How did that Euro2020 final go?
Fans behaviour
- Thread starter golden_blunder
- Start date
-
In the latest episode of the United Hour Podcast, Nik @Rood and Imran @Annihilate Now! start with the good news by celebrating Manchester United Women's emphatic FA Cup win over Spurs at Wembley and the future of manager Marc Skinner.
Then it's the bad news and the ever worsening form of our Men with losses to Arsenal and Palace.
Finally the main debate - ETH Out now or keep him until the end of the season - if not longer. Are you Team Nik or Team Imran?
I'm just pulling your leg
hala Madrid!Well we won't know will we but I'm just making the point that I think there may well be a good reason for some / most of the jibbing which is the incompetence of the policing and security.
I mean at this stadium. International football never has any issues.
Scumbags. UEFA should play this footage with the CL anthem every game at Anfield next season
Yeah I think there’s definitely a large portion of blame for the organisation of the event, whether that’s UEFA or the police’s fault, they should be set up to prevent it regardless.
Seems strange that there was no issues in the Madrid end, especially if we’re shifting blame to French fans for jibbing. Maybe it was all a stitch up but I don’t really see what UEFA or the French police gain from that when hosting a final. It’s different to your average Euro away in both the amount of eyes on it and the demographic of the fans.
My main issue is that it’s unequivocally everyone’s fault bar the Liverpool fans when being reported, there’s little balance. Especially when you can literally see the gangways full of fans in the Liverpool end.
I don't think it was a concerted strategy from the top to feck the match up, that's generally not the problem with policing / stewarding. The problem usually comes from incompetent planning and incompetent supervision of potentially thick, prejudiced cops / security.
Wasn't there similar issues with Liverpool in Greece for the 2007 final
My first thought was basically the reverse of this - some Liverpool fans were pricks, leading to the French police/security taking out their frustrations on the innocent ticket holders.
The videos of Liverpool fans storming the barriers seemed to be circulating before the scheduled kick off time, while those of fans waiting patiently and being tear gassed were after 8pm. My timeline may well be wrong, but that was just how I interpreted it.
I'm inclined to think the authorities were working along the lines that a portion of fans were going to be unruly so were more cautious than with the Madrid supporters. In effect they were completely right and unfortunately riled them up to the point where they acted in the way they were trying to avoid. This of course shouldn't happen and it's still up to the fans to behave.
Should be some stricter punishments handed on. Perhaps decreasing the amount of tickets available to Liverpool supporters for the next few away european games.
Last edited:
Police/security taking their frustrations out on innocent ticket holders would be the definition of bad policing...some fans being wankers is to be expected at any event of this scale no matter who they are. Responding to it correctly is what they are supposed to be paid to do.
From the guy saying he got in for free?
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Pretty clear organisational issues were the primary problem here, as per the massive bulk of testimony from people who were actually there.
It's just some English journalists saying it was all on the foreigners, isn't it? I wouldn't call that a balanced assessment of the situation. Though unfortunately we may never get one, since French police probably wouldn't publicly announce their short comings.
It's a journalist detailing his first hand experience as per the first tweet and asking for an investigation.
Fans behaviour, or lack of, has been happening for a long while now, look at the Euro final and how England fans behaved. It happens at every football game and will continue to do so, until the likes of FIFA, UEFA and all governing bodies clamp down on it with properly planned security measures. By this I don't mean just whilst in and around the stadium, I mean conversing and planning with individual clubs regarding how the safest possible way of getting fans to each stadium is.
Now is the time to sort it once and for all before something very, very bad happens and the governing bodies wonder why things weren't changed beforehand.
Now is the time to sort it once and for all before something very, very bad happens and the governing bodies wonder why things weren't changed beforehand.
It is getting worse, but sadly not just in Football,
It's almost like Covid changed people's behavior.
The decent compassionate and honest silent majority remain the same or are even more understanding
But the noisy, ignorant, deluded minority have taken Nasty stupidity to a new level
You see it everywhere, from shop customers, over the telephone, on Social Media, and of
course when little thugs, who are scared of their own shadow when they are their own, but think they can do anything
when they are part of a bigger group, one on one, many would wet themselves
It's almost like Covid changed people's behavior.
The decent compassionate and honest silent majority remain the same or are even more understanding
But the noisy, ignorant, deluded minority have taken Nasty stupidity to a new level
You see it everywhere, from shop customers, over the telephone, on Social Media, and of
course when little thugs, who are scared of their own shadow when they are their own, but think they can do anything
when they are part of a bigger group, one on one, many would wet themselves
But he clearly goes beyond just giving his own first hand witness account.
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Introducing another report that claims it was all the foreigners, "none of those in shots have LFC colours". Unfortunately he missed the video linked on this very page (https://www.redcafe.net/threads/fans-behaviour.470645/page-3#post-28931278) during his research, showing the opposite and judging by the lighting it also happened earlier. Must have been around the time of " Important to note that at this stage noone had tried to climb barriers " and " it was a lovely atmos here, benign and as it should be…. " Just bad luck I guess.
Also looking at the video he referenced:
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
You can clearly see red colors trying to climb the fences.
Last edited:
It's strange watching the accepted narrative around Europe that loads of Liverpool fans had no/fake tickets and stormed the ground trying to get in, so French police shut the gates, vs the British media spinning it that innocent fans were violently turned away.
It strikes me as strange that Madrid fans had no issues and its far from the first time that English and especially Liverpool fans have had such troubles. Its quite hard to argue the numerous videos of Liverpool shirted fans climbing fences and running through ticket checks.
It strikes me as strange that Madrid fans had no issues and its far from the first time that English and especially Liverpool fans have had such troubles. Its quite hard to argue the numerous videos of Liverpool shirted fans climbing fences and running through ticket checks.
Nah, the organisation is getting plenty of criticism elsewhere.
Random examples:
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
He said it was hard to tell but from the pictures and videos going around it's clear that a lot of the jibbers were French youths. That doesn't mean that Liverpool fans were completely innocent on that front. Of course any first hand testimony is going to be biased which is why he does the right thing in asking for an investigation from the proper bodies.But he clearly goes beyond just giving his own first hand witness account.
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Introducing another report that claims it was all the foreigners, "none of those in shots have LFC colours". Unfortunately he missed the video linked on this very page (https://www.redcafe.net/threads/fans-behaviour.470645/page-3#post-28931278) during his research, showing the opposite and judging by the lighting it also happened earlier. Must have been around the time of " Important to note that at this stage noone had tried to climb barriers " and " it was a lovely atmos here, benign and as it should be…. " Just bad luck I guess.
Also looking at the video he referenced:
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
You can clearly see red colors trying to climb the fences.
Except they were not foreigners if they were local. The Liverpool fans were the foreigners.But he clearly goes beyond just giving his own first hand witness account.
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
Introducing another report that claims it was all the foreigners, "none of those in shots have LFC colours". Unfortunately he missed the video linked on this very page (https://www.redcafe.net/threads/fans-behaviour.470645/page-3#post-28931278) during his research, showing the opposite and judging by the lighting it also happened earlier. Must have been around the time of " Important to note that at this stage noone had tried to climb barriers " and " it was a lovely atmos here, benign and as it should be…. " Just bad luck I guess.
Also looking at the video he referenced:
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
You can clearly see red colors trying to climb the fences.
He literally wrote "none of those in shots have LFC colours. Indeed a LFC fans tries to stop one, doing better job than stewards" while himself linking to evidence to the contrary. He's telling a tale of innocent Englishmen wronged by foreigners.
I'm going to ask a very simple question: Why everytime Brits leave the UK, especially to football away matches, they're acting like total bellends with minimal education?
I love the UK and its culture, but boy when you leave its premises you're one of the stupidest around.
I love the UK and its culture, but boy when you leave its premises you're one of the stupidest around.
Agreed, obviously.
A couple of quotes from the French police statement don't sit very well either. "The rapid intervention of police allowed the return to calm" and "The dispersal of the spectators takes place without difficulty" were the highlights. Given that tear gas was being deployed on fans who seemed to be behaving, those quotes just seem a bit smug and heartless.
Like I said my timeline and understanding of where this or that was happening might be wrong, but that's just how it looked based on when certain videos started circulating and what was in them.
Alcohol and tribalism.
Liverpool fans are no angels and have been involved in terrible tradgedies, Heysel being their darkest day......but to suggest the S*n rag legitimately reported the behaviour of the fans at Hillsborough defies belief. Have you seen the footage of the front page? All part of a smear campaign to exonerate the authorities of any responsibility....seems to have worked in this case.
There are always some scruffs chancing their luck in situations like this and Pool seem to have more than their fair share, maybe it's because so many of them rock up at finals....
but it's not as if UEFA and the French Police were thrown a surprise party.
The onus has to be on the coordination of the event and the management of such. I mean, look at the Old Trafford invasion last year? It was all over Facebook and yet the response from the authorities was pathetic.
Last edited:
I lol'ed at that, haha.
Yeah, but how can it be properly organised when thousands of ticketless fans turn up? No organisation can legally prevent people from travelling to these events, so no matter where checks take place there will be failures if people won't behave. It seems to be a modern case of entitlement rather than exercising responsibility and not travelling if you don't have a ticket. What's the answer?
Are you saying that it wasn't mostly French youths that caused the initial problem by jibbing? There's been compelling evidence that this is true posted by @sullydnl
Are you saying that you don't think the evidence Draper posted about police blocking entrances with vehicles contributed to the crushing?
Please can you detail how you think Liverpool fans caused the issues?
It seems clear that the issues were a combination of (at least) three factors: the organizational concept/police, locals trying to force their way in and the behavior of Liverpool fans / fake tickets. Cue British journalists trying to blame it all on the first two groups and absolving the third.
In saying it was the French youths causing the initial problem you're already absorbing the clearly biased reporting.
Pertinent questions would be for example:
-how many Liverpool fans tried to use a faked ticket?
-when did the incident of Liverpool fans breaking through an entrance occur?
Because the answer to either question could (to a degree) explain the strategy of the police.
Last edited:
It's a subset of people: the sort who prefer to travel in groups, and who tend to drink themselves silly wherever they are.
If you stay away from the areas frequented by that sort of tourist from the UK, you'll come across a whole lot of perfectly normal people who go on holiday like...normal people.
Tweet
— Twitter API (@user) date
There are dickheads from all parts of the UK but scousers are a different breed. Have you ever been to Liverpool?
No. The tweet.
Why don’t you just front up and wear your penis on your forehead more openly?
You obviously want to turn this into some sort of anti-Liverpool diatribe without quite having the balls to go full ‘let’s blame them for Hillsborough’, although I suspect you’re well on your way. This is clear by the refusal to engage with any of the evidence that has been presented to you so far. Your mind is made up and you want this to be a fan issue.
The idea that British journalists have no interest in condemning poor fan behaviour is also preposterous. Happens all the time - see the reaction to the madness at Wembley last year.
The biased reporting from non-British Twitter accounts? Yes it would be the initial problem because if ticketless fans get in then fans without tickets can't get in without the stadium becoming dangerously overcrowded.
I think you'll find that in my first post in this thread I said that some Liverpool fans had jibbed. That said, it seems that from the Tweets, video and reports out there that the jibbing was mostly local. Your mate Jan even said that locals were trying to jib a day before the game!
It's possible that the fake ticket narrative is overstated as an excuse as to why so many fans couldn't get in (security breakdown and jibbing being the big reason). Andy Robertson said that his mate who he got a ticket for was told it was fake so some genuine ticket holders were getting bounced back.
I see now, it's a French Farage type blaming French minorities for causing the chaos.