trophy he wont last a few year let alone 26 years.

It's like thinking that mitsubishi lancer is equal to evo because they look alike, they forgot about the engine

 

[Raees]

Go tell Kenny Dalglish that......How many titles did he win for Liverpool as their player's manager?.... I guess he was managing Real Madrid, Barcelona and Bayern before he became a player manager.

Dalglish was a leader on the pitch.. the Cruyff of Liverpool. He was the King... a man who you would bank on having the intelligence to read the game, he was ruthless and articulate.

Giggs has never been a leader for us, he was the last player I had pegged down as manager material. Not saying he can't be a good one but it is a huge insane irrational leap of faith to appoint him. He's shown nothing which suggests leadership skills apart from being the cool guy from the class of 92.

 

[Physiocrat]

Beyond Pep and to some extent Mourinho who is a proven winner in the major European leagues plus is still around?

Allegri
Conte
Luis Enrique
Blanc
Klopp (!!!!)
Mancini
Pelligrini

That pretty much leaves Conte, Allegri or Blanc. Style wise it leaves Blanc. In this light Giggs doesn't seem such a bad choice- would people prefer Pardew?

 

[Minimalist]

Plenty of reasons you can be anti Giggs as a person. It's not an 'embarrassing' position like some genuine classes people are on here seem to think (who clearly have never properly considered the full extent of doing something like that to your family).

As for being anti-Giggs for the next manager, that's the wrong way to look at it and always has been. Either you want the best for Man Utd going forward or you want Ryan Fecking Giggs, a man with no experience as our manager. Replace Giggs with Nicky Butt or David Beckham and it's still ridiculous.

It also doesn't help we keep getting told from the club, media and some supporters he's getting the job without a single logical reason ever stated. This isn't a religion, we need some fecking critical thinking here or we're about to start an almighty slide.

 

[Pexbo]

Beyond Pep and to some extent Mourinho who is a proven winner in the major European leagues plus is still around?

Allegri
Conte
Luis Enrique
Blanc
Klopp (!!!!)
Mancini
Pelligrini

That pretty much leaves Conte, Allegri or Blanc. Style wise it leaves Blanc. In this light Giggs doesn't seem such a bad choice- would people prefer Pardew?

I'd prefer Pardew, definitely.

 

[Physiocrat]

I'd prefer Pardew, definitely.

TBF I think Pardew is actually a very good manager and could be an interesting choice. It's just when people compare managers to Giggs it's Pep, Mou, Ancellotti etc. However the likelihood of attaining such managers could well be low. In such a comparison Giggs doesn't look that bad

 

[JPRouve]

Beyond Pep and to some extent Mourinho who is a proven winner in the major European leagues plus is still around?

Allegri
Conte
Luis Enrique
Blanc
Klopp (!!!!)
Mancini
Pelligrini

That pretty much leaves Conte, Allegri or Blanc. Style wise it leaves Blanc. In this light Giggs doesn't seem such a bad choice- would people prefer Pardew?

I would take Laudrup, Pardew, Blanc and maybe Rodgers before Giggs. For the sole reason that I don't know Giggs, the people inside the club know him and maybe they have good reasons to champion him but from where I stand, there isn't one objective thing in favour of Giggs.

 

[JPRouve]

Dalglish was a leader on the pitch.. the Cruyff of Liverpool. He was the King... a man who you would bank on having the intelligence to read the game, he was ruthless and articulate.

Giggs has never been a leader for us, he was the last player I had pegged down as manager material. Not saying he can't be a good one but it is a huge insane irrational leap of faith to appoint him. He's shown nothing which suggests leadership skills apart from being the cool guy from the class of 92.

I remember Evra describing the leaders in United locker room and he said that Giggs was taciturn, he is open if you need him but he isn't going to engage the conversation.

 

[togg]

Giggs, bloody brilliant instinctive player but no way an intelligent instinctive manager. They are two very very different jobs.

 

[Minimalist]

I remember Evra describing the leaders in United locker room and he said that Giggs was taciturn, he is open if you need him but he isn't going to engage the conversation.

I'm not just backing up what Evra said there but anytime I listen to Giggs that's exactly the sort of person he comes across as. He'd be a potentially good attacking coach on the training ground but managing players? Just seems completely out of his depth.

 

[Ixion]

Go tell Kenny Dalglish that......How many titles did he win for Liverpool as their player's manager?.... I guess he was managing Real Madrid, Barcelona and Bayern before he became a player manager.

Dalglish and Guardiola took over teams already at the top. It's a pointless comparison.

 

[Zoo]

Giggs may not sound the brightest but I remember last year Beckham saying that he could be ruthless and that's an important quality in management.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

I agree with what several posters have touched on: Grooming Giggs for the part does smack of an unwillingness to let go of the Fergie era. What does Giggs represent if not the most successful period in the club's history, a direct link to our greatest ever manager - and so forth? Well, so did Wilf back in the day.

The parallels are unsettling.

It's even more unsettling when you suspect that the heaviest decision makers (Avram, Joel, Woody) aren't people who are qualified to go for Giggs based on football factors. If they do so, they do it on the recommendations of...who? Fergie? LVG? We don't really know, do we?

The story of Giggs becoming our next great manager is very marketable. It's just a story, though. I sincerely hope Woody realizes this. You can sell anything, but a great, highly marketable story doesn't get you goals and points.

 

[Badunk]

People are stating that Giggs can't be a good manager because he's not a leader and he's not vocal enough. Like you can only be good if you shout at people or something.

Roy Keane a great manager was he? Was Bryan Robson? Paul Ince? There's 3 of our most influential leaders on the pitch in the Fergie years and they've not exactly set the world on fire since retiring as players.

 

[Minimalist]

People are stating that Giggs can't be a good manager because he's not a leader and he's not vocal enough. Like you can only be good if you shout at people or something.

Roy Keane a great manager was he? Was Bryan Robson? Paul Ince? There's 3 of our most influential leaders on the pitch in the Fergie years and they've not exactly set the world on fire since retiring as players.

Nice straw man. No one is saying our manager needs to lose the rag (although most do at times).

 

[togg]

People are stating that Giggs can't be a good manager because he's not a leader and he's not vocal enough. Like you can only be good if you shout at people or something.

Roy Keane a great manager was he? Was Bryan Robson? Paul Ince? There's 3 of our most influential leaders on the pitch in the Fergie years and they've not exactly set the world on fire since retiring as players.

It's the ability to fill a player with confidence, to do it according to that persons personality and how they react. A manager has to be some sort of psychologist most the time and that is not one of Giggs's strong points in my opinion. I also do think it would be better for Giggs to go and test himself elsewhere before being considered at United. At least we found out that way that Robson, Bruce, Ince, Hughes etc are most likely not good candidates to manage United.

 

[Leftback99]

In this light Giggs doesn't seem such a bad choice- would people prefer Pardew?

Yes. The only thing Giggs has over Pardew is 'knowledge if the club' at this point.

 

[Badunk]

Nice straw man. No one is saying our manager needs to lose the rag (although most do at times).

That's a strawman? In a thread full of nonsense about a club legend denigrating his intelligence, his abilities and his knowledge of the game, that's what you choose to quote and highlight?

 

[glazed]

Can we have a poll on Giggs as next manager? I can't believe many people think this is a good idea (unless Pep is nailed down for the summer.)

 

[alibaba]

Why won't Giggs go get a managerial job somewhere else and prove himself?
Why wouldn't he find a women other than his sister-in-law?

Bloody hell mate, we are talking about football. Lets just leave him to carry his personal baggage.

 

[glazed]

Bloody hell mate, we are talking about football. Lets just leave him to carry his personal baggage.

Perhaps he has limited horizons.

 

[Golden Nugget]

If we were top of the table, or somewhere near top, or at least playing good football with some quality players, then I'd be all for it - especially as he's been training under sir Alex for many years and has been assistant to Van Gaal. He'd be a great choice if we wanted continuity.

As it stands though, we need change, it's not something I'd trust from Giggs, who as many have said, has never managed a team before, not even the reserves (bare a few games). He could be great, but the odds for him to transform the team into a great attacking team would be low.

Chelssa are likely to finish lowly this season - say if they hired Hiddink, who has 1 decent season followed by a poor football and poor results and gets the sack - if John Terry was in the same position as assistant manager at the time, would anyone expect him to take the job and in the rare even that he does - I'm sure everyone (except Chelsea supporters) would be delighted.

 

[Giggsy92]

There are plenty of good reasons why he shouldn't be our next manager (ie. he's only ever managed 4 games in his career, Mourinho is seemingly available, etc) but I really don't see why people feel the need to go over the top and bring irrelevant stuff like how he looks on the touchline or a fecking documentary into it, just seems a bit desperate.

 

[itso 7]

I agree with what several posters have touched on: Grooming Giggs for the part does smack of an unwillingness to let go of the Fergie era. What does Giggs represent if not the most successful period in the club's history, a direct link to our greatest ever manager - and so forth? Well, so did Wilf back in the day.

The parallels are unsettling.

It's even more unsettling when you suspect that the heaviest decision makers (Avram, Joel, Woody) aren't people who are qualified to go for Giggs based on football factors. If they do so, they do it on the recommendations of...who? Fergie? LVG? We don't really know, do we?

The story of Giggs becoming our next great manager is very marketable. It's just a story, though. I sincerely hope Woody realizes this. You can sell anything, but a great, highly marketable story doesn't get you goals and points.

I think Woody recognizes this hence the call, which I'm sure he overrode Fergie who wanted Giggs installed as early as 2014, to hire Van Gaal - who came in with a highly impressive CV and he based his choice on that. However as LVG's reign has gone tits up I'm sure Joel and Avram will demand that the board reaches a consensus on the next appointment because, imo, the attacks that undermined LVG from the likes of Scholes suggested some form of discord within the ranks, I doubt very much that Scholes, Schmeichel et al would savage LVG so viciously if Fergie was 100% behind Van Gal.

 

[Tarrou]

I'm not sure Guardiola is as brilliant as you make him out to be. He started out his managerial career with the best team in the history of football already at his disposal. Rijkaard won before him (not being a special manager before his appointment or show anything since) and his successors have all shown how easy it is to win with Barcelona. Every single manager with that core of a team has been inexperienced and won things.

Onto Bayern, he's won the league twice and the cup once which is fairly standard. Can't really ask for less considering his squad and the competition he's facing. LvG did the same with a lesser squad and in a more even league. He barely had to do anything there but to keep on trucking.

If he joins either Manchester club he'll have a good foundation, a lot of youth investments and a whole lot of money to buy whoever he wants but he want take over an already dominant side and that will be his first "real" test imo. Even with free reign of money he has shown himself to be an average buyer of talent at best. He basically added only 2 players to the Barca-side, one of which only established himself because of difficulties with the CB position after failing to performing in his natural position.

That's easy to say in retrospect. They finished 3rd with 67 points the season before he took over. Nobody was talking about them in those terms, or anything close to it, until Pep had gotten hold of them.

 

[Spark]

Was it succession planning though.

Liverpool did very well by promoting from the backroom staff post Shankly. I still feel they screwed up by deviating from that policy and going for KKK. He may have got them some short term success but they then struggled for many years because of the mess left behind.

There are not many teams that have continued success when bringing in managers with different styles.

As others have said, Giggs has now been part of 2 back room staff at United. Neither seemed to be what the fans want. Is he really ready to take on building a new foundation. I am not too sure. I would prefer someone who has a history of attacking football and good management skills.

Liverpool screwed up giving the job to Graeme Souness and hoping he'd carry on the legacy. He then sold all their players, changed shit around and the rest is history.

To bring back to thread, giving the job to Giggs is the equivalent of giving the job to Souness. Both very successful players in very succesful teams and both extremely limited in managerial experience. fecking risky all round.

 

[Barca84]

Liverpool screwed up giving the job to Graeme Souness and hoping he'd carry on the legacy. He then sold all their players, changed shit around and the rest is history.

To bring back to thread, giving the job to Giggs is the equivalent of giving the job to Souness. Both very successful players in very succesful teams and both extremely limited in managerial experience. fecking risky all round.

And Souness, unlike Giggs, appeared to have all the necessary attributes to make it as manager.

Look at how Keane has failed. Great player, leader on the pitch, hugely respected by fellow players and those who lined up against him. Car crash of a manager.

 

[RedChip]

Perhaps he has limited horizons.

Aye. Sounds like the sort of bloke whose job search only goes as far as his home town. Not exactly indicative of a real interest in the art of managing and pushing forward the frontiers of management. I think Ryan just expects one of the biggest jobs in world football to drop in his lap, having risked very little in terms of showing what he can do. So far as I can see, he will be a disaster.

 

[Adisa]

If we had a squad full of world class players in a league that isn't really competitive, then I'd be all for this. Appointing Giggs could cement this club out of the CL places for some time.

 

[itso 7]

Aye. Sounds like the sort of bloke whose job search only goes as far as his home town. Not exactly indicative of a real interest in the art of managing and pushing forward the frontiers of management. I think Ryan just expects one of the biggest jobs in world football to drop in his lap, having risked very little in terms of showing what he can do. So far as I can see, he will be a disaster.

Certainly, whilst he has done well to earn his badges (I'm sure he is the only one to do so whilst still playing but then he played till he was forty) I don't think he has done enough to expose himself to different football cultures and tactics to stand a chance of succeeding in his first try. You read abour Guardiola travelling to Mexico, Chile etc just to quench his hunger for football knowledge, how he spent 14 hours speaking with Biesla on the eve of his Barca appointment and after his success with Barca how he left them to go to Germany - all these signify a man's quest to be the best he can be and he has pushed managerial boundaries into new horizons. It's hard not to feel underwhelmed with Giggs' preparation, if one can call it that, when staked up against the man many use as a posterboy for inexperienced managers.

 

[B20]

Liverpool screwed up giving the job to Graeme Souness and hoping he'd carry on the legacy. He then sold all their players, changed shit around and the rest is history.

To bring back to thread, giving the job to Giggs is the equivalent of giving the job to Souness. Both very successful players in very succesful teams and both extremely limited in managerial experience. fecking risky all round.

Souness had managed rangers for five years before he managed us. If anything, he was a break with the boot room tradition. He hadn't been at the club for seven years when he came back.


Giggs big problem is that you don't get any sense of him having a drive to be a successful manager. He only wants to be successful as "Manager of Manchester United."

 

[Xaviesta]

I get the sense that Giggs wants to be a manager but doesn't have the self belief that he'd succeed away from United. I'm sure the Swansea job would be his if he wants it. @B20 i agree with your last sentence.

 

[Jazz]

Souness had managed rangers for five years before he managed us. If anything, he was a break with the boot room tradition. He hadn't been at the club for seven years when he came back.


Giggs big problem is that you don't get any sense of him having a drive to be a successful manager. He only wants to be successful as "Manager of Manchester United."

That's exactly right. We should worry that he doesn't want to come out of his comfort zone. The manager of United needs to be bold and not afraid of challenges. If he gets this job and a miracle doesn't occur where he'll do well - then he will regret it for the rest of his life because I can't see him having the tools to deal with the fall out from any failure. Him, nor the people around him don't even have the foresight to at least anticipate that failure would absolutely ruin him. It's astonishing.
Then of course, the club will be left picking up the very expensive pieces from any failure on his part. Absolute risk you don't need to take. Amazing audacity from the club hierarchy if they go with him

 

[Xaviesta]

I know Giggs hasn't managed a reserve team or a "B" team, but you could insert inexperienced and the point would be valid.

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