That fight showed why everyone ducks Ortiz. Man is a beast.
The RedCafe Boxing Thread
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I believe it included the last round. Two bomb zquads weighed heavy on the judges.
You really have to throw logic and reason out the window when it comes to Wilder. It's all well and good stating he's an atrocious boxer in terms of technique and form, but the fact of the matter is he has a slingshot of unorthodox returns and he'll gladly get hit to exchange them. He can take a punch, but nobody, as of yet, has been able to take his.
Joshua's chin is always there to be hit, and that's the concern here - Wilder will gladly trade, but can Joshua handle that? Klitschko does not have the same kind of generative force from bizarre positions and stances, so it is not the same kind of issues with power.
Joshua will also tire before Wilder.
It's a really interesting clash, when/should they meet. Wilder is no boxer, yet he's a legitimate threat. It's the Fury's, who can evade all night, that will be the fighters Wilder has little chance against - anyone he can trade with, he will always have a big chance of winning against.
Joshua's chin is always there to be hit, and that's the concern here - Wilder will gladly trade, but can Joshua handle that? Klitschko does not have the same kind of generative force from bizarre positions and stances, so it is not the same kind of issues with power.
Joshua will also tire before Wilder.
It's a really interesting clash, when/should they meet. Wilder is no boxer, yet he's a legitimate threat. It's the Fury's, who can evade all night, that will be the fighters Wilder has little chance against - anyone he can trade with, he will always have a big chance of winning against.
Ortiz was shattered at the end. In redcafe age terms he's got one foot in the grave. Still managed to get in plenty of promising positions though and a Fury or a Joshua would be making a hell of a lot more of it. It's Wilders incredible power that makes it a fight.
Those last 4-5 rounds were fun as feck! Wilder has some fecking chin on em'
Wilder fights like a Super Punch Out character.
Yeah AJ is better per say, but it just seems like he'll get knocked out by Wilder when they meet.
MMA legend Brendan Schaub rates the Wilder fight as the greatest heavyweight fight of all time
Of course he is you cheeto fingered feck.
Any more bbbbrain busters my man?
I totally agree with you btw.
say what you want about Wilder, he is a danger to anyone.
Long reach, appears he has a better chin than some thought and most important of all a huge right hand.
I like him and hopes he wipes Joshua out, but in truth anything can happen when 2 big punchers go toe to toe.
As for Brook that was nothing fight just to get him back to winning ways, Khan seems like the only fight left for him.
Long reach, appears he has a better chin than some thought and most important of all a huge right hand.
I like him and hopes he wipes Joshua out, but in truth anything can happen when 2 big punchers go toe to toe.
As for Brook that was nothing fight just to get him back to winning ways, Khan seems like the only fight left for him.
the Judges had Wilder up by 1, all of them. They must have been drinking the same thing as Brendan Schaub.
Credit to him, went through the fire, just a shame Ortiz gassed. Someone is going to clip him if he keeps going in like that. You would think if he just took his time and picked his shots he’d wipe people out other than burning energy throwing wild inaccurate sloppy shots.
Filled out a bit scince this fight. Heavyweights tho. Any of them take a clean hit they’ll go to sleep. Certainly showed he can grind out a recovery but Ortiz should never have let him off.
Credit to him, went through the fire, just a shame Ortiz gassed. Someone is going to clip him if he keeps going in like that. You would think if he just took his time and picked his shots he’d wipe people out other than burning energy throwing wild inaccurate sloppy shots.
Filled out a bit scince this fight. Heavyweights tho. Any of them take a clean hit they’ll go to sleep. Certainly showed he can grind out a recovery but Ortiz should never have let him off.
I wasn’t impressed by wilder. Age won the fight not ability. He was completely out boxed. Fair play to him though for the resilience when he was rocked. He’s clearly a hard puncher and can throw a good shot out of nowhere but there wasn’t much to him beyond being gangly and unorthodox. I’m even more confident now that AJ will beat him as he’s similar to Ortiz who wilder clearly struggled to work out but is bigger, stronger, quicker and fitter. That said I’m still not convinced by AJ’s chin or recovery time after being wobbled and Wilder certainly has the power to wobble him.
A bit of context. Ortiz is a 38 year old fighter coming back from a layoff, and one whose only had six 12 round professional fights in his career.
Disagree with some of this.
AJ is a better boxer than Wilder. Wilder looks very limited bar his reach and powerful right. Genuinely looks to have little else in the locker. Yes, he's now has his chin tested but let's be honest he was out on his feet against Ortiz and might as well have been knocked down. He was lit up and up until the stoppage (despite the bizarre score) was losing the fight by 3 rounds.
AJ has had his heart and chin tested and came through. Watching last night shows that Wilder is there to be hit himself and don't think AJ would have too much difficulty landing.
Also don't understand the criticism of AJs engine and why you feel Wilder has the advantage here? I don't think a fight between these two goes the distance anyway.
In essence I think AJ is far more rounded with equal power. Wilder always has a chance with his very odd style and heavy hands but if AJ refuses to get involved in a gunslinging contest I think he wins pretty comfortably.
Wilder looks very beatable to me.
Be some fight Joshua vs Wilder.
Both got some power, obviously Joshua is more rounded, but Wilder punches from awkward angles and KO's look so brutal.
I'd have to go with Joshua, especially if goes later rounds but wouldn't surprise me seeing Wilder KO Joshua.
Think Wilder would beat Fury.
Both got some power, obviously Joshua is more rounded, but Wilder punches from awkward angles and KO's look so brutal.
I'd have to go with Joshua, especially if goes later rounds but wouldn't surprise me seeing Wilder KO Joshua.
Think Wilder would beat Fury.
You have to throw all conventional boxing analysis out the window with Wilder. He's patient enough to absorb the opposition and then just casually destroy him with a a flurry of wild punches. Not sure if that would work against AJ since he world class but this idea that one of them is clearly better is now gone. They are just two different world class fighters who bring an entirely different set of skillsets to to table.
Not for me, doubt he'd even land a punch on a fully fit Fury.
Honestly I’m just happy that prick Dirrell lost yesterday.
WRT the HWs, the Gypsy King will baptise both Joshua and Wilder.
WRT the HWs, the Gypsy King will baptise both Joshua and Wilder.
AJ will destroy Wilder.
I don't know man, I like Tyson Fury outside the ring/press conferences but I'm not the biggest fan of his boxing talents, even the Fury who beat Vlad, think that Fury would even struggle against Wilder and can't see the Tyson Fury who's coming back being better than the Tyson Fury who beat Vlad.
Would never happen but think Haye vs Wilder would be a good fight.
AJ even gets tagged by shots he sees coming Wilder's completely bizarre and unorthodox winging punches are going to land at some point - I think that's inevitable. I also think Wilder punches harder and certainly harder than Klitschko so I wouldn't use that as a gauge for punch resistance against faster, harder and dangerously unsighted shots.
AJ has better form behind the jab but it's that same jab that keeps him in range and Wilder will gladly trade beings as he can generate obscene power from angles that make no sense. He really is a terrible boxer, but it doesn't matter if he can connect, which he can on AJ, imo.
It's Fury who would make him look like a joke as I don't think he could set up anything on a fundamentally better and far more elusive boxer.
About gassing. AJ always gasses if he fights in volume. At the weight he is and with the muscle he has the likelihood of a much lighter and looser man with that kind of power draining him is high.
Having said all that my thing with this fight is who can take the most punishment will win. They're both there to be hit but it's the punches you don't see that will do the most damage and unfortunately, that's Wilder's forte.
I don't think Wilder would get near him. He's got more chance against Joshua, as he's more likely to land that bomb of a right.
Wilder has more power, stamina and recovers quicker from being hurt. Joshua has better boxing skills. Really, you should pick skills over the athlete.
Full Fight
He'd get schooled. Wouldn't have the reach advantage either which he has over most heavyweights.
I think that would be a good fight as well - both in terms of matchups and hype, since both have big mouths. I think Wilder would win in the end as I just don't see Fury rolling back the clock to 3 years ago, especially after no having fought for that long.
Yeah, I think that's being overlooked a lot. Fury is a fantastic boxer but we're talking about coming back to the absolute highest level of a sport after such a long time. You can't take that for granted. Especially not with Fury, given his self-admitted (and supported by photo evidence) horrible physical shape during that layoff. I don't think he's ever coming back to his old level.
Wasn't that impressed by Wilder TBH.
Ortiz was winning that fight until he gassed trying to finish him off.
Fair play Wilder has a good chin, he recovered pretty fast, but if that's AJ hitting him in that situation he's going down, period.
If AJ beats Parker it really is the next logical fight. It'll break records that's for sure.
I think his unorthodox style and speed will give AJ a bit to think about, but he can definitely beat him.
Ortiz was winning that fight until he gassed trying to finish him off.
Fair play Wilder has a good chin, he recovered pretty fast, but if that's AJ hitting him in that situation he's going down, period.
If AJ beats Parker it really is the next logical fight. It'll break records that's for sure.
I think his unorthodox style and speed will give AJ a bit to think about, but he can definitely beat him.
That was Wilder's strategy. A bit risky for him and somewhat boring for the fans, but it generally works.
Ah, boxing politics. A great reminder of why I can't be bothered with the sport nowadays. Seems to have somehow got even worse in recent years, although maybe I'm just getting more cynical.
I dont mind the politics - sometimes it even helps hype up the fights. And its still better than having the likes of Dana White do the same thing in the UFC.
But isn't that the literal thing with Wilder? Who is ever impressed by him? He's a terrible boxer who does so many things wrong in all of his fights. Swings for the fences; finds himself off balance and woefully off-line; constantly picks the poorer option when setting up his punches and so and so forth, but none of it matters - the speed, power and angles of his random swings make him lethal unless the opponent is simply not there to be hit.
How often does a fighter come along where nothing he does makes sense yet it's effective time and again? I was going to say he is similar to Naseem Hamed, but he really isn't given Hamed had total control and intent with what he did and didn't take a shot to land one.
I still don't see how a fight between Joshua and Wilder doesn't come down to who can take the punch of the other and remain standing.
Anyone watching the Indongo fight this Friday night? Got blasted out by Crawford, but still a decent fighter.
For me, neither are going to be able to take the punches of the other. They are the two hardest hitting heavyweights in the division. It's simply a case of who is able to land their big shots first and for that reason alone, I'd favour AJ because he's the better boxer.
It took Wilder till round 5 to land a decent shot on Ortiz and he took quite a lot of decent shots himself before then. If that happened against AJ, he wouldn't see round 5. That's not to say you could ever write him off. It's the punchers chance and AJ is hittable.
The [main] problem I have with Joshua is he doesn't move his head, at all. In every fight against a boxer with some pedigree to them, he gets hit, and it's for the good graces of not fighting a truly ferocious puncher, he hasn't been in more bother than vs. Klitschko. Joshua's own size and power generally means he'll win through, but that's seriously risky stuff.
I think Wilder is the harder puncher with his wild, winging shots and he also has the reach advantage. I can't help but think he'll land something that logically he shouldn't be able to and then he'll pounce.
re. the rounds and Ortiz. Ortiz is harder to hit than Joshua, he actually started getting tagged as he tired. The problem here is, unless you've got a natural mover like a Fury, Wilder is always going to have his moments and unless there's a sizable speed or reflex advantage (which A.J. doesn't have) he is going to land.
I'd like Joshua to win if they do step in the ring, but the nagging voice in my head says he's going to get caught and I think he has less punch resistance of the two of them, and definitely less stamina. I really hope I'm wrong, but the middle rounds are where I'd expect the fight to turn and Joshua to gas.
It was an obvious strategy from Wilder to approach the fight by allowing Ortiz to gas before going to work on him. He obviously wouldn't do that with most other fighters. If he fights Joshua, then they will start slugging it out early imo.