Scott McTominay | Transfer discussion not performance discussion

[Dominos]

I always feel a odd sense of relief when he's subbed on to ,likely, 'close a game out' and yet I don't know why.

Same feeling happened again against Nottingham Forest and the first thing he did was give away a silly foul with a high foot towards a Nottingham Forest's players chest and continued to lose control of the ball rather consistently from there.

So, I've convinced myself he's a good player but the reality is he really isn't.

Hopefully he's brought on to close the game out against Arsenal when we're leading..

It's because the rest of our players are so physically meek that the theory that Mctominay's physicality will save the day starts to sound appealing. In reality, he just ends up chasing shadows and giving the ball away.

Still baffles me we tried to hold for £45m and scared away the interest. If we'd have set the price at £35m after we rejected 30 we'd be £35m richer right now, pure profit for FFP on an academy product. Also likely could have got us both Amrabat + Gravenberch rather than just one of them, or neither it's looking like right now.

 

[James35]

It's because the rest of our players are so physically meek that theory that Mctominay's physicality will save the day. In reality, he just ends up chasing shadows and giving the ball away.

Still baffles me we tried to hold for £45m and scared away the interest. If we'd have set the price at £35m after we rejected 30 we'd be £35m richer right now, pure profit for FFP on an academy product. Also likely could have got us Amrabat + Gravenberch rather than just one of them, or neither.

£30m only gets his ability, his passion costs an extra £15m.

 

[tomaldinho1]

It's because the rest of our players are so physically meek that the theory that Mctominay's physicality will save the day starts to sound appealing. In reality, he just ends up chasing shadows and giving the ball away.

Still baffles me we tried to hold for £45m and scared away the interest. If we'd have set the price at £35m after we rejected 30 we'd be £35m richer right now, pure profit for FFP on an academy product. Also likely could have got us both Amrabat + Gravenberch rather than just one of them, or neither it's looking like right now.

Bulldog Murtough is working the phone mate, don’t fear. Fletcher’s on the fifth tea run of the day whilst the Bulldog sits with his shined shoes crossed on his desk, phone tucked under suspiciously gout red looking jowls whilst he chews the ear off some poor sod at Bayern. He hangs up, speedials out and is through to Tim Steidten at West Ham, ‘Bayern are in’ he barks then hangs up. West Ham call back, they want in, he is dismissive, borderline rude, he demands they send their best offer. He waits, beady eyes glinting in his puffy face, the ultimate negotiator finally unleashed, unsupervised, unshackled.

The phone rings, he lets it keep going to the cusp of voicemail, the ultimate power play. This is his arena and he will set the tone for what is about to happen. It’s Bayern, they’ll get to £40m with adds on if we stop negotiating with West Ham. He’s emotionless, this is child’s play for the Bulldog, he pretends to be reluctant but it’s just part of the dance, the deal is done.

He hangs up, his demeanour changes and his cheeks flush. He’s back on the phone this time to McT’s agent, he’s threatening him, yelling, telling him he needs to be in Munich yesterday. He hangs up, it was all an act, he leans back completely calm. This is what he was born for. Fletcher pushes through the door carrying two cups of tea, he’ll enjoy the brew and then thrash out Donny for £8m back to Ajax.

 

[marktan]

£35m is nothing really, City well random academy players for that these days.

Scotty 2 Hotty has what, probably around 200 games for us? He has had some very good games for us. I was hoping he'd spend the summers developing his passing, but there's no real need for us to sell him. If selling him for £35m would mean we'd get quality replacements in then sure, but we spent what £130m on Mount and Hojlund. It's only when we actually start signing quality starting players that it makes sense to sell the squad players, otherwise you end up with a weak first XI and a weak squad.

 

[Dominos]

£35m is nothing really, City well random academy players for that these days.

Scotty 2 Hotty has what, probably around 200 games for us? He has had some very good games for us. I was hoping he'd spend the summers developing his passing, but there's no real need for us to sell him. If selling him for £35m would mean we'd get quality replacements in then sure, but we spent what £130m on Mount and Hojlund. It's only when we actually start signing quality starting players that it makes sense to sell the squad players, otherwise you end up with a weak first XI and a weak squad.

The problem is, what is our actual plan with Mctominay for the remainder of his contract? He's got 2+1 left on his deal, are we really going to keep a sub-par player until his contract expires and let him leave for free? Is that a better outcome than selling him now for 35m?

Or are we planning to sell him next summer instead? When he's a year older, has sat on our bench all season? How much are we going to get for him next summer? Less than £35m I promise you that. So we can pretend he's worth far more than £35m based on the market but if that's the best we're going to get, that's his market value whether we like it or not. So now you're left asking is it really preferable to get even less money a year from now, or no money 2 years from now?

It's a complete lack of foresight as usual from the club. We received £60m offer for Mctominay and Maguire and yet we couldn't find a way to get either of them out the door. It's pure incompetence.

 

[Cassidy]

The problem is, what is our actual plan with Mctominay for the remainder of his contract? He's got 2+1 left on his deal, are we really going to keep a sub-par player until his contract expires and let him leave for free? Is that a better outcome than selling him now for 35m?

Or are we planning to sell him next summer instead? When he's a year older, has sat on our bench all season? How much are we going to get for him next summer? Less than £35m I promise you that. So we can pretend he's worth far more than £35m based on the market but if that's the best we're going to get, that's his market value whether we like it or not. So now you're left asking is it really preferable to get even less money a year from now, or no money 2 years from now?

It's a complete lack of foresight as usual from the club. We received £60m offer for Mctominay and Maguire and yet we couldn't find a way to get either of them out the door. It's pure incompetence.

Its possible McTominay didn’t want to go to West Ham like Maguire?

I think both should definitely have been sold this summer. I think Ten Hag wanted to replace Mctominay however with someone with height and physicality hence the links to Onana.

 

[Dominos]

Its possible McTominay didn’t want to go to West Ham like Maguire?

Wasn't reported as such. Also very rare a club bids for players who are completely unwilling to join them, they sound them out first.

We've priced Mctominay out of a move.

With Maguire we've refused to take the necessary steps to usher him out, we've let him believe he still has a role to play here if he stays, he should have been frozen out and told to find a new club at the end of last season, and omitted from first team duties. We then failed to negotiate a satisfactory pay off to get him out.

 

[Cassidy]

Wasn't reported as such. Also very rare a club bids for players who are completely unwilling to join them, they sound them out first.

We've priced Mctominay out of a move.

With Maguire we've refused to take the necessary steps to usher him out, we've let him believe he still has a role to play here if he stays, he should have been frozen out and told to find a new club at the end of last season, and omitted from first team duties. We then failed to negotiate a satisfactory pay off to get him out.

With Maguire paying him off would have meant we could not afford his replacement

 

[Dominos]

With Maguire paying him off would have meant we could not afford his replacement

Maguire is costing us £13m a year in transfer fee amortization which we no longer have to incur when we sell, we'd have got a profit on his book value when we accept the £30m offer. A £30m signing on 5year deal to replace him would only have a yearly amortization of £6m which is much less than the £13m Maguire was costing us, so there's a saving there. The replacement should also be on significantly less money than the £200k Maguire was earning.

I just don't believe there's absolutely no way we could have got rid of Maguire this summer if we really wanted to make it work. Let's not forget the alternative is, he sits on our bench for most of the season while he's another year older and we try sell him next summer for absolute peanuts, or he leaves for free in 2 years time.. So it's pick your poison.

 

[MasterDarcy]

Every time I read one of your posts I think what the feck.

Oscar Wilde called, he said "Ridicule is the tribute paid to the genius by the mediocrities."

 

[croadyman]

It's because the rest of our players are so physically meek that the theory that Mctominay's physicality will save the day starts to sound appealing. In reality, he just ends up chasing shadows and giving the ball away.

Still baffles me we tried to hold for £45m and scared away the interest. If we'd have set the price at £35m after we rejected 30 we'd be £35m richer right now, pure profit for FFP on an academy product. Also likely could have got us both Amrabat + Gravenberch rather than just one of them, or neither it's looking like right now.

We made a monumental mistake turning down the offer for McTominay,like you say had we accepted then there was a possibility we could have got another midfielder or maybe a backup ST

 

[Borussia Teeth]

We made a monumental mistake turning down the offer for McTominay,like you say had we accepted then there was a possibility we could have got another midfielder or maybe a backup ST

Yet many idiots on here were agreeing with our board and saying we should hold out for more money. They all seem to have gone into hiding now; surprise, surprise.

 

[elmo]

£35m is nothing really, City well random academy players for that these days.

Scotty 2 Hotty has what, probably around 200 games for us? He has had some very good games for us. I was hoping he'd spend the summers developing his passing, but there's no real need for us to sell him. If selling him for £35m would mean we'd get quality replacements in then sure, but we spent what £130m on Mount and Hojlund. It's only when we actually start signing quality starting players that it makes sense to sell the squad players, otherwise you end up with a weak first XI and a weak squad.

So the brilliant plan is to give up money which could have gotten us potential signings and just stick with what we already know isn’t good enough.

No wonder our club is fecked.

 

[CantonaManc]

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Old news from yesterday but we are stuck with him.

Our board is for dismissal after rejecting 30m pounds for him.

 

[Judas]

Fair to say, we probably won't be seeing a bid as high as 30m next summer, unless he has the sort of season so good we don't actually want him to leave anyway?

 

[CantonaManc]

Fair to say, we probably won't be seeing a bid as high as 30m next summer, unless he has the sort of season so good we don't actually want him to leave anyway?

United will never receive such an offer again. They will be mad after a few months that they even rejected that deal. Ten Hag clearly don't like Mctominay and want to replace him.

However, United's stubbornness and stupidity always prevails. Every other club in the world will bait your hand off if you offer them 30m pounds for Mctominay.

His price will continue to drop because he will be on the bench all season and after a year we will be lucky if we get 20m pounds offer for him.

 

[B. Munich]

The Bayern board must have read RedCafe to come to this conclusion.

Thanks all here to smarten them up make us move to another, more suitable, target.

 

[Telsim]

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Old news from yesterday but we are stuck with him.

Our board is for dismissal after rejecting 30m pounds for him.

Terrific news! I personally can't wait to see him hide from the ball again, make a mess of it when he eventually gets it, and end up getting a dumb yellow. Bayern will surely regret not getting such an incredibly entertaining asset!

 

[Siorac]

Can we now say it was stupid to price him out of the move, or is it still a "negotiation tactic" and "you don't accept the first offer", as we were told back then after rejecting a reported 30m which would have been a fantastic price?

 

[Gordon Godot]

Can we now say it was stupid to price him out of the move, or is it still a "negotiation tactic" and "you don't accept the first offer", as we were told back then after rejecting a reported 30m which would have been a fantastic price?

The defenders of McT and Harry are mad. Neither are good enough. The lack of interest says it all. We should have bitten off WH's hand when they made bids. No we cannot reinforce where needed and we left with two players that drag us down, Maguire in particular will cost us goals.

 

[Sky1981]

We don't need 2 Casemiro. We can actually use McT + Casemiro and McT would provide the Engine and steel and stamina to harras players while Casemiro conserving his energy for a more positional play.

 

[Gordon Godot]

We don't need 2 Casemiro. We can actually use McT + Casemiro and McT would provide the Engine and steel and stamina to harras players while Casemiro conserving his energy for a more positional play.

Casimero will soon be 32, he already is slowing. One injury and we are in trouble. McT has shown coutnless times he cannot play a defensive role. Sorry but yours is a really dumb post

 

[Remember the geese]

We don't need 2 Casemiro. We can actually use McT + Casemiro and McT would provide the Engine and steel and stamina to harras players while Casemiro conserving his energy for a more positional play.

Any midfield containing McTominay is not good enough.

 

[Cassidy]

Maguire is costing us £13m a year in transfer fee amortization which we no longer have to incur when we sell, we'd have got a profit on his book value when we accept the £30m offer. A £30m signing on 5year deal to replace him would only have a yearly amortization of £6m which is much less than the £13m Maguire was costing us, so there's a saving there. The replacement should also be on significantly less money than the £200k Maguire was earning.

I just don't believe there's absolutely no way we could have got rid of Maguire this summer if we really wanted to make it work. Let's not forget the alternative is, he sits on our bench for most of the season while he's another year older and we try sell him next summer for absolute peanuts, or he leaves for free in 2 years time.. So it's pick your poison.

You missed out the 15m contract termination payoff

 

[Sky1981]

Casimero will soon be 32, he already is slowing. One injury and we are in trouble. McT has shown coutnless times he cannot play a defensive role. Sorry but yours is a really dumb post

That's what we said. Until they play elsewhere and actually does the job.

 

[arnie_ni]

Hes a DM and their best player

Buts hea not better than scotty mct cassidy, cmon you know this

 

[FortunaUtd]

Wasn't reported as such. Also very rare a club bids for players who are completely unwilling to join them, they sound them out first.

We've priced Mctominay out of a move.

With Maguire we've refused to take the necessary steps to usher him out, we've let him believe he still has a role to play here if he stays, he should have been frozen out and told to find a new club at the end of last season, and omitted from first team duties. We then failed to negotiate a satisfactory pay off to get him out.

With Maguire paying him off would have meant we could not afford his replacement

Maguire is costing us £13m a year in transfer fee amortization which we no longer have to incur when we sell, we'd have got a profit on his book value when we accept the £30m offer. A £30m signing on 5year deal to replace him would only have a yearly amortization of £6m which is much less than the £13m Maguire was costing us, so there's a saving there. The replacement should also be on significantly less money than the £200k Maguire was earning.

I just don't believe there's absolutely no way we could have got rid of Maguire this summer if we really wanted to make it work. Let's not forget the alternative is, he sits on our bench for most of the season while he's another year older and we try sell him next summer for absolute peanuts, or he leaves for free in 2 years time.. So it's pick your poison.

You missed out the 15m contract termination payoff

Benjamin Pavard has moved for 30m €, which is 25m £. He was open to joining us. He would probably have wanted wages similar to the ones Maguire is on, who is 4th or 5th choice. He is a starter for a top club, treble and world cup winner, covers CB and right back, and just entering his prime. How much more of a bargain do we want to hold out for?

I find it very, very hard -actually impossible- to believe that between the two ~30m £ offers for Maguire and McTominay, freeing massive wages from De Gea to Ronaldo, and moving Henderson for another 20m £, we simply would not be able to afford 25m £ for Pavard. And then 15m£ for Amrabat (in whom we are obviously interested), or 25m£ for Gravenberch if we wanted a more positionally close replacement for McTominay.
Bayern are not hard to deal with, they always sell their players for relatively low fees once they want out.

I am not even one to constantly want to moan about our recruitment team, because of a last decade they are not responsible for. And I accept that the Maguire situation is a problem from the past which would have required a painful payoff. But it is maddening to me that we could not find solutions to move on these two players that are clearly out of favour and holding our squad makeup back, when there was interest in them and obvious upgrades were readily available and affordable.

 

[MadDogg]

We don't need 2 Casemiro. We can actually use McT + Casemiro and McT would provide the Engine and steel and stamina to harras players while Casemiro conserving his energy for a more positional play.

ETH already showed last season that he doesn't rate McTominay in that role, seeing as he was behind other players we've already sold or dropped down the pecking order. If we're expecting him to now be that player then we've literally just weakened ourselves this window.

Playing a Scott/Casemiro combo would require Casemiro to pick up even more of the playmaking and control of the team duties, something that he's already being asked to do more than he's ever done in his career and quite frankly that he's not doing very well. But Scott isn't capable of doing it whatsoever.

 

[Mr Pigeon]

Jesus, someone explain to me what McTominay is good at? Decent in the air, that's it. He's a horribly mediocre player.

Resident Real Scotsman here to explain in detail why you're completely wrong.

He has good positioning, he's good at giving opposition players a little nudge in the back after they've already passed the ball, he also has.... feck.

 

[Highfather_24]

Can we now say it was stupid to price him out of the move, or is it still a "negotiation tactic" and "you don't accept the first offer", as we were told back then after rejecting a reported 30m which would have been a fantastic price?

Nah, its actually the Glazers/Woodward's/boogie man's fault we rejected that bid apparently. Its definitely not Murtough and co's fault that we suck at selling, its all the fault of the previous regimes.

 

[Cassidy]

Benjamin Pavard has moved for 30m €, which is 25m £. He was open to joining us. He would probably have wanted wages similar to the ones Maguire is on, who is 4th or 5th choice. He is a starter for a top club, treble and world cup winner, covers CB and right back, and just entering his prime. How much more of a bargain do we want to hold out for?

I find it very, very hard -actually impossible- to believe that between the two ~30m £ offers for Maguire and McTominay, freeing massive wages from De Gea to Ronaldo, and moving Henderson for another 20m £, we simply would not be able to afford 25m £ for Pavard. And then 15m£ for Amrabat (in whom we are obviously interested), or 25m£ for Gravenberch if we wanted a more positionally close replacement for McTominay.
Bayern are not hard to deal with, they always sell their players for relatively low fees once they want out.

I am not even one to constantly want to moan about our recruitment team, because of a last decade they are not responsible for. And I accept that the Maguire situation is a problem from the past which would have required a painful payoff. But it is maddening to me that we could not find solutions to move on these two players that are clearly out of favour and holding our squad makeup back, when there was interest in them and obvious upgrades were readily available and affordable.

We had a summer budget apparently of 120m we’ve spent over 180m. Not sure why you’re bringing up DDG wages or other sales. When you can clearly see we can’t even afford to get Amrabat over the line properly.


If we sell Maguire he needs to be replaced would have been fine if we got 30m from West Ham which is why we accepted it. However if 15m of that goes to paying Maguire off then we could not afford his replacement (Pavard or Todibo)

McTominay if he is sold needs replacing. Im sure we could have got a decent player for 30m to be honest on this one I blame the club.

On Maguire we could not force him out, club accepted a fee for him, the rest was on him

 

[DJBillRemfry]

West Ham seem to have a ceiling on the maximum amount they are willing to pay for any player this summer, feeling that many valuations and prices paid elsewhere are absurd and do not represent reasonable value.

Any £100m plus midfielder should be a regular match winner in very big games, not a cog in a machine, yet others are ridiculously overpaying.

McTominay at about £30m is fair value for the output. None of the £100m midfielders in the PL is worth it. Some clubs are regularly overpaying by £30m-£40m.

 

[RedSky]

Buts hea not better than scotty mct cassidy, cmon you know this

He's quality and better than Scott in almost every way. Very good midfielder.

 

[FortunaUtd]

We had a summer budget apparently of 120m we’ve spent over 180m. Not sure why you’re bringing up DDG wages or other sales. When you can clearly see we can’t even afford to get Amrabat over the line properly.


If we sell Maguire he needs to be replaced would have been fine if we got 30m from West Ham which is why we accepted it. However if 15m of that goes to paying Maguire off then we could not afford his replacement (Pavard or Todibo)

McTominay if he is sold needs replacing. Im sure we could have got a decent player for 30m to be honest on this one I blame the club.

On Maguire we could not force him out, club accepted a fee for him, the rest was on him

I am bringing up De Gea's wages and other sales because they would affect our budget, do they not? Or are you arguing that any transfer fee for a Maguire replacement would somehow have to be from exactly that separate pot of money that a Maguire sale brings in?
And even if we accept that he would have wanted 15m as payoff out of the 30m transfer fee (although I would argue there is something between 'he wants 15m' and 'we are offering 7m'), the difference to Pavard's fee would have been an extra 10m £. Am I really to believe that there is no way, in the bigger picture, we could have structured a deal for Pavard (or another replacement) to make that work?
I am no expert on this, do not get me wrong. I do not want to sound definitive. But I am struggling here.

 

[Highfather_24]

I am bringing up De Gea's wages and other sales because they would affect our budget, do they not? Or are you arguing that any transfer fee for a Maguire replacement would somehow have to be from exactly that separate pot of money that a Maguire sale brings in?
And even if we accept that he would have wanted 15m as payoff out of the 30m transfer fee (although I would argue there is something between 'he wants 15m' and 'we are offering 7m'), the difference to Pavard's fee would have been an extra 10m £. Am I really to believe that there is no way, in the bigger picture, we could have structured a deal for Pavard (or another replacement) to make that work? I am no expert on this, do not get me wrong. I do not want to sound definitive. But I am struggling here.

Also dont forget we could have sold McT for 30M, and bought Amrabat for 17-20M, bringing in over 10M pure profit anyway covering all that.

 

[Cassidy]

I am bringing up De Gea's wages and other sales because they would affect our budget, do they not? Or are you arguing that any transfer fee for a Maguire replacement would somehow have to be from exactly that separate pot of money that a Maguire sale brings in?
And even if we accept that he would have wanted 15m as payoff out of the 30m transfer fee (although I would argue there is something between 'he wants 15m' and 'we are offering 7m'), the difference to Pavard's fee would have been an extra 10m £. Am I really to believe that there is no way, in the bigger picture, we could have structured a deal for Pavard (or another replacement) to make that work? I am no expert on this, do not get me wrong. I do not want to sound definitive. But I am struggling here.

Pretty sure if we could have sold Maguire for 30m and given Maguire half the fee and then still afford to sign Pavard or Todibo we would have

 

[FortunaUtd]

Pretty sure if we could have sold Maguire for 30m and given Maguire half the fee and then still afford to sign Pavard or Todibo we would have

Fair enough, let us leave it at that. Ultimately I cannot argue against the fact that the actual professionals at our club would know the situation better than me armchair fan. And the window is not over, we can look at the result on Saturday.
Still struggling though

 

[Cassidy]

Fair enough, let us leave it at that. Ultimately I cannot argue against the fact that the actual professionals at our club would know the situation better than me armchair fan. And the window is not over, we can look at the result on Saturday.
Still struggling though

We’re broke. The owners are not investing. Simple as that

 

[RuudTom83]

The owners don't care about winning and the directors are inept at their jobs.

EtH should of realised by now selling Maguire/ McTom for decent money is not something anyone at the club can do, and buying a replacement for sensible money is also out of the question.

So it's probably best we just keep hold of McTom, stick our heads in the sand and hope for the best. Top 4 MUFC

 

[DickDastardly]

Scott in a hot pot