Messi v Ronaldo | Contains double your daily salt allowance

[Vialli_92]

It's weird that Ronaldo is so far from being unplayable yet so often makes the difference, game after game, season after season. Perhaps your definition of being unplayable is a little narrow?

Was he really that great tonight?

He didn't get me off my chair or make me go wow.

Messi does that consistently and makes plays happen that you can't believe.

That's the level Ronaldo is being compared to and he's simply not there.

He doesn't have the talent so he won't ever be at that level.

He's been comfortably the second best player in that time but you can't compare him with Messi as there is no competition

 

[manutd619]

Messi brigade out in full force tonight, I blame Phil Neville for inciting it on the bbc sport updates

 

[Peyroteo]

Messi is unplayable and brings things to the game that Ronaldo simply can't.

Ronaldo is unplayable and brings things to the game that Messi can't.

Both are true

 

[Zen]

I'd say it's more or less Ronaldo's - who do you give it too if Juventus/Monaco win? You CAN at worst at least thank him and Messi for at least not meaning you do win by showing up for one game or mostly big occasions at the moment. You just can't give it to anyone over either this year, but Real would have to implode on both fronts for Messi to nick it.

As much as I don't see him being the most key to their league/overall season, he's clearly been the most key to them now being in this position, at the key time of the year. It's deserved, 3 knockout stage games.....3 knockout performances from him.

 

[Vialli_92]

Ronaldo is unplayable and brings things to the game that Messi can't.

Both are true

Yes but one is a significantly better player than the other.

 

[RedRevongge]

Was he really that great tonight?

He didn't get me off my chair or make me go wow.

Messi does that consistently and makes plays happen that you can't believe.

That's the level Ronaldo is being compared to and he's simply not there.

He doesn't have the talent so he won't ever be at that level.

He's been comfortably the second best player in that time but you can't compare him with Messi as there is no competition

Tonight he was bloody brilliant. Scored a hat trick, was a constant nuisance for the defence. Really was a dominant performance. Even if you think Messi is better it would be wrong to suggest he wasn't great tonight. Especially since it was a CL semi final against a very good, local rival

 

[Brwned]

Was he really that great tonight?

He didn't get me off my chair or make me go wow.

Messi does that consistently and makes plays happen that you can't believe.

That's the level Ronaldo is being compared to and he's simply not there.

He doesn't have the talent so he won't ever be at that level.

He's been comfortably the second best player in that time but you can't compare him with Messi as there is no competition

How often a player makes you go wow doesn't really correlate to how influential, decisive or unplayable he is. It just correlates to your enjoyment of the game. Laurent Robert had quite a lot of wow moments but was a crap player. If Messi did less things that made you go wow and more of this boring stuff, they'd be the ones in pole position to win the biggest trophy in the world for the third time in 4 years. That's demonstrably more valuable.

 

[Rado_N]

Messi brigade out in full force tonight, I blame Phil Neville for inciting it on the bbc sport updates

It's an inferiority thing.

 

[Peyroteo]

Yes but one is a significantly better player than the other.

Messi is better on the ball than Ronaldo but there are more things to football than that. Prefering one or the other is one thing, saying one is significantly better than the other is just not true

 

[Revan]

He may be remembered as the fourth best ever, time will tell.

As for the rest, absolutely not for me - there's a limit to how far goalscoring feats will take him. The idea that Ronaldo is greater than Maradona is ridiculous.

I see no possible scenario when Ronaldo will be rated as lower than in fourth place. Especially when he will be compared with guys who no-one saw them playing.

I'll quite confidently assert that Ronaldo will never be deemed the greatest player ever.

For arguments sake - if he was then I'd find that both sad and a poor advertisement for the sport. The greatest in any sport has to have brought more to the table than Ronaldo has...much more.

He is already the most popular footballer in the world, and the kids who grew up watching him will have an opinion. Those who didn't see him play, will read about him and look his highlights, both looking fantastic. It will all be part of the legend of Ronaldo. And his story is fantastic.

Lets be fair, Pele is very close to an unanimous choice for the GOAT (or was, until Messi came around) despite that the 99.99% of people who have him as No.1 have never seen him play bar a couple of matches in World Cups (at best) and his career highlights. Even in Maradona, only Italians have seen him play week after week. Most people have them as high based on their story.

Ronaldo's (and Messi's of course) story will be just as good, and Pele will be 'a long time ago'. There is no doubt in my mind that both of them have a good shot at being remembered as the GOAT of the sport. While Messi has been the better player, Ronaldo has the advantage of having done it with 2 clubs and his national team. I don't think that Messi should leave Barca to make happy people in internet forums, but really, doing it outside of him comfort zone looks better in the story.

 

[wr8_utd]

Hypothetical and will never happen, but if Messi were to sign for Madrid/ Ronaldo to sign for Barca, would the fans turn on them?

Messi would love it probably in terms of performances. Madrid' have a complete and perfect team and he'd score and assist bucketloads. Ronaldo would struggle a bit in the current Barca team. Only Neymar has any sort of creativity other than Messi.

 

[wr8_utd]

Tonight he was bloody brilliant. Scored a hat trick, was a constant nuisance for the defence. Really was a dominant performance. Even if you think Messi is better it would be wrong to suggest he wasn't great tonight. Especially since it was a CL semi final against a very good, local rival

I really dislike Ronaldo but it's hard to argue against this. A lot of the times when he scores, he's pretty absent through the game but today he was great all around.

 

[Revan]

Has Ronaldo been the better player though? Before these 3 games, he had 2 goals in the competition. Yes he's been the difference on the big stage but that doesn't make him the best player this season imo. It's the same way Kaka was never the best the year he won it just for his 4-5 great games in the CL.

Hmm, for all Messi's creativity, Ronaldo has 6 assists this season, compared to Messi's 2 assists. So, Ronaldo before these 3 matches, had 2 goals and 6 assists which put him in the second place in UCL when it comes to assists.

And of course, matches in the final stages of competition matter more than those before. Messi was part of a team that suffered two heavy defeats, being very anonymous in all those matches. Neymar saved his (and Barca's arse) in the 1/8th of finals, and they failed again in the quarters, while Ronaldo scores hat tricks for fun against Bayern and Atletico.

And it isn't that Ronaldo is having a bad season outside of UCL. He is still the best player and the top goalscorer of the team who most likely is going to beat Barca when it comes to La Liga title.

 

[Zen]

It's testament to what Messi does in an overall performance that people seemingly see tonight as some kind of ordinary 6/10 performance, or well are completely writing it off, it's also testament to Ronaldo himself that you see this as routine. When while it wasn't an all-playmaking all-goalscoring display, it was still the perfect predatory performance 10/10, no doubt. Flawless. Nothing he can do about "offsides" except finish it and let the officials decide if it's no go.

 

[Vialli_92]

How often a player makes you go wow doesn't really correlate to how influential, decisive or unplayable he is. It just correlates to your enjoyment of the game. Laurent Robert had quite a lot of wow moments but was a crap player. If Messi did less things that made you go wow and more of this boring stuff, they'd be the ones in pole position to win the biggest trophy in the world for the third time in 4 years. That's demonstrably more valuable.

I've watched both and Messi is comfortably the better player.

Ronaldo did play well tonight but it's not close to the level Messi plays at.

Messi just plays a different game to Ronaldo that he wouldn't be able to match.

If Real were having a hard game and struggling to create and Ronaldo was the one to get the goals out of no where I would give him more credit.

When comparing him to Messi getting on the end of a few chances isn't enough to say he's on his level.

 

[Revan]

Messi would love it probably in terms of performances. Madrid' have a complete and perfect team and he'd score and assist bucketloads. Ronaldo would struggle a bit in the current Barca team. Only Neymar has any sort of creativity other than Messi.

It is quite amazing how people see things totally differently.

For what is worth, I think that most likely it will be the other way around. Ronaldo with his incredible movements would find spaces to score a shitload of goals, especially with Neymar and Suarez creating havoc in defense. Messi, really hasn't ever shown to be able to shine that much outside of Barca. He is incredible though, so he would find the way.

Would love it to happen. And if Real would fail, would love to see Messi fans claim that playing with Benzema, Bale and Modric isn't very suited to him. I mean, people argued that Messi would have done better if he played with Postiga and Almeida instead of Aguero and Higuain.

 

[wr8_utd]

Hmm, for all Messi's creativity, Ronaldo has 6 assists this season, compared to Messi's 2 assists. So, Ronaldo before these 3 matches, had 2 goals and 6 assists which put him in the second place in UCL when it comes to assists.

And of course, matches in the final stages of competition matter more than those before. Messi was part of a team that suffered two heavy defeats, being very anonymous in all those matches. Neymar saved his (and Barca's arse) in the 1/8th of finals, and they failed again in the quarters, while Ronaldo scores hat tricks for fun against Bayern and Atletico.

And it isn't that Ronaldo is having a bad season outside of UCL. He is still the best player and the top goalscorer of the team who most likely is going to beat Barca when it comes to La Liga title.

The latter yes but the former? Every time I watch Madrid play, Marcelo, Kroos and Modric seem their best players.

 

[TheNewEra]

Today just reaffirms the belief.

Ronaldo - The greatest goalscorer of all time.

Messi - The greatest football er of all time.

Luckily it's a team sport and not an individual one.

 

[wr8_utd]

It is quite amazing how people see things totally differently.

For what is worth, I think that most likely it will be the other way around. Ronaldo with his incredible movements would find spaces to score a shitload of goals, especially with Neymar and Suarez creating havoc in defense. Messi, really hasn't ever shown to be able to shine that much outside of Barca. He is incredible though, so he would find the way.

Would love it to happen. And if Real would fail, would love to see Messi fans claim that playing with Benzema, Bale and Modric isn't very suited to him. I mean, people argued that Messi would have done better if he played with Postiga and Almeida instead of Aguero and Higuain.

Suzrez really doesn't imo. He's good to get on the end of chances but his overall play has really fallen at Barca. All of Barca's good play and attack still comes from Messi and he carries them. Barca with Madrid's midfield would be unstoppable.

 

[Revan]

The latter yes but the former? Every time I watch Madrid play, Marcelo, Kroos and Modric seem their best players.

He wins too many matches with his goals. A lot of matches when his goals are decisive.

Saying that, it has been closer than the other seasons when the difference was bigger. But to be fair, with neither Benzema nor Bale being that good this season, Ronaldo has been carrying them in attack. To his fortune, the midfield and defense of Madrid has been the best I remember.

 

[VorZakone]

Midfield is everything when you want to win trophies. Messi profited from peak Xavi-Iniesta-Busquets and now Ronaldo profits from Kroos-Casemiro-Modric. Pound for pound Messi is clearly the better player. Messi is almost 3 years younger yet he has an equal amount of CL's at the moment and more league titles.

 

[Vialli_92]

The latter yes but the former? Every time I watch Madrid play, Marcelo, Kroos and Modric seem their best players.

Yes they are all playing on a similar level.

Ronaldo is the one getting the goals so he's seen as the best and gets the headlines.

 

[wr8_utd]

He wins too many matches with his goals. A lot of matches when his goals are decisive.

Saying that, it has been closer than the other seasons when the difference was bigger. But to be fair, with neither Benzema nor Bale being that good this season, Ronaldo has been carrying them in attack. To his fortune, the midfield and defense of Madrid has been the best I remember.

I find the defense pretty average when it comes to defending really. This was their first clean sheet in 19 games But Carvajal, Ramos and especially Marcelo are absolutely incredible going forward. Then there's the world's best midfield ofcourse in Kroos and Modric.

 

[Arthur Friedenreich]

I think Messi is one of the best players in the history.
But i dont think he should NEVER win the balon d'or over Ronaldo for the simple reason that i watch ALL games of the South American wc qualifiers and playing here, where the other NT see you as an ENEMY, where the adversary players will not FIGHT FOR YOUR SHIRT after a game... where everybody will beat you, stomp you, say terrible things about your family, etc, in this context away from Barcelona(momy's home), he doesn't look like the "best of the world at all"..

In fact, after ALL round of the S.A qualifiers the argentinian media TRASH him for weeks.
In the S.A qualifiers Neymar, Coutinho, Alexis Sanchez, Vidal, Suarez and even Cavani are better than him.
Europeans will only count the footbal at club level of course.

Club-level-player. Won nothing with Argentina even in the years when Brazil was "out of the business".
Scored almost THREE TIMES less goals by minutes played than Neymar in World Cups

Cristiano Ronaldo is superior.

 

[Revan]

I find the defense pretty average when it comes to defending really. This was their first clean sheet in 19 games But Carvajal, Ramos and especially Marcelo are absolutely incredible going forward. Then there's the world's best midfield ofcourse in Kroos and Modric.

Yep, defense as in defending aren't that special, but they are so damn good in attack. If that makes sense.

 

[Brwned]

I've watched both and Messi is comfortably the better player.

Ronaldo did play well tonight but it's not close to the level Messi plays at.

Messi just plays a different game to Ronaldo that he wouldn't be able to match.

If Real were having a hard game and struggling to create and Ronaldo was the one to get the goals out of no where I would give him more credit.

When comparing him to Messi getting on the end of a few chances isn't enough to say he's on his level.

How many games has Messi scored three goals out of nothing, in a game where his team struggled to create chances, never mind in a game as important as the UCL semi? It doesn't happen. UCL semis are tight affairs where contributions like Ronaldo's often decide the game. Ronaldo's done it more often than Messi now too. He's scored more in one night than Messi has in his entire career.

I think Messi's the better player but your argument falls apart on so many levels, to the point where your only real point is "Messi's better because I've seen him and I say so".

 

[broccoli]

You are absolutely making no sense. He scored all of Real's goals in the quarter finals and the semi finals so far apart from a grand total of one. Apparently that isn't the same as and/or is inferior to "carrying" the team or "getting them out of trouble." I've seen so much bad logic on the internet, but these threads contain some that are up there with the worst of them.

Fantastic. Spot on!

 

[RedRevongge]

I seriously think Ronaldo is the only player on the planet who can receive any form of negativity for his performance after scoring a hat trick in a Champion's League Semi Final

 

[Vialli_92]

How many games has Messi scored three goals out of nothing, in a game where his team struggled to create chances, never mind in a game as important as the UCL semi? It doesn't happen. UCL semis are tight affairs where contributions like Ronaldo's often decide the game. Ronaldo's done it more often than Messi now too. He's scored more in one night than Messi has in his entire career.

I think Messi's the better player but your argument falls apart on so many levels, to the point where your only real point is "Messi's better because I've seen him and I say so".

If you watch both players it's obvious to see. The clasico last week he dominated Real Madrid.

You can take his goals away and he was still the best player on the pitch.

He scored 2 against Bayern Munich 2 years ago when Barca couldn't break Bayern down.

He got 2 goals on his own without any help from his team he literally won his team that match all on his own

 

[Acheron]

I seriously think Ronaldo is the only player on the planet who can receive any form of negativity for his performance after scoring a hat trick in a Champion's League Semi Final

It's quite unbelievable how far people can go just because of their bias.

 

[Brwned]

If you watch both players it's obvious to see. The clasico last week he dominated Real Madrid.

You can take his goals away and he was still the best player on the pitch.

He scored 2 against Bayern Munich 2 years ago when Barca couldn't break Bayern down.

He got 2 goals on his own without any help from his team he literally won his team that match all on his own

Do you think you're making sense to anyone but yourself?

 

[Vialli_92]

Do you think you're making sense to anyone but yourself?

Where am I wrong with that statement?

 

[Utdstar01]

If you watch both players it's obvious to see. The clasico last week he dominated Real Madrid.

You can take his goals away and he was still the best player on the pitch.

He scored 2 against Bayern Munich 2 years ago when Barca couldn't break Bayern down.

He got 2 goals on his own without any help from his team he literally won his team that match all on his own

He's not disputing who the better player is. Ronaldo is and has been the more decisive player in the big games in recent years and Messi has been very inconsistent in that respect.

 

[Theonas]

Where am I wrong with that statement?

Nowhere. Goalscoring wise they both register more or less the same numbers which makes them freaks of nature as goalscorers and probably the best ever. But as you say, take away their goals and one is still one of the best playmakers ever whereas the other is a decent winger. That is why Messi is being talked about as the best ever whereas Ronaldo is being measured against Messi.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

I seriously think Ronaldo is the only player on the planet who can receive any form of negativity for his performance after scoring a hat trick in a Champion's League Semi Final

Yeah mind-boggling indeed.

 

[Revan]

He's not disputing who the better player is. Ronaldo is and has been the more decisive player in the big games in recent years and Messi has been very inconsistent in that respect.

The thing is, should being better in bigger matches should elevate a player above some player who is a better player but less influential in bigger matches?

Messi is still the greater player, but Ronaldo has made a massive gap (that was in 2012 or so) a marginal one IMO. And the more times Ronaldo gives performances like this the gaps gets smaller. Especially if Messi and Barca check out in earlier stages of the competitions.

 

[Vialli_92]

He's not disputing who the better player is. Ronaldo is and has been the more decisive player in the big games in recent years and Messi has been very inconsistent in that respect.

My whole point is Messi is a one man team when he's at his best.

Ronaldo can't do that. He has to have his team creating for him to have an impact

Messi can literally flick a switch and go into god mode where nobody can touch him.

Ronaldo can't play at that level and do it like Messi can.

If Messi wasn't around I would probably be saying Ronaldo is the best I ever seen and nobody comes close it's just Messi is that good he makes Ronaldo look ordinary at times

 

[Vialli_92]

The thing is, should being better in bigger matches should elevate a player above some player who is a better player but less influential in bigger matches?

Messi is still the greater player, but Ronaldo has made a massive gap (that was in 2012 or so) a marginal one IMO. And the more times Ronaldo gives performances like this the gaps gets smaller. Especially if Messi and Barca check out in earlier stages of the competitions.

Yeah Messi had the better team for his younger years and now Ronaldo has the better team in the latter stages of their careers.

Both players definitely need their teams to perform at the level they do but Ronaldo definitely has it much easier than Messi right now

 

[Peyroteo]

My whole point is Messi is a one man team when he's at his best.

Ronaldo can't do that. He has to have his team creating for him to have an impact

Messi can literally flick a switch and go into god mode where nobody can touch him.

Ronaldo can't play at that level and do it like Messi can.

If Messi wasn't around I would probably be saying Ronaldo is the best I ever seen and nobody comes close it's just Messi is that good he makes Ronaldo look ordinary at times

Messi creates chances for himself with the ball at his feet. Ronaldo does it with his movement. He has 71 goals in 138 games for Portugal with only 4 penalties. 56 of those were in official matches too. Where was the world class service? Any half decent player can create chances for a guy with this kind of movement. Today he was assisted by Casemiro, Benzema and Lucas Vasquez. He needs service of course but so does Messi. It's just that they operate in different areas. There isn't one correct way to play football

 

[RedRevongge]

I think we can at least all agree we are lucky to be able to watch both on a regular basis. Imagine if Pele and Maradona both hit their prime in the same era, this is what it is like with Messi and Ronaldo