Ole Gunnar Solskjær | 2021/22 Discussion

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Phil Osophy

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You can say whatever but a game with 22 shots against 5 represents a good job from the manager in my book. Considering the number of chances we had today, balls to the box, crosses, a penalty, Ole could have scored a hattrick even with his current physical form.

There's certain things I'd like to change like the formation, allowing Pogba more freedom in a 4-3-3 to exploit his talent and sending Lingard to the bench at the same time. I'd introduce Gomes next to him without fears, considering that he's got the mastery and creativity on the ball that everyone else is lacking right now in tight spaces. But that's the only margin I see to introduce changes for the next game and there's no guarantee of success either, because what we're missing mainly is quality and determination in both boxes.

In the last two games we had 31 shots and conceded 11. Total goals scored 2, total goals conceded 3. But here you have some people talking about in-game management and whatever crap that fits the agenda. For me, considering how we finished last season and the few changes we've seen in a rotten, mediocre squad with the attack and midfield being even weaker than before, I think he's doing a good job since pre-season trying to revitalize the team and building something new.

The problem, far too tender and unreliable yet in many ways as expected, depending on young players all over the field with obvious lack of consistency. And at the same time needing even more like Gomes and Greenwood when we have already the youngest XI in the Prem without them, because they're far more gifted than many others in the squad. So bad if you play them and bad if you don't.

But considering the cards on the table I can take what I'm seeing by now. The attacking intent is undeniable after 6 years of utter dross. The physical side of the game has improved since pre-season and there's intensity again, discipline and a team playing for the manager. The pressing is there finally, early stages but it's work in process.

I hope he manages to improve the passing game now, but I have the feeling that until we sign someone or Gomes is a regular starter we'll be weak in that department. Our current front four are natural runners and lack the talent to pass the ball in the right way, at the right time in many situations. They dwell too long on the ball and make poor decisions, and we can include Pogba there too, with McTominay being just correct and nothing else. I think we need a different selection and lots of coaching there to see some improvements, so it will take time I think.
 

nickm

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Exactly, we need to be patient. Give time for Ole to build and develop a young team that will dominate for seasons to come. SAF was given time and dominated for a generation.
SAF was a top manager before he even came to United. That is one reason he was given time.
 

fergiesarmy1

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Mind you that was last season and since then our results are even worse. :lol:

Despite that Chelsea win(which improves it a bit) I honestly can’t recall a worse set of results for United manager since Jimmy Murphy.
We had a good pre season though ;)
 

Kemizee

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Dont sack the goddamn manager, you're becoming worse than Real Madrid fans at asking for managers to be sacked.

Its not the managers fault.
And that is the difference between Real Madrid and Man United. One club has high standards and will not tolerate mediocrity all the way from the board to the coach(ex players included), players etc.. while the other keeps lingering in idealistic garbage like playing youth, the United way, Academy product and British core which perpetuates players like Lingard, Young, Smalling, Jones who should have been binned 5 years ago.

At least with Real Madrid, you know what you in for when you belong to that family and a single season failure is seen as a taboo and immediately rectified like it was this summer while we keep swallowing the 'Transition' opium with no end in sight from our board and manager.
 

rotherham_red

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This constant argument for 'we have to give him time'

If he's doing well, he'll get time.

If not, he should get the sack.

Relegation form in our last 15 games in the Prem I think.
Cos a season lasts 15 games, and it's not as if 12 of those games were with a different squad, or that he's working under conditions which are drastically worse than every manager in the top 7-8 of the league...

Seriously, think of the context and realise that no current manager would get anywhere near with a squad where our first XI is more like a first VIII with three players in by default, let alone our Dad's army of backup options. Not Pep, not Klopp, and not Poch.

Ole needs at least two full seasons to even begin to sort out this mess. He likely won't get it, but that is what he needs.
 

Canagel

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His football is not too different to Mourinho, except with more running. Dont think he will last very long especially if he blindly sticks with players like Lingard.
 

The Urban Goose

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Who brought that Championship winger?
The championship winger who is young, has scored two in three and, in the days of massively inflated prices, looks to be a bargain?

Who made the unflushable Young captain?
We don't know the dressing room balance. He might be an essential calm experienced head amongst a bunch of young kids who are at risk of losing themselves up their own backsides.

Who persists with Lingard?
What choice does he have? You want to look at recruitment? See below.

Who sold Lukaku and didn’t address the attack?
What's the common theme since the Glazers took over? Yet you're happy to pin this on Ole? It's clear Woodward is the yes man desperate to keep his own position of power; the more money he makes for the Glazers, the better his position.

Or would you rather continue scapegoating the incumbent manager rather than point the finger at the actual people at fault?

Who didn’t brought a midfielder after losing 2 first teamers?
See above.

Mind boggling how he’s exempt of responsibility.
Mind boggling how fans are so quick to jump on yet another manager so quickly. Who are the common themes since SAF retired? They certainly aren't the manager.
 

fergiesarmy1

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His football is not too different to Mourinho, except with more running. Dont think he will last very long especially if he blindly sticks with players like Lingard.
Ole fan but that’s his weakness, he needs to drop him and I think for jlingz and his stupid fecking brands sake.

Playing crap every week and getting picked isn’t helping anyone.
 

Foxbatt

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It is not Lingard alone that is the problem. Ole has no clue how to coach a team that can play in different ways. We do not need the luck of a penalty or the referee to win against a team like Palace. Our movement off the ball is horrible. Even Sheffield United had better movement off the ball than us. You look at the way our players play. they do not know how to move and where to move and what to do when we have the ball.
 

Frank Grimes

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All I care about is the results and performances. Ours are not good enough and that is down to the manager, as it always has been. Solskjaer was never the man to manage Manchester United and 3 wins in his last however many games is testament to that.
Amazing he has so many supporters showing blind faith.
 

fergiesarmy1

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How long is a day in the Manchester United calendar cycle? It's been 7 freaking years since we looked like a proper football club never mind a big one.
Because of the Liverpool v arsenal game they had a segment on the arsenal win in 1990 that won them the title.

29 years later and liverpool haven’t won it, we are in for the same unthinkable cycle
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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Cos a season lasts 15 games, and it's not as if 12 of those games were with a different squad, or that he's working under conditions which are drastically worse than every manager in the top 7-8 of the league...

Seriously, think of the context and realise that no current manager would get anywhere near with a squad where our first XI is more like a first VIII with three players in by default, let alone our Dad's army of backup options. Not Pep, not Klopp, and not Poch.

Ole needs at least two full seasons to even begin to sort out this mess. He likely won't get it, but that is what he needs.
That's pure nonsense.

"He needs time."

He won't get it if the results continue in this downward spiral.
 

Foxbatt

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When you play a match, it is statistically proven that players actually have the ball 3 minutes on average … So, the most important thing is: what do you do during those 87 minutes when you do not have the ball. That is what determines wether you’re a good player or not.

Our players have no idea at all when we do not have the ball and that is down to coaching. Trust me give this team to Pep or Klopp and they would have this team playing a lot better than what we are doing now. Some will call me out on this and it is not that I do not support United and do so always but that is the honest truth.
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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Trying to update our footballing style and culture in the tactical modern age of 2019, by attempting to replicate the 90s and 00s motivational methods of a uniquely inspirational motivational manager, without that manager, was alwasy a pretty iffy recipie for success...

Liverpool’s decline was predicated on their slavish adherence to the “boot room”.... which fell apart when football changed in the 90s, and the old school ideologies of Souness and Evans simply didn’t cut it anymore.... yet for some baffling reason we’ve all convinced ourselves that the clubs failures under Mourhino and LVG (themselves antiquated - albeit high profile managers) was entirely down to them not being sufficiently “United” enough... which basically just meant “not Alex Ferguson”... or rather “not the subjectively mythical version of whichever of the many different Alex Ferguson sides we imagine had the most discernible style!”
Excellent post.

I agree with this.
 

ash_86

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The system Ole put out gave us more than enough chances to win the game. If we didn't win then that talks about the quality of the players more then anything.
 

izec

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We are quite clearly not doing much in training. Look at teams like City or Pool, every freekick, throw in and corner gets used to make a chance and score. Same for City, these things are well studied and drilled, it isnt a coincidence. These teams have done so much work on trying to score from every half chance and have multiple ways of playing it. The same with and without the ball, every player knows what to do in which situation and what his teamate will do. Well oiled machines in both directions.

Then you look at us. Completely clueless. Not just general in game, but from throw ins, freekicks and corners. We try the same stuff every single time and fail. We just throw it in there and hope someone puts his head in, while not getting the ball past the first man or let Rashford kick it somewhere. Just have the players be more fit and that will solve 90% of our issues. Our football is from 10 or 20 years ago, while other teams and managers moved on, we rely on individual quality and luck most of the time.
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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We are quite clearly not doing much in training. Look at teams like City or Pool, every freekick, throw in and corner gets used to make a chance and score. Same for City, these things are well studied and drilled, it isnt a coincidence. These teams have done so much work on trying to score from every half chance and have multiple ways of playing it. The same with and without the ball, every player knows what to do in which situation and what his teamate will do. Well oiled machines in both directions.

Then you look at us. Completely clueless. Not just general in game, but from throw ins, freekicks and corners. We try the same stuff every single time and fail. We just throw it in there and hope someone puts his head in, while not getting the ball past the first man or let Rashford kick it somewhere. Just have the players be more fit and that will solve 90% of our issues. Our football is from 10 or 20 years ago, while other teams and managers moved on, we rely on individual quality and luck most of the time.
But we run more.

So it's all good.
 

Ayush_reddevil

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Trying to update our footballing style and culture in the tactical modern age of 2019, by attempting to replicate the 90s and 00s motivational methods of a uniquely inspirational motivational manager, without that manager, was alwasy a pretty iffy recipie for success...

Liverpool’s decline was predicated on their slavish adherence to the “boot room”.... which fell apart when football changed in the 90s, and the old school ideologies of Souness and Evans simply didn’t cut it anymore.... yet for some baffling reason we’ve all convinced ourselves that the clubs failures under Mourhino and LVG (themselves antiquated - albeit high profile managers) was entirely down to them not being sufficiently “United” enough... which basically just meant “not Alex Ferguson”... or rather “not the subjectively mythical version of whichever of the many different Alex Ferguson sides we imagine had the most discernible style!”
I remember multiple times over the last 6 years when people have talked about United turning into the Liverpool of 90's & later and your post is bang on about it . This whole United way nonsense needs to end . We need a professional approach from top to bottom and people running it need to stop living in this delusional world that United are some powerhouse
 

rotherham_red

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Ole fan but that’s his weakness, he needs to drop him and I think for jlingz and his stupid fecking brands sake.

Playing crap every week and getting picked isn’t helping anyone.
He's going with what and who he knows. Which is absolutely fine in the early stages. The people going on like he will never change and is stubborn, are the same people who said he'd play Mata and Matic every game this season, or that he's a Glazer stooge because Ed didn't do his job and also decided to give contracts to the likes of Rojo, Jones, and Smalling. He's shown in his actions, that he knows where the issues are. If the board don't think the same, that's not on him.

Lingard isn't amazing or anything, but he does fulfill a vital function off the ball which creates the space for everyone else in the attack. He leads the press, and no one else is capable of doing it. It's not working out for him right now, but he's honest in his endeavour. In an ideal world, he'd be replaced and be squad player, but like I said in my last post, he's one of around three players in the first XI who are in by default.

Considering all the twats who were calling Ole a puppet and yes man have now suddenly latched on to Lingard's continued inclusion as proof of him not having a clue, then I suppose it's a positive.

Guaranteed the people who are wanting Angel in will be the same people laying into Angel when he inevitably has a poor game, which he will have, cos he's young. Notice how the crying over Greenwood on Monday suddenly stopped today? He came on for 40 mins today and was barely a factor.

Like I said in Gomes' thread, the amount of building up they are doing to someone so young (precociously talented yes, but still very young) is so extremely counterproductive, it could kill his career before it's even begun. The amount of expectations on both him and Greenwood are frankly scary. They are 17 and 18, ffs.
 

rotherham_red

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That's pure nonsense.

"He needs time."

He won't get it if the results continue in this downward spiral.
Ok, genius. Tell me, who has it worse in the top 7-8? This includes, Wolves, Everton, Chelsea, Arsenal, Leicester, btw.

We have a good defence, a piss poor midfield which would be outplayed by 12-13 of the 20 PL clubs and a promising but unproven attack.
 

fergiesarmy1

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He's going with what and who he knows. Which is absolutely fine in the early stages. The people going on like he will never change and is stubborn, are the same people who said he'd play Mata and Matic every game this season, or that he's a Glazer stooge because Ed didn't do his job and also decided to give contracts to the likes of Rojo, Jones, and Smalling. He's shown in his actions, that he knows where the issues are. If the board don't think the same, that's not on him.

Lingard isn't amazing or anything, but he does fulfill a vital function off the ball which creates the space for everyone else in the attack. He leads the press, and no one else is capable of doing it. It's not working out for him right now, but he's honest in his endeavour. In an ideal world, he'd be replaced and be squad player, but like I said in my last post, he's one of around three players in the first XI who are in by default.

Considering all the twats who were calling Ole a puppet and yes man have now suddenly latched on to Lingard's continued inclusion as proof of him not having a clue, then I suppose it's a positive.

Guaranteed the people who are wanting Angel in will be the same people laying into Angel when he inevitably has a poor game, which he will have, cos he's young. Notice how the crying over Greenwood on Monday suddenly stopped today? He came on for 40 mins today and was barely a factor.

Like I said in Gomes' thread, the amount of building up they are doing to someone so young (precociously talented yes, but still very young) is so extremely counterproductive, it could kill his career before it's even begun. The amount of expectations on both him and Greenwood are frankly scary. They are 17 and 18, ffs.

As I said ole fan

Your wrong in your defence of Lingard though, he is not good enough for a club of our stature and I’ve seem better burnt out players in my pub.

The issue is correct though who else is there youngster or oldster?
 

Eddy_JukeZ

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Ok, genius. Tell me, who has it worse in the top 7-8? This includes, Wolves, Everton, Chelsea, Arsenal, Leicester, btw.

We have a good defence, a piss poor midfield which would be outplayed by 12-13 of the 20 PL clubs and a promising but unproven attack.
All but the top 6 are clearly in a worse situation than us.

Our "piss poor" midfield completely nullified Wolves for a large period and dominated them in the 1st half.

You're spewing hyperbolic nonsense.

What do Wolves have? What do Everton have? What do Leicester have? It's all clearly worse than us.
 

Leftback99

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All but the top 6 are clearly in a worse situation than us.

Our "piss poor" midfield completely nullified Wolves for a large period and dominated them in the 1st half.

You're spewing hyperbolic nonsense.

What do Wolves have? What do Everton have? What do Leicester have? It's all clearly worse than us.
So we in your words dominated Wolves away from home but you want the manager out?
 

rotherham_red

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As I said ole fan

Your wrong in your defence of Lingard though, he is not good enough for a club of our stature and I’ve seem better burnt out players in my pub.

The issue is correct though who else is there youngster or oldster?
I don't disagree. He needs to do so much more, and the cold hard truth is, outside of a purple patch a couple of years ago, he's never shown that he's ever had enough to be a proper Utd starter.

But like I said, who is the alternative in that squad?
 

Mockney

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Excellent post.

I agree with this.
Another tangential and frustrating aspect of this, is people insisting we can solve our problems by simply throwing all the academy kids in, a la the Class of 92... which completely ignores that the side the Co92 were introduced into, already contained a settled title winning defence, a midfield with Roy Keane, and an attack with Cole and Cantona... not to mention that they were weaned into a pre-metropolitan Premier League, where our biggest domestic competition were Newcastle and Blackburn teams whose defensive spines relied on the hardly Maldini-elsque talents of Colin Hendry and Darren Peacock!...

We simply can’t do that anymore!... even Fergie himself never tried it again, preferring to balance big name signings with the very occasional academy option once the league became infinitely more competitive...

It’s all well and good getting rid of underperforming deadwood like Lukaku, Fellaini and Sanchez... but not even trying to replace them, under the (presumable?) auspices that the United way is to give our youth a chance of a place (rather than a chance to compete for a place) seems at best short sighted, and at worst negligent.

The “United Way” has become simply “The Ferguson Way, circa 1995” with the great irony being that there was never any one singular or consistent way employed by the great man over his 26 years... in fact his success was defined by his willingness to adapt to modernity at every turn! Trying to “copy him” is a nebulous endeavour.
 
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fergiesarmy1

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I don't disagree. He needs to do so much more, and the cold hard truth is, outside of a purple patch a couple of years ago, he's never shown that he's ever had enough to be a proper Utd starter.

But like I said, who is the alternative in that squad?
Well that’s the problem, I see and hear many talk about Gomes but I’ve not seen enough of that to be convinced. We should have signed felix but that’s just me :lol:
 

Garethw

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Everything United fans are saying now is exactly what the Cardiff fans were saying when he was boss.

I love Ole the player, but the simple fact is that he is a shit manager.
 

Rhyme Animal

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Everything United fans are saying now is exactly what the Cardiff fans were saying when he was boss.

I love Ole the player, but the simple fact is that he is a shit manager.
What stuff specifically? Genuine question, I'm curious as to Cardiff fans' take on OGS.

Were there similarities in the footy and / or results?
 

11101

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I like the direction he is trying to take the team with the signings he has made and the way he is trying to get us to play. I also like his approach to games and the tactics he sends us out with.

I am extremely worried about his complete inability to influence a game after it has started. Changing tactics and making subs, he seems to be completely hopeless at both.

If he doesn't learn the latter, and quickly, he won't make it to the end of the season imo.
 

yumtum

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Worrying trend is that every manager post Fergie has been out of contract.

Points towards the upper management being tight fisted (150m net spend after 4 transfer windows will prove this). If Ole were to be sacked, you can bet that we wont hire someone that's currently at a club.
 

fps

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This issue with penalty takers has now cost United 3 points in total. It is clear that it's an issue. Ole needs to make a decision and back whoever it is.
 

rotherham_red

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All but the top 6 are clearly in a worse situation than us.

Our "piss poor" midfield completely nullified Wolves for a large period and dominated them in the 1st half.

You're spewing hyperbolic nonsense.

What do Wolves have? What do Everton have? What do Leicester have? It's all clearly worse than us.
No, go on. You obviously said it's nonsense (twice) It would be nice to back up your statement to my "hyperbolic nonsense", (ironic considering your choice of phraseology...)

We have 8 elevenths of a starting XI, with the likes of McTominay, Lingard, Pereira, and James getting consistent starts whereas they wouldn't be anywhere near a Chelsea let alone City or Liverpool. We then have the likes of Young, Matic, and Mata who are all seemingly ready for the glue factory but are constants on our bench. Beyond those three, we either have the deadwood who are persona non grata, or a bunch of kids whose sum total of first team minutes barely adds up to a full 90 minutes.

Do you really want me to compare that to those teams? Do you think their boards have allowed their teams to be in such a state of disrepair? They may not have players with the individual quality of someone like Pogba, but they have a complete team with decent squad and rotation options off the bench.

Meanwhile, 75% of this board are determined to collectively lose their shit over two teenagers... And you still say we're in a better state than the clubs around us :lol: what a fecking joke of a comment.
 

Jacob

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As much as we would love him to succeed, what can you really expect from a rookie manager coming from Norway?
 

rotherham_red

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Well that’s the problem, I see and hear many talk about Gomes but I’ve not seen enough of that to be convinced. We should have signed felix but that’s just me :lol:
Our board haven't backed Ole. It's as simple as that. He has had to let a striker go without a replacement and because Ed is a cnut, he fecked over any small chance Ole had in keeping Herrera.

Gomes is great, but honestly blooding in kids who are by their very nature inconsistent in a team as patchy as ours is just asking for trouble. Unfortunately though, we have little choice. I just hope that Gomes and Greenwood especially, are mentally ready for such huge pressure and expectations.

I don't want to be misinterpreted though. I rate both (in fact, just yesterday I ordered the new away and third tops with their names and numbers on the back) but the clamour over them from the bunch of ungrateful cnuts that we have on the forums and social media is making me fear the worst. If they don't hit the ground running, the knives will be out from the bandwagon jumpers and the media. Which is a frankly preposterous situation for someone so young and inexperienced.
 

BusbyMalone

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Ultimately it's a coaching/management issue. I simply refuse to accept that we haven't got the personnel to break down Crystal-fecking-Palace. Ole seems to be pretty adept at picking/managing a counter attacking side, but the problem there is that 90% of the teams we face (particularly at Old Trafford) won't afford us the luxury of counter attacking them. Therefore, when it comes to breaking down teams that defend deep, we struggle. This is obviously not unique to Ole, as we've struggled with this aspect for a few years, but he doesn't seem to have a remedy for this either.
 
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