Ah yes, that £75m we spent on a striker because of a career ending Injury to Zlatan.
Can you imagine City's spending if Aguero got a 1-year injury...would they even win the title without Aguero? Very difficult to replace a player of that quality.
Pep on MNF special
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In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
Can you imagine City's spending if Aguero got a 1-year injury...would they even win the title without Aguero? Very difficult to replace a player of that quality.
City's most expensive transfer under Pep was under £60m, so I don't know what he would or wouldn't do in the same case.
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City had a way more established squad full of quality from money spent over many years. United were a mess when Jose arrived.
Why didn't Mourinho nurture Martial or Rashford to do the job Ibrahimovic did? You see, You can throw the same argument back too.
Thread is an accident waiting to happen.
Think his biggest achievement was getting unreal performances out of the likes of Otamendi, Fernandinho, Sterling and Sane.
So many of his players especially the ones that are nothing special, had the best season of their careers.
Think his biggest achievement was getting unreal performances out of the likes of Otamendi, Fernandinho, Sterling and Sane.
So many of his players especially the ones that are nothing special, had the best season of their careers.
I haven't watched any of the title celebrations either, so a few pics and that on twitter but I'm really not bothered with all that gumph.
The squad was old, he had to replace them and he did, I think in 2 or 3 season time United may have to do the same if they don't do it in the next 2 windows it'll be a huge mistake, likes of Fellaini, Sanchez, Mata, Young, Matic, Valencia will be 30+ in a season or so.
Be interesting to see how many players we sign, he said one or two, I still think we'll sign 4 or 5 but maybe 2 or 3 of those will be straight of to Girona if they're 19-20ish.
The squad was old, he had to replace them and he did, I think in 2 or 3 season time United may have to do the same if they don't do it in the next 2 windows it'll be a huge mistake, likes of Fellaini, Sanchez, Mata, Young, Matic, Valencia will be 30+ in a season or so.
Be interesting to see how many players we sign, he said one or two, I still think we'll sign 4 or 5 but maybe 2 or 3 of those will be straight of to Girona if they're 19-20ish.
Great watch. Innovator in football. Love his style he asserts on football matches, the way his team play. Absolute breathe of fresh air in the Premier League
City were a mess too. Ageing full backs all 4 of which were in their 30s. An injury prone Kompany, a ridiculed by many Otamendi, Mangala and a departed Demichelis in defence.
City had a core in 15-16 to build from but so did United
In 2 or 3 seasons, City will have players in 30s too.
Bravo, Walker, Kompany, Gundogan, Aguero, Delph, David Silva, Fernandinho, Otamendi, Yaya Toure will all be 30 or 30 plus in 2-3 years.
He really is a genius. He develops talent by erm deciding they aren't good enough and spending fortunes on the best available in the world... in every position required....on top of an already hugely expensive and talented squad.
I particularly like the way he developed Hart and did such a good job he thought he'd do it again with Bravo and did such a good job that he had to do it again with Ederson.
I really don't understand the pep love fest. There is a common Pep theme
A) Get a team with best players in the world
B) if not best, buy best
C) Have such a dominantly strong team that any tactics would work due to the exponential benefit of having so much quality in every position
D) Take plaudits for 'tactical' genius.
Pep is a good manager, but its impossible to say any more than that because any manager with his level of spending could potentially achieve similar things.
In fact if anything he is a poor manager for doing so badly in Europe with such a well funded team.
I particularly like the way he developed Hart and did such a good job he thought he'd do it again with Bravo and did such a good job that he had to do it again with Ederson.
I really don't understand the pep love fest. There is a common Pep theme
A) Get a team with best players in the world
B) if not best, buy best
C) Have such a dominantly strong team that any tactics would work due to the exponential benefit of having so much quality in every position
D) Take plaudits for 'tactical' genius.
Pep is a good manager, but its impossible to say any more than that because any manager with his level of spending could potentially achieve similar things.
In fact if anything he is a poor manager for doing so badly in Europe with such a well funded team.
If I had a team of the great players and wanted to win I'd give it to Pep, if I had a team of crap players and wanted to win I'd give it to Jose. Both would be successful with them, now it's your choice as to who is the better manager; both are better than the other in specific circumstances.
Except that most of the players he bought were under the age of 25? Far from established super stars?
Really irrelevant, since the point was that without freak injuries the gap in spending would either be bigger or the gap in quality would be smaller due to spending on other areas. Zlatan and Rojo were important players (especially Zlatan).
Matic was the only outright improvement to the squad, the other 2 were forced replacements due to injury. On the other hand, City had Ederson, Walker, Silva and Danilo (you can discount Mendy since he got a freak injury and Laporte was a January signing).
That's £40m vs. £150m of players to improve the squad.
Are you a simpleton? Rashford and Martial to play the same role as Zlatan, 99% of players can't play like Zlatan does, forget about two players that have never scored over 20 goals in their career.Martial and Rashford are years away from being top players, and will most likely never reach the level of Zlatan.
They will, but our first XI in 4 windows time without anyone over 30 and not replacing any of those above we could realistically line up
Ederson
Walker, Stones, Laporte, Mendy
Danilo
Sterling, Silva, KDB, Sane
Jesus
that 11 would make Walker the oldest at 29. What out of interest would United's look like?
Unbelievable. The Pep worship which is going on in here is sickening.
You have Pep who could possibly have joined us, but preferred MCFC - our closest rivals. Fair enough - that was his choice.
Then you have Jose who genuinely wanted to join us, for quite some time. We even went and hired Moyes, over Jose, instead. But years later, Jose did arrive.
And some of you are pining for Pep. WTF!!!
Perhaps I come from a different generation, but football is tribal and pining over your rivals' players/manager is a major no-no.
Support your own club, guys.
You have Pep who could possibly have joined us, but preferred MCFC - our closest rivals. Fair enough - that was his choice.
Then you have Jose who genuinely wanted to join us, for quite some time. We even went and hired Moyes, over Jose, instead. But years later, Jose did arrive.
And some of you are pining for Pep. WTF!!!
Perhaps I come from a different generation, but football is tribal and pining over your rivals' players/manager is a major no-no.
Support your own club, guys.
Which of Pep signings would you have considered the best?
Zabaleta, Clichy, Sagna, Navas all out of contract and past the point of retraining. Needed replacing.
Kolarov 1 year left on contract and wanted to leave.
How do you fit Poch's and Klopp's performances into that logic? United's spending dwarfs theirs much more than City does United's.
When talking about competition a lot of people can't stress finances enough when talking about City, but completely forget them when talking about the other two.
Pep inherited among those you mentioned...
Sterling (£49m)
Aguero (£35m, but worth over £100m when he arrived)
De Bruyne (£54.5m, but again maybe £100m+)
Delph (bargain £8m, but solid squad player)
Silva (£24m and at 32 on arrival maybe aging, but still world class)
Toure (£24m, again at 35 hard too say much value, but still solid winning experience)
Fernandinho (£30m, again at 33 he is aging, but quality player). 4th highest appearances in 17-18
Otamendi (£33m, 5th highest appearances this year and 7th in 15-16 so has always been a solid option)
So that's a serious core of talent. A world class striker, two world class midfielders. Experienced winners. And even the defence was not shoddy.
Compare that to what Jose has had to work with.
your autocorrect on your phone is great, i get people for pep but what the heck is cibsidcons?
Any video please??
If you are going with playing young players (and out of position too) then
De Gea
Darmian Lindelof Bailly Shaw
Herrera Matic Pogba
Lingard Lukaku Rashford/Martial
Very poor RB and oldest is Matic
Doing my head in.your autocorrect on your phone is great, i get people for pep but what the heck is cibsidcons?
but everyone laughed when we signed Sterling, everyone said Silva, Aguero, Kompany, Yaya were in decline, people laughed at Otamendi saying he was too rash and was shite (he still is 2 rash tbf) then add in Navas, Clichy, Zaba, Sagna, Kolarov, Fernando who all had to be replaced. It emphasises my point above, either Jose will have to do this or your next manager will, in 4 or 5 windows you're looking at an ageing squad.
I love Pep's football but as a person...let's just say if we were playing Super Mario World and, as Mario because I have to represent my boy Luigi, he ran out of lives, I don't think I'd give him any of mine to allow him to continue. I'm sorry but I just don't think I would.
Best available or put another way minimum 7-8/10 players in every position.
that wasn't my point, my point is you're going to have an old squad with all the 28 year olds on your books now, it's not an old squad now but in a few windows it will be and they'll need replacing. Would you be happy with that lineup in 2 season time? 3 of them will be 30+ out of that 11. If Jose doesn't do it your next manager will need to do it.
I feel the thread will now be about Pep and Jose. Why cant people who havent watched it just let the thread go?
I wanted the discussion to be about the show and things discussed in the show.
I wanted the discussion to be about the show and things discussed in the show.
Obviously there will be signings and replacements.
anyway I enjoyed the programme, it's a shame they can't do it for each manager, would be really interesting to see Jose, Klopp, Ponch and then the likes of Houghton, Wagner, Rafa explain their tactics and what they want to get out of the squad of players.
I don't doubt there was work to do. The point is the core which is the most important and arguably expensive part was already well covered. The new buys also meant those being replaced were well experienced and quality players.
Jose may as well have been starting from scratch. Yes players like Smalling/ Jones/ Mata have experience and can do a job, but they are not at any of City players level.
The only players Mourinho inherited that were a top standard were De Gea and maybe you could say the limited but industrial Valencia.
Martial is worth noting as a young and high cost talent equivalent to inheriting Sterling.
Herrera is half as good as Silva/ De Bruyne.
Yes you have to say there shouldn't be a 20 points difference and where the points were lost shows a mentality issue that is arguably Jose's fault, but some of that comes from a plague spread by Moyes and LVG that needs to be sorted.
totally agree, but my point was if I was Jose, I'd be getting rid of most the squad players that won't feature in say two season time, Fellaini, Young, Mata, Herrera, Blind, Darmian and replace them this window with 4 or 5 22-25 year olds and one experienced player, say Alderwiereld who would be an excellent signing
This .
It's become the same with Messi and Ronaldo. Thread is ruined and I wish the mods would do something about it.
I thought this thread was going to be a tactical discussion but some had to ruin it.
It's relative to United though, we've spent £260m net since Pep/Mourinho took over (vs £370m for you), and £160m of that was signing Pogba and Lukaku.
You on the other hand had De Bruyne and Aguero already there for the same positions, too equally class players. Add on top of that David Silva, and Raheem Sterling (who I thought was one of your best players under Pep's first season where he came in for flack) and you had a far better midfield and attack from the same point at the end of 15/16. Pep does deserve credit though for shoring up your aging and poor defence and bring Sane in.
Sorry I didn't watch the show and very fair point. I'm sure it was interesting hearing about his tactical prowess....in the transfer market with a massive pot of cash!
I can't believe this thread is also turning to Jose v Pep thread. Just stop it ! Don't you people get bored of repeating the same opinions again and again and again ?
I agree. Think this summarizes the two as succinctly and accurately as you could.
Got me thinking..when was the last time you heard about one of our players staying late to improve something whether tactics or dead ball?
Sinc Pep and Mourinho arrived the spending is.
Pep £477m
Mou £313m
Not to mention City already had a better team. Zlatan got a bad injury so we had to replace our main striker.
People who talk about them both spending the same money are either ignorant on purpose or stupid enough to not understand the scenario.
Pep £477m
Mou £313m
Not to mention City already had a better team. Zlatan got a bad injury so we had to replace our main striker.
People who talk about them both spending the same money are either ignorant on purpose or stupid enough to not understand the scenario.
to be fair he mentioned that and said lots of what was achieved couldn't be achieved without that