That's true, but then can be said for any Dem - it's more a general comment on the Republicans' attitudes to the Dems as a whole as opposed to any one Dem.
2020 US Elections | Biden certified as President | Dems control Congress
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Sounds like pie in the sky fanaticism to me. The Dems can't even agree on what their healthcare policy should be and don't have control over both houses of congress. So at the end of the day, it wouldn't matter who is elected since none of them can move policy (much less major policy like M4A) in the current political dynamics. There is a pretty decent chance that voting for Sanders would therefore only result in a meager improvement in the ACA - just as it would under Biden or Klobuchar or Buttigieg.
Fair point.
There is no indication the Dems wont keep the House against a Trump party. The Dems have a decent chance at flipping the Senate too.
Turnout is crucial of course.
If we have a decent candidate like Bernie or Warren its doable.
Warren is progressive, has actually done something in senate (unlike Bernie), and can unite her party. Which is why I believe she will win the primaries.
Again, at least a Sanders presidency would offer the possibility of further and more radical reform - a Biden presidency would essentially be a guaranteed continuation of what we have now.
She's not a particularly great orator though and there's a concern she'll not be particularly great at handling Trump's tit-for-tat approach when it comes to attacks as has been evidenced in the past. Certainly the second best option for Sanders though, I'd argue.
what a ridiculous post from someone who only offends.
Please look how you started your debate addressing me.
But the post you quoted is only offensive to you because you cannot back up what you say.
Agree that she is not a great orator, and that might be a problem. On the other hand, we don't know how much Right wing propaganda machine will harm Bernie when they will get fully concentrated on him and label him as a commie.
Are you Jill Stein? In that case, I apologise for calling you a moron.
Whether it offers a fleeting possibility or not, the reality is that you need certain things in order to move policy, which his election wouldn't provide for. The Dems would still be split on healthcare and various other big ticket issues and the Republicans would immediately entrench themselves to obstruct and vilify in preparation for the next mid terms, which they would likely win. We've seen similar movies with the same plot before. Just 12 years ago, Obama rode to power with an almost messianic fervor and wound up disappointing because you need congress to get things done (along with his own missteps of nothing aggressive in his first two years).
The right-wing propaganda machine will savage any Democrat though, and considering Warren is one of the most progressive candidates in the running they're likely to apply much of the same criticism to her as well. I'd imagine most people know of Bernie's policies by now, and yet in national polling he still does alright when he comes up against Trump. A proper campaign could turn sour but there's no evidence this is anymore likely than it is for Biden or Warren.
again a moronic post.
Sorry. That only deserved that reponse.
Critical thinking is not your strength.
I don't blame you. That is how your brain works.
But do step back from your hurt.
They'll do this irrespective of who's in office and irrespective of what policy proposals are on offer when it comes to anything remotely progressive. Irrespective of whether it's Biden, Sanders or Warren.
What I would be most worried about in a Bernie or Warren presidency is one where nothing happens because Congress blocks it all. Then the progressives would really get lambasted as not realistic with the added “told ya so” of a lame duck 4 years.
A good deal of importance is put on who is gonna be in the WH, and I get that... but it will all be for shit if the Senate stays red.
With all due respect Obama did not have the courage to fulfill his promise.
You’re not in a good mood today, please don’t take it out on others.
The main stumbling block is the Senate.
Warren has spoken of getting rid of the filibuster. Bernie has not.
But Bernie can do a lot via Executive action.
Bernie I believe is quite vulnerable though. Commie tag will hurt him, and they will show all day long him praising USSR in the eighties. Him also having done feck all in senate for 12 years will probably hurt him.
I don't think that current polls against some particular Dem vs Trump are super useful. Mostly cause at the moment Trump and his cronies aren't fully focused on anyone in particular. But when someone will win the primaries, they will target him.
Saying that, I believe that Bernie is more electable than Warren, though that is primarily cause he is a man.
EA’s won’t get done what you want done.
You’re doing it again.
These discussions may be over your head.
True.
But stacking the courts and using the Presidential pulpit can go a long way.
Probably is a factor. No doubt Trump will reserve some fairly sexist criticism for Warren if she's the nominee. Shouldn't be something to deter people from opting for her in the primaries if they feel she's the best choice, though.
It doesn't matter whether or not you think Obama didn't or Sandars does. The political conditions to move policy aren't there, which means a continuation of the status quo.
Again.You’re doing it again.
You do not understand much of what has been said. I'm not being insulting.
True, but that doesn't resolve the bit that the Dems don't have the political capital to deal with such a situation if they themselves are split on big policies like healthcare and beyond. In order to overcome a GOP blockade you have to be unified - and the Dems are anything but unified, so the likeliest scenario is that nothing happens other than what is possible through EO.
Any condition or situation can be changed.
Its people who determine this.
It starts a t grassroots level. Local and State governments.
EDIT:
It will take time.
Ok, then you can vote for people you support at the local level. But don't expect any of that to change anything at the national level over the next cycle.
To be fair here you are only able to see your side of things. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, change to the left needs to be gradual. You are not going to get Dems to suddenly embrace left wing policies, much as you might wish them to. Unless something drastic happens within the US in the next year or so of course.
https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/15368370601054894
https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/0031-9155/49/2/011/meta
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/30196934
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29884550
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/29709736
I could go on and on and on, there's loads.
It is fair to say that change will not happen immediately.
But you have to make a start.
Getting rid of the filibuster can be done next cycle. I am not sure if that is wise. It can come back to bite you.
You are simply wrong to speak of Left and Right.
Its policies that benefit everyone. It is about information. People don't understand.
Trump voters want the same thing anyone else does.
Good health Care for example. Decent paying jobs.
They were unified under Obama though and kept on losing congressional elections, followed by Clinton's 2016 defeat. Again, it's doesn't matter. The Dems need to play to their own prospective strengths instead of worrying about an obstructionist GOP who will thwart them either way.
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That was due to a tactical mistake Obama made, which allowed the Repubs to regroup during 2009-10 and launch an assault on the house. Had he been a bit more ruthless, he would've got a lot more done and the effects on 2010 would've been mitigated by some degree of accomplishment.
It’s not wrong to speak of left and right. They may be policies that benefit everyone but not everyone who votes thinks as you think. They have their own ideas of what benefits them and paying for someone else’s medical care is not a policy that is embraced by all. Far from it.
Frankly I’d vote for the village idiot if he was going to bring in Med for All but the US is a country where people focus on their money (what’s mine is mine) more than anywhere else in the world probably. They can’t get their heads around any policy that is being branded as “socialist” and the members of the Senate/Congress are unlikely to pass anything too extreme.
We all know what would benefit people but it will take time for people to adjust to a different way of thinking.
Axelrod got Obama elected.
They ignored local seats and the House.
And Obama was too accommodating to the Republicans.
Just not letting the Bush tax cuts to expire for example.
I have addressed this.
Lack of information. For example. People think if you have Single Payer you have to go to some poor public clinic, which is not true.
People want the same thing as I have said. And it can be paid for easily. Its called reallocation of resources.
We are a huge economy where you get economies of scale as compared to Denmark for example.
The media is hell bent on disinformation for obvious reasons.
btw I will be in a bad mood only if United don't take advantage and win by 2 goals to go top.
There’s the obvious issue of voters not understanding the process of governance, and as a result the utter malice of the GOP.
Obama took office with a 1T+ deficit, he wanted a trillion stimulus package, only got 700bn and had to make cuts to social services to accommodate them, and got called a socialist (imagine that, a self-professed Tom Friedman fan). Then in 2014 after the mid term loss had to do a sequester deal with the GOP, slowing the economic recovery even further. When he left office, the deficit was down to 600bn.
The first thing the GOP did when they got in again? The Trump tax cut. And now the deficit has shot up again to 1T+, and the US isn’t even in a recession. If they win again, great, they would continue appointing judges and scale back on federal agencies, further entrenching them to continue wielding power, or obstruct effectively. If they lose, the next Dem president will be left with a shit show that will take years to clear up, and then people will be agitating for change again because their lives aren’t getting better.
The establishment Democrats are far from innocent in all this, of course, and someone like Biden who openly brags about getting along with Republicans will smooth things even more for them, but it’s still a dilemma that can’t be solved if the electorate don’t take a longer view on politics. The evangelicals, the Old South racists are far from content with the GOP, but they understand the long game and never compromised, even if they encounter setbacks along the way.
Obama took office with a 1T+ deficit, he wanted a trillion stimulus package, only got 700bn and had to make cuts to social services to accommodate them, and got called a socialist (imagine that, a self-professed Tom Friedman fan). Then in 2014 after the mid term loss had to do a sequester deal with the GOP, slowing the economic recovery even further. When he left office, the deficit was down to 600bn.
The first thing the GOP did when they got in again? The Trump tax cut. And now the deficit has shot up again to 1T+, and the US isn’t even in a recession. If they win again, great, they would continue appointing judges and scale back on federal agencies, further entrenching them to continue wielding power, or obstruct effectively. If they lose, the next Dem president will be left with a shit show that will take years to clear up, and then people will be agitating for change again because their lives aren’t getting better.
The establishment Democrats are far from innocent in all this, of course, and someone like Biden who openly brags about getting along with Republicans will smooth things even more for them, but it’s still a dilemma that can’t be solved if the electorate don’t take a longer view on politics. The evangelicals, the Old South racists are far from content with the GOP, but they understand the long game and never compromised, even if they encounter setbacks along the way.
Yes it is lack of information, but it’s long-standing and won’t be changed easily. They have fixed ideas and it’s deeply embedded. Whilst everyone is so obsessed with their own wealth and themselves it will be a struggle. That’s why you are the only “civilised” country left (so to speak) with this pretty appalling health care system.I have addressed this.
Lack of information. For example. People think if you have Single Payer you have to go to some poor public clinic, which is not true.
People want the same thing as I have said. And it can be paid for easily. Its called reallocation of resources.
We are a huge economy where you get economies of scale as compared to Denmark for example.
The media is hell bent on disinformation for obvious reasons.
btw I will be in a bad mood only if United don't take advantage and win by 2 goals to go top.
Btw I will be joining you if we don’t do well. Only fair to warn you.
(Biden will get sod all done so please don’t vote for him).
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