Sofyan Amrabat | signs for United on loan

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Chairman Steve

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Hopefully the Glazer pennypinching this calendar year is part of the club sale process. I’d be mad if come 1st January 2024 and there’s still no sign of them going or they’re already gone.

In terms of Forest bidding, don’t forget PL clubs are flush with cash compared to teams in Italy and Spain. Atletico Madrid got namedropped too. There’s probably a whole lot of interest because of his contract situation.
 

IamBurnsey

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Look at united messing around with this transfer now for ages whilst city just go and get who they need, it would be great if united could operate under the same rules as them!
 

mav_9me

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We've just signed Mount for big money and McTominay has played about 5 minutes in 3 games so far. Honestly at this stage I'm convinced it's panic stations at Old Trafford after the start we've had and we're throwing enough shit at the wall that we hope something sticks. This is the approach that got us into the mess we are in, constantly trying to get rid of players that don't work out and were never good enough in the first place.
You may feel Amrabat is not good enough. In which case fair enough, I don't have a great deal of insight on him. My only point is, either we say McT is good enough as squad rotation in CM or we replace him with someone who the club thinks is better. Worst case scenario is we try and fail to get Amrabat. Best case is because we left it till the brink, we get a great deal on Amrabat.
 

RuudTom83

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The bolded part is something no one ever mentions and makes me irrationally mad.

Not to mention the debt part.

This tweet illustrates our problem. As long as the Glazers own us, we will not win a title. 100% sure of it.
Exactly! United are run like a team aiming for Top 4.

That's all the Glazers care about.
 

FerociousCorgis

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would love to see a loan deal. Italian clubs love trying to get their talent in on loan deals it seems so would love to see it work in reverse.
 

Valencia Shin Crosses

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"Martial...He's isolated Skrtel here..."
You may feel Amrabat is not good enough. In which case fair enough, I don't have a great deal of insight on him. My only point is, either we say McT is good enough as squad rotation in CM or we replace him with someone who the club thinks is better. Worst case scenario is we try and fail to get Amrabat. Best case is because we left it till the brink, we get a great deal on Amrabat.
Yeah the reluctance to sell McTominay is just bizarre and reeks of the Lingard situation all over again. A player that doesn’t play many minutes is valued at a very decent price by some other clubs but we hang on to them just to not use them and kill any value they might have. Incompetence of the highest order
 

cyberman

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This is off topic, so apologies.

We knew in Jan 2022, that Greenwood was gone, Cavani was leaving in summer, Martial went on loan to Sevilla. So our only striker was Ronaldo who we got rid before Jan 2023. So on Jan 1, 2023, all we had was Rashford as our striker and Martial if you want to count him. And all we add is Weghorst on a loan?

In general I agree use proper loans to fill short term holes. But in general as a club what we have done in support of ETH is abysmal, mainly from a planning perspective and that imo is mainly on the owners and partly on the structure.
I’m sure we could have done better but if we went out and spent in the January window we would have Gakpo here for 40m odd that doesn’t really fit into the team not 8 months later.
it was a risk but somehow worked out.I’d also say we can use the market better rather than just using it incorrectly.
 

Pintu

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Napoli the same club who offered a loan deal?

He’s only not considering Forest because we want him. The question is, should we?!

We’ve seen in January that just getting a number isn’t all it’s cracked up to be.
I don't know about Napoli's offer, but it seems he rejected approaches from them because United is his priority.

There is 0 proof of him only rejecting Forest because of United... Everything suggests, he'd rather see out his contract at Fiorentina (until 2025, once Fiorentina triggered their option) than sign for small clubs...


2) The question is, should we?!

I don't know if this would work or not. But I believe we should be looking for a midfielder, we need more quality players and if he is ETH's choice, I'm inclined to trust him on this one. It is far from expensive...
 

avgp_1

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Happy with this signing if we make it.

His inconsistency esp defensively is a bit of an issue but he does tend to do well against the better teams. For Verona or even last season I thought his best games came against Napoli earlier in the season and the away game at San Siro, pocketed Tonali in that one, another was Juve away. When he is switched on, Amrabat is a very good midfielder which I believe he showed at the WC (Watched them only twice though)
 

Ekeke

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What are you on about? Of course he’s Fiorentina’s best midfielder. What has he done to this poster - maybe he used to date someone close to you? You seem to have a real agenda against him for whatever reason.
No I just watched them. He was average/poor last season and Mandragora is easily a better player. Castrovilli was better in past seasons but now he gets injured and doesnt play enough so you might choose Amrabat due to availability. Not ability. Bonaventura was probably a bit better than Amrabat and Duncan is about the same level as Amrabat.

Fiorentina were very average and finished 8th, with Amrabat's position one of those they could improve on

They've started the season with a win and a draw with a midfield 3 of Bonaventura, Mandragora and Arthur and sit 5th after 2 games with Amrabat frozen out and training alone, no participation in the team
 

Leftback99

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Do you think it's a negotiating tactic or something the journalists have gotten wrong?
I think it's not something you can bluff which many seem to think. It's been clear it's a problem all summer.
 

ShinjiNinja26

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It’s a sad state of affairs when we’re scrimping around trying to get a midfielder in on loan while Nottingham Forest come straight in and drop £17m on the table for the player in question and get an offer accepted. This is what these Glazer parasites have reduced us to.
 
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Assuming there is a loan fee, I don't see the FFP benefit this year.

The loan fee would hit our P & L this year, whereas a five-year contract would spread the (reported) transfer fee over five years.
 

Infra-red

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It’s a sad state of affairs when we’re scrimping around trying to get a midfielder in on loan while Nottingham Forest come straight in and drop £17m on the table for the player in question and get an offer accepted. This is what these Glazer parasites have reduced us to.
Sad state indeed. £17m on a five year deal is £3.4m a year as far as FFP is concerned. The fact that we can't even swing that, is a pretty damning indictment of where the club is at.
 

Eugenius

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Sad state indeed. £17m on a five year deal is £3.4m a year as far as FFP is concerned. The fact that we can't even swing that, is a pretty damning indictment of where the club is at.
I know Boehly has made amortisation popular by cooking the books, but don't ignore the actual cash flow elements of spending money. It's probably not strictly FFP but also managing cash flow and debt given we are (at least now) a publicly listed company with investors (and suitors) who aren't fooled by amortisation and accounting gains and losses.

I will also add Boehly isn't completely mad in his approach. They are taking the bet that the players they've bought will be worth more than book value (ie young players who can keep or grow their value)... Amrabat on the other hand doesn't have any real chance of sell on value.
 

Infra-red

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Cash is the problem for United more than anything Else .
If it's cash that's the problem, that would make more sense than FFP. We can only afford to offer a loan deal because even though that is probably less useful for FFP calculations, it nevertheless gets us around the more immediate problem of not being able to put down any upfront payment for the player. We've presumably maxed out the credit facility.
 

Overhaul FC

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I'd rather we didn't sign Cucurella or a left back and sign Amrabat.

We need him more. Atleast we have Dalot and AWB for this period until Malacia or Shaw return.

But if Casemiro is out or we don't have a CM that can play in away games were fecked.
 

RuudTom83

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Look at united messing around with this transfer now for ages whilst city just go and get who they need, it would be great if united could operate under the same rules as them!
I know! City will be lining up this weekend with Rice and Paqueta in midfield, while we are scrounging around trying to get some freebies in! Typical United! Bloody useless ;)
 

gajender

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If it's cash that's the problem, that would make more sense than FFP. We can only afford to offer a loan deal because even though that is probably less useful for FFP calculations, it nevertheless gets us around the more immediate problem of not being able to put down any upfront payment for the player. We've presumably maxed out the credit facility.
It is more likely than FFP either we simply don't have much cash or don't want to commit much on further incomings for current window .
 

STYLOISRED

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This is going to be a loan with obligation to buy in a year i feel. Probably going to pay something in the region of 3mil this year and a further 17m full transfer.
 

Ahmer Baig

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This is so embarrassing that the club does not even have 25 to 30 M to buy a player, thanks to useless Glazers and Woodward.
 

Fooza

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This is so embarrassing that the club does not even have 25 to 30 M to buy a player, thanks to useless Glazers and Woodward.
they'll get their pants pulled down for the likes of antony and mason in terms of price, then they can't sell any players for a dime.

should really have hired a top dof with a good board, clubs still rotten. thanks glazers.
 

Rauður Djöfull

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Yet another reason to rally and protest the owners and get them out

This is ridiculous for "the biggest club in the world"
 

Ekeke

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Would be a smart signing imo. He's a high volume passer, shows a lot of composure on the ball, adds technical security in the deeper build up phase and can occupy the central centre back (CCB) role in a 3 man back-line in build up. His long passing ranks in the 99th percentile for passes attempted/completed and there was a reason Fiorentina ranked among the best teams in the league at keeping possession with players like Amrabat. It's a smart signing on a possible low fee for a player that we don't have in midfield.

With Casemiro, Eriksen, Amrabat and Mainoo, that's a good variety of players to have in the first phase of midfield. Then in advanced midfield positions we have Bruno, Mount and possibly Hannibal.


That should hopefully open up the opportunity for us to go big on a midfielder and CB in the following summer. A midfielder who is the controller type with the ability to pass through the lines, evade pressure comfortably whilst also having the out of possession game to control opposition transitions. With the CB we also require someone who ticks the boxes when it comes to in-possession but out of possession I feel we should target someone who has the pace, power and athleticism to go along with the ability on the ball.
Taking very selective stats rather than looking at a bigger, or whole picture is something you can do for any player to make them look twice as good as they actually are.

We had the same thing in the past with Lindelof. Oh look at this, the CB who has been beaten the least by a dribble in the league! ... Because he only tried to tackle and win the ball if he was almost guaranteed to win it and was for the most part running away towards his own goal backing off. He would attempt half as many tackles as other CBs and people were taking this stat seriously.

When people give 1 or 2 stats and dont give a proper spread of them its to create a false impression on purpose.

2.3 tackles at the world cup is a completely normal amount for someone in his position. However when you factor in that Morocco averaged 38.4% of the ball. Thats the 6th least of the tournament, or 27th from the top. You would think that your defensive midfielders would win the ball an above average amount in that scenario with all the defending you are doing for the vast majority of the game. Its not like its a bad number, its just he's in the perfect position to do lots of that and its not a high amount.

As an example Bruno and Casemiro both average 3.3 tackles a game so far this season and we average 54% of the ball. McTom averaged 2.5 tackles per 90 mins last season, Fred 3.4 and we had 53.8% of the ball.

They talk about Amrabat's improved clearances. Great. That was the 9th most in the team, their striker En Nesyri had the same amount. They were a team that had very little of the ball and had loads of players back in their box clearing the ball out, while some players like Amrabat ran around outside the box to put in a few tackles and put some pressure on the ball. And then Ounahi would carry the ball forward well with little end product and En Nesyri was the only player able to score more than 1 goal in the tournament. They were a very limited team who showed resilliancy defending as deep as possible. Thats not how we play. Thats how Luton are going to have to play

I dont have much frame of reference for "pressure regains". Not many websites carry that stat. Im not sure I know exactly what is meant by it. Morocco averaged 19.6 clearances a game which is the 12th most of the 32 teams. So thats plenty of cleared balls to chase after and compete for. Obviously a lot more than any of the good teams. Belgium had 18, that might be a good indication of why they were knocked out in the group stages in Morocco's group. You wouldnt expect a good team to have to clear that amount of balls out of their own box on a regular basis.
 

Red_toad

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So loan and he extends his contract for a further 12 months. What a struggle for United to strengthen the squad :rolleyes:
 

Adnan

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Taking very selective stats rather than looking at a bigger, or whole picture is something you can do for any player to make them look twice as good as they actually are.

We had the same thing in the past with Lindelof. Oh look at this, the CB who has been beaten the least by a dribble in the league! ... Because he only tried to tackle and win the ball if he was almost guaranteed to win it and was for the most part running away towards his own goal backing off. He would attempt half as many tackles as other CBs and people were taking this stat seriously.

When people give 1 or 2 stats and dont give a proper spread of them its to create a false impression on purpose.

2.3 tackles at the world cup is a completely normal amount for someone in his position. However when you factor in that Morocco averaged 38.4% of the ball. Thats the 6th least of the tournament, or 27th from the top. You would think that your defensive midfielders would win the ball an above average amount in that scenario with all the defending you are doing for the vast majority of the game. Its not like its a bad number, its just he's in the perfect position to do lots of that and its not a high amount.

As an example Bruno and Casemiro both average 3.3 tackles a game so far this season and we average 54% of the ball. McTom averaged 2.5 tackles per 90 mins last season, Fred 3.4 and we had 53.8% of the ball.

They talk about Amrabat's improved clearances. Great. That was the 9th most in the team, their striker En Nesyri had the same amount. They were a team that had very little of the ball and had loads of players back in their box clearing the ball out, while some players like Amrabat ran around outside the box to put in a few tackles and put some pressure on the ball. And then Ounahi would carry the ball forward well with little end product and En Nesyri was the only player able to score more than 1 goal in the tournament. They were a very limited team who showed resilliancy defending as deep as possible. Thats not how we play. Thats how Luton are going to have to play

I dont have much frame of reference for "pressure regains". Not many websites carry that stat. Im not sure I know exactly what is meant by it. Morocco averaged 19.6 clearances a game which is the 12th most of the 32 teams. So thats plenty of cleared balls to chase after and compete for. Obviously a lot more than any of the good teams. Belgium had 18, that might be a good indication of why they were knocked out in the group stages in Morocco's group. You wouldnt expect a good team to have to clear that amount of balls out of their own box on a regular basis.
We need a first phase midfielder who is comfortable in the first phase of midfield. Amrabat is comfortably better than Mandragora in the deeper build up phase and the eye test along with the stats tell you this. Amrabat comfortably out does Mandragora when it comes to passes attempted, progressive passes, pass completion and progressive carries which is far more important for a midfielder occupying the deeper areas of midfield, which we lack in. And the strengths Mandragora brings we don't need because we already have Bruno and Mount.
 

JJ12

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This has absolutely nothing to do with Glazers though.
That's not entirely true, they've sanctioned such shit transfers and paid stupid fees/wages to get us in this mess.

Or at least the people they've employed.
 
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