And yes, good point to recall as much as possible they're not only charged for FFP violations.It’s not FFP. That’s only a small part of it. It’s fraud and cheating.
And yes, good point to recall as much as possible they're not only charged for FFP violations.It’s not FFP. That’s only a small part of it. It’s fraud and cheating.
Go find out how many start ups fail due to money problems before you spout your nonsenseThen what good does it do for smaller clubs? It essentially only limits the speed with which they can grow. It's like saying "we don't trust you to run your business yourself so we put rules in place you have to abide to for your own protection".
This is absolutely unthinkable in any other market. Imagine startups only being allowed to spend what they earn, we'd probably still be stuck with analog photography, cell phones and horses.
Sport isn’t any other market and pretending they can be compared will never be of benefit.Then what good does it do for smaller clubs? It essentially only limits the speed with which they can grow. It's like saying "we don't trust you to run your business yourself so we put rules in place you have to abide to for your own protection".
This is absolutely unthinkable in any other market. Imagine startups only being allowed to spend what they earn, we'd probably still be stuck with analog photography, cell phones and horses.
From what I heard yesterday any evidence whether it's gained legally or not is admissable in this case.Hope all of this is admissible evidence. It's all stuff from the email hacking that featured in the previous UEFA investigation right?
Someone should do an audit of their attendance figures too.Can we focus more on the guy who thinks they’re being charged for the length of the grass please
North West Counties League One North. Massive game v AFC Liverpool coming up and a revival of the legendary City v Bury mega derby.If City were to be kicked out of the Prem, would it be League 2 they have to restart from? Seen lots of folk online and journos saying it would be the Championship.
My city fan colleague told me this, where has it come from?Can we focus more on the guy who thinks they’re being charged for the length of the grass please
Yes you're correct with regards to start-ups, but they exist only to generate profits and maximise shareholder returns.Then what good does it do for smaller clubs? It essentially only limits the speed with which they can grow. It's like saying "we don't trust you to run your business yourself so we put rules in place you have to abide to for your own protection".
This is absolutely unthinkable in any other market. Imagine startups only being allowed to spend what they earn, we'd probably still be stuck with analog photography, cell phones and horses.
Why? The Wikipedia definition reads as follows: A cartel is a group of independent market participants who collude with each other in order to improve their profits and dominate the market. Cartels are usually associations in the same sphere of business, and thus an alliance of rivals.Oh stop spouting nonsense will you. That's just a ridiculous statement.
Then explain to me what advantage FFP poses for small teams. It is literally impossible to organically catch up with top clubs. FFP only cuts their economic freedom in a way that limits their growth potential severely. It only protects them against their own incompetence and prevents them from utilizing their own competence. In effect, it freezes the status quo and ensures that everything stays as it is.Your second paragraph is so stupid I won't even respond to it.
With regards to the 1st one - yes! To grow organically, within their means, and not to face the scenarios we've seen time and time again in football were they've been too greedy and ambitious, ruin the clubs, feck off, and leave entire communities in disarray.
It's been my favourite one so far today, and there have been a few whoppers - the aplomb and arrogance with which it was brought forwards is what made it gold, for me.Can we focus more on the guy who thinks they’re being charged for the length of the grass please
You mean besides them being absolute morons?My city fan colleague told me this, where has it come from?
To the 2 bolded parts - it's not, and I've already done that. If you're going to be wilfully ignorant about things, and argue without any intellectual honestly, then that's your prerogative.Why? The Wikipedia definition reads as follows: A cartel is a group of independent market participants who collude with each other in order to improve their profits and dominate the market. Cartels are usually associations in the same sphere of business, and thus an alliance of rivals.
That's exactly what FFP is doing: A group of independent market participants who put rules into place that ensure their profits and market leadership. Let's be real, European football has nothing to do with a free market. Maybe the word "collude" is too strong since it is widely accepted and known that they do it. But the result is still the same. IMO it should be forbidden.
Then explain to me what advantage FFP poses for small teams. It is literally impossible to organically catch up with top clubs. FFP only cuts their economic freedom in a way that limits their growth potential severely. It only protects them against their own incompetence and prevents them from utilizing their own competence. In effect, it freezes the status quo and ensures that everything stays as it is.
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They can trace that back though, they can ask for KDBs bank statements and then ask for all sponsorships he has and with what companies.If they did they would have probably set up an entity that paid their share of taxes and so did KDB on the payments recieved.
The aim wasn't to save taxes but to ensure the payments can't be traced back to City
Sport is based on some principle of fairness. The comparison with the startups makes no sense. I mean, startups and companies can just hire more people and throw them at the problem. Let's do so in sports too and some squad fields 800 players at the same time.Then what good does it do for smaller clubs? It essentially only limits the speed with which they can grow. It's like saying "we don't trust you to run your business yourself so we put rules in place you have to abide to for your own protection".
This is absolutely unthinkable in any other market. Imagine startups only being allowed to spend what they earn, we'd probably still be stuck with analog photography, cell phones and horses.
It’s the shittest legal cartel I’ve ever seen. If Arsenal, Liverpool and United are putting in rules deliberately to stop City and Chelsea from competing then feck me - what a job they’ve done. 1 league title between the 3 of them in 10 fecking years. Anyone who looks at wages and transfer fees going up continually and doesn’t think maybe some sort of cap is needed to stop that growth in relation to revenues is being a bit silly in my mind.Depends on how you define "fair". In my view, FFP is anything but fair. In fact, I'd say it's closer to a legal cartel.
It’s the shittest legal cartel I’ve ever seen.
Yeah we can forgive you for joining them as all make mistakes,jokes aside I see both going abroad if they got on their toesWould love for them to get relegated, or not allowed to play in any English leagues.
Ill take KBD and Haaland in the summer if they do, so they can remain in Manchester
A rule has been referenced by code (K.20 or something) which people have then cited from the current rules, but it’s actually referencing the 2013 rule book and obviously additions have been made since so K.20 from 2013 isn’t the same rule as it is now.My city fan colleague told me this, where has it come from?
You know he hit post, and sat back ready to bask in the glory of his wisdom as the notifications rolled in.It's been my favourite one so far today, and there have been a few whoppers - the aplomb and arrogance with which it was brought forwards is what made it gold, for me.
The premier league is in effect the owners of the 20 clubs in it. To win a vote City would have to bribe 7 of those owners/groups of owners, which would take a hell of a lot of money with a good chance one of them would spill the beans on what was happening and leave them even deeper in it.Why are many posters so confident that some kind of action will happen? Is PL or independent body a pious organization immune to money bags?
Not missing any relevant point.It’s just the point you think you are making is not relevant.Jesus wept. Talk about missing the point!
I mean the two biggest clubs in the country have had two eras of real success each and in between and for the majority of seasons have not been successful. United have gone 10 years without a league win and Liverpool just came off a 30 year wait.That’s not quite true. The big clubs influenced FFP in order to make it impossible for them to be matched financially. By all means have a go at City but let’s be honest about the big clubs motives here.
At the end of they day it is just 53 pages of wishfull thinking. No one knows if anything illegal can be proven, nor if anything illegal has even taken place as hard to believe as it may be.Why are many posters so confident that some kind of action will happen? Is PL or independent body a pious organization immune to money bags?
City are the Amber Heard of clubsThe defensive stance of City/some in the media claiming everyone's against them- yeah, you broke the rules for a sustained period of time when other clubs have been fighting to stay competitive, fighting to stay in the league in some instances, and have felt huge pressure from the Covid pandemic; they had to do all of those things within the laws of the game and you flagrantly cheated by breaking those laws, of course they're going to be pissed off with you!!!
I disagree with FFP in general but heres my issue with my club.Probably true to some degree...
What's interesting about this is it's got nothing to do with fairness.
It's just about the same clubs being locked in to the top of football forever. No one being allowed to come in like Jack Walker, Abramovich or Abu Dhabi and build a club up.
City just took it to the extreme.
If you want a fair league, a squad level salary cap is the answer. Not these ridiculous FFP rules.
Slightly disingenuous. It's many pages of sharing media reports and excerpts of the documents substantiating the charges.At the end of they day it is just 53 pages of wishfull thinking. No one knows if anything illegal can be proven, nor if anything illegal has even taken place as hard to believe as it may be.
For those aspiring for European football they'll vote against them, and those in relegation scraps its a vote they'll never win.The premier league is in effect the owners of the 20 clubs in it. To win a vote City would have to bribe 7 of those owners/groups of owners, which would take a hell of a lot of money with a good chance one of them would spill the beans on what was happening and leave them even deeper in it.
Already has been proven no?At the end of they day it is just 53 pages of wishfull thinking. No one knows if anything illegal can be proven, nor if anything illegal has even taken place as hard to believe as it may be.
Not quite true that is it.At the end of they day it is just 53 pages of wishfull thinking. No one knows if anything illegal can be proven, nor if anything illegal has even taken place as hard to believe as it may be.
In which case we're hopefully correctly be punished.By the sounds of it many of City transfer fees and wages could be hidden. Making the real spend even higher.
Its 53 pages of leaks that show they wanted to get around rules that were in place.At the end of they day it is just 53 pages of wishfull thinking. No one knows if anything illegal can be proven, nor if anything illegal has even taken place as hard to believe as it may be.
I bet you’re popular on bluemoonIn which case we're hopefully correctly be punished.
Make no mistake, I don't think City should walk away from this, even if the charges don't stick there needs to be a change at the top regardless of where that leaves the club.
This whole thing came about (the transfer inflation disucssion) because I made a Harry Maguire joke.