You’re missing the point. You’re worrying about the latest symptom of our failure, not the cause.
Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager / awaiting clarity from the club over his position
- Thread starter sewey89
- Start date
Does anyone here remember Jurgen Klopp's first team? The likes of Mignolet, Clyne Alberto Moreno, Lucas, Sakho, etc?
They were fecking dross.
He cycled through the shit players, changed three goalkeepers to get to Alisson, replaced his whole starting line up in 4+ years to get to the title.
And you're judging a coach who's here for a year and a half and has bought 6,7 players or so and has half of them injured?
Yes the results are bad and yes the play is also bad but come on, it takes time. And it takes money.
But above all, it takes patience.
They were fecking dross.
He cycled through the shit players, changed three goalkeepers to get to Alisson, replaced his whole starting line up in 4+ years to get to the title.
And you're judging a coach who's here for a year and a half and has bought 6,7 players or so and has half of them injured?
Yes the results are bad and yes the play is also bad but come on, it takes time. And it takes money.
But above all, it takes patience.
Any club in europe would struggle with the injury list and players not available for other reasons which we currently have.
We have first, second and third choice lb injured. We havent had our first choice cb pairing playing together since the start of the season. Our marquee midfield signing hasnt played since August (before today) and we're being forced to play an underqualified noodle of a kid RW because none of our first choice are available.
The start has been terrible, theres no getting away from it, but the players we have missing is unmitigated.
Once we have everyone back, if things looked the same or worse, then id start being concerned but until then I think ETH has enough good will in the bank to try to turn this around after last season.
We have first, second and third choice lb injured. We havent had our first choice cb pairing playing together since the start of the season. Our marquee midfield signing hasnt played since August (before today) and we're being forced to play an underqualified noodle of a kid RW because none of our first choice are available.
The start has been terrible, theres no getting away from it, but the players we have missing is unmitigated.
Once we have everyone back, if things looked the same or worse, then id start being concerned but until then I think ETH has enough good will in the bank to try to turn this around after last season.
Mate, we haven’t played anything resembling football since we beat Barcelona last February. I don’t understand why we’re slowly descending into this mess now, nor why it’s not the managers responsibility.
Klopp signed good players who replaced the duds. Ten Hag's signings have been mostly just more duds added to the squad. That's the difference.
The midfield was not a problem today. We had 77% possession and this was a lot to do with the work of our two high 8s. The midfield worked okay and will work fine when the whole team is used to our set up.
No-one likes losing but you’re pinning the blame on the wrong guys.
You're being pretty inconsistent now, Poch implementing a style that his players can't play well yet is exactly the situation we're in this season under ETH. Wolves seem to be playing mostly counter attacking football, which they were playing before, so not exactly a huge revolution.
Ange is a reasonable point, although it remains to be seen how much of this is a new manager bounce. If he equals or betters Ten Hag's season last season, and then again beats his season this season, then you'll have a good example.
With Klopp, despite all that shit, you could still see what he is trying to do. I have yet to really see what ten Hag is trying to do - I don't know what his play style is, he talks a game about dominating etc. but I don't see it. I go into a United game like I did under Ole where I had no idea how we would play and just hope for the best
He has had money and blown it on a certain players who have been questionable. Only Casemiro and Martinez seem to be good buys
Yeah and still scored like 20 more goals than ETH first season
The likes of Karius, Wijnaldum, Naby Keita, Minamino, Nunez, Gakpo, Endo?
Kind of crazy that he is seemingly under no pressure yet.
Not saying he should be fired but feck me this is absymal. If this goes on another few games in the league we simply don't have a choice.
Sadly his signings seem to be more misses than hits which looks to be one of the reasons we are regressing
Things are very very bad
Not saying he should be fired but feck me this is absymal. If this goes on another few games in the league we simply don't have a choice.
Sadly his signings seem to be more misses than hits which looks to be one of the reasons we are regressing
Things are very very bad
Except for Karius, I'll actually take pretty much all of these ahead of our signings in the past 10 years.
Weird to consider Wijnaldum, Nunez and Gakpo bad business, though, by the way.
Cool.
While finishing 8th, 4th and 4th in his first 3 seasons.
Under him, it has become normal to have a negative goal difference. That was worrying even last year when we finished third last year.
EtH is a stubborn idealist, he won't give up his CasBrunoMount folly. He seem to have the same malady as Pep. Except Pep won stuff.
Nunez is horrific business for a deal which could eventually be 100 million.
He's distinctly average and often on their bench, given the fee it cant be anything other than poor.
Duds. Wijnaldum, Loris, Keita, Oxlade, Minamino....
The audience is still out on Nunez and Gakpo, but even he's not playing them so....
Why are the fans being told to have patience? Ultimately if he doesn't get Too 4 he's gone. That's not a patience thing. That's a "football clubs need results immediately" thing. Fans can have all the patience in the world but Joel and Avram decide.
Did he say something on the decision we didn't get in this game or any other game ? he needs to call it out already
Why do you think the problem was the midfield? We had nearly 80% possession and Palace barely made it into the final third.
Barely anything created with 80% possession
That 80% is more on Palace low block.
The progress was visible last season, some good breakdowns in articles such as this. Key point for me is how despite not being the best pressing team in the league, we're joint best for the counter press, fast turnovers that result in a shot at goal. This is where ETH's comments about being a top transitional team come in. He progressed it last season and now intended to master it this season, I believe. But it's just not working at all right now, the new signings seem to have unbalanced the dynamic significantly, and we're not even taking those chances anymore. We're not even pressing like we did back then. We've regressed. We're also massively missing Luke Shaw, and an equivalent quality RB as Ten Hag also introduced (and started to rely on) the inverted fullback, and only really Shaw is any good at it in our squad. Even just having the one side covered made a noticeable difference.
Injuries and signings that haven't gelled (yet) have massively disrupted the balance of the team. They also look absolutely knackered after a heavy fixture list last season (including a World Cup in the middle of it), compounded with a far too intense and ridiculous summer schedule. We've also had a number of off-field issues. It's all contributing to this colossal mess of a season.
Palace conceded possession willingly. They were more than happy to sit back, soak up pressure, and counter.
Wijnaldum and Ox were definitely not duds. Both were pretty solid business for Liverpool.
This ratio of good/flops transfers is far better than anything we have done for the past 10 years. Any manager signs some flops, Guardiola did and Ferguson too, but they got most of their business right, so does Klopp. United are getting most business wrong and very few are hits and this hasn't changed one bit under Ten Hag.
And that was after they scored. Before it was more of an even contest.
What is going on with our tactics this season.
When Amrabat had the ball in the SH Casemiro’s position was on the edge of their box. As does Mount when he plays in that #8 role.
What an earth is the thinking behind this. Don’t remember Eriksen being that high up last season.
When Amrabat had the ball in the SH Casemiro’s position was on the edge of their box. As does Mount when he plays in that #8 role.
What an earth is the thinking behind this. Don’t remember Eriksen being that high up last season.
Our two starting wingers were responsible for most of that, one ran into dead ends or misplaced easy passes and the other has the touch of Lukaku today.
I’m very critical of this particular midfield, even before the season started, but against a bus parking team with 2 banks of 4, the creativity has to come from out wide, unless you can work the ball fast enough on the rare occasions they aren’t in formation, and we bypassed the midfield with a lot of lofted balls from deep the way we play, the two 8s primary function isn’t to get on the ball but to contest 2nd balls and press opponent into mistakes, something that works better against team with intention to play rather than the likes of Palace.
Yep, the guy you're replying to for one...
To be fair it’s not the fans job to choose a replacement. They can still say they are unhappy with the current manager. We’re going through a 7 month tough spell so people are blind to be asking questions and having doubt
I agree it’s horrendous. Clearly the manager has some responsibility- I just don’t know how much, or who else is liable for this shitshow. We really do seem to be cursed.
Very worrying and there are shades of LVG....but I've got to back him.
The reality and alternative is too depressing. It's the only hope I've got to cling on.
The reality and alternative is too depressing. It's the only hope I've got to cling on.
And finished 5 places below ETH's team
Finally listened to one of his post match interviews because the man is boring to listen to and it really is a dull affair isn't it? He has the charisma of a dish cloth
Keep making things up.
Are you including the months during close season?
But if you are asking for a guy to be sacked then other guys have a right to ask do you have any manager in mind? You can't just say sack him and then say we don't have back up plan. I am not saying eth cannot be sacked but I don't think it's a wrong question to ask who next?
Don't make me dredge up a million of your posts again
This.
ETH is struggling and you can now see it in his eyes. He's losing that squad, offers no inspiration, expression or fun. Teams reflect their manager. Look at ETH at any Press Conference. He's defensive, uncooperative, gloomy (even when we win...), and totally inflexible.
And players, fans, and media can see this. He has a tough few months. Not sure how this may go for him.
Might have "felt" that way but in reality was never a contest. They had one small patch after 25 minutes and they profited.
EtH got bested by a geriatric Hodgson playing 90's Catenaccio.
