Yeah I'm thinking new Andrei Kanchelskis rather than new Jairzinho.People need to temper their expectations.
What are our expectations? Makes the rightwing his own? 10 goals + assists? Is a useful option from the bench?People need to temper their expectations.
I never thought I would read Valencia and the phrase "pin-point crosses" in the same sentence. Just because some of his crosses hit the mark doesn't mean he was a good crosser of the ball. His trademark cross, after all, is a low, hard cross and hope for the best.Valencia the winger had Rooney on the receiving ends of his pin-point crosses (How I have missed that)... I'm not sure if the winger Valencia would be that impressive it it was Lukaku at the end of his crosses.
Yeah, I gave the benefit of doubt after some big game performances, but last season’s form should really result in a sale. He is a local lad though, so as backup he’s alright. No wonder we’re excited about a potential danger from our right hand side!Haha look at me I'm a top red, cracks me up. Yeah mate he is a complete bell and if he done it on the pitch (Pogba to a degree I guess although needs to do so much more) you kind of put up with it but the fact he is just a terrible football player as well as a tool of it, get him sold haha.
If I have to pay to watch him run around on the right for the next 12 months my eyes will be bleeding haha
You need to go back and watch 09/10 season. Valencia was actually a very good crosser that year, but after his ankle break he just never had the same finesse.I never thought I would read Valencia and the phrase "pin-point crosses" in the same sentence. Just because some of his crosses hit the mark doesn't mean he was a good crosser of the ball. His trademark cross, after all, is a low, hard cross and hope for the best.
It takes a rival fan to speak some sense which is normal as we will hype up any player linked with us. I always think "if Spurs Arsenal or Chelsea signed him, would I be concerned" answer is nope.Rarely, the whole 'tired legs' thing is overplayed by fans anyhow. It's 2019, professional players, fullbacks especially, are incredibly fit and capable of doing intense sprints up to the 90th minute of most games.
Obviously fresh legs helps and is a bonus, but he's not going to suddenly be murdering a fullback just because he's come on late, or all PL clubs would be utilising that tactic all of the time. And the quality on the end of his runs has to be questioned considering his pretty average output at championship level, where I'm going to say the athleticism and ability of defenders is generally much lower. It's mostly just hope and the fact he's a new, exciting new signing driving these narratives, which I don't blame people for .. I've fallen victim to it myself at times with many players.
He's a talent but I'd really be surprised if he had any major impact first season, good time to bed him in/get some games in the cups and use him in a sub some games. He's a 21 year old coming from a lower league.
Wonder how many ManUtd fans were concerned when Liverpool signed Robertson, Mane, Salah, Firmino and few more players. It's not as simple as that.It takes a rival fan to speak some sense which is normal as we will hype up any player linked with us. I always think "if Spurs Arsenal or Chelsea signed him, would I be concerned" answer is nope.
Delli Alli did ok mind......
Odd thing to say, 11/12 was easily his best season.You need to go back and watch 09/10 season. Valencia was actually a very good crosser that year, but after his ankle break he just never had the same finesse.
True not immediately after when he came back, but the form soon dropped off and he never really recovered.Odd thing to say, 11/12 was easily his best season.
HmmHe'll be hot garbage.
All those players were very good in various top leagues. Perhaps you couldn't expect them to make the step up as strongly as they did (robertson especially) but they had proven class in top divisions. Signing from the lower leagues is a significantly bigger gamble. Doesn't mean that gamble won't pay off (like it did with Alli) but it's very much flipping a coin, because no scout can really know for sure whether a player will make that step up or shrink away from it. There have been many hugely talented youngsters impressing at championship level (Zaha was amazing, then needed years to get his career back on track when he stepped up) who then struggled. But equally, plenty of examples of players who are a roaring success, James Maddison for Norwich being a great example. My biggest concern about James is that he's already not super productive as a player, especially compared to others who have made the step up from championship level. Seems a bit on the hopeful side to think he's suddenly going to be more prolific at a higher level.Wonder how many ManUtd fans were concerned when Liverpool signed Robertson, Mane, Salah, Firmino and few more players. It's not as simple as that.
Lot of fans also worried when Chelsea signed Higuain and he was dud.
Well yeah, no one expected them to step up like they did and there were sure and safe transfers who ended up like worst transfers. I just don't agree with "whether I would have worried had some other club signed him" logic. There are so many players who caf thought were not good enough but ended up as very good players.All those players were very good in various top leagues. Perhaps you couldn't expect them to make the step up as strongly as they did (robertson especially) but they had proven class in top divisions. Signing from the lower leagues is a significantly bigger gamble. Doesn't mean that gamble won't pay off (like it did with Alli) but it's very much flipping a coin, because no scout can really know for sure whether a player will make that step up or shrink away from it. There have been many hugely talented youngsters impressing at championship level (Zaha was amazing, then needed years to get his career back on track when he stepped up) who then struggled. But equally, plenty of examples of players who are a roaring success, James Maddison for Norwich being a great example. My biggest concern about James is that he's already not super productive as a player, especially compared to others who have made the step up from championship level. Seems a bit on the hopeful side to think he's suddenly going to be more prolific at a higher level.
I never understood why people were worried about Higuain and was very vocal about it at the time. He was dogshit at A.C Milan and was clearly past his best as a player, coming to a more physical/energetic league was the last thing he needed, guaranteed flop from day one.
Yeah I find it worrying how many of our fans seem to think we have bought a ready made established player who will fit right in. IMO we have bought a young lad with all the attributes needed to nurture and develop, pace, skill, attitude, work ethic, good cross, has a goal in him.All those players were very good in various top leagues. Perhaps you couldn't expect them to make the step up as strongly as they did (robertson especially) but they had proven class in top divisions. Signing from the lower leagues is a significantly bigger gamble. Doesn't mean that gamble won't pay off (like it did with Alli) but it's very much flipping a coin, because no scout can really know for sure whether a player will make that step up or shrink away from it. There have been many hugely talented youngsters impressing at championship level (Zaha was amazing, then needed years to get his career back on track when he stepped up) who then struggled. But equally, plenty of examples of players who are a roaring success, James Maddison for Norwich being a great example. My biggest concern about James is that he's already not super productive as a player, especially compared to others who have made the step up from championship level. Seems a bit on the hopeful side to think he's suddenly going to be more prolific at a higher level.
I never understood why people were worried about Higuain and was very vocal about it at the time. He was dogshit at A.C Milan and was clearly past his best as a player, coming to a more physical/energetic league was the last thing he needed, guaranteed flop from day one.
Shaw and Depay had more chemistry than Shaw and Martial.Have Shaw and Martial ever been exciting on the left? They won’t have played that many games together, but should be at least 20 odd and I can’t remember being excited by them?
At his best, Valencia was really good at varying his crosses.I never thought I would read Valencia and the phrase "pin-point crosses" in the same sentence. Just because some of his crosses hit the mark doesn't mean he was a good crosser of the ball. His trademark cross, after all, is a low, hard cross and hope for the best.
Oh yeah, it shouldn't matter if other clubs are worried. It's whether or not you trust the scouts at United/have seen enough of him to make a judgement. Plenty of players get misjudged by rival fans.Well yeah, no one expected them to step up like they did and there were sure and safe transfers who ended up like worst transfers. I just don't agree with "whether I would have worried had some other club signed him" logic. There are so many players who caf thought were not good enough but ended up as very good players.
I don't have any problem with his productivity either. It was his first proper season.
I agree. Sometimes he would but the left shin of the full back, and then he would hit the right shin of the full back.At his best, Valencia was really good at varying his crosses.
And even the third leg, if he was feeling luckyI agree. Sometimes he would but the left shin of the full back, and then he would hit the right shin of the full back.
Well, if he makes the team play better, and subsequently other players become more productive, ai wouldn't worry too much about his productivity. You mentioned Firmino, but he isn't even that productive. However, he does make the team play better and brings other players into good positions. His work rate is a reason for that. James doesn't seem to lack workrate, unlike some of the other primadonnas.Oh yeah, it shouldn't matter if other clubs are worried. It's whether or not you trust the scouts at United/have seen enough of him to make a judgement. Plenty of players get misjudged by rival fans.
It's not an issue, it's just going to be a big ask for him to go for average winger productivity in the championship to really stepping up to the plate in the PL. The likelihood is he will need a settling in season as he develops and your fans shouldn't have weighty expectations of a 21 year old coming in from a lower league. I think the whole 'he's gunna come in immediately and replace Lingard' expectation from some is just a little naive.
I give Valencia a lot of credit. I think he was a true professional and always made the most of his talents. He definitely had phases of great play and the last I remember was our last PL title. I think RVP (most of the campaign), Nani (start of the campaign) and Valencia (last 2 months or so of campaign) were the most important players during phases of the season. So to say his ankle injury was the turning point is just not true. Anyway, he just has never been a consistent good crosser of the ball. To put this in perspective, compare his overall work of crosses with Beckham's.You need to go back and watch 09/10 season. Valencia was actually a very good crosser that year, but after his ankle break he just never had the same finesse.
09/10 it was like his right foot had a telepathic connection with Rooney. He used to do some lovely little dinked crosses if I remember correctly.You need to go back and watch 09/10 season. Valencia was actually a very good crosser that year, but after his ankle break he just never had the same finesse.
He showed more than Martial today.I really like him, I think he'll play a lot more than some people think.
He certainly puts pressure on Martial to perform on the left wing.
I think so too.He showed more than Martial today.
Martial was playing out of position as a striker today, hardly a fair comparisonHe showed more than Martial today.
Everybody has been shouting for him to be played through the middle though.Martial was playing out of position as a striker today, hardly a fair comparison
I haven't. He's always terrible as a striker. He's clearly a left winger. Rashford is our strikerEverybody has been shouting for him to be played through the middle though.
Fair enough then. So what you would say is don't play him down the middle.I haven't. He's always terrible as a striker. He's clearly a left winger. Rashford is our striker
Absolutely. People think because Martial is our best finisher (not counting Lukaku) that makes him an ideal striker but that's nonsense. The striker needs to do far more than simply shoot. They need to hold the ball up, play in others but most importantly they need to have excellent attacking movement and make great runs which is Martial's biggest weakness (and Rashford's biggest strength). Combine Rashford's movement with Martial's finishing and you'd have a perfect 25-30 goal a season centre forward. Martial is a fantastic dribbler and can create chances and goals when given time on the ball. Putting him in a position where he is crowded and given no time to do this is just dumb.Fair enough then. So what you would say is don't play him down the middle.
He's also nowhere near as talented as Martial which is pretty importantJames has a much higher work rate than Martial and better suits our ‘new’ pressing style. Thought he did ok today, made some great runs in behind and also tracked back and got some tackles in. Unfortunately, in the first half nearly all our play was through the left side with, surprisingly, Young playing some good balls into space for him. When he was switched to the right he got a little bit lost as nobody on that side had the vision to spot his runs.
Would like to see him in a team with Pogba who, I think, would really get him more involved.
Personally, I thought Martial was pretty crap today.He's also nowhere near as talented as Martial which is pretty important
So did I, that doesn't mean he's a pretty crap playerPersonally, I thought Martial was pretty crap today.
Higher workrate doesn’t quite cut it or Lingard would be world class. He might have more workrate but isnt half as good as martial. I’d like for us to focus more on his actual technical qualities which I’m still not sure of but it’s early days.James has a much higher work rate than Martial and better suits our ‘new’ pressing style. Thought he did ok today, made some great runs in behind and also tracked back and got some tackles in. Unfortunately, in the first half nearly all our play was through the left side with, surprisingly, Young playing some good balls into space for him. When he was switched to the right he got a little bit lost as nobody on that side had the vision to spot his runs.
Would like to see him in a team with Pogba who, I think, would really get him more involved.
No, neither do I, we just need to work out how best to use him. He’s not best suited to a high work rate system, but I agree we have to find a way to unlock his talent.So did I, that doesn't mean he's a pretty crap player