Clearing out the squad for the new manager - yay or nay?

[altodevil]

I want Ten Hag for a myriad of reasons. But could be whoever.

How would you feel about a massive clear out? The likes of Rashford, Shaw etc.

Players who have been here for years, won nothing, and developed a bad culture (whether due to the players themselves or terrible management).

Bring through a lot of the youth. Even if they aren't United quality. In the the hopes that a new, driven work ethic can be instilled. This could then be built upon by shrewd recruitment by a more football focussed upper management (fingers crossed) and tactically-consistent coaching.

Could well result in us hovering in the lower reaches of the top-6 for a few seasons, but I'd argue it would set us up better to challenge for titles again in the future. None of this treading water crap, which we can't even achieve!

What say you? Do you think this is a valid strategy? Or would you prefer we go down an Ancelotti/Zidane approach and try and milk the players we have?

 

[Red Shorts]

Their call at the end of the day. If the manager has a vision which doesn't include some players, then they should have full rein on their decisions to let players go. Only issue is it doesn't seem we will have a large budget next summer, so can't go too crazy with offloading.

 

[ManchesterManchester]

Sorry but why do people still the manager has complete control ?

This isn’t 2012, Fergie isn’t here. We have Murtough and Arnold who have ultimate power and over any contract extension or sale.

It’s irrelevant what the manager wants, it’s not his choice. He has a limited say (1/3rd of the transfer committee) in transfer incomings that’s it.

 

[Smores]

I hope that's the route we go down but i don't think we will. Our new manager will have to somehow use most of these players whilst they leak how moving is too much effort.

If we can bring in 2 or 3 new players that fit our new style, whatever that may be, it will likely be transformative.

 

[buckooo1978]

Id love a clear out.

Think we need a cultural reset and we've an overpaid, under performing squad.

Pounds for points we must have the worst squad in the league

There are some examples at the minute that underline the issue....

i wonder how much we have offered a perpetually inconsistent and often injured Pogba to stay? and he's going to wait and see

Luke Shaw..... see above really. One good season last year in 5/6 years isnt good enough

Rangnick will need to advise on how we trim the fat but big Summer ahead

 

[Red Shorts]

Sorry but why do people still the manager has complete control ?

This isn’t 2012, Fergie isn’t here. We have Murtough and Arnold who have ultimate power and over any contract extension or sale.

It’s irrelevant what the manager wants, it’s not his choice. He has a limited say (1/3rd of the transfer committee) in transfer incomings that’s it.

I don't think they have full control, however to develop as a club that should change. Not to say they will have full power on decisions, but Murtough and Arnold should be listening more intently rather than think they know best.

That's the glass half full aspect from me. Likelihood is nothing will change on the situation.

 

[TrueRed79]

Sure Ralf just said it recently that the club should have structures and style of play implemented already, so manager has to fit that. Therefore, we should already be selling/buying if we were properly ran. New manager can then come in and hit the ground running. You are hearing all these reports about a split between ETH or Poch. If true, that tells me nothing whatsoever has changed at the club, and absolutely nothing will till we have new owners, because the rot sets from the top. Period.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

We definitely need a clear out, more for attitude problems to be honest. I would hate yet another season of assessing the players.

 

[Bobcat]

If there is a rotten culture in the dressing room it needs to be pulled up root and stem

 

[DomesticTadpole]

If there is a rotten culture in the dressing room it needs to be pulled up root and stem

Agree. Too much of a tail wagging the dog thing going on at our club.

 

[Craig Ward]

Their call at the end of the day. If the manager has a vision which doesn't include some players, then they should have full rein on their decisions to let players go. Only issue is it doesn't seem we will have a large budget next summer, so can't go too crazy with offloading.

Cant go crazy with outgoings? Are you mad? If we do not change, we will not progress regardless of who the manager is.

We could easily afford to lose the below with no impact on our squad:
Jones
Mata
Matic
Martial
Chong
Tuanzebe
Periera
Lingard
Cavani
Bailly

Then uncertain futures over:
Pogba
Henderson
Donny

Question marks over whether they're good enough
McTom
Dalot
AWB
Lindelof

Plus the new manager might not fancy some players anyway.

We need a reset and the only way that happens is by overhauling the squad.

We cannot take another year to "assess" who is good enough. We need to be ruthless

 

[Damien]

Can't see it happening purely due to the number of players leaving on a free (Pogba, Lingard, Cavani, Mata, Grant), some of which we have to replace first.

Then Henderson and Ronaldo will be leaving. Bailly and Tuanzebe will probably be going - we'd get rid of Jones if there were any takers, and Greenwood being an arsehole.

So just from those names alone, ignoring even the likes of Martial, we would need to bring in a goalkeeper (seems we're targetting Johnstone on a free), at least one CB, a midfielder and at least one attacking player before even addressing the issues we needed to sort last summer (RB, defensive midfield, RW).

Ideally we would go scorched earth but in a regular transfer window we don't even fix our most urgent problems (couple of years ago we needed an attacking signing when Rashford was playing through the pain, last summer we really needed a midfield signing but the investment wasn't there), so a full clearout would lead us to being another decade of nowhere near the title - especially when you factor in the possibility of the stadium rebuild if that happens.

 

[Revaulx]

Sorry but why do people still the manager has complete control ?

This isn’t 2012, Fergie isn’t here. We have Murtough and Arnold who have ultimate power and over any contract extension or sale.

It’s irrelevant what the manager wants, it’s not his choice. He has a limited say (1/3rd of the transfer committee) in transfer incomings that’s it.

Yes and no.

One would hope that Murtough and the new manager would be very much on the same page regarding player recruitment, and that they’d be able to rely on Arnold’s support.

What we need to get away from is the manager announcing to the world that he wants United to play a fast-paced front-foot style of football, and the club believing that the way to achieve that laudable goal is to pay £80m for Harry Maguire.

 

[Red Shorts]

Cant go crazy with outgoings? Are you mad? If we do not change, we will not progress regardless of who the manager is.

We could easily afford to lose the below with no impact on our squad:
Jones
Mata
Matic
Martial
Chong
Tuanzebe
Periera
Lingard
Cavani
Bailly

Then uncertain futures over:
Pogba
Henderson
Donny

Question marks over whether they're good enough
McTom
Dalot
AWB
Lindelof

Plus the new manager might not fancy some players anyway.

We need a reset and the only way that happens is by overhauling the squad.

We cannot take another year to "assess" who is good enough. We need to be ruthless

No, I'm not mad, quite a rational thinker I like to believe.

The first list is viable, but then going through some of the players below starts to make our squad look thin. If the reported budget of £50m is true, then we won't be making many signings.

 

[AndySmith1990]

Happy to get rid of any player the new manager doesn't want.

Don't want to see anymore situations where fans are siding with the likes of Martial and Pogba when the manager wants rid due to their poor attitude.

 

[BuzzKillington]

There was a thread the other day listing around 15 players that are pretty much gone in the summer. Even if you take a conservative approach we’re likely to lose 10. And this is before you start looking at players you’d probably like to see moved on like Rashford and Maguire (and for some of you Shaw).

Most of the outs are currently our bench players. Whilst that may not seem like a bad thing, we still need options from the bench. A bench full of academy prospects will seem much less appealing in reality that it does in peoples dreams.

Whilst I don’t have much love for our current squad trying to integrate a couple of players can be problematic as seen with Sancho & Ronaldo this year. If we try and replace half the team in one summer the real scorched earth will be next season. People say they are happy to take a year or two getting it right, but 12 months of losing as many games as we win and the pitchforks will be out for whoever the new manager is and, the new players. Most of them will end up like Donny with their confidence shot to pieces and will become the new deadwood. It’s just not realistic in my opinion.

 

[Annihilate Now!]

Massive outgoings are just impractical.... we have enough players that will be definitely be going (Cavani, Pogba, Lingard, and others) and tons that more that most likely will also go (Martial, Mata, Jones, Bailly, Henderson, VdB?, Ronaldo?) that as much as I'm sure people will love to bin off Maguire, AWB, Rashford, McT etc.... we won't really be able to as we'd have to buy about 10 players, which just isn't happening.

 

[Lentwood]

I don't think it would be the worst idea to have a total clearout purely so we can reset the wage structure and create a new model.

I'm not really laying much of the blame for this mess on our players, I don't buy the idea that they don't try or don't care and most of them are actually good footballers too. Problems really stem from clash of styles and no clear way of playing, plus weakness in key areas like central midfield.

I think my basic line of reasoning would be, if you earn more than £200K per week, Id be looking to ship that player out. Start a new performance-related wage structure.

Personally, I dont care if we finish 15th next year playing mostly Academy lads. We should have done this during the first "cultural reset" but the club lost its bottle/got ahead of itself (not sure which) and seemed to abandon/forget what they had supposedly learnt

 

[Von Mistelroum]

That's absolutely not going to happen but definitely should. Not just players either.

 

[JB7]

Nothing will change until the goalkeeper changes. Been saying it for years. Clear out should start with De Gea otherwise we're just throwing money away, especially if we're bringing in defensive players of any age.

 

[Red Shorts]

Nothing will change until the goalkeeper changes. Been saying it for years. Clear out should start with De Gea otherwise we're just throwing money away, especially if we're bringing in defensive players of any age.

Ok, you've stated it but the question is: who is the answer to the GK issue?

 

[TheRedDevil'sAdvocate]

I am leaning toward yes solely on the basis that our wage-bill is in dire need of restructuring. It has to be more performance based and from what i'm reading everybody in the club atm thinks they deserve a pay rise no matter how well or badly they are playing. There seems to be a sense of entitlement, a notion that we find ourselves in such a poor predicament that we require their services, despite their own failings, more than they need us to promote their careers. It goes hand in hand with the lack of accountability and the fear of change that characterizes the people who run the club.

So, yes, if it entails a change of direction. It doesn't need to happen during one window, either. But it's time for the messages we send to become clear. Decide on how important each player is to the overarching plan and, when the time comes, negotiate nothing. "You want a new contract? Fine, this is how much we value your services. Take it or leave it, and the offer will be withdrawn at the end of the season".

I would also be interested to see how well some of these players would cope outside the United bubble.

 

[FireballXL5]

Ah, the mythical clear out that never happens.

 

[Neil_Buchanan]

In an ideal scenario we would do some kind of one off mass clear out, 10 out and 4-5 in with a few youngsters making up the numbers.These guys have repeatedly shown that they aren’t good enough and don’t deserve a fresh start under a new manager. Plus Ralf has already assessed them all on behalf of the new man.

I don’t think that’s what will happen, it’s unheard of in top level football, but it’s what I would do.

I expect all those on expiring contracts to leave and we sell a player or two. I think recruitment will improve but we’ve never ever been good at shifting the shit, it’s very hard when they are all on stupid contracts.

 

[Leftback99]

Ok, you've stated it but the question is: who is the answer to the GK issue?

Henderson is more likely to adapt to a new style of play than De Gea. If he's not good enough recruit next season.

We shouldn't be renewing De Gea on ridiculous terms again.

 

[DaveinToronto]

Cant go crazy with outgoings? Are you mad? If we do not change, we will not progress regardless of who the manager is.

We could easily afford to lose the below with no impact on our squad:
Jones
Mata
Matic
Martial
Chong
Tuanzebe
Periera
Lingard
Cavani
Bailly

Then uncertain futures over:
Pogba
Henderson
Donny

Question marks over whether they're good enough
McTom
Dalot
AWB
Lindelof

Plus the new manager might not fancy some players anyway.

We need a reset and the only way that happens is by overhauling the squad.

We cannot take another year to "assess" who is good enough. We need to be ruthless

No Maguire and Rashford on above's list?

 

[IrishRedDevil]

Isn’t the squad naturally being cleared out anyway with a lot of Contracts expiring this summer?

 

[Red Shorts]

Henderson is more likely to adapt to a new style of play than De Gea. If he's not good enough recruit next season.

We shouldn't be renewing De Gea on ridiculous terms again.

Personally I dont think he's good enough to play for us as our first choice, so I would be keen to know from those who think the GK issue is the biggest, then who should we sign? I'm genuinely curious as I believe the number of quality GKs available is a small market.

 

[DomesticTadpole]

Isn’t the squad naturally being cleared out anyway with a lot of Contracts expiring this summer?

It is, but how many of them are the agitators. There will be some in there, but suspect some of the biggest whingers will still be around. We need a manager who will tell them straight any leaks from them or their hangers on and said player will be out of the door.

 

[Leftback99]

Personally I dont think he's good enough to play for us as our first choice, so I would be keen to know from those who think the GK issue is the biggest, then who should we sign? I'm genuinely curious as I believe the number of quality GKs available is a small market.

He probably isn't but just doing the same thing over and over with De Gea rooted to his line being nothing but a shot stopper will never improve us long term.

No idea on the GK market.

 

[Red Shorts]

Isn’t the squad naturally being cleared out anyway with a lot of Contracts expiring this summer?

Grant
Pogba
Lingard
Cavani
Chong

So 5 there alone, all pretty much nailed on to leave. 2023 is where we have quite a lot expiring.

 

[IrishRedDevil]

Grant
Pogba
Lingard
Cavani
Chong

So 5 there alone, all pretty much nailed on to leave. 2023 is where we have quite a lot expiring.

And Mata.

 

[McGrathsipan]

We definitely need a clear out, more for attitude problems to be honest. I would hate yet another season of assessing the players.

the match going fans needs to slaughter them, they are ripping the piss at this stage for the most part

 

[Red Shorts]

And Mata.

Ah yes thought there was one missing. Thanks

 

[redshaw]

The new manager will have to work with some of the poorer aspects of the squad but we should also consider that we've seen a huge drop off this season in so many it's hard to lambast and jettison them all. I think half can be useful, some are already leaving. With the budget it won't be possible for a mass clearout.

If we get a top manager I'm sure they will address key areas in 2-3 seasons much like Klopp or Pep did.

 

[Jacob]

If I were given the option to begin from scratch with a squad of 0 players and a transfer kitty of 700, I'd take it. Thats how low I rate the current squad.

 

[JB7]

Ok, you've stated it but the question is: who is the answer to the GK issue?

Well there are numerous approaches one could take to finding a new goalkeeper. We've already got Henderson for one, he is better at the aspects of the game De Gea struggles with and the defensive unit last season looked far more comfortable in front of him and yes I know everyone remembers the Liverpool horror show but that was nothing worse than we've seen at times from De Gea even this season. I'd be content with giving him a full season as I think we have other areas that need more spending this summer, particularly given there will be relatively low expectations next season. I genuinely couldn't tell you if he would be good enough in the long-term but he is definitely a better fit for our defence than De Gea which is why it is odd he hasn't been given a proper chance this season.

I've just seen you respond to another poster that it's a small market for goalkeepers good enough and I'm not sure I agree. Just last summer there were three very interesting goalkeepers allowed to change clubs for sub £15m fees in Jose Sa, Mike Maignan and Gregor Kobel, plus obviously Donnarumma without any fee. The summer prior we saw Mendy and Martinez move to PL clubs for circa £20m.

If we were say Henderson definitely isn't good enough and we wanted to look specifically within the Premier League the stand out option screaming us in the face is Jose Sa. He's been an exceptional find for Wolves, to sell Patricio and replace him with Sa whilst making a profit was incredible business. He dominates the penalty area and on the face of it would fit our defence like a glove. The next best option in terms of a fit for our defence (ignoring the obvious Allison, Ederson etc) is Robert Sanchez at Brighton, very similar to Sa in a lot of ways, dominates the box and is comfortable being the extra man when his teams in possession of the ball. I think Sa is the better shot stopper and obviously has the experience of winning titles and playing European football but Sanchez is 5 years younger and is only his his second season of top flight football, so is a much more raw player than Sa.

Obviously I could go on to players outside of the PL but I think you get my drift, I think there are plenty of goalkeepers out there at the moment and it wouldn't take a fortune to bring one in.

 

[RopersReturn]

This isn’t a simple job of patching up- to use an analogy, if your roof has been leaking for years then you’d most likely need to call in the experts to rectify it.
There’s a lot of rot in this current side that simply are incapable of playing to a standard that the fans yearn for.

 

[Desert Eagle]

Hell yay

 

[Red Shorts]

Well there are numerous approaches one could take to finding a new goalkeeper. We've already got Henderson for one, he is better at the aspects of the game De Gea struggles with and the defensive unit last season looked far more comfortable in front of him and yes I know everyone remembers the Liverpool horror show but that was nothing worse than we've seen at times from De Gea even this season. I'd be content with giving him a full season as I think we have other areas that need more spending this summer, particularly given there will be relatively low expectations next season. I genuinely couldn't tell you if he would be good enough in the long-term but he is definitely a better fit for our defence than De Gea which is why it is odd he hasn't been given a proper chance this season.

I've just seen you respond to another poster that it's a small market for goalkeepers good enough and I'm not sure I agree. Just last summer there were three very interesting goalkeepers allowed to change clubs for sub £15m fees in Jose Sa, Mike Maignan and Gregor Kobel, plus obviously Donnarumma without any fee. The summer prior we saw Mendy and Martinez move to PL clubs for circa £20m.

If we were say Henderson definitely isn't good enough and we wanted to look specifically within the Premier League the stand out option screaming us in the face is Jose Sa. He's been an exceptional find for Wolves, to sell Patricio and replace him with Sa whilst making a profit was incredible business. He dominates the penalty area and on the face of it would fit our defence like a glove. The next best option in terms of a fit for our defence (ignoring the obvious Allison, Ederson etc) is Robert Sanchez at Brighton, very similar to Sa in a lot of ways, dominates the box and is comfortable being the extra man when his teams in possession of the ball. I think Sa is the better shot stopper and obviously has the experience of winning titles and playing European football but Sanchez is 5 years younger and is only his his second season of top flight football, so is a much more raw player than Sa.

Obviously I could go on to players outside of the PL but I think you get my drift, I think there are plenty of goalkeepers out there at the moment and it wouldn't take a fortune to bring one in.

Good response. I just see a lot of posters saying De Gea should be replaced, but fail to provide a solution, so refreshing to see a logical approach.