Virgil Van dijk: UEFA Player of the year

[The holy trinity 68]

You can talk about Messi and Barca not showing up for that 4-0 win all you want. How about VVD and his team throwing away a 10 point lead in the PL. Both won 1 trophy and bottled another.

Yet people avoid that fact.

 

[SquishyMcSquish]

In the first CL leg Messi scored two goals and VVD was not good. He also laid one on a plate for Dembele, and had he finished it's probably enough to kill the tie. But we're meant to say VVD had a better season purely based on the return leg becoming a mess, in which yes Messi played poorly but was far from the main culprit. The only difference here is Liverpool are a better 'team' than Barcelona are, so as a team they were able to get it together and win the tie.

Van Djik is a brilliant cb, but he isn't even a fraction of what Messi is. Like others have said, if a player broke out this season and banged in 36 goals whilst getting 13 assists in a top league, whilst scoring 12 and assisting 3 in the CL, nobody in the world would argue a cb had a better season than him. Nobody. It's just because it's Messi and it's what everybody expects from him that a fresh face is given the award.

It's as simple as that .. these competitions really are that dumb. It's about the team achievement rather than how an individual plays.

 

[Jimmy_Bond]

The Liverpool hype train continues to pick up pace.

It's unbelievable.

And rightly should. Much deserved then Modric last year IMO.

Only because people have got bored and now expect Messi to be delivering the kind of stats and performances he has done this year.

Messi is on a completely different planet to every other footballer alive. His stats are frightening. He's become a victim of his own success really, as if someone like Salah delivered the kind of season Messi did last season (which wasn't even close to Messi's best) he would win the Balon D'or without question, and people would be saying it's one of the most incredible seasons we've ever seen from any player.

If we want to vary who we're giving it to a bit, then fine. But if it's a genuine vote of who has been the best player in the world for the past 12 months, then I'm afraid it's the same guy who has been the best player on the planet for the past 120 months or so. Messi.

His "normal" is every other player's "unattainable."

 

[SquishyMcSquish]

You can talk about Messi and Barca not showing up for that 4-0 win all you want. How about VVD and his team throwing away a 10 point lead in the PL. Both won 1 trophy and bottled another.

Yet people avoid that fact.

Pretty simple really, people judge Messi by completely different standards.

Which, fair enough, he's arguably the greatest player of all time whereas Van Djik is just a really good cb. But let's not pretend these awards should be taken remotely seriously.

 

[wr8_utd]

No show at Anfield against the eventual winner of the award in the most important game of the season plus a no show again in the Copa sealed his fate. What he did against Europa level sides like United and Lyon isn't taken all that seriously anymore.

Van Dijk didn't show up in one leg and Messi didn't in the other and despite not showing up at Anfield he still set up 3-4 good chances for his teammates to miss. He scored against every team he faced in the CL all season.
Also the Copa should have no impact on the fact that he was by and far the best player in the world last year. Also, is a UEFA award going to take into account performances in the Copa?

 

[wr8_utd]

You can talk about Messi and Barca not showing up for that 4-0 win all you want. How about VVD and his team throwing away a 10 point lead in the PL. Both won 1 trophy and bottled another.

Yet people avoid that fact.

Messi didn't bottle it at Anfield and VVD didn't bottle anything in the Premier League. They both had great seasons but one clearly was by and far the best in the world (even VVD said this after the CL final).
Why is VVD to blame for Liverpool not winning the PL? Why should Messi be blamed for not winning the CL? They both did more than enough for their teams in the respective competitions they didn't win.
VVD won POTY in England despite not winning the League and Messi should be winning POTY despite not winning the CL. Like VVD said, it doesn't matter if Messi went one game further or not, he's been the best.

 

[wr8_utd]

In the first CL leg Messi scored two goals and VVD was not good. He also laid one on a plate for Dembele, and had he finished it's probably enough to kill the tie. But we're meant to say VVD had a better season purely based on the return leg becoming a mess, in which yes Messi played poorly but was far from the main culprit. The only difference here is Liverpool are a better 'team' than Barcelona are, so as a team they were able to get it together and win the tie.

Van Djik is a brilliant cb, but he isn't even a fraction of what Messi is. Like others have said, if a player broke out this season and banged in 36 goals whilst getting 13 assists in a top league, whilst scoring 12 and assisting 3 in the CL, nobody in the world would argue a cb had a better season than him. Nobody. It's just because it's Messi and it's what everybody expects from him that a fresh face is given the award.

It's as simple as that .. these competitions really are that dumb. It's about the team achievement rather than how an individual plays.

They should just rename this and the Ballandor as the awards for the best player of the team that wins the CL/WC because they don't look at who the actual best players actually are.
I think Messi to ever win Ballandor again without winning the CL in that season, he'd probably need to score and assist around 90-100 goals given the standards that are expected from him.

 

[ayushreddevil9]

It's unbelievable.

Only because people have got bored and now expect Messi to be delivering the kind of stats and performances he has done this year.

Messi is on a completely different planet to every other footballer alive. His stats are frightening. He's become a victim of his own success really, as if someone like Salah delivered the kind of season Messi did last season (which wasn't even close to Messi's best) he would win the Balon D'or without question, and people would be saying it's one of the most incredible seasons we've ever seen from any player.

If we want to vary who we're giving it to a bit, then fine. But if it's a genuine vote of who has been the best player in the world for the past 12 months, then I'm afraid it's the same guy who has been the best player on the planet for the past 120 months or so. Messi.

His "normal" is every other player's "unattainable."

to all of that.

Just because you can't see the contribution of a defender and doesn't make you go wow like the Messi's chip against Betis doesn't take away the fact that vvd deserves it this season.

By your logic only attacking players deserve the award because of the 'stats'

 

[RooneyLegend]

You can talk about Messi and Barca not showing up for that 4-0 win all you want. How about VVD and his team throwing away a 10 point lead in the PL. Both won 1 trophy and bottled another.

Yet people avoid that fact.

They got 97 points and had the best defensive record.

You can talk about Messi and Barca not showing up for that 4-0 win all you want. How about VVD and his team throwing away a 10 point lead in the PL. Both won 1 trophy and bottled another.

Yet people avoid that fact.

Talk about a reach. They never had a 10 point lead.
They reached 97 points in a tougher league.
Had the best defensive record in said league.
Won the biggest competition in club football.

 

[tentan]

Well deserved. Should win the Ballon D'or too.

 

[RooneyLegend]

In the first CL leg Messi scored two goals and VVD was not good. He also laid one on a plate for Dembele, and had he finished it's probably enough to kill the tie. But we're meant to say VVD had a better season purely based on the return leg becoming a mess, in which yes Messi played poorly but was far from the main culprit. The only difference here is Liverpool are a better 'team' than Barcelona are, so as a team they were able to get it together and win the tie.

Van Djik is a brilliant cb, but he isn't even a fraction of what Messi is. Like others have said, if a player broke out this season and banged in 36 goals whilst getting 13 assists in a top league, whilst scoring 12 and assisting 3 in the CL, nobody in the world would argue a cb had a better season than him. Nobody. It's just because it's Messi and it's what everybody expects from him that a fresh face is given the award.

It's as simple as that .. these competitions really are that dumb. It's about the team achievement rather than how an individual plays.

Most of the time Messi has played in the best 'team' and it hasnt taken away from his personal accolades. In fact, what we've seen when he's out of that team is the only thing thats held him back from being the greatest player ever without argument. Btw that better team didnt even have 2 of their best players on the pitch.

 

[De Portago]

Most of the time Messi has played in the best 'team' and it hasnt taken away from his personal accolades. In fact, what we've seen when he's out of that team is the only thing thats held him back from being the greatest player ever without argument. Btw that better team didnt even have 2 of their best players on the pitch.

They had a coach though, that counts for a lot. Klopp should be eternally thankful that Valverde was in charge that day, had Barcelona had any other half competent coach that is not completely devoid of courage 4-0 never happens.

 

[RooneyLegend]

Van Dijk didn't show up in one leg and Messi didn't in the other and despite not showing up at Anfield he still set up 3-4 good chances for his teammates to miss. He scored against every team he faced in the CL all season.
Also the Copa should have no impact on the fact that he was by and far the best player in the world last year. Also, is a UEFA award going to take into account performances in the Copa?

Its fair to say the second one was more important wouldn't you say? which game had the bigger effect on what happened?

It does have an effect, its a big competition for his nation. It certainly affects the perception of player standings for awards. Had he been amazing in the Copa im pretty sure he would've gone on to win all the awards, he wasnt so he wont.

 

[RooneyLegend]

to all of that.

Just because you can't see the contribution of a defender and doesn't make you go wow like the Messi's chip against Betis doesn't take away the fact that vvd deserves it this season.

By your logic only attacking players deserve the award because of the 'stats'

Exactly, strange discussion going on in here especially since we all know the huge difference Van Djik has made to their fortunes.

 

[SquishyMcSquish]

Most of the time Messi has played in the best 'team' and it hasnt taken away from his personal accolades. In fact, what we've seen when he's out of that team is the only thing thats held him back from being the greatest player ever without argument. Btw that better team didnt even have 2 of their best players on the pitch.

Messi was better than Van Djik over those two legs though. He scored 2 goals, laid numerous chances on a plate (even in the 2nd leg) and he's not responsible for how his team defends. He was by far the top scorer in the CL, far better than Van Djik in the competition overall (van djik should have been banned after that horror tackle vs Napoli) and also won his domestic league with an insane amount of goals and assists, pretty much carrying them to that title.


And yes, they were missing two players .. but as a side, Liverpool are far better coached than Barcelona are right now. They rely less on individual assets like Messi, that and it was a fluke night in which everything went right for them and everything went wrong for Barca. This happens in the champions league, it's an unpredictable bitch of a competition and individual awards should never be handed out based on one off knockout games. Messi tore up the whole competition and had one under par night and apparently that means VVD had a better season. Ok??

Look, again these awards mean very little .. but we're not seriously arguing Van Djik played better than Messi did this season, right? Like who out there is consistently watching both of these players perform and thinking Van Djik looks better?

 

[Sayros]

Voter's fatigue is a real thing. Same reason why Jordan wasn't MVP every single year of his career even though he was far and away the best player during his entire Bulls career.

 

[RooneyLegend]

Messi was better than Van Djik over those two legs though. He scored 2 goals, laid numerous chances on a plate (even in the 2nd leg) and he's not responsible for how his team defends. He was by far the top scorer in the CL, far better than Van Djik in the competition overall (van djik should have been banned after that horror tackle vs Napoli) and also won his domestic league with an insane amount of goals and assists, pretty much carrying them to that title.


And yes, they were missing two players .. but as a side, Liverpool are far better coached than Barcelona are right now. They rely less on individual assets like Messi, that and it was a fluke night in which everything went right for them and everything went wrong for Barca. This happens in the champions league, it's an unpredictable bitch of a competition and individual awards should never be handed out based on one off knockout games. Messi tore up the whole competition and had one under par night and apparently that means VVD had a better season. Ok??

Look, again these awards mean very little .. but we're not seriously arguing Van Djik played better than Messi did this season, right? Like who out there is consistently watching both of these players perform and thinking Van Djik looks better?

You're working hard to discredit an all time great defensive season by a player. We tend to value attackers more so its hard to say he had a better season but Van Djik was as good a defender as you can get. Did you know Pool conceded 0 goals at Anfield in the knock out stages of the CL? Held 4 clean sheets in the knock outs. Had only 1 match where they conceded more than 1 goal?(the barca game)

Van Djik's side also had the best defensive record in the league. He also won the man of the match in the final.

His team had more points in its league despite that league being more competitive.

 

[amolbhatia50k]

So, is he the best defender ever to have played in the premier league? Going by personal awards alone, he must be up there right?

 

[RooneyLegend]

https://www.uefa.com/uefachampionsleague/news/newsid=2618573.html




So, is he the best defender ever to have played in the premier league? Going by personal awards alone, he must be up there right?

He's no Paul Mcgrath but he's close though.

 

[tenpoless]

Why are We comparing Van Dijk to Messi? Fecking albino velociraptor on a uni wheel. That's just stupid.

These type of awards always puts achievement (trophy) above all other factors, what's the surprise?

 

[Amadaeus]

Deserved. Without him, Liverpool isn’t winning the champions league. Surprised Mane is so high up there.

 

[Kush]

The meltdown in here

Can't wait for mental gymnastics to hear how Modric winning last year over Ronaldo was completely deserved but van Dijk winning over Messi isn't.

You're working hard to discredit an all time great defensive season by a player. We tend to value attackers more so its hard to say he had a better season but Van Djik was as good a defender as you can get. Did you know Pool conceded 0 goals at Anfield in the knock out stages of the CL? Held 4 clean sheets in the knock outs. Had only 1 match where they conceded more than 1 goal?(the barca game)

Van Djik's side also had the best defensive record in the league. He also won the man of the match in the final.

His team had more points in its league despite that league being more competitive.

People will always be vowed by attackers, it's as simple as that. Messi had an amazing season as a forward, put up absurd numbers. The numbers which in the past secured him these awards.

But, I agree with your point on van Dijk. Those are some amazing statistics which you put up, being MoTM in the CL Final is probably what clinched it for him.

 

[minh_loc_xoay]

Short termism at it's finest.

I miss the days when you had to perform at a world class level for a fair few years and win a few trophies before you were considered worthy for such accolades.

Top top player. However, if he retired tomorrow he'd have had a worse career than Sami Hypia. Greatest defender in PL history? He'll have to win a few of them before he can even be in the discussion.

What a time to be alive.

Messi was better than Van Djik over those two legs though. He scored 2 goals, laid numerous chances on a plate (even in the 2nd leg) and he's not responsible for how his team defends. He was by far the top scorer in the CL, far better than Van Djik in the competition overall (van djik should have been banned after that horror tackle vs Napoli) and also won his domestic league with an insane amount of goals and assists, pretty much carrying them to that title.


And yes, they were missing two players .. but as a side, Liverpool are far better coached than Barcelona are right now. They rely less on individual assets like Messi, that and it was a fluke night in which everything went right for them and everything went wrong for Barca. This happens in the champions league, it's an unpredictable bitch of a competition and individual awards should never be handed out based on one off knockout games. Messi tore up the whole competition and had one under par night and apparently that means VVD had a better season. Ok??

Look, again these awards mean very little .. but we're not seriously arguing Van Djik played better than Messi did this season, right? Like who out there is consistently watching both of these players perform and thinking Van Djik looks better?

Admit it. Liverpool now have the best pair of fullbacks in the world, together with the greatest defender in the PL history (The first ever defender to win it over Messi/Ronaldo).
If you think otherwise, you are just being jealous of them. Unless we ourselves beat them in a match, we have no right to doubt their players. It will sound like sour grapes.

 

[SteveW]

Better than a 51 goal 19 assist in 50 games player last season? No chance.

Messi is a victim of his own success. If him and Ronaldo only starting playing football this season and put out them numbers they would have won it.

People are clearly bored and just want to see other people win it.

These awards are only given to players who win the champions league these days. Its dumb.

 

[adexkola]

Messi was better than Van Djik over those two legs though. He scored 2 goals, laid numerous chances on a plate (even in the 2nd leg) and he's not responsible for how his team defends. He was by far the top scorer in the CL, far better than Van Djik in the competition overall (van djik should have been banned after that horror tackle vs Napoli) and also won his domestic league with an insane amount of goals and assists, pretty much carrying them to that title.


And yes, they were missing two players .. but as a side, Liverpool are far better coached than Barcelona are right now. They rely less on individual assets like Messi, that and it was a fluke night in which everything went right for them and everything went wrong for Barca. This happens in the champions league, it's an unpredictable bitch of a competition and individual awards should never be handed out based on one off knockout games. Messi tore up the whole competition and had one under par night and apparently that means VVD had a better season. Ok??

Look, again these awards mean very little .. but we're not seriously arguing Van Djik played better than Messi did this season, right? Like who out there is consistently watching both of these players perform and thinking Van Djik looks better?

Too much common sense

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Messi was better than Van Djik over those two legs though. He scored 2 goals, laid numerous chances on a plate (even in the 2nd leg) and he's not responsible for how his team defends. He was by far the top scorer in the CL, far better than Van Djik in the competition overall (van djik should have been banned after that horror tackle vs Napoli) and also won his domestic league with an insane amount of goals and assists, pretty much carrying them to that title.


And yes, they were missing two players .. but as a side, Liverpool are far better coached than Barcelona are right now. They rely less on individual assets like Messi, that and it was a fluke night in which everything went right for them and everything went wrong for Barca. This happens in the champions league, it's an unpredictable bitch of a competition and individual awards should never be handed out based on one off knockout games. Messi tore up the whole competition and had one under par night and apparently that means VVD had a better season. Ok??

Look, again these awards mean very little .. but we're not seriously arguing Van Djik played better than Messi did this season, right? Like who out there is consistently watching both of these players perform and thinking Van Djik looks better?

Bingo.

VVD winning this award is more about the nature of the award than him being the best player of last season, or the greatest ever PL CB. He was very good, no doubt. But the hyperbole surrounding him is absurd.

 

[Infordin]

but then again his side didn't blow a 3-0 lead to a side with their B team forwards playing in a CL semi final.

I still cannot believe that we managed to lose 4-0 to a team that fielded Origi and Shaqiri up top. It haunts me.

 

[Eddy_JukeZ]

I can already tell Messi isn't winning the Ballon D'Or.

I think he's getting voters' fatigue. It happened to MJ for regular season MVP awards in the NBA(especially the 96-97 season - a farce).

No one with a straight face can say he wasn't the best player during the entirety of last season.

It's been a while since the gap was that big between the best and 2nd best player(probably Van Dijk for the season).

 

[RedRonaldo]

It’s just the same as Modric winning it last year. His stats are poor, he isn’t anywhere the near best player at club level, and he is no way better than Xavi or Inesta as best midfielder in past decade. You may argue last year is different because it’s WC year, but fact is he didn’t even win the WC to begin with.

 

[Halftrack]

Admit it. Liverpool now have the best pair of fullbacks in the world, together with the greatest defender in the PL history (The first ever defender to win it over Messi/Ronaldo).
If you think otherwise, you are just being jealous of them. Unless we ourselves beat them in a match, we have no right to doubt their players. It will sound like sour grapes.

No white text?

 

[giorno]

Still annoys me how easily Liverpool got Van Dijk. Seemed to be basically unopposed, especially after they had already fecked Southampton off with a previous pursuit. All the top teams in Europe should have been in a bidding war

There was supposed to be a bidding war for him involving chelsea and city. Liverpool convincing him to turn them down(thus killing that prospect for s'oton) and then bragging about it was why they had to wait 6 months and fork out £75m in transfer fee for him

Costacurta called him the most improved player in the world today. Have to agree with that. If you told me 3 years ago that he would become not only the best CB in the world but one that would belong in the same category as the likes of Cannavaro, Thuram, Rio(at least in terms of ability), i'd have laughed at you. And i don't think i'd be alone in that

 

[giorno]

Voter's fatigue is a real thing. Same reason why Jordan wasn't MVP every single year of his career even though he was far and away the best player during his entire Bulls career.

This is part of it. Van Dijk was the best player in the PL and the best player in the CL final, on a team that won the CL, while also being amazing in the nations league. He deserved the award. Messi also would have deserved the award. That's where voter's fatigue kicks in

Same thing with Modric last year

 

[Kush]

This is part of it. Van Dijk was the best player in the PL and the best player in the CL final, on a team that won the CL, while also being amazing in the nations league. He deserved the award. Messi also would have deserved the award. That's where voter's fatigue kicks in

Same thing with Modric last year

The trend was already set last year. Ronaldo scored in first 10 CL games but didn't score any goal in CL SF/F which sealed his fate, Modrics' amazing WC only contributed to it. I don't think Messi or Ronaldo are winning another Ballon d'Or for scoring 50 goals in a season and winning the domestic league unless they win the CL AND score in the SFs/F.

I still cannot believe that we managed to lose 4-0 to a team that fielded Origi and Shaqiri up top. It haunts me.

Don't forget Wijnaldum scoring a brace that night too... I mean what can you say about that?

These away KO ties in CL have been Barcas' Achilles heel for a while now.

 

[Coxy]

The negativity in the first page is hilarious.

Congrats to him - fully deserved for last years performances

 

[Beagle]

The award is obviously based on vague and maybe even irrelevant criteria. But if you rate this guy as a top 10 CB in the PL years, that's being very biased. His ability and compousre puts him in absolute elite company. Granted he needs to maintain these levels for a few years but assuming that happens, he's definitely in the top 3 defenders I've watched (from around 2000).

 

[JustAGuest]

Based on individual performances it has got to be Messi without a doubt, I guess winning the CL is being heavily weighted here?

 

[#00F]

Sometimes trying to prove that you are the best is an insult.

 

[Marcus]

Congrats and well done. I don't think he is paid what he is worth at Liverpool. Time for the big clubs to circle and for his agent to start agitating for a move to his 'dream' club. Come on you journalists, time for some VVD to Madrid/Barcelona stories.

 

[El Zoido]

I can't believe the effect that he has had on them since the beginning of 2018. They were celebrating a draw with West Brom in the beginning of 2017-2018, but now, with the abuse that I get from my liverpool supporting friends on a daily basis, if they ever win the PL, I might have go underground.

Brace yourself because they’re winning it this season.

 

[Donaldo]

I don't think @RooneyLegend has made one sensible point in this thread.

This is an improvement.