Has the Palace result finally woken us up to reality?

[Freak]

Don't know what the feck we do in training but we are shit in attack. I guess when you play Rashford and Lingard that's to be expected given how brainless one is and how pointless the other is. Ole has the options to change his attack but he won't.

This midfield/attack looks a lot better than what we have been using the past few games, if only because there are players who use the ball better and don't take stupid long range shots because they think they're Ronaldo:

-------------Martial-------------
Sanchez---Pogba-----James
--------Fred-------McT---------

 

[PaulRich]

I don't know if its woken us up but what it has done is turn a reasonably positive outlook after two decentish opening performances into a veritable shit storm of negativity and heaped pressure on Ole. Southampton is now a pressure cooker of a result. Lose that and the slide would be almost inevitable.

 

[Madzik_92]

Actually the Chelsea we should have known what level we're at. Yes we did won but that is because their defence sucks. We did not control that game right?

 

[NewGlory]

One of the worst aspects of our situation is how well-run Manchester City are. They had a long term vision that has come to fruition. Their player recruitment is amazing. Just look at their squad and the backup they have on the bench compared to us. Compare that to our player recruitment post-Fergie. Our signings have either been total flops (Sanchez and ADM) or ok-ish (Shaw, Miki and Pogba). As it happens the 2019 summer window signings may turn out the best post Fergie. You can actually see a philosophy behind those signings.

Man City has Txiki Begiristain running things, we have a petty moron named Woodward. This should begin and end any comparision between us and them because honestly - there's nothing to see here once you see that. It's not about Ole at all.

 

[Abhinav]

I think its a wake up for people who thought we had got in enough quality and gave the transfer window 6 or even 7/10. The same people cant stop moaning now after a bad result.

For others, we knew squad is not good enough for a guaranteed top 4 and we will most probably finish 5th/6th. The truth is we have been unlucky with the ref decisions and the penalty misses the past few games. The harsher truth is that we will get more such results with the current set of players. If we had a prime rooney or harry kane playing for us, we would have got the 9 points and people would be praising the manager, the coaching staff and what not. Quality buys you points even when you have days where things aren’t going your way. Otherwise, you get inconsistent results that we will get throughout the season.

 

[Treble]

I think its a wake up for people who thought we had got in enough quality and gave the transfer window 6 or even 7/10. The same people cant stop moaning now after a bad result.

For others, we knew squad is not good enough for a guaranteed top 4 and we will most probably finish 5th/6th. The truth is we have been unlucky with the ref decisions and the penalty misses the past few games. The harsher truth is that we will get more such results with the current set of players. If we had a prime rooney or harry kane playing for us, we would have got the 9 points and people would be praising the manager, the coaching staff and what not. Quality buys you points even when you have days where things aren’t going your way. Otherwise, you get inconsistent results that we will get throughout the season.

But were lucky against Chelsea. 4 pts after 3 games is about right. Maybe 5 pts would reflect better the standard of playing. 2 shots on target against Palace at home is very poor.

5-6th isn't guaranteed.

 

[cafecillos]

Man City has Tixi Bergstein running things, we have a petty moron named Woodward. This should begin and end any comparision between us and them because honestly - there's nothing to see here once you see that. It's not about Ole at all.

Sorry, I don't mean to mock you, I just found that genuinely hilarious.

 

[Bobcat]

Depends on what reality you live in

No one with any sense expected us to challenge for the title this year but let us get some perspective here. Vs Wolves we should have won but missed a penalty. Yesterday was a perfect storm of silly mistakes on our part and a cnut of a ref ended with maybe the most undeserved loss i've ever seen

The reality is that we have the youngest squad in the league right now and are in the midst of a massive rebuild that will take years, an inexperienced manager and a board and a CEO that are bean counters and care feck all about football as long as the numbers in the books are in the black

 

[UpWithRivers]

It's like we are cursed. Maybe being dramatic but fk me how does everything we touch turn to sht. Has anything turned out good since Sir Alex left? Yeah at a stretch we won the Europa! And we have some exciting youth players- but not one has stepped up to reach their potential. Not one. Not one big money signing hasn't either turned to sht, wants out Pogba, or hasn't reached thier potential. The only player that has been consistently at a world class level has gone to sht - De Gea. Not one manager has not come and turned out sht- even supposedly world class one like Mourinho. Everything we touch turns to sht. Leave out the new signings as it's too early to tell. Is that dramatic or true?

And another unpopular opinion. We never should have sold Fellaini and Lukaku if we were not replacing them. Both would have made a difference yesterday even as impact subs.

 

[kestrel]

First I want to say that the comments in this forum are generally much more objective than those in other sites like twitter or other forums. Kudos！ It irritates me that so many man utd fans on these other sites are anyhow shooting their mouths off, thinking that being Man Utd fans means they are entitled to wins in every game, and even making racist abusive comments.

I am seeing this club as in transition, which means we will be playing at a standard far off from MC, LIV and even TOT. So unfortunately we will not be having many wins this season. I think that the positives currently are that the team is more attack-minded and committed than under LVG or Mourinho (most of his later tenure), and keep trying. And there are some good players with potential here.

Is Ole the man to lead us long-term? I think he can and should be relied on to set the foundation of this team for just the next 2-3 years, but I don't expect him to lead the team to top 4 or even top 6 in his time here. Success cannot be rushed. But I don't think many Man Utd fans can tolerate that.

Agree with many comments above about what needs to be worked on. I want to add:

- I think our players do have quality and creativity (I recall Rashford in his debut season) but often they seem as if they don't "dare" to try new things. So James' goal yesterday was a breath of fresh air.

- We are stuck at how to break down teams who sit back. But there have been flashes of moments where our players actually make good runs and interpassing moves that do break down teams (again James' goal in point). I don't know why we don't try that more often.

- We don't score enough from long-range (MC, LIV, TOT, ARS all have players who regularly score from outside the box)

- Our players don't believe in themselves enough (one or two defeats and the players seem to be deflated and may give rise to dressing room conflicts). We need players who keep their heads up and keep trying as a team whatever happens and don't blame each other.

 

[11101]

Why are you? What are these parts which make you a top 4 side on paper?

Good (but undeperforming for a while) keeper and a decent backline, average midfield aside from Pogba and a good but unexceptional attack with no one forward standing out like Kane or Aubameyang who can score 30 a season.

I'm being harsh but I'm not exactly looking at that United team and thinking that you should be making top four. It's not a bad team, top six 100%, but better than Arsenal or us?

I'd say our first team is better on paper than Chelsea and Arsenal and with AWB and Maguire our back 5 isn't too far off matching anyone.

Our forward line is young but rapid and exciting. Our midfield, aside from having the most talented single player in the league, is our major weakspot.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

And everyone is questioning Solskjaer- how is this not Woodward’s fault

It is Woodward's fault. He is trying to be a clever wheeler dealer and is rubbish at it, leaving his manager with a badly depleted squad.

 

[jackal&hyde]

Much as I love Ole and think he is a United legend, he is tactically naïve and borderline tactically inept.

Why? We only have Pogba that has the quality to break teams down, and we play him deeper now. We could play him further forward, but that would mean playing Matic as well. I think we played our best team in a good setup, we just have very poor players in the creativity department, especially in nr 10s. Save for that we dominate completely but a manager can't make a player find a through ball, that is up to the player quality.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

I'd say our first team is better on paper than Chelsea and Arsenal and with AWB and Maguire our back 5 isn't too far off matching anyone.

Our forward line is young but rapid and exciting. Our midfield, aside from having the most talented single player in the league, is our major weakspot.

Which then affect our creativity, but also yet again puts our defence under pressure as at times they might as well not be there, or at least do not have the tactical nous to know where they should be in defensive situations.

 

[youmeletsfly]

One of the worst aspects of our situation is how well-run Manchester City are. They had a long term vision that has come to fruition. Their player recruitment is amazing. Just look at their squad and the backup they have on the bench compared to us. Compare that to our player recruitment post-Fergie. Our signings have either been total flops (Sanchez and ADM) or ok-ish (Shaw, Miki and Pogba). As it happens the 2019 summer window signings may turn out the best post Fergie. You can actually see a philosophy behind those signings.

You are definitely onto something.
Our situation is so bad just because one of our competitors is doing alright. Jesus, that's one of the most stupid things I've ever heard.
We're in such a deep shit and all you can think of is your envy for City, do you feel ashamed towards City fans that your beloved club is doing so poorly?
Fek me

 

[Nou_Camp99]

I'd say our first team is better on paper than Chelsea and Arsenal and with AWB and Maguire our back 5 isn't too far off matching anyone.

Our forward line is young but rapid and exciting. Our midfield, aside from having the most talented single player in the league, is our major weakspot.

Most talented midfielder in league? He's only the 4th or 5th most.talented in Manchester.

I'd have KDB blindfolded over the dabber. Anyone who thinks Pogba is better than KDB is a fool.

 

[Falcow]

Scoring goals will be our biggest problem this season. I have no reason to believe that our current attackers will score too much more than they did last season and then take out lukakus contribution. Let's say martial and rashford manage 15 each in the league, where are the remaining 45 ish goals going to come from that would be required for 4th spot? 10 from pogba maybe, who else is there after that. I think we will struggle to score 50/55 which is concerning.

 

[11101]

Most talented midfielder in league? He's only the 4th or 5th most.talented in Manchester.

I'd have KDB blindfolded over the dabber. Anyone who thinks Pogba is better than KDB is a fool.

Yeah, ok. Put Pogba in a top team and he's unstoppable, like he was when France won the World Cup.

 

[Smudgers]

Got to start Gomes give the lad a go great talent, creative, clever , everything we are missing at the mo . Got to be better than Jesse . Awful today like the end of last season all over again .

 

[Nou_Camp99]

Yeah, ok. Put Pogba in a top team and he's unstoppable, like he was when France won the World Cup.

He wasn't unstoppable at the world cup. Had quite a few nothing games really. Played well in the final in fairness but he's nowhere near as good as you think he is.

Cost us again yesterday with stupid sloppy play. Does it a lot. KDB is far better than him. David Silva is too.

 

[fastwalker]

We are going to hear this sort of analysis a lot this season, I fear.

The best teams don’t continually make excuses for consistently failing to beat the dross

We have won three of the last fifteen competitive games which is hilariously bad

Totally agree with you. The word 'if' is often the best friend of a football fan in denial. 'If' Rashford had scored the penalty we would have drawn, 'if' Cahill had been sent off we would have won, 'if' Sir Alex Ferguson came out of retirement the glory days would be back again. The wonderful thing about 'if' is that it is means that people never have to confront reality and can instead simply ignore or avoid it. That is just the delusional world that Liverpool fans occupied for decades until they won the champions league.

The truth is that we had three shots on target (the same as Palace) playing against a Palace side shorn or Aaron Wan-Bissaka, with Wilf Zaha still smarting over his inability to secure a summer move and coming off the back of a defeat at Sheffield United. Let's stop the excuses, we should have beaten Palace out of sight. The fact that we could not should worry every United fan.

I refuse to become accustomed to failure, nor am I willing to accept excuses for it. I do not expect us to win every game and am realistic enough to know that there will be times when even with our best endeavours we will lose. However, playing against a weakened Crystal Palace side at Old Trafford, with more than 70 per cent of possession is a game that I expect us to win.

 

[youmeletsfly]

Woken us up to reality?

What the feck were you thinking after this summer, that we're gonna fecking win the title or something? I hate these type of threads, just shows how vain, delusional and spoiled Man United fans are. Where the feck have you been in the last 6 years that suddenly the Palace game determined this sudden wake to reality?

There's a simple equation below:
disadvantages
- weak LB
- young RB
- no decent DM
- no decent DLP
- no decent RM
- no natural or decent RW
- no natural or decent LW
- all nr 10's except Pogba are dogshit
- no proven goal scorer
- GK on the decline
- over hyped youngsters coming from the youth teams (as always)
- manager that proved feck all at this level or at any other god damn level except fecken Molde
- 50 mil Fred not even on the bench (our 2nd creative player btw)

advantages:
- Pogba
- Maguire
- AWB(still too young)

Add to that list the fact that our club has been a joke, investment has been poor, we have no strategy, no DOF, no ideea on how to actually run a club.

Taking a look at the above, do you still believe the Palace game is the wake up call for any decent, not blind, Man United fan?

We are a midtable club only by looking at our lineup. You can't have only two class players in your team and hope you're gonna compete, jesus feck.

 

[fastwalker]

Why? We only have Pogba that has the quality to break teams down, and we play him deeper now. We could play him further forward, but that would mean playing Matic as well. I think we played our best team in a good setup, we just have very poor players in the creativity department, especially in nr 10s. Save for that we dominate completely but a manager can't make a player find a through ball, that is up to the player quality.

Did you read your post before you sent it? I mean that with all due respect.

In effect you are suggesting that Manchester United and Manchester United fans should accept the fact that we are incapable to breaking down a Crystal Palace side at Old Trafford and should therefore accept that defeat against Palace is the best that we should expect? If that is what you are implying, it is utter madness. Please forgive the colourful language here but that Palace side should have been sent out in body bags. When did the expectations of United fans get so low that we are making excuses for not being able to beat Crystal Palace at Old Trafford?

 

[fastwalker]

Woken us up to reality?

What the feck were you thinking after this summer, that we're gonna fecking win the title or something? I hate these type of threads, just shows how vain, delusional and spoiled Man United fans are. Where the feck have you been in the last 6 years that suddenly the Palace game determined this sudden wake to reality?

There's a simple equation below:
disadvantages
- weak LB
- young RB
- no decent DM
- no decent DLP
- no decent RM
- no natural or decent RW
- no natural or decent LW
- all nr 10's except Pogba are dogshit
- no proven goal scorer
- GK on the decline
- over hyped youngsters coming from the youth teams (as always)
- manager that proved feck all at this level or at any other god damn level except fecken Molde
- 50 mil Fred not even on the bench (our 2nd creative player btw)

advantages:
- Pogba
- Maguire
- AWB(still too young)

Add to that list the fact that our club has been a joke, investment has been poor, we have no strategy, no DOF, no ideea on how to actually run a club.

Taking a look at the above, do you still believe the Palace game is the wake up call for any decent, not blind, Man United fan?

We are a midtable club only by looking at our lineup. You can't have only two class players in your team and hope you're gonna compete, jesus feck.

Ok so before the game you are telling me that you expected United to lose? That is what you are saying right?

 

[Marcus]

Season is not over. I still have faith we can get into the top 4 this season

 

[elnorte]

Season is not over. I still have faith we can get into the top 4 this season

Not possible due to what we are stuck with managing the team right now.

 

[Tincanalley]

I don't know about waking up. But acceptance seems to have set in. Last year there still lingered some bit of anticipation about the transfer window, the summer. This time we know that not enough will be done. Ole will smile and try to butter us up. He has ideas - he is not bad. Not too bad will have become the peak of our ambition.

 

[El Zoido]

Season is not over. I still have faith we can get into the top 4 this season

This game isn’t going to be an exception. Expect many more results like this over the course of the season. We cannot get top 4 if we continually drop points and lose against teams like Crystal Palace. We’ve won three out of our last 15 games, this is the form we’re going to take forward. I genuinely feel we will not even make the top 6.

 

[Lash]

Fecking hell . Our luck was well and truly in vs Chelsea and our luck was well and truly out against CP. Wolves game is hard to tell, as we’ve not seen them at home to the big boys this season, but could end up being a decent result.

 

[90 + 5min]

I think it is wrong game to ask if Palace has woken us up to reality. With little bit of luck we would have won the game yesterday. Pretty easy. We dominated the game and with "real" striker we could have scored 4-5 goals. I think we underestimated Palace from the beginning. It's not like we haven't lost against poor teams before. Even when Sir Alex Ferguson was in charge. I'm not saying that we are that good or compere Ole Gunnar Solskjaer with him. What I'm saying is to wait 10 games and see where we stand. After Chelsea people here thought we would win everything. Now after this game we are at best League One material.

 

[AaronRedDevil]

Its just plain stupid and delusional to think United will get top 4 or even win the EL with kids. One player gets Injured and we are screwed. Won't be long more till United field a team of the u-18s. Don't know who's to really blame for lack of replacements, but it's nice to see the team more together then they've ever looked. When James celebrated his goal(as he's allowed to you miserable gits), rashford and martial wanted to rush back and get another goal. Thats good mentality. But United fans need to understand that this is a young team and some are very experienced. But losses are going to happen. Fans are too flip flopping these days.

 

[Abhinav]

But were lucky against Chelsea. 4 pts after 3 games is about right. Maybe 5 pts would reflect better the standard of playing. 2 shots on target against Palace at home is very poor.

5-6th isn't guaranteed.

Yes, its true we were lucky against Chelsea but its part of the same problem. Its the inconsistency that you get with young players and not enough proven prime players. One day the team will convert all the chances they get and the other days, we won’t be able to convert even a penalty.
While top 6 is not a guarantee, I believe we have enough to finish 5-6 because on the days we will click, we will hammer some teams. If we don’t finish top 6 then it will be a coaching failure as much as a DOF/Ed Woodward failure.

 

[Bestietom]

A lot of fans predicted 1 3-0 and 4-0 win for us before this game. They now see the same old story from last season. We are just not good enough. Our midfield is Worse than last season with no cover for the backline, and no creative player for the forward line.
How does it take 6 years to find a RW, and We need a prolific CF.
If we continue to Rebuild at this rate Maguire and Pogba will be old men, before we have a team to compete.

1.100 million for a rebuild each year, is not enough, for first 3 windows at least.
2. Not replacing players is only making us weaker, not better.
3. Herrera and Lukaku should have been replaced this summer window.
4. We can't keep changing the manager every year, he must be backed.
5. Woodward needs to step down from doing transfers, and stick to what he does best. ( commercial deals only)

 

[red woppit]

Got to start Gomes give the lad a go great talent, creative, clever , everything we are missing at the mo . Got to be better than Jesse . Awful today like the end of last season all over again .

If there's just one change in the team, think this should be it. I'm under no illusion that Gomes would come in and be world class, but it's those little situations in and around the box where that ability he has can give us those two or three opportunities to score. He is also better at free kicks than Rashford (so are Pereira and Mata).

 

[gulli_G]

They put the camera on Fergie toward the end of the match and that was the saddest of all of this. Boss must be gutted to see us fall so far from the perch he put us on.

He put us on the perch and dropped us off it by being greedy over Horse sperm. It's a sad reality that after so much success, he built a well oiled machine, that was primed to keep getting better. He took his eye off the ball with his racing and it filtered into the club. Under the Glazers he survived and did his magic, but when he left the team was already on the decline, only he could squeeze the results that he did. Then getting Moyes with a free reign to sack our backroom just did it.

 

[BlueHaze]

It woke me up to reality and the reality is simply that Ole is not good enough. I was fully behind him in the summer. I thought there was a posibility the god awful end to the season might have been due to the players being gassed.

I've now realized that wasn't the case. And all the crap about being fitter was just pure bs already Shaw with hamstring problems and Martial probably injured too. James was down for a while as well touching his calf.

This man is playing Scott and Pogba as defensive midfielders with Lingard further up as the creator while playing counter attacking football against Crystal fecking Palace. He got schooled by Hodgson using his very own tactics against him. We were awful, abyssmal, a disgrace to the sport.

I hate to say it people but stop deluding yourself thinking things will ever come good under him. If you think so you are just living in denial. 3 wins in 15 or 16 games. That's the worst I've seen in my lifetime. He's devoid of ideas, counter attack that's it. He's even that tactically inept that as I said earlier he has Pogba in his team but plays with Lingard as the #10.

He'll be gone mid or end season and then these utter clowns owning the club will bring in another poor geezer and then rinse and repeat this process until they are gone themselves. The reality is that under these owners the ambition is simply gone. They have given up on the results side of the club and only put focus on making as much revenue as possible.

When Ed and the Glazer's see all the United fans at Old Trafford they don't see human beings. They see $ signs.

 

[Lentwood]

It shouldn’t have been a shock to any Utd fan. We aren’t very good, it’s as simple as that

We have a few players who on their day when they have their tails up are above average. The problem is we lack guts, know-how and we also give away goals so easily at both ends of the pitch. Add to that I don’t think our GK has made a save in a year and we’re always likely to lose games

 

[Inigo Montoya]

It woke me up to reality and the reality is simply that Ole is not good enough. I was fully behind him in the summer. I thought there was a posibility the god awful end to the season might have been due to the players being gassed.

I've now realized that wasn't the case. And all the crap about being fitter was just pure bs already Shaw with hamstring problems and Martial probably injured too. James was down for a while too touching his calf.

This man is playing Scott and Pogba as defensive middielders with further up as the creator while playing counter attacking football against Crystal fecking Palace. He got schooled by Hodgson using his very own tactics against him. We were awful, abyssmal, a disgrace to the sport.

I hate to say it people but stop deluding yourself thinking things will ever come good under him. If you think so you are just living in denial. 3 wins in 15 or 16 games. That's the worst I've seen in my lifetime. He's devoid of ideas, counter attack that's it. He's even that tactically inept that as I said earlier he has Pogba in his team but plays with Lingard as the #10.

He'll be gone mid or end season and then these utter clowns owning the club will bring in another poor geezer and then rinse and repeat this process until they are gone themselves. The reality is that under these owners the ambition is simply gone. They have given up on the results side of the club and only put focus on making as much revenue as possible.

When Ed and the Glazer's see all the United fans at Old Trafford they don't see human beings. They see $ signs.

There's very little there to dispute.

 

[Waynne]

We have:

NO setpiece threat
NO reliable penalty taker
NO wingers
NO midfield anchor
NO world class striker
NO playmaker
NO squad depth
NO director of football

There are far too many signs that the club is currently in a mess of epic proportions and no win against any top side will paper of the cracks.
I dont want new signings.

What will make me a very happy man/fan is the day we get in a Director of Football that will run the football side unimpeded and with complete control backed by the board and Woodward.
Then and only then will there be some hope that the club will get back on the path to success.

Until them this is what were going to see week in, week out.

 

[Jacckk1985]

The whole game was a freak of a result, move on and please don't whine..