Would you sack or keep Ole? (Poll reopened)

[Adnan]

The truth is Ole doesn't have the credit in the bank from his earlier managerial exploits. Infact his previous stint in the EPL was very dissapointing at Cardiff. So people need to understand why many fans would be receptive to giving more time to someone who has never shown the ability to manage at EPL level, nevermind a club with United's aspirations.

I also keep seeing posts where Ole knowing the club and having United DNA is some sort of way to put forward his case to make us challengers again. I'd like to remind you guys that our two greatest managers (Sir Matt & Sir Alex) were both non United men and never had the United DNA before they arrived at United. Busby played most of his career at Man City and Liverpool and Fergie was Glasgow Rangers through and through.

In Ole's defence we could say he wasn't backed or if his last press conference is anything to go by, the players he wanted weren't available. So if that is the case then the club can't be entirely faulted and Ole has to be criticized too. Has he sacrificed a entire season in the hope of signing his preferred targets for potential longterm gain? Allowing Smalling, Lukaku, Sanchez, Fellaini, Herrera to depart without getting replacements is criminal.

Are there managers out there that are significantly better than Ole at Coaching football? The answer to that is a resounding YES. Would Manchester United have a better chance at closing the gap to Liverpool & City with another manager? I would answer yes without hesitation.

I love Ole for what he did for the club. But my love for my club over rides all sentiments.

 

[RedDevilRoshi]

Do you know what those who support Ole are just doing it out of blind faith with no logic or realism & their not going to change their minds even if we finish mid table as it’s all a long long process or plan or something.

So enjoy us in mediocrity & going nowhere

Nope. Point out/quote the poster that said “I’m happy we are a mediocre mid-table team and don’t seem to be going anywhere”.

Our problems stem much further than the manager. The problem at the club and it has been for a long time is Ed Woodward.

Woodward should be at the firing line way, way before Ole. If anyone is to lose their job or have it severely scrutinised, it is that fraudster of a man.

People wanting the likes of Pochettino, Nagglesman etc brought in but do you honestly think they will be an instant success here working under this present infrastructure? Absolutely no chance. You must be seriously deluded if you think everything will change with a new manager. Even Guardiola would struggle to work under this infrastructure. We’ve hired and sacked managers before and where has that taken us? Under any new manager working under this present setup at Utd, we will have a honeymoon period like you get when you hire a new guy in, everything will look all happy clappy, saying “we are back” etc but then all of a sudden when that one bad result comes then all s*** will hit the pan. That’s what has happened in the past under all the managers Woodward has appointed and it's happening again right now. People desperate for the manager to go thinking that’s the solution all over again just so they can go through a “honeymoon period” all over again. Another new manager coming in means another re-build from the very start and our fanbase doesn’t have the patience to go through one of them again.

Woodward is the reason we’ve got into such a big mess.

Take City for example, they were preparing for Guardiola’s arrival way before he was officially appointed. The owners had already brought in the likes of Bergstein & Soriano, guys that he enjoyed so much success with at Barca. The way Guardiola had his Barca team playing was the exact same blueprint they wanted the City team to be like. We don’t have no structure or vision like that. Just wanting to get back to the top but no plan on how too other than hoping overnight, everything clicks and both City & Liverpool suffer a major meltdown that allows us to sneak back in.

 

[ChrisNelson]

or accept that we might have a lean season while we rebuild the team

Genuine question regarding the sentence above.

Do you think that City, and now Liverpool would now accept a lean season while they rebuild the team? With the vast, vast resources of the clubs at the top I think the fans have a right to expect the club at least holds its own and continues to challenge for trophies while the rebuilding process goes on.

Just because there have been changes of managers doesn't mean we can just sit back and write seasons off - because we will watch our rivals pull even further ahead of us so by the time the rebuilding is complete it will need another one to bridge the gap to the top.

I'm sorry to say it but OGS was never the right man to sort out the mess our club has been allowed to become.

 

[DRM]

What do you know about Allegri? What's his philosophy? Relationship with the board? How does he setup his team? How does he deal with a poorly assembled squad? What's his record at Milan when the team was gutted (similar to us)?

Or are you just throwing a brand name coach out there?

What do you know about Allegri? - Quite a bit actually - he's won 4 Seria A titles on the bounce including 4 Coppa Italia's
What's his philosophy? He can get his teams to score more than 1 goal a game and not shit the bed when they concede a goal. Doesnt get rid of attacking players without finding adequate replacements.
Relationship with the board? - Fine
How does he setup his team? To win
How does he deal with a poorly assembled squad? - Does not throw his toys out of the pram ala Mourinho
What's his record at Milan when the team was gutted - Won the league with them.


Anything else you would like to know?

 

[Giggsyking]

You should add another option sack in December if things go south

 

[VP89]

What do you know about Allegri? - Quite a bit actually - he's won 4 Seria A titles on the bounce including 4 Coppa Italia's
What's his philosophy? He can get his teams to score more than 1 goal a game and not shit the bed when they concede a goal. Doesnt get rid of attacking players without finding adequate replacements.
Relationship with the board? - Fine
How does he setup his team? To win
How does he deal with a poorly assembled squad? - Does not throw his toys out of the pram ala Mourinho
What's his record at Milan when the team was gutted - Won the league with them.


Anything else you would like to know?

He didn't really react well versus us when conceding. I recall Juve fans being broadly annoyed at his defensive approach to seeing out games when there is a narrow lead, rather than putting the game to bed. Quite sure many posters on their fan forum labelled him a coward at various points in the season.

Winning a one horse league is nothing to shout about.

The board had enough of him too, wasn't it?

 

[Mainoldo]

Better yes, enough to stop them getting relegated probably not. Would Pep be able to keep my Sunday league team in the PL?

Would Lionel Messi? This is an odd debate.

 

[matt10000]

What do you know about Ole?

 

[charlenefan]

But why? This is what I don't get with fans who want him to stay, what are you backing and why do you think Ole is the right manager?

Speaking only for myself I'm still backing him because his philosophy is right and that's not something we cant say about the 3 previous managers before him

Moyes - who knows what he was trying to do
LVG - his possession based sideways passing boring football
Mourinho - his short termism

Solskjaer is building a team for the future, not for the next year or two when it inevitably will have to be torn up and started over again. Lets say we sack Ole and get Allegri (picking him because of the story that emerged last night) is he going to continue with the path Ole has started us down or is he going to switch tact and go for more Mourinho style signings again?

I've said countless times I dont believe Ole is the man who's going to win us league titles so unless we can replace Ole with an upgrade that shares his beliefs (buying young players/promoting youth) then it's just another reset. The most obvious candidate to build on what Ole has started would probably be Poch but there's an element of damaged goods about him at the moment

 

[Bilbo]

Do you know what those who support Ole are just doing it out of blind faith with no logic or realism & their not going to change their minds even if we finish mid table as it’s all a long long process or plan or something.

So enjoy us in mediocrity & going nowhere

You would have fired Ferguson before he had a chance to succeed here - thank about that for a second. The two most successful periods in our history have come from stability and having the balls to see something through.

I am not suggesting that Ole is or will ever be at that standard before the hate posts by the way. My point is that we have lots of proof in our own clubs DNA that long term planning can work, and also lots of proof that knee jerk decision making does not.

 

[Maticmaker]

"A journey of a thousand miles starts with the first step"... so said somebody, who was apparently a wise man.

Fitness and speed are not ends in themselves but they had been missing from United's tired looking play. Ole has also managed to move out one or two who were either square pegs in round holes, or just not good enough. His first three 'buys' are looking good, McTominay is flourishing as Matic runs down, youngsters like Greenwood are getting their chances, the manager is beginning to build the squad he wants, but he's still some way off, both in terms of personnel and the way they play.
I don't think there is anywhere else to go (in terms of managers) whilst we retain the current structure within the club. Ole knows the standard required and he also must realise we are someway off it just now. The key will be the rate of development and whether some of the 'known unknowns' i.e. will Pogba and De Gea stay, and if they do will they hit top (world class) form consistently or be reasonably consistent?

Yes we could look for top managers/coaches around the World, two of the best are quite close, Pep/Klopp but they are not coming to United!

 

[Massive Spanner]

You would have fired Ferguson before he had a chance to succeed here - thank about that for a second. The two most successful periods in our history have come from stability and having the balls to see something through.

I am not suggesting that Ole is or will ever be at that standard before the hate posts by the way. My point is that we have lots of proof in our own clubs DNA that long term planning can work, and also lots of proof that knee jerk decision making does not.

Hiring Ole was epitome of a knee jerk decision, though.

What have we seen so far to suggest there's long term planning involved here, other than signing some British players and getting rid of some under-performing ones.. is that it? I haven't seen any signs of him bringing a structure, enforcing his own style of play etc. I haven't seen anything else from the club to suggest they're changing the way decisions are made or how the manager is backed.

 

[Bilbo]

Genuine question regarding the sentence above.

Do you think that City, and now Liverpool would now accept a lean season while they rebuild the team? With the vast, vast resources of the clubs at the top I think the fans have a right to expect the club at least holds its own and continues to challenge for trophies while the rebuilding process goes on.

Just because there have been changes of managers doesn't mean we can just sit back and write seasons off - because we will watch our rivals pull even further ahead of us so by the time the rebuilding is complete it will need another one to bridge the gap to the top.

I'm sorry to say it but OGS was never the right man to sort out the mess our club has been allowed to become.

Nobody is writing off a season or saying we shouldn't try our best to squeeze what we can out of this season, but I do think they would looked at the squad and realised that we are light in certain areas and this is likely going to impact us. We are still very much in four competitions by the way - 3 cups to try and win and a top 4 place to achieve. None of those are currently beyond us and I think we will strengthen in January.

I think the view is that we aren't going to be able to compete with City and Liverpool in this current cycle - too much investment would be needed in a short space of time. The plan is to build a new squad from the ground up over the next 2-3 years and if all goes well we will be in a strong position when those teams age or start to decline.

 

[AneRu]

Genuine question regarding the sentence above.

Do you think that City, and now Liverpool would now accept a lean season while they rebuild the team? With the vast, vast resources of the clubs at the top I think the fans have a right to expect the club at least holds its own and continues to challenge for trophies while the rebuilding process goes on.

Just because there have been changes of managers doesn't mean we can just sit back and write seasons off - because we will watch our rivals pull even further ahead of us so by the time the rebuilding is complete it will need another one to bridge the gap to the top.

I'm sorry to say it but OGS was never the right man to sort out the mess our club has been allowed to become.

This, I reiterate that Ole is being criticized because he is not top of the log he is being criticized because he is failing to arrest the slide that's begun last season and continues to do things that haven't worked. If we fail this season the rebuild will be affected as we won't be able to attract the players we need whilst the teams above just pull ahead.

For Ole to stay he has to show it on the pitch in matches that he is the guy to pull us up the table. We can't keep a manager in hope without evidence of him being capable to achieve the bare minimum.

 

[Leftback99]

Would Lionel Messi? This is an odd debate.

The poster is basically saying that Pep could take any PL team (like Cardiff) to the Europa without buying anyone. It's nonsense.

 

[Sky1981]

Ole has been a manager for 10 years. If he has any ideas and phylosophy we would have seen it reflected at his previous club.

The result of that might vary according to the resources at his disposal. But it's absurd to think that he's moyes with cardiff and now he's saf with us. The man is the same man, fresh from molde. It's not like he took a 5 years sabbatical to enhance his understanding of the game.

We should just dig on his molde years to see what his phylosophy looks like. He's had a good few years there, should be enough to know what is his end game.

 

[Sky1981]

The poster is basically saying that Pep could take any PL team (like Cardiff) to the Europa without buying anyone. It's nonsense.

Yeah. Because eddie howe cant take Bournemouth to midtable. It's nonsense.

 

[Sky1981]

You would have fired Ferguson before he had a chance to succeed here - thank about that for a second. The two most successful periods in our history have come from stability and having the balls to see something through.

I am not suggesting that Ole is or will ever be at that standard before the hate posts by the way. My point is that we have lots of proof in our own clubs DNA that long term planning can work, and also lots of proof that knee jerk decision making does not.

Correction. SAF works.

Same patience, same long term planning without saf won't work.

Saf made it work, not the mere 6 years given to him.

 

[Leftback99]

Yeah. Because eddie howe cant take Bournemouth to midtable. It's nonsense.

With Bournemouth's squad you think they should finish bottom?

Put it another way. If every team was managed by Pep one team would finish bottom. You're saying that team would finish Europa. No chance.

 

[Adnan]

Correction. SAF works.

Same patience, same long term planning without saf won't work.

Saf made it work, not the mere 6 years given to him.

Saf also had credit in the bank by being very successful at Aberdeen winning 3 league titles and even beating Real Madrid in a European final. Saf was given the reigns at United on merit. He was given time because he had a track record of success in building winning teams.

 

[tomaldinho1]

Speaking only for myself I'm still backing him because his philosophy is right and that's not something we cant say about the 3 previous managers before him

Moyes - who knows what he was trying to do
LVG - his possession based sideways passing boring football
Mourinho - his short termism

Solskjaer is building a team for the future, not for the next year or two when it inevitably will have to be torn up and started over again. Lets say we sack Ole and get Allegri (picking him because of the story that emerged last night) is he going to continue with the path Ole has started us down or is he going to switch tact and go for more Mourinho style signings again?

I've said countless times I dont believe Ole is the man who's going to win us league titles so unless we can replace Ole with an upgrade that shares his beliefs (buying young players/promoting youth) then it's just another reset. The most obvious candidate to build on what Ole has started would probably be Poch but there's an element of damaged goods about him at the moment

I understand the thinking but I think it kind of applies to most managers, if you look outside of the 'big' coaches in world football. My concerns with Ole are many but two points in particular are lack of past experiences (I can't see what we're building towards) and also the fact that I see no evidence of the high pressing, attacking football he has spoken so much about on the pitch.

The first part we can't really change but it's a factor - he is almost completely unproven. The second is probably what worries me the most because I don't see a difference between hiring Ole and any other former player with limited coaching experience, he can say all the right things but he's never coached an elite team, he didn't play in a team that aggressively pressed and he never played in a team that was as poor as ours. United now is completely different to United when he was playing. I just think whoever we have as our manager is a risk with the new strategy of younger players (which I also agree is a good plan by the way) but we should at least be mitigating that risk by bringing in someone with more experience in the style we are apparently trying to implement. You could probably point to at least 10 other PL managers and rationally think they'd be a better bet than Ole, the only difference is he is an ex player.

 

[Sky1981]

With Bournemouth's squad you think they should finish bottom?

So it wasnt moyes fault we finished 7th? So you can just pluck ole to bournemouth and they'll finish 6th?

Because hey, good managers doesnt mean a thing? Might as well give it to giggsy then

 

[John Blund]

I'm supporting Ole, and I'm looking at our transfers, in and out, how the players behave both on the field and in the media (all supports Ole, generally looks happier than we've done since SAF left us). And the fact at we're not converting chances is not something Ole - he's not playing anymore. If we look at the xG-table, we should be having more points than we do, and over time these stats usually evens out. In other words, if we brought in another Ole, we'd expect to gain more points than we have done so far - and the "new Ole" would be praised for improving the results.

Stick by our man, he's a bigger fan than most of us, and he gets the club.

 

[Rafaeldagold]

Saf also had credit in the bank by being very successful at Aberdeen winning 3 league titles and even beating Real Madrid in a European final. Saf was given the reigns at United on merit. He was given time because he had a track record of success in building winning teams.

They’re a lost cause. No use using reason or logic with them.

We’ll be doomed with Ole for a while yet unfortunately

 

[OleTheGreat]

No manager on this planet can actually change this squad into a championship winning squad nor can anyone really push for top4 with this squad but i think Ole will find a way like SAF did during the 92' season. We will get a total overhaul of this squad in the next couple of windows and things are gonna drastically change. We are going to have a lot of depth and composure in the team while playing defensive teams.

I'm rooting for Ole20!!

 

[Rafaeldagold]

No manager on this planet can actually change this squad into a championship winning squad nor can anyone really push for top4 with this squad but i think Ole will find a way like SAF did during the 92' season. We will get a total overhaul of this squad in the next couple of windows and things are gonna drastically change. We are going to have a lot of depth and composure in the team while playing defensive teams.

I'm rooting for Ole20!!

As I said above, we’re doomed.

 

[Bestietom]

No manager on this planet can actually change this squad into a championship winning squad nor can anyone really push for top4 with this squad but i think Ole will find a way like SAF did during the 92' season. We will get a total overhaul of this squad in the next couple of windows and things are gonna drastically change. We are going to have a lot of depth and composure in the team while playing defensive teams.

I'm rooting for Ole20!!

I will go along with this.

 

[Leftback99]

So it wasnt moyes fault we finished 7th? So you can just pluck ole to bournemouth and they'll finish 6th?

Because hey, good managers doesnt mean a thing? Might as well give it to giggsy then

No they'll finish around the same mid table give or take a couple of places in line with the quality of their squad.

Don't you think it's odd that no hidden gem manager even breaks the top 6 if they are worth so many points?

 

[momo83]

This.

+ We live in the Age of Trolls, where shite, cnut, crap and delusional are the favorite words for a lot of our "fans/supporters" when talking about our own team and staff.

We are 7 games into the season and we will be spending in January, yet some in here talk about relegation. Come on! This makeover-process is not made over night, and it might even get worse before it gets better, but it will never come to that.

From the last couple of seasons with SAF and through Moyes, LVG and Mourinho we haven't played attractive football. LVG's and Mourinho's football philosophies are actually depressingly defensive and cynical. We all want to see Man United attacking, dominating and winning again, but for that to happen the team needs to be rebuilt. A rebuild is impossible if we toss the long term project overboard and sack the manager every time the team has a dip in form. Ole must be given the time and money to see that project through, then we can see if he has the skillset required to be the next top manager. Not before! Even if that means some bad performances and losing to midtable teams every now and then this season.

If LVG’s philosophy is defensive then so is Pep’s.

 

[Halal Jalal]

No manager on this planet can actually change this squad into a championship winning squad nor can anyone really push for top4 with this squad but i think Ole will find a way like SAF did during the 92' season. We will get a total overhaul of this squad in the next couple of windows and things are gonna drastically change. We are going to have a lot of depth and composure in the team while playing defensive teams.

I'm rooting for Ole20!!

What the hell

Ole has already been exposed as utterly clueless and out of his depth but yeah sure, he's gonna transform into SAF any day now!

Strongly disagreed about our Top 4 chance this season too. Obviously it's not going to happen with the Molde manager in charge (not even Top 6 most likely) but a top manager could still guide us to CL qualification, assuming we get rid of Ole as soon as possible. Liverpool and City are out of reach for foreseeable future but the rest aren't particulary strong - Arsenal can't defend, Spurs are falling apart, Chelsea have a novice manager and no striker. Get Allegri, give him some money to spend in January and I believe he could finish 3rd.

 

[golden_blunder]

He is. But there is also no excuse for not coaching current players into the semblance of an attack. These are not mutually exclusive problems - the club needs change in both upper and team management.

I don’t agree.. yet. I’d like to see what he can do with his own players and a bit more time. I’d like to see us use the pitch width a lot more and stretch teams but we really need to address that RW!

 

[Sky1981]

No they'll finish around the same mid table give or take a couple of places in line with the quality of their squad.

Don't you think it's odd that no hidden gem manager even breaks the top 6 if they are worth so many points?

So mourinho is a genious for finishind 2nd? Or was it the player?

If it's the player, why are we so shit now? Practically the same squad minus deadwoods plus 2 great defender

 

[golden_blunder]

Ole is still adding to his coaching team

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.iri...r-news/man-utd-appoint-coach-who-20332703.amp

It’s a work in progress, we should afford him more time

 

[Sir Scott McToMinay]

What the hell

Ole has already been exposed as utterly clueless and out of his depth but yeah sure, he's gonna transform into SAF any day now!

Strongly disagreed about our Top 4 chance this season too. Obviously it's not going to happen with the Molde manager in charge (not even Top 6 most likely) but a top manager could still guide us to CL qualification, assuming we get rid of Ole as soon as possible. Liverpool and City are out of reach for foreseeable future but the rest aren't particulary strong - Arsenal can't defend, Spurs are falling apart, Chelsea have a novice manager and no striker. Get Allegri, give him some money to spend in January and I believe he could finish 3rd.

At what cost though?
Are we prepared to sleep through matches week in week out just to finish top 4 and the occasional decent cup run?
Allegri is an inferior manager to Jose Mourinho and arguably Van Gaal imo, wouldn’t it be better to try and build something with a younger and a hungry manager like Nagelsmann with a creative vision and a modern approach, who could get us up there when Klopp or Pep would leave for an other club or take a break?

I don’t think Allegri is a manager who could get us out of our seats and be excited about football, and I don’t think he’s a Simeone level manager who could ever come close to challenging Pep or Klopp in this league.

Seriously, we as supporters, we aren’t getting paid anything, we don’t get any medals, I simply don’t accept the notion that winning is literally the only thing that matters, it ain’t worth it dreading watching matches for, every week.
Fair enough with Jose, his teams played great football at times, I’ve never ever seen an Allegri team play good football.

No from me.

 

[Leftback99]

So mourinho is a genious for finishind 2nd? Or was it the player?

If it's the player, why are we so shit now? Practically the same squad minus deadwoods plus 2 great defender

You mean the one he said was one of his best achievements? He was right.

6th the season before and left us in 6th, that's what we are with one of the greatest ever managers.

 

[Rafaeldagold]

Ole is still adding to his coaching team

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.iri...r-news/man-utd-appoint-coach-who-20332703.amp

It’s a work in progress, we should afford him more time

He was assistant to former Wales international midfielder Carl Robinson in Vancouver for four years until both were sacked in October 2018.

Sounds better than Ole to be fair, maybe if he’s good at coaching he can take over as we need that right now

 

[Ainu]

He didn't really react well versus us when conceding. I recall Juve fans being broadly annoyed at his defensive approach to seeing out games when there is a narrow lead, rather than putting the game to bed. Quite sure many posters on their fan forum labelled him a coward at various points in the season.

Winning a one horse league is nothing to shout about.

The board had enough of him too, wasn't it?

Well he did manage to win that one horse league with two different horses.

 

[glazed]

It's irrelevant. He's not the problem.

 

[mjstokes85]

I think sacking Moyes, LVG and Jose shows that sacking a manager achieves nothing, stick with him.

 

[Mainoldo]

I'm supporting Ole, and I'm looking at our transfers, in and out, how the players behave both on the field and in the media (all supports Ole, generally looks happier than we've done since SAF left us). And the fact at we're not converting chances is not something Ole - he's not playing anymore. If we look at the xG-table, we should be having more points than we do, and over time these stats usually evens out. In other words, if we brought in another Ole, we'd expect to gain more points than we have done so far - and the "new Ole" would be praised for improving the results.

Stick by our man, he's a bigger fan than most of us, and he gets the club.

If he gets he club he would walk. Ole would look terrible working under Ole. He’d look like Javier Hernandez playing for West Ham.