At what point do Man Utd move to plan B? Chelsea has been burned chasing a player all window and the result was a panic buy at the end.
Frenkie de Jong | The last muppeting lap
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Actually I've not seen it described as a circus too often, bloody stupid and tedious to see though. It would be a very crap and unentertaining circus.
It's a truly dull saga, only made better because he's a class player and when we finally get the deal done he'll improve us massively.
I’m not as confident as I was with this transfer but Barcelona are hell to deal with. Absolute monstrosity of a club. Seem intent on dragging us to their none Messi level.
They are now a smaller club than United without the little magician playing superman every week so we at least have the last laugh either way.
They are now a smaller club than United without the little magician playing superman every week so we at least have the last laugh either way.
Nothing has changed and no significant news has been reported for several days. The constant worrying and negativity in this thread only perpetuates the feeling that it won't happen, when in reality all signs still point to it happening eventually
It's a shame that the midfield market is so crap at the moment. Looking for alternatives is good and well but when these alternatives are freaking Ruben Neves I rather we really hang on to this tedious saga and try and somehow get him to sign for us. Huge shame this is dragging on for so long though. One midfielder was the bare minimum this season and I hoped we would get this sorted early on. It's a position we really have the most problems in recruitment wise. Even under Fergie we struggled there or straight out neglected it.
Really concerning that EtH is now sending messages that he is prepared to wait beyond the start of the season. For someone who would be our playmaker/talisman you need to know very soon if he is going to be part of the squad or not ASAP; then coach the team accordingly.
As far as club management you could argue that Barcelona is ”a smaller club”, but in terms of pitch results they had one or perhaps two bad seasons, the latter after that arguably the best player ever left the club and with a manager shift mid season, but still managed to end up second.
All for playing the long ball game, as long as our owners set aside the amount as an addition should it happen, rather than take half of our summer budget away. But we know how that plays out. So if we can’t buy other players in the meantime, and we don’t end up getting De Jong, we are in trouble.
I can see that too. Barcelona need to register their new players, and ETH need to sign FDJ at all cost.
So in the end, either Barcelona or us would give in and pay up the 17m. I suspect we would strike a deal with them at the last days of transfer window, maybe we both pay up extra 8m to FDJ to close the deal.
Brobbey the other example
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Ten Hag is looking at the long term. If we get him and he's a key player for United for the next decade, who will care that we signed him at the end of August instead of the beginning of July?
The only issue with waiting is if we don't sign him, then we have no time to sign an alternative
People are laughably short sighted when it comes to this signing. He's one of those players its worth waiting for and it dragging on. None of the other options come close.
They are desperately trying to force him to either give up tens of millions in wages AND take a massive pay cut, or leave and also give up millions in deferred pay.
Both choices likely work for Barca.
Leaving him out of the squad would legally put them in a tricky position either way, that would be undisputed proof of him being forced to break contract.
Even if we switched targets now they would probably only be here for the final week of training at best.
Never. Just as with Sancho, we wait it out and get our man.
Barca must convince him to give up tens of millions (whilst spending like mad men), and accept an enormous pay cut, else they must sell him.
At some point between now and the end of the window, Barça have to make a choice.
Especially so because he's not a short stop signing....you could actually build a team around him, not just stop the gap for a year or two.
Disagree, no manager is looking at what a player can do for a club over 10 years. It’s highly likely ten Hag won’t be here for more than 5 years with the managerial merry-go-round. He wants De Jong because he’s one of the few players in the world who can play his style, managed him before and available at a fee we can afford.
Second in their league is absolutely nothing to brag about.
They have zero competition from anyone other than the top 3. La Liga cannot even remotely be compared to the Premier League these days.
I don't think leaving Frenkie out would put Barca in a difficult legal position. They could argue it's the coach's choice, just like with Umtiti, Mingueza and other players that were left out. It's a choice that a coach has a right to make.
I do think there is a scenario that United get left with nothing. Frenkie going on tour does suggest to me that there's still a chance that he will stay a Barcelona players. If this wage thing can't be resolved, he will in the end stay and Barca can't afford to then leave him out, treat him like an outcast and put him in the stands. If he stays, he'll be part of the team and he will be playing unless Xavi thinks other players are really better. Frenkie is now worth 85m euro's and if he doesn't leave because Barca can't/won't solve the wage issue, Barca's can't afford to treat him like an outcast as that'll deminish that 85m value.
Hence there is a scenario that this stalemate doesn't get resolved and Frenkie stays a Barcelona player. I think Barcelona is aware of that and therefore he's been taken on Tour. That is obvoiusly not a great message for Manchester United. This doesn't mean that it won't be resolved, because there is always a chance at some point Barcelona or Frenkie takes it's losses and just wants to get out of this mess. It's up to Manchester United how long they can wait for it to resolve. Obviously United could put a lot of pressure on Barcelona by just telling them they have X amount of time left to resolve these issues, otherwise United will pull out of the agreement and move on. Obviously this could already have been discussed. Maybe in agreeing the fee United already told Barca it has to resolve this within a certain amount of time. Who knows.
Nevertheless, it can't be ruled out that Frenkie stays in Barcelona in the end. Especially if Barcelona selling other players (like the 5 players that don't go on tour and maybe players like Memphis and Aubameyang) might also resolve their issue in registering the newly signed players for La Liga. Frenkie is clearly the easiest way for Barcelona to resolve their wage issues, but if some other players leave this may also help them get there and then Frenkie could stay. In my opinion this scenario is realistic and therefore Barca have taken Frenkie on tour.
It's not just his desire to come that's a barrier to this signing though, there is also the contractual issue. Both seem like significant issues which may not be overcome. There is also a smaller chance Chelsea or another cl team come in and take him.
All in all, it's a big risk to wait it out for him and if he doesn't come it's easy to imagine us failing to sign an alternative in the time left. Top 4 would then look a difficult ask
The Guardian reporting that ETH has told the club to buy him even if it's after the season begins so looks as the dynamic duo have rebooked their room at the Barcelona Hilton... if the boss is only 75% right that he sees him as Scholes-like (never did replace him), then he's been good for the club... if he's wrong he's going to look a bit stupid, as the piece says
https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...mble-on-protracted-pursuit-of-frenkie-de-jong
Can it not? The premier league is a two horse race with a few decent teams fighting for 3rd and 4th. Doesn't sound too dissimilar to La Liga tbh
I’m not saying the competition in La Liga is as hard as in the Premier League (even though one might underestimate the spanish league - last year had three spanish and three english teams in CL quarter finals), but finishing second after only the CL winners despite their circumstances is not worse than finishing sixth under ours.
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I'd say he's a roaming playmaker with a deep starting position so basically a rumboregiquartista
I think I'm on the side of those saying "wait as long as it takes to get this done".
Two reasons: 1) It's the guy ETH has wanted from the first moment he arrived and, possibly more importantly, 2) There is no obvious alternative. Other names being bandied about are either not available or nowhere near a big enough improvement on what we have. Not a Neves fan: fine if he was cheap and as cover if we already had 1999's midfield. As a statement of intent? the statement would read: "this is all we could get and aren't interested in any sort of challenge for any trophy."
I'd love it if we could find an older, proven player who would could get on a short-term deal like Thiago at Chelsea or, well, Thiago at Liverpool, but they don't seem to exist. So what choice is there? Flippin' heck, it sounds as if I'm backing waldorf and statler... (err, I mean Arnold and Murtough)
Two reasons: 1) It's the guy ETH has wanted from the first moment he arrived and, possibly more importantly, 2) There is no obvious alternative. Other names being bandied about are either not available or nowhere near a big enough improvement on what we have. Not a Neves fan: fine if he was cheap and as cover if we already had 1999's midfield. As a statement of intent? the statement would read: "this is all we could get and aren't interested in any sort of challenge for any trophy."
I'd love it if we could find an older, proven player who would could get on a short-term deal like Thiago at Chelsea or, well, Thiago at Liverpool, but they don't seem to exist. So what choice is there? Flippin' heck, it sounds as if I'm backing waldorf and statler... (err, I mean Arnold and Murtough)
No we are not, he’s agreed with ETH he will come here - he wants to be part of eriks project.
You wouldn't want to see this resolve tested by a big team offering instant silverware, though
seen no sign of that, although also no sing of anyone else being interested
I don’t think that scenario exists (well, that United end up with nothing exists, but not FdJ at Barça on his current wage), hence why they have negotiated his sale and why in every single interview Laporta says “he needs to reduce his wage” to stay.
Salary cap rules in La Liga won’t allow that scenario, so we’re in total disagreement there.
I reckon that ETH knows for a fact rhar FdJ would like to play under his management again. So therefore the complication has come over who ends up paying for FdJ’s deferred wages, Barca are digging their heels in and Utd are rightfully not coughing it up which would set disastrous precedent for all future player negotiations.
I think Barca’s hope is that a moneybags club comes in with a bid For Frenkie that will also cover deferred wages. However I truly believe this won’t happen because FdJ’s only preferred choice is Utd due to EtH*.Therefore this becomes a waiting game and makes it more clear why FdJ is being so clear publicly about wanting to stay at Barca. Should also be noted that wanting to stay at Barca and being open to playing for Utd aren’t mutually exclusive.
Barca obv want to sell and my prediction is the deal happens right at the end of the window with some agreement reached that meters out the deferred wages between the clubs allowing each not to lose too much face and not leaving Utd looking like a soft touch/idiots in any future transfers, particularly marquee ones.
edit: * yeah exception would be Man City and playing for Pep.
I think Barca’s hope is that a moneybags club comes in with a bid For Frenkie that will also cover deferred wages. However I truly believe this won’t happen because FdJ’s only preferred choice is Utd due to EtH*.Therefore this becomes a waiting game and makes it more clear why FdJ is being so clear publicly about wanting to stay at Barca. Should also be noted that wanting to stay at Barca and being open to playing for Utd aren’t mutually exclusive.
Barca obv want to sell and my prediction is the deal happens right at the end of the window with some agreement reached that meters out the deferred wages between the clubs allowing each not to lose too much face and not leaving Utd looking like a soft touch/idiots in any future transfers, particularly marquee ones.
edit: * yeah exception would be Man City and playing for Pep.
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I don’t think it would matter. I also don’t have an inferiority complex about other teams in our league. I think as a proposition we can compete with all of them.
It’s been reported he already said he doesn’t want Chelsea. I guess it’s a case of what to believe and what to ignore.
Don’t kid yourself. If City or PSG went in for him we wouldn’t even be in the equation.
We did that already. The bid we made, which had already been accepted by Barcelona, was unilaterally altered by Man Utd - to pay them MORE so that they could cover at least half of the money owed to FDJ. They announced the Lewandowski signing the day after. They're just playing us like a fiddle.
That's the spirit.
City I agree, Pep would be very hard to turn down for him, and the guarantee of competing for trophies.
PSG I’m always doubtful, so so many players have an do regularly turn them down due to their league. FDJ has already turned them down once.
It has nothing to do with inferiority complex, it's just a simple truth that there are more attractive projects around at the moment.
Now I've seen nothing to suggest he'd prefer say City or PSG over us, but at the same time, it's only been us in the hunt, so spinning to story of him wanting to reunite with his old coach is easy. If there was serious competition for his signature, the narrative might be different
It’s been in the news for a good 2 months and every man and his dog knows Barca want to get rid. If City or PSG haven’t bid for him by now they never will.
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