Sancho won’t return to Man Utd until he's ready - Way too much inappropriate speculation.

[Tarrou]

So when he wasn’t performing well because of poor mental health state and everyone was giving him dogs abuse, did anyone consider his mental condition? Or before that when he didn’t join the tour because of his son’s loss and daughter also being in hospital. Did anyone cut him some slack when he was wasn’t scoring goals? Or when he gave the interview with piers Morgan and explained his mental state after the death of his newborn. Did anyone have any sympathy towards that interview or the overall situation?

Do you want me dig every single post for his performances and after the interview to show you the lack of empathy towards his mental health?

people criticising him for his poor performances or poor behaviour does not mean they "showed zero empathy for him losing his son"..

 

[Van Piorsing]

Agreed with the support for Sancho and I wish he comes back stronger the lad.

But I’m amazed at the sheer hypocrisy of posters here who showed zero empathy to Ronaldo who was also going through crisis after losing his son and the daughter being in hospital. He himself said this was the most difficult moment in his life more than the passing of his father. His mental state was all over the place and all of you holier than thou posters gave him nothing but abuse after abuse for weeks and months on this very forum. I remember after his meeting with Jordan Peterson for his own mental health how this place reacted. Shameless the lot of you. Just maintain the consistency, eh?

!

Where were you in 2005 when Ronaldo's father passed away ? That kind of emotional blackmail is weakest argument you could pull off. Keep blaming supporters for everything. United were the only club who wanted to respectfully pay him high wages he wanted in the first place. He was welcomed here better than Cantona after suspension despite visible decline in Juve.

Sancho will start playing on required level or he'll go. Newsflash for you - The times when club was constantly putting up to underperforming players for years is over.

Jordan Peterson ? I wonder what Doctor Phil has to say about this.

 

[mav_9me]

I would actually not agree with that.

Look, there is a reason for why this is swept under the rug, why teams -- and society -- for decades has called it for something else than what it is. I had a really bad burnout in 2016. Took on every possible challenge in my life from birth in 1981 to I was 35 y/o, played pro sports, did military service in an elite ranger division, aced school, everyone was like 'do you ever get stressed? You are always so calm!' -- then I could not go to the store and buy food for 6 months, had to set up goals, I can walk to the next block without giving up, then the next block, three blocks to the closest grocery store -- and I was fortunate and after around 10 months I could get back fairly well. Worked 100% (150%) from after a year and now its a thing of the past.

If we turn back the clock to 2015 -- what would I be writing in this thread? I don't know. Its not a topic I had thought about a lot -- but I could never even remotely imagine that I myself could get a burnout. It was something that happened to others. I am not the type who calls out others perhaps, but would I think 'what a softie'? I don't know. What do I think now? It is a tad different for everyone. But to a large extent it comes down to anxiety. Anxiety is your body's mechanism for preventing you from doing something stupid or at least to let you know when you did something stupid. Anyone can imagine how it would feel if the worst possible thing happened. You get caught in an avalanche and know no help will come. You accidentally kill a child, your own child to make it worse, in a car accident while driving recklessly. How would you feel if that happened? Its just the max level of anxiety, and a burnout is often about the body starting to hit you with that max level of anxiety like a couple of times per day. You know its an overreaction. And while nothing is unbearable I recon, it is extremely unpleasant. Goes on for a few hours. Afterwards the body is completely drained of energy. You start to freeze. Slight trembles. Can't eat. The body has just been in total alert mode, you get sensitive for lights and sounds. Day after day, every time you try to push yourself you get hit by it, even when you don't do anything and just stares into the roof, you get hit by it anyway. Even if you can keep going a little longer, you aren't doing anyone a favor. You would not be functioning at a high level. Has nothing to do with being soft or a snow flake. You keep hearing some experts say stuff like '100 years ago burnouts did not exist, life was different, it was so tough from a young age that people learned to coupe with hardship'. It is 100% false. The longer you go back, the more common it was, since life was harder. Anywhere you look, if you have those glasses on, you will find information on how people ended up lying in bed for prolonged periods and stuff like that. Couldn't perform their duties. Captains of Man-o-wars being forced to be put a shore because they were in a sorry state. Stuff like that. It was a big problem with high officers during WWII. Of course. Why wouldn't it have been?

The only sane thing to do if you get issues like this -- and definitely the sooner the better -- is to take a step back. Deal with whatever issues you have, its an overreaction for sure, but there are always some issues that stir things up. When you have done that, you will come back stronger than before, 100%. But it can take time.

Can we expect everyone that never really heard about these type of things to understand it? Nah, I don't think so. But really, does it matter?

Being in similar circumstances is not a prerequisite to being compassionate and understanding even if you truly don't get it. Just my opinion.

 

[Elcabron]

Oh here come the he has a lot of money so whats the problem posts.

Yep, apparently money magically makes you happy or some sort.

Anyone mentioning his wages in this thread is an idiot and a prick.

Haven't read all the quotes in this thread but I haven't seen anyone say he should be immune from mental health issues (if he actually has mental health issues that is, people seem to be jumping to conclusions) due to his high wages.

 

[JustinC00]

Sell him next summer because that's what this is and what he wants. He's pulling a Pogba.

 

[mav_9me]

I have only 2 things to say. For the record.

1. I fully support the club/ETH in their efforts and of course Sancho.

2. Hopefully it's not mental health issue and it's more of an attitude issue (for Sancho's sake).

 

[Cloud7]

He's been through a lot. Signing for Ole, watching him get sacked, Ralf come in and then ETH. The whole Ronaldo fiasco and the toxic dressing room. The club being sold. Losing his England place. Mason Greenwood. The Premier League. It's not been a great place for a young player. Hopefully ETH will settle it down and send him on a month's fitness holiday in Dubai.

I get what you meant but I love how the way this is worded makes it seem like signing for Ole was another negative thing or challenge he had to overcome

 

[Forevergiggs1]

I asked whether people found it extremely strange that Sancho wasn't linking up with the squad in spain when it was first announced a few weeks ago considering he missed the WC and some poo-pooed this away.

Now proving to be a real issue as many of us agreed it looked to be.

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This is refreshingly honest from ETH, but also very damning on our Marque signing.

He had pre-season with us, he has been playing games. Now according to our manager in his own words he is "not fit enough or in the right mental status" and "can't give a prognosis of when he will return". Rashford and Saka btw both had international issues before but they have bounced back since then.

Fair enough if some want to downplay the severity of this current situation by putting positive spin on it, and fairplay to Luckhurst and ETH who are dovetailing quite well in softening the impact of this revelation, but can anyone else recall a situation developing like this where a player has been dropped from a squad mid-season, potentially going to miss one or more significant fixtures for our season, with no return date, to work on his fitness and mentality?

Best case scenario it might work out as a masterstroke and he might come back ripped and able to sprint high intensity at his fullback whilst contributing to wins every week, I will celebrate as I love Sancho & his playstyle but like I said in the "sancho needs our support thread", feel like the writing could be on the wall for him and this does not bode well for our £73M man at all. I hope it's not the case but just looking at what's infront of our eyes here.

Not to mention he is on £300k/week and Rashfords' renewal will probably be using that as the yard stick for his new deal. I hope he turns it around and lives up to his status he had before he came here, it's great handling from ETH to call Sancho out and design a path back to the top for him but it is worrying we are at this crossroad in the first place.

ETH mentioned how hard it is to get into the England squad for the WC which suggests to me Sancho was devastated in not making the cut which could have numerous knock on effects and is where the mentality issue comes in. Depression is a real thing in football and if there's any doubts the club needs to do all it can in resolving the issue. If that means time out for Sancho then fair play. There's no point having a player not in the right mentality as we all witnessed with Rashford last season. Confidence needs to be regained and hopefully Sancho comes out of it a stronger person.

 

[kaku06]

people criticising him for his poor performances or poor behaviour does not mean they "showed zero empathy for him losing his son"..

But did anyone consider his mental state whilst judging his performances? They aren’t isolated to each other you know, the last 8 pages would tell you that.

 

[Elcabron]

!

Where were you in 2005 when Ronaldo's father passed away ? That kind of emotional blackmail is weakest argument you could pull off. Keep blaming supporters for everything. United were the only club who wanted to respectfully pay him high wages he wanted in the first place. He was welcomed here better than Cantona after suspension despite visible decline in Juve.

Sancho will start playing on required level or he'll go. Newsflash for you - The times when club was constantly putting up to underperforming players for years is over.

Jordan Peterson ? I wonder what Doctor Phil has to say about this.

Exactly what I've been trying to say. The state of this thread. Sancho has massively underperformed for us since he was signed, he is one of the highest earners at the club. This is not a situation the team tolerate.

 

[mav_9me]

Haven't read all the quotes in this thread but I haven't seen anyone say he should be immune from mental health issues (if he actually has mental health issues that is, people seem to be jumping to conclusions) due to his high wages.

Your own posts which are insinuating (even if not directly saying)

The warning signs were there at Dortmund, he had issues there with being late for training due to over sleeping. He hasn't exactly rolled up the sleeves since he arrived. Needs to sort himself out and fast, otherwise look to get rid in the summer. We are a football club not a psychiatric hospital.

He earns over 300k pw. We are a billon in debt and apparently can't afford to bring in the striker we desperately need. This is in part due to the outlay on Sancho who has been an absolute dud for us so far. He needs to sort himself out and fast. Maybe he will come back stronger after this reset but if he doesn't he needs to be moved on, end of.

All this compassion required etc is based on pure speculation. Nobody in the know has said he has mental health issues. So I'll save the compassion until im told otherwise.

Whatever is going on I really hope he's able to get the help he needs and recover. He's clearly going through a lot of stuff and it's great the club are taking the sensitive steps required.

But that said, he is afforded privileges in his life that 99% of us will never get to experience. His job is one that, if we could, we would probably all do for free. On a purely materialistic level, there's only so far he can fall during a time when there is great financial pressure on many.

I'llmake a general point. Despite any amount of money, anyone can fall a long way due to mental health issues.

 

[kaku06]

!

Where were you in 2005 when Ronaldo's father passed away ? That kind of emotional blackmail is weakest argument you could pull off. Keep blaming supporters for everything. United were the only club who wanted to respectfully pay him high wages he wanted in the first place. He was welcomed here better than Cantona after suspension despite visible decline in Juve.

Sancho will start playing on required level or he'll go. Newsflash for you - The times when club was constantly putting up to underperforming players for years is over.

Jordan Peterson ? I wonder what Doctor Phil has to say about this.

Read it again, it’s not your strongest point so keep trying until you get it.

 

[Judas]

Sell him next summer because that's what this is and what he wants. He's pulling a Pogba.

Bloody hell, the mental gymnastics going on in this thread is something else.

 

[Van Piorsing]

Read it again, it’s not your strongest point so keep trying until you get it.

He had a mental health problem and one of first things he did was to go to Piers Morgan to stir even more bad blood. Logical.

Sorry but I'm not entirely buying Sancho is the similar example to Ronaldo to compare with. It's almost disrespectful to Sancho who didn't attack the club at any means.

Sancho still got time to make it and he probably will, as for Ronaldo, people on the Caf reacted to the behaviour on the pitch, not the fact of his close one passing away.

 

[groovyalbert]

Your own posts which are insinuating (even if not directly saying)






I'llmake a general point. Despite any amount of money, anyone can fall a long way due to mental health issues.

Nice one for completely misreading my post - that couldn't be further from the point I was making.

 

[Messier1994]

I wonder what's happened to him. He was playing to a decent level and looked to be fitting into the team, certainly nothing to suggest what seems to be a sudden descent.

I'd imagine he has found it difficult to go from being a star at Dortmund to come to the PL. How he left City, perhaps he's not too good at dealing with adversity in the game, and this time there is no other suitor ready to promise him everything he wants.

Either way, he's one of the most talented players in our squad and hopefully we stand by him and he pays us back in full.

Honestly, I think that it almost always can be assumed that these things are -- not -- about "something" happening. These things are common in society, I bet that in 95% of the cases it was not triggered by a specific event.

I think that it is much more likely to be about -- for example something like -- Sancho starting to have problems sleeping the day before a game when he was like 14 y/o and its something he has wrestled with "forever". That he always becomes really nervous before games, pukes or whatever. Or that he is constantly in pain, nothing major, but still enough to always wear on him. Or things like eating disturbances or stuff like that. Or that he really dreads it every time he goes on 'in society' because he is afraid of meeting people who will yell that he is an awful player. Like whatever. Then these type of issues can of course get aggregated by 'current events'. Family members getting sick. You aren't picked for the World Cup. A breakup. Or whatever. But that is not the issue causing it. The cause is 100% wear and tear over several years.

Think of it like this, the root problem is the body protesting mechanism falling into a constant state of alarm. If something happen, it can knock you down if it is extremely severe, but then you recover. A really bad teen break up, you can be down for weeks. If not longer. But then you recover. That is the natural result of evolution. A burnout is more like the body going -- 'OK, I warned you several times per week for 10 years and you didn't listen, suit yourself, take this if you can'.

I think its important to point this out because if you are in the position Sancho is in, I think its extremely common to think "if I take time off, people will think its because of X/Y/Z" and X/Y/Z being some recent event, some dirty secret or very traumatic event . It is not.

 

[TheReligion]

It doesn't look good on Manchester United full stop. I get he has mental health issues but it's rare you see this on the top level (in football anyway) whereby a player becomes unavailable for selection due to it. It's well documented how Iniesta struggled with depression at a time where Barcelona and Spain were dominating world football.

Personally, I think it reflects brilliantly on Manchester Utd. So much ignorance on here about the struggles of mental health, and I suspect a lot of that is from people who are lucky enough to have never experienced it for themselves. Manchester Utd is showing a level of compassion rarely shown at the top of elite institutions or sports. We are supporting him both physically and mentally, and if that works, I guarantee you Sancho will feel a sense of loyalty to this club like nothing else. Let's hope he's one day able to repay that. We, of course, don't know all the details, but I think it's safer to err on the side of empathy and compassion, but then I could say that for a number of topics...

Absolutely agree with you @TrustInJanuzaj . Good post.

 

[nimic]

My degree is in Psychology.

What degree is that, then?

 

[JustinC00]

Bloody hell, the mental gymnastics going on in this thread is something else.

He's downed his tools. Plain and simple. He's had a month off to clear his head and try to get right and he still needs more time? This is him sulking after being left out of the World Cup. The time off has made him realize he wants out of the club.

Rashford remerging. Antony taken his RW job. Garnacho emerging. ETH wanting more attacking options . He wants back in the national side and staying here will keep him out because he isn't first choice for ETH
.

 

[Tarrou]

But did anyone consider his mental state whilst judging his performances? They aren’t isolated to each other you know, the last 8 pages would tell you that.

probably not and people rarely do

100% of people are sympathetic for him losing his son, obviously

but its nonsense to criticise people for showing "zero empathy" on a seperate issue because they are critical of his footballing performances

Ronaldo acting like a massive twat on the interview didn't help either

 

[Raoul]

Ronaldo, Jones, Greenwood, Sancho....we're slowly becoming a nursing home for the old, the crippled, the mentally weak and.....more. Are players properly scouted before signed/given new contracts?

One might question the intellectual prowess of anyone who lazily generalizes each of these players into the same sentence, knowing full well that each of their situations are radically different.

 

[gerdm07]

At the end of the day this is a ruthless business and if you can't help your side win matches you are expendable. I predict the club will give him time, provide empathy and understanding, and welcome him back. Unless he performs outstanding when he comes back, though, he'll be sold in the summer.

Now we need a striker, a winger, a cm, and a rb. The list keeps growing.

 

[Herman Toothrot]

Sell him next summer because that's what this is and what he wants. He's pulling a Pogba.

Is it though? Because it feels a little bit like you might be pulling things from your arsehole and holding them up to the light as fact.

 

[Chesterlestreet]

people criticising him for his poor performances or poor behaviour does not mean they "showed zero empathy for him losing his son"..

Correct.

Shouldn't have to be pointed out (again and again).

If Ronaldo had come out stating that he needed some time off (or anything indicating that he was having a hard time coping), hardly anyone on here would have been unsympathetic. This isn't even hypothetical - there's zero doubt about it. The Caf is not a cesspit like Twitter.

(At the very least, people would have refrained from making harsh comments about him - even those who clearly don't like him very much.)

 

[Devil81]

My biggest worry is this is a Deli Alli situation and it's simply a case of get all the wealth young and losing that motivation and drive that got you where you are.

I hope its not the case but I suspect sadly it might very well be.

 

[glazed]

I get what you meant but I love how the way this is worded makes it seem like signing for Ole was another negative thing or challenge he had to overcome

Well given the way Ole's last season (Sancho's first) panned out, you can't blame him for being traumatised. He thought he'd joined a football club and it turned out to be a clown circus.

 

[phelans shorts]

The relevance is that he needs to be moved on if he is not up to it as we have other areas in squad that need to be addressed and we can't afford to pay a player 300k pw for zero output. Get rid and bring someone else in on half that salary. We are hugely in debt.

So no relevance. Got it.

 

[TheReligion]

One might question the intellectual prowess of anyone who lazily generalizes each of these players into the same sentence, knowing full well that each of their situations are radically different.

Yup. More and more I read what people post here these days and think ‘what a twat of a post’.

So far detached from reality It’s untrue.

 

[devilish]

One might question the intellectual prowess of anyone who lazily generalizes each of these players into the same sentence, knowing full well that each of their situations are radically different.

Well we always seem to end up with the wrong type of players, players whom, for one reason or another, are unsuited to play in a team who is aiming to seriously compete for top honours.. Considering that we're definitely won't win anything with so many sob cases around then maybe we should consider creating the empathy cup. I'd suggest we call it the Ole cup in the honour of the guy who helped assemble this great squad.

 

[phelans shorts]

He's downed his tools. Plain and simple. He's had a month off to clear his head and try to get right and he still needs more time? This is him sulking after being left out of the World Cup. The time off has made him realize he wants out of the club.

Rashford remerging. Antony taken his RW job. Garnacho emerging. ETH wanting more attacking options . He wants back in the national side and staying here will keep him out because he isn't first choice for ETH
.

You’re full of shit

 

[TheReligion]

Well we always seem to end up with the wrong type of players, players whom, for one reason or another, are unsuited to play in a team who is aiming to seriously compete for top honours.. Considering that we're definitely won't win anything with so many sob cases around then maybe we should consider creating the empathy cup. I'd suggest we call it the Ole cup in the honour of the guy who helped assemble this great squad.

Why are you behaving like a spoilt cretin?

 

[devilish]

Why are you behaving like a spoilt cretin?

Yet you are the one insulting the poster

 

[Shai-Hulud]

But did anyone consider his mental state whilst judging his performances? They aren’t isolated to each other you know, the last 8 pages would tell you that.

We don't know whether Ronaldo was in any real crisis or not. Or the extent of such a crisis. The poor performances started long before that, and are better explained by his age.

Thinking Ronaldo is a normal human being, mentally, is a mistake. He's a massive narcissist.

 

[TheReligion]

Yet you are the one insulting the poster

No I’m saying how you are behaving.

Spoilt and stupid posts.

 

[devilish]

No I’m saying how you are behaving.

Spoilt and stupid posts.

You are right. We shouldn't expect players to do their job in the same way many had been doing for decades despite having issues of their own
(including myself). My apologies.

As said the empathy cup is really needed here. That's one this team can reach the final for

 

[TheReligion]

You are right. We shouldn't expect players to do their job in the same way many had been doing for decades despite having issues of their own
(including myself). My apologies.

As said the empathy cup is really needed here

Nice try.

 

[Raoul]

Let’s knock it off with the insults (whether intended or not)

 

[Luka Mora]

Sounds like Sancho is soft like butter and doesn't have the mentality to survive and thrive at United.

I did not see any sympathy for when maguire's performances plummetted or calls for a world wide support club, the prognosis, was/is that he needs to be sold.
So I think the same applies to sancho, we need to move on off our books the same way we quietly moved on Dan James and pretend the transfer didn't happen

 

[devilish]

Nice try.

That's the best this squad can do. Hopefully a new owner + ETH will change things around

 

[Herman Toothrot]

Sounds like Sancho is soft like butter and doesn't have the mentality to survive and thrive at United.

I did not see any sympathy for when maguire's performances plummetted or calls for a world wide support club, the prognosis, was/is that he needs to be sold.
So I think the same applies to sancho, we need to move on off our books the same way we quietly moved on Dan James and pretend the transfer didn't happen

Does it sound like that? Which words do you think make it sound like that? It read to me like Ten Hag sent a player on a specialist training regime during what is essentially the off-season. I didn't get any dairy vibes.

You're right about Maguire, he was treated appallingly by a large section of our Internet-based fans. Let's try and do better!