Why are the standards at one of the biggest club in football (Manchester United) so low?

[Amadaeus]

A culture of mediocrity has set in at Manchester United, and it has nothing to do with manager Ole Gunnar Solskjaer. In many ways, Solskjaer is merely a victim of the erosion of standards and expectancy caused by the club's owners, the Glazer family, and their senior executives at Old Trafford.
……
But Solskjaer has delivered for the Glazers because they have set the bar so low; Champions League qualification appears to be enough to satisfy their demands.

https://www.espn.com/soccer/manches...glazers-as-apathy-and-low-standards-take-hold

I feel like our lack of success is not only down to having a poor coach, but also because the club owners has set the bar so low for success here at United. The owner might be willing to splash a lot of cash, but if we are just going after the top four trophy, we might as well just use those funds to rebuild Old trafford and give it to charity because we dont need much to get in that position.

When you look at the standards at other top clubs, for example psg, where they are 7 points on top of the league and already beaten one of the best team in Europe, yet Pochettino is still under crazy amount of pressure. Similiarly, we wouldn’t expect managers from city, Bayern, liverpool, Real Madrid, Barcelona, and chelsea to survive putting their club into Europa league. I am pretty sure if Abramovic was our owners, after the liverpool game, Ole would have been sacked on the spot. The club owners needs to set a higher bar and ensure that we get back to the glory days of United under ferguson.

 

[Desert Eagle]

Lack of accountability from top to bottom. Fergie held it all together, once we walked away we were exposed for what we were. An ageing giant, poorly maintained, stuck in the past and carried by the fire and genius of a Scotsman for 3 decades. Now we have a chance to modernize but we have chosen bankers and money men to make footballing decisions so are doomed by their choices.

 

[Flytan]

Owners are playing into the mindset of the fanbase of romanticism.

 

[VorZakone]

Board ambitions. The club is making them money and they're satisfied.

 

[gajender]

Lack of accountability from top to bottom. Fergie held it all together, once we walked away we were exposed for what we were. An ageing giant, poorly maintained, stuck in the past and carried by the fire and genius of a Scotsman for 3 decades. Now we have a chance to modernize but we have chosen bankers and money men to make footballing decisions so are doomed by their choices.

It's more the case of their incompetence it has nothing to do with their background .

 

[Abraxas]

Owners are playing into the mindset of the fanbase of romanticism.

As if, it has absolutely nothing to do with fans. That is completely misplaced criticism because of the implication that fans somehow contribute to it, or allow ourselves to be exploited when the reality is far from that.

The fans don't work at the club. The fact is we turn the TV on, we cheer, we go and buy overpriced hotdogs and T Shirts and post on social media. But the influence beyond that is extremely limited. We just have to put up with what we get or moan and protest to the extent that it's actually allowable and ethical, that is the limit.

The standards for any organisation trickle down from the top in terms of leadership and strategic direction.

 

[Valar Morghulis]

Because the fanbase has allowed it to be.

 

[PlayerOne]

Top 4 and a decent CL run makes enough money, that's all it comes down to. If the sponsors start moaning and some of them leave then watch their ambition get bigger.

Also, doesn't help that they have people who are stuck to the "United Way" of doing things advising them on football matters while they have no understanding of football.

 

[Desert Eagle]

It's more the case of their incompetence it has nothing to do with their background .

The incompetence is linked to the background. How would a banker know if X is a good player or Y a good signing ? More importantly how would he know a good manager or good football? When they have to make a final decision on these things without first hand knowledge it becomes tricky.

 

[Uniteddy]

Because we are not Manchester United Football Club any more, we are Manchester United.
Manchester United is a massive global marketing company who have a football team.
Owners want us to do well enough to be relevant but trophies are for egos. Narrative and stories are for dollars.

I'm sure the social media engagement numbers have been huge since the Liverpool match.
Those are the critical figures that matter to owners and sponsors.
Think of the redemption arc now if we beat City, who cares if the season is gone, we are box office, bigger than football.

 

[Flytan]

As if, it has absolutely nothing to do with fans. That is completely misplaced criticism because of the implication that fans somehow contribute to it, or allow ourselves to be exploited when the reality is far from that.

The fans don't work at the club. The fact is we turn the TV on, we cheer, we go and buy overpriced hotdogs and T Shirts and post on social media. But the influence beyond that is extremely limited. We just have to put up with what we get or moan and protest to the extent that it's actually allowable and ethical, that is the limit.

The standards for any organisation trickle down from the top in terms of leadership and strategic direction.

Oh come on, the fans just stopped a super league from forming despite all the CEOs wanting it. If the fan base was more vocal like Barca (without the assault) and most other fan bases, he'd be gone.

 

[FootyGirl88]

The Glazers/the board.

 

[gajender]

The incompetence is linked to the background. How would a banker know if X is a good player or Y a good signing ? More importantly how would he know a good manager or good football? When they have to make a final decision on these things without first hand knowledge it becomes tricky.

Do you believe Man City are well run Club ?

 

[MoskvaRed]

In descending order (as it’s only the owners who can effect real change):

- Owners and executives who seem to lack focus (beyond making money) and know very little about football while appearing unwilling to appoint experts to make up for that deficiency

- A brilliant manager in situ from 1986 to 2013 resulted in the club not being forced to modernise in the same way as its peers

- The fans were shielded from reality by Fergie and are struggling to adjust to normality where managers are hired and fired regularly based on results

- United pundits are generally ex-United players from the Fergie era who also struggle to imagine life under a less than perfect manager

Finally, it’s not all about United. The world has changed as we can no longer outspend rivals, the EPL has the most of the best managers in the world and even smaller teams are wealthy.

 

[bond19821982]

True that. One of the finest opportunities in many years, we have a great team who will thrive under a right coach yet we are giving a final warning to one of the most incompetent managers , United has ever seen.

Who the feck gives this kind of final warning? It's either in or out. Having Fergie in the background also doesn't help.

Look at our structure - Woodward, Murtough, Fletcher, Arnold, Ole, Carrick and McKenna

Tell me how many of them actually has some level of experience in running a club like this ? Seriously ? Everyone of them is learning on the job.

 

[Desert Eagle]

Fans cannot escape culpability. We are not vocal or united enough. Every singe United fan knows if this was reversed and happened to Liverpool, there would have been riots and the manager would literally feel unsafe. There is a happy middle ground between prawn sandwich brigade and rabid ultras but we would do well to edge a little bit to the latter end of the scale.

 

[FatTails]

It is such an interesting phenomenon with the fans. Fans of Bayern, Madrid, Barca, and United all react differently to underperformance and have different levels of expectations, but we are at the very end of the spectrum when it comes to patience and support. Madrid probably at the opposite end.

 

[Desert Eagle]

Do you believe Man City are well run Club ?

Very. They have footballing people making footballing decisions ( which they mainly poached from Barca) . They did the wing it approach early with the Robinhos etc but quickly adapted and set up the club in a way that experts are in charge and it's a smooth operation.

 

[RedRonaldo]

- Owners who doesn't know anything about football
- Clueless manager
- Very bad coaching team
- So called Man Utd tradition and DNA, which is only a hindrance to the ever-evolving football

 

[Ixion]

It is something that permeates through-out the club now. The sloppy performances, passes, tackles, pressing etc. we see from the star players with no threat to their starting position are because Ole allows it and has low standards. The bar we expect of our managers is low, make top 4. The bar we set for our transfers is basically bring in some big names every now and then to keep the sponsors happy. We reward the manager and players with wages that are among the highest in the world despite winning nothing.

We need a manager that demands the absolute best from his players every single day in training with the highest standards AND demands it from those above him.

 

[DutchCruijff]

Top Reds

Romanticism about the "United Way"

This feel good factor of "we're not like other clubs, we stick by our managers"

And match going fans who are way too easy on the club/team/manager.

 

[pablotatt]

Because we're mugs. I watched the Fergie documentary last night. I enjoyed the Best one on BT as well Cantona's one on Sky.

We love living in the past and reliving past histories, but have no desire to make any as a club nowadays.

 

[midou]

Because Glazers + Woodward.

Yes, Ole and his team are amateurs, but we would never be in this position if the people calling the shots had any idea what they are doing.

 

[Abraxas]

Oh come on, the fans just stopped a super league from forming despite all the CEOs wanting it. If the fan base was more vocal like Barca (without the assault) and most other fan bases, he'd be gone.

Maybe, but that's the problem - when football fans gather and there is a climate of negativity it often spills over into something which is not justified considering we're talking about sporting performance not a life and death situation. That's why I referred to the fact our recourse has to be legal and ethical, and therefore is by its nature somewhat ineffective considering our absent ownership.

Are we very patient as fans? Yes, quite probably. Yes there is a harkening back to Fergies days for some. But it's still not explanatory, it is simply an observation of a response. It's putting the cart before the horse to suggest it's an important reason for underperformance, the convening of fans isn't a way we can run a football club.

Why are we really in this position? Because when we start to round on fans then we're already looking at the response to failure and not the root cause. The answers are numerous and quite obvious because everywhere we look within the club we see underperformance. Poor executives, filtering down into poor spend, into poor appointments and eventually into poor football. Those are where the standards come from.

 

[Swedish_Plumber]

Going the same way as Arsenal. Gotta feel that the board really don’t care too much about the football as long as enough money comes in (top 4).

If we bring in an established manager who’s still at the top of his game (conte) and it all falls apart again then we must look to sustained pressure on the hierarchy. It’s been obvious for a while and we’ve shown glimpses of serious unrest last season. The board has gotten lucky with how the fans have edged towards blaming each failed manager for their perceived weaknesses rather than how the board have allowed standards to slip.

Conte exploding at the board might just be the massive wake up call for that pressure to mount. Oles not going to moan too much cause he’s a nice guy, conte will want to get all the players he thinks necessary for success or he’ll call them out. We have to be on his side if it ever gets to the stage.

 

[The Dane]

I think the only football our owners know of is the one played with an oval ball and in the NFL there is only one trophy at stake every year and most of the teams haven’t won that for decades including big teams like the 49’ers and Dallas Cowboys. Still there fans seems to be relatively quiet about it. The show up every other weekend, eat their Hot Dogs, drink their beers and hope that their team might make it to the play offs this season and thus get and extra game or two. I am not American so maybe I got it all wrong but it seems like a different mentality and maybe that can explain the Glazers attitude and winning trophies seems less important as long as you qualify for CHL where the big games and the big money await

 

[amolbhatia50k]

Standards have to be set by someone.

 

[LoneStar]

It's easy to blame it all on Glazers and Woodward. Of course they have a major part in all of this.

But our fanbase is also far more tolerant of failure than most top clubs. People still deluding themselves that Ole can come out of this ffs. If this exact situation happened to Real Madrid, their fans would not let Perez go until he fired the manager.

It's incompetence from all sides of the club, masked under a nostalgia of 'The United Way' and 'United DNA'. Whatever that is. It somehow always comes back to Sir Alex (who can never be replicated) or the class of 92 (who themselves seem to be deluded in this nostalgia). No other top club will accept this level of mediocrity after having spent crazy amounts every summer since 2013.

 

[lex talionis]

Others have argued this point but I'll add to it. Football has always been a business, but what Manchester United Football Club have become is a branding operation that earns its revenue off of marketing nostalgia. We know we've been watching shite for the last 8 seasons but we, myself included, are held so captive by what once that we refuse to believe that we're watching now is fundamentally a very different club than the one that made our footballing success starting in the 1990s possible. The Glazers know this and have entrusted the management of the club to individuals like Woodward and Moyes to now Ole who can't get us anywhere near a proper challenge for the PL, which is all we're asking for.

 

[Fracture90]

Because we tend to dwell on the past success, romanticizing that any manager, given enough time, will eventually turn to into Sir Matt Busby/SAF.

 

[united_99]

Hilarious how fans are being mentioned here. Does this include the same fans who are mentioning it as well?
Why are you then not doing or organizing anything or going to the games and voicing your opinion if you are so convinced it will achieve anything? Go and camp in front of OT yourself instead of expecting actions from other fans.
Or is it just enough to type “fans” on a keyboard and actually mean that other United fans should do something (whatever this should be)?

 

[LoneStar]

Over the last decade, is there any club which even comes close to the money/success ratio we have had? Seriosuly look at the big spenders - City, RM, Barca, Chelsea. All these clubs have won the CL and PL in the last couple of years.

The only club which I can think of is PSG, since they haven't yet won the CL despite spending crazy money. A

 

[Rhyme Animal]

Because the fans accept it. It’s that simple.

The Utd fanbase find it extremely difficult to put THE CLUB ahead of anything else.

If the Glazers bought and tried this with ANY other big club they would get properly chased out of the club - and rightly so.

There is an element at Utd of being ‘good fans’ that is, ironically, destroying the club.

Behaving well for big daddy SAF doesn’t help the club anymore, and the Glazers do not deserve you’re obedience, quite the opposite.

 

[Lentwood]

I don't go with the line that standards are low. It's an easy accusation to throw around when results are bad but its not really supported by the money we have spent or the players we have bought in.

If the coach needs to be replaced then fine, but I just dont get this "Glazers are happy with top four line", where is the evidence for it, apart from one tenuous link between a season were we finished 4th and "only" spent £50m net (season Jose blew up because the Board wouldn't/couldn't buy Maguire)

 

[Acheron]

I perceive it as a lack of ambition from all the organization, from the owners to the fans. Jose achieved more in less time and he was getting a lot of backlash, he was fairly sacked (although he should had been sacked sooner) but with Ole the standards have gotten so low. I've read a lot of people talking about progress under him but like I said Mourinho and Van Gaal achieved more so it's not really progress, more like stagnation, and everyone seemed happy with being embarrassed year after year in UCL, not winning anything and not challenging for the title all while displaying some archaic football. So for a club with this type of resources it should be something unacceptable but it has been going on for so long I don't know what to think of it.

 

[gajender]

Very. They have footballing people making footballing decisions ( which they mainly poached from Barca) . They did the wing it approach early with the Robinhos etc but quickly adapted and set up the club in a way that experts are in charge and it's a smooth operation.

Soriano Cities current CEO worked as Vice president under Laporta's in his first stint as Barcelona's president with him having business background with no footballing background ,along with Cities current Sporting Director Txiki" Begiristain an Ex Barcelona player who was appointed Barca's Sporting director during the same period without any prior experience as Sporting Directer role whatsoever .
So basically these so called experts learnt on job as well and one of them currently running the Show at City didn't even have any footballing background either.

 

[Abraxas]

Because the fans accept it. It’s that simple.

The Utd fanbase find it extremely difficult to put THE CLUB ahead of anything else.

If the Glazers bought and tried this with ANY other big club they would get properly chased out of the club - and rightly so.

There is an element at Utd of being ‘good fans’ that is, ironically, destroying the club.

Behaving well for big daddy SAF doesn’t help the club anymore, and the Glazers do not deserve you’re obedience, quite the opposite.

How can you chase out owners that don't give a shit about your response? It's not as if United fans have sat on their arses since they bought the club, there were protests, there were campaigns. But beyond going to Florida with a sniper rifle, what is your expectation? Mike Ashley sat at Newcastle for years and he was a lot easier to shout at! Do Arsenal fans like their ownership? What you're saying doesn't even correlate with reality - owners are not easily perturbed and ours especially so.

We just don't have as much power as you're making out that we do and you're struggling to accept that very simple fact. It's not nice, it's not what we want, but that's how it is - there is no kicking out the Glazers unless done within financial means.

 

[Desert Eagle]

Soriano Cities current CEO worked as Vice president under Laporta's in his first stint as Barcelona's president with him having business background with no footballing background ,along with Cities current Sporting Director Txiki" Begiristain an Ex Barcelona player who was appointed Barca's Sporting director during the same period without any prior experience as Sporting Directer role whatsoever .
So basically these so called experts learnt on job as well and one of them currently running the Show at City didn't even have any footballing background either.

Soriano had 5/6 years as director at Barca before joining City.

Txiki has a lifetime in football and almost a decade as a director at Barca before joining City.

Now compare that to Woodward and Arnold.

 

[Rhyme Animal]

How can you chase out owners that don't give a shit about your response? It's not as if United fans have sat on their arses since they bought the club, there were protests, there were campaigns. But beyond going to Florida with a sniper rifle, what is your expectation? Mike Ashley sat at Newcastle for years and he was a lot easier to shout at! Do Arsenal fans like their ownership? What you're saying doesn't even correlate with reality - owners are not easily perturbed and ours especially so.

We just don't have as much power as you're making out that we do and you're struggling to accept that very simple fact. It's not nice, it's not what we want, but that's how it is - there is no kicking out the Glazers unless done within financial means.

Ask yourself what would happen if the Glazers bought and tried this at Barca, or Real, or Bayern, or Liverpool…

Imagine - literally - what would happen.

 

[LoneStar]

I perceive it as a lack of ambition from all the organization, from the owners to the fans. Jose achieved more in less time and he was getting a lot of backlash, he was fairly sacked (although he should had been sacked sooner) but with Ole the standards have gotten so low. I've read a lot of people talking about progress under him but like I said Mourinho and Van Gaal achieved more so it's not really progress, more like stagnation, and everyone seemed happy with being embarrassed year after year in UCL, not winning anything and not challenging for the title all while displaying some archaic football. So for a club with this type of resources it should be something unacceptable but it has been going on for so long I don't know what to think of it.

If one of your club legends would have been managing the team like Ole has with us, would he still have been a manager? Or would he have been sacked a long time ago?

That's the difference between the two clubs imo. This whole nostalgia factor and United way is killing the club.