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Firstly, it is not completely apparent to everyone. As I mentioned in the rest of my post, he's working with an incredibly light squad further decimated by injuries. Ole is an unknown quantity at this level but even highly experienced managers would struggle in his position.So, to be clear, even if it's completely apparent to everyone that he is unfit to manage the club and we are going nowhere under him, he should still be allowed to follow through because six months ago the club made an idiotic decision to hire him fulltime?
Or maybe try to understand the post before calling it terrible logic?It's really silly logic. Look, I understand that if the club feels "youth, energy, attack" is the direction we've chosen, and more importantly, truly believe in, then we should stick to it (if we continue to believe in it). However these principals are NOT patented by and the trademark of Ole. It was nice and all that he copy pasted it from Sir Alex but that ideology can exist without him. And if he's proving incompetent in fully realising that ideology, then it's common sense that somebody more competent should carry it out.
If one believes in Ole then fine. But don't use such terrible logic in justifying sticking with him.
How about when we are 17th in the Championship.Happy to give OLE 2 more years and then I think it would be prudent to reassess our progress in relation to transfer windows and performances.
I saw some signs of progress and cohesion at the start of the season, that was derailed by crucial injuries. Clearly far from the finished article but the stats suggest we did enough to win more games and would usually have more points.The match on Sunday won't really prove anything, one way or the other. They are the best team in the league and they'll attack which is the only way we can actually score, so strangely, it might suit us. Or we might get totally destroyed. It's the 5 games after this one that will really count.
Recruitment is key but I have definite doubts about the decision-makers of our recruitment under the previous three managers so structure comes into that. We had a good summer in so far that we didn't buy bad players, ill-fitting players, drama-queens. But absolutely terrible when you consider the lack of bodies for midfield, to address the elephant in the room. And we may also have paid well over the odds for Maguire.
I was happy to see Lukaku and Darmian sold, even Sanchez shipped off on a loan, as well as Smalling. It would obviously have been better to sell them, but alright. However, this "new journey" Woodward has talked about is neither new nor is it well prepared. We had months to find suitable targets and we failed. There is no way 50+ scouts and a bunch of analysts cannot find a couple of midfielders that fit a long-term plan as well as not being disruptive twats in the dressing room. It doesn't add up. Was it a money saving exercise or does our "recruitment team" alienate players 90% of the time?
Crucially we have not yet seen any signs of progression in the team's style of play or its cohesion under Ole. Yes, it's not all on him but he selects his backroom staff, and he's done little but gush over how amazing it all is. Moyes was rightfully ridiculed for having replaced everyone with his elite Everton buddies, but our coaches now all have question marks hanging over them. Certainly not elite.
I think we lost a lot when Faria decided to up and go. Certainly aligns with our free fall into mediocre territory and ever more frequent injury pile ups. I'd be a lot more comfortable with Ole at the helm if he had 2-3 proven top coaches.
Only 2, are you mad? Give him at least 4 ffs. What he has shown so far here and elsewhere as a manager was nothing short of amazing, i fear big clubs will poach him from us in the future.Happy to give OLE 2 more years and then I think it would be prudent to reassess our progress in relation to transfer windows and performances.
Depends what were LVG and Mourinho´s plans for long term success. Where there any?I'm not one for blind faith. SAF was given time but he had proven pedigree, keeping LVG or Mourinho would've been much smarter moves if we're going down the route of short term pain to trust a manager for long term success.
I trust him to fight relegation.Only 2, are you mad? Give him at least 4 ffs. What he has shown so far here and elsewhere as a manager was nothing short of amazing, i fear big clubs will poach him from us in the future.
Kappa? must be a City fan !He doesn't need time or respect
As a manger he's been awful for the club, he needs to get out.
Starting with the last point, which definitely merits discussion. We probably did need to clear wages if we were to recruit - maybe we could have carried some unwanted extra cost for a season just to make sure we weren't leaving us too thin (which we did). But with regards to planning, I wonder if we tried aggressively to ship out more who the club knew probably in April/May weren't in Ole's plans. I doubt it. It's not unlikely that we could have sold Smalling, Rojo and one of Bailly/Jones if we had been willing to accept less than the club valued them at, biting the bullet. But we actually extended the contracts of Smalling and Jones after Ole arrived, didn't we? Probably a slight increase too on their deals. Bailly might have still fetched suitors had he not injured himself in pre-season, but again, could probably have been sold months prior. It's also pretty clear Ole doesn't fancy Matic, maybe that's a later development, but it's likely he'd fetch suitors. Point being, I think we definitely could have sold more players had there been serious planning and a clear vision from the time it dawned on Ole that this squad is seriously flawed in terms of quality and character, and of course balance.I saw some signs of progress and cohesion at the start of the season, that was derailed by crucial injuries. Clearly far from the finished article but the stats suggest we did enough to win more games and would usually have more points.
We will never know who exactly is to blame for not bringing in more players in the summer, Ole was clear that he wanted more so for me it is Woodward and the negotiation team who take most of the blame.
On the money side, it is probable that we needed to offload Lukaku and Sanchez before bringing in replacements and those deals came late in the window - transfer fees are not an issue for us, but there are limits on the wage bill and we have been over the usual maximum 50% wage ratio. That kind of limitation can only be blamed on the Glazers, Woodward and co - I am sure we have big funds to spend in January and next summer, but results will have to improve for Ole to make it that far.
The point @amolbhatia50k makes is still valid. The idea to pursue youth, energy and attacking football with the right characters, doesn't require Ole Gunnar Solskjaer to be in control. Granted, it's tricky to find an interim manager but Ole could be sacked today and these aims still be in place. A DoF would be tasked with ensuring it, but the club can still keep the same model (without a DoF) and look for a better manager pursuing the same ideals. You can't retain a manager just because he has noble ideals. He's got to have some leverage. And what's the leverage? All I can see is that it's difficult for the club to make a change at this stage of the season.Or maybe try to understand the post before calling it terrible logic?
The club needs a long term direction to avoid a continuation of the terrible decisions being made over the recruitment and retention of the playing squad. They have decided to have the manager dictate that process. If that's the case and they task him with a long term rebuild in the summer, how can you sack him in October?
If he's not the man, they need to implement a proper structure with the right people in place to implement the long term rebuild before changing the manager and going in another completely different direction.
You cant have that much squad churn in one window - need some kind of continuity even at the start of a rebuild, a lot of players left this year and clearly we needed more players not less in the end. But long term the likes of Matic, Mata and Young will be replaced by younger models and I would trust Ole to identify the right players for the club.Starting with the last point, which definitely merits discussion. We probably did need to clear wages if we were to recruit - maybe we could have carried some unwanted extra cost for a season just to make sure we weren't leaving us too thin (which we did). But with regards to planning, I wonder if we tried aggressively to ship out more who the club knew probably in April/May weren't in Ole's plans. I doubt it. It's not unlikely that we could have sold Smalling, Rojo and one of Bailly/Jones if we had been willing to accept less than the club valued them at, biting the bullet. But we actually extended the contracts of Smalling and Jones after Ole arrived, didn't we? Probably a slight increase too on their deals. Bailly might have still fetched suitors had he not injured himself in pre-season, but again, could probably have been sold months prior. It's also pretty clear Ole doesn't fancy Matic, maybe that's a later development, but it's likely he'd fetch suitors. Point being, I think we definitely could have sold more players had there been serious planning and a clear vision from the time it dawned on Ole that this squad is seriously flawed in terms of quality and character, and of course balance.
I don't remember Ole talking about wanting a midfielder, other than maybe a creative one. I think we could have done with many types of midfielders, not simply in terms of progressing the team, but simply because of lack of bodies.
And the last point, I agree that injuries have played a huge role - and I wonder whether the coaching is at fault there. But, shame as it is, I didn't really see too much to keep the hope going that Ole will come good. So far his pros since the end of last season IMV are: Bought players who fit. Sold two who didn't. Promoted Tuanzebe to 3rd choice CB. Gave chances to Williams and Greenwood. While (some of) the cons are: Seems to have only one approach to games. Tactically inflexible. Left the squad too thin this summer - at leats partly responsible given his endorsement of all things club related. In-game management seems missing. Our set pieces are the worst they've ever been. Doesn't seem to carry any authority - the penalty takers situation, the double standard on the players he sold "because they didn't want to be here" or "we want the right characters" and then brushing off questions about Pogba doing his own fitness thing in Dubai whilst talking to Zidane when the club is in crisis. I know he's positive but he comes across as really naive. I love him but I just don't love him as a manager. He's friend-zoned for me.
This is starting to look pathetic. These articles, Neville interview...it sounds like all those shit in countries which have dictator ; " Look what our great leader did. In school, he was already best in his class, with 15y he already was leader in his community and with 18y he finished his 4th book...."Bored of these articles, you give Ole time relegation is a foreseeable possibility.
Have they really been that good? James has been a pleasant surprise, I suppose, but he still looks very much a work in progress. AWB looks good, but memories of Darmian's strong start give me pause when lauding AWB a big success, especially since he's missed a few games, and the attacking side of his game hasn't been great. I think Maguire will be solid for us, but so far I don't think he's been that great; certainly not a huge upgrade over Smalling.I would give him more time because I think his vision for the team is a good one and I think he is making progress towards it. The results are bad because our attack is so poor but I put that down to player quality. Given how good his signings have been so far I am willing to give him at least the January window to make another signing or two in this area.
I kind of agree and I think all 3 have done well so far. Patience and objective analysis works both ways in that you don't write off a player with a few bad games initially (see Evra and Vidic) and you don't proclaim players great signings after a handful of good games (Darmian, Depay and Di Maria were mega flops here but they all started pretty well)Have they really been that good? James has been a pleasant surprise, I suppose, but he still looks very much a work in progress. AWB looks good, but memories of Darmian's strong start give me pause when lauding AWB a big success, especially since he's missed a few games, and the attacking side of his game hasn't been great. I think Maguire will be solid for us, but so far I don't think he's been that great; certainly not a huge upgrade over Smalling.
Can you please stop being objective here?I mean if you want to respect him based on his past accomplishments 20 years ago, its only fair if certain fans absolutely hates him for what he is doing to the club now? Both are sentimental reactions.
You can't be accepting on and rejecting another.
Rashford, mata, James, lingard, greenwood or even lukaku aren't world beaters, granted. But they still better players than 50% of the teams in the league. Oles failure is not at getting the team to win or falling to climb the table. His failure is at fundamental levels like player movements, optimization is performance, coaching and selection.I would give him more time because I think his vision for the team is a good one and I think he is making progress towards it. The results are bad because our attack is so poor but I put that down to player quality. Given how good his signings have been so far I am willing to give him at least the January window to make another signing or two in this area.
Cheers to that mate.Ole has respect as a player, he has to earn it all over again as a manager.
It's not about his resume. We've done the whole "been successful at other clubs" malarchy and that didn't work so we have to try something different and by different I mean let a less skilled manager work his magic and rebuild usOnly 2, are you mad? Give him at least 4 ffs. What he has shown so far here and elsewhere as a manager was nothing short of amazing, i fear big clubs will poach him from us in the future.
We don’t need them to fly. If they can float that will be enough.Pigs might fly.
Wrong. It's inspiration for some "MU" supporters.GREAT ARTICLE!
This article is inspiring for any MU supporter.
Anyone commenting on this thread and moaning that Solskjær should be sacked is either of these two things:
1. Has not read this article.
2. Is a glory hunter looking for a quick fix.
I think his signings have been pretty good. Definitely like the 'direction'. 26 and below. However, there's no need for us to hail them before they make a real and tangible impact. As far as I can see, they're all solid additions but are they players with no question marks who absolutely sort out positions for a title winning United team in 2023 - I don't think so. We'll have to wait and see. It's not like Salah and Mane where the position is absolutely sealed. AWB is the closest to that for me - really like the signing. But hopefully we can either compliment him with a better RW or he can improve going forward. Maguire seems good but would have to wait and watch - we did spend a fortune here. James looks an interesting player. To be honest he looks a rotational player but you never know how a footballer improves. So I'd give that a solid 7.5-8/10, and hopefully that gets bumped up if the players improve.exactly. Feel like people are just blowing up his signings to try and justify him. We havent kept many clean sheets with maguire, and he looks decent-but not sure worth the incredible amount of time and money we spent getting him. AWB is pretty strong defensively, but still hasn't helped with clean sheets either. Add to the fact that he looks pretty average at best going forward. James started hot, but seems to play just rashfords LW position best and hasn't exactly been lighting it up all around. Had some pretty good moments going forward but still obviously growing as a player.
Can you please stop being objective here?
AgreedOnly thing i dont like is when Ole being called names, you think he is not good enough or is awful clueless manager in general, fine, you have issues with his certain skills as manager, fine and so on. Guy is a legend for what he is done as a player and people should be able to separate the two.
How & Why?These long term plan is a bullshit.
No manager should plan for what happens in 3 years. It doesnt work like in fm.
Stop referencing co92 as long term plan by fergie. It happens, when you have a young beckham,scholes,butt, neville, giggs you will field them. When fergie doesnt have that he bought from outside.
What fergie did is what's best in that time, if we copy it stupidly we will bound to fail. Fergie's greatest strenght is he adapt. We all blindly follow what he did without looking at the context of time and situation.
If fergie were to be given this squad he'll buy 4-5 players, a stopgap for a few years, then he probably do a restructuring from behind the screen. Ole looks pretty clueless and he does thing without a plan, well he has a plan but a naive and stupid plan that wont work.
That's exactly what Sky is saying. You can't go to success from failure by jumping to the top. It's a process. In this process you have to get better players than you have currently and when we get to the situation where those players are no longer good enough you sell them and then get much better players.How & Why?
Success doesn't come from short cut. Long term is needed.