VAR and Refs | General Discussion | May 15: Premier League clubs to vote on proposal to scrap VAR from next season

[Oranges038]

VAR is shite and should be ditched. And it's unfortunate that McT had this goal chalked off as it's a great hit. But the situation here is clear. Hendry had his hands on and was trying to push the keeper having been offside, there was no other decision to make as he is clearly intefering.

But the main problem with that explanation, is that it's not 100% clear that he was offside, as you can see from the still they used, there is a motion blur on the ball, which would suggest that it's already in motion and the lines are being drawn after it's been kicked and not from the initial point of contact.

The referee did not signal for offside either and instead signalled for a foul, if they were indeed looking at offside, we should have seen it at the time and they should have drawn the lines before the decision was made. Not 20 mins later.

It was a farcical decision making process.

 

[CoopersDream]

According to the rules:

• a player moving from, or standing in, an offside position is in the way of an opponent and interferes with the movement of the opponent towards the ball this is an offside offence if it impacts on the ability of the opponent to play or challenge for the ball; if the player moves into the way of an opponent and impedes the opponent's progress (e.g blocks the opponent) the offence should be penalised under Law 12

where Law 12 is foul. I think what he did pretty clearly falls under this. This means that if Hendry was offside a foul should indeed be called.

Regarding whether they use the correct frame or not, they clearly always use the frame where they can be sure that the ball has been played. It might say in the rules that they offside is from the first contact, but that's clearly not how VAR implements it. So yes, by the instructions VAR has, Hendry was offside and thus did physically interfere with the goalkeeper and a foul should be given. Correct call.

 

[Snow]

But the main problem with that explanation, is that it's not 100% clear that he was offside, as you can see from the still they used, there is a motion blur on the ball, which would suggest that it's already in motion and the lines are being drawn after it's been kicked and not from the initial point of contact.

The referee did not signal for offside either and instead signalled for a foul, if they were indeed looking at offside, we should have seen it at the time and they should have drawn the lines before the decision was made. Not 20 mins later.

It was a farcical decision making process.

They made the correct decisions. The mistake was made in communication. VAR broadcast should have shown the offside lines. They knew there was a player in the offside position. The referee was asked to judge if the player in the offside position was affecting play. Why he called a foul was probably just a mistake in the moment from him as he was asked to call a foul or not.

 

[Withnail]

They made the correct decisions. The mistake was made in communication. VAR broadcast should have shown the offside lines. They knew there was a player in the offside position. The referee was asked to judge if the player in the offside position was affecting play. Why he called a foul was probably just a mistake in the moment from him as he was asked to call a foul or not.

It still makes it weird as it doesn't need to be a foul for the player to be considered interfering with play from an offside position. It was poorly handled whichever way you look at it and possibly was miscommunication but it's a bizzare turn of events.

 

[Snow]

It still makes it weird as it doesn't need to be a foul for the player to be considered interfering with play from an offside position. It was poorly handled whichever way you look at it and possibly was miscommunication but it's a bizzare turn of events.

I wonder of there was a problem with the technology. As someone currently sitting in broadcast van after a NT match I remember two match days ago we had a goal chalked off for offside but we didn't get the offside graphics until after the match and so we couldn't show it on TV.

There's a whole lot of shit to go wrong with VAR in NT games. There's a company that has the deal from UEFA to handle VAR. They subcontract people and fly them to games from all over. These guys are on shit pay and shit hours and I can imagine there's a communication problem because of language barriers.

My point is, in terms of VAR in these UEFA games there are more factors than the refs themselves so unless they honestly tell us what went wrong there could be a number of things behind the scenes going wrong.

 

[Shane88]

Every football official is just a fecking braindead idiot. That's all there is to it. A linesman not 10 yards away gives a free kick for this.

 

[90 + 5min]

But the main problem with that explanation, is that it's not 100% clear that he was offside, as you can see from the still they used, there is a motion blur on the ball, which would suggest that it's already in motion and the lines are being drawn after it's been kicked and not from the initial point of contact.

The referee did not signal for offside either and instead signalled for a foul, if they were indeed looking at offside, we should have seen it at the time and they should have drawn the lines before the decision was made. Not 20 mins later.

It was a farcical decision making process.

If they want to make this offside than they can. Just freeze picture at "right" time and you got that. No matter how stupid it looks. You can see the ball was already on the way. Just like Garnacho goal against Arsenal. Now they blew for some imaginary foul that was later "offside" because you know they wouldn't allow that goal in one way or other.

 

[Oranges038]

They made the correct decisions. The mistake was made in communication. VAR broadcast should have shown the offside lines. They knew there was a player in the offside position. The referee was asked to judge if the player in the offside position was affecting play. Why he called a foul was probably just a mistake in the moment from him as he was asked to call a foul or not.

I get your point. But that's not what happened.

The referee checked for a foul, awarded a foul and his handle signal indicated a foul. There was nothing in his decision about offside. This only came about much later.

If they want to make this offside than they can. Just freeze picture at "right" time and you got that. No matter how stupid it looks. You can see the ball was already on the way. Just like Garnacho goal against Arsenal. Now they blew for some imaginary foul that was later "offside" because you know they wouldn't allow that goal in one way or other.

Considering how much movement goes on between frames amongst all the players moving, there's about 2 seconds from the referee blowing the whistle to that ball hitting the net. Still relying on humans to make that call and pause the video. Unless they can pinpoint the moment of contact with 100% accuracy, through micro chips in the ball and all that shite then there has to be a greater marging for error.

 

[Stack]

I foolishly thought VAR would end up being a huge help to the game. I was so hopelessly wrong.

 

[FootballHQ]

Was Morata actually level then? He looked half a yard ahead of the defender when he blocked the shot from the replay I saw.

 

[Red in STL]

I foolishly thought VAR would end up being a huge help to the game. I was so hopelessly wrong.

It has helped the game ..... it's opened up to everyone that fact that most officials are actually much worse than we always thought they were and some of the laws of the game are plainly ridiculous

 

[Stack]

It has helped the game ..... it's opened up to everyone that fact that most officials are actually much worse than we always thought they were and some of the laws of the game are plainly ridiculous

I dont know about the officials being much worse than we thought. It highlights how hard it is to referee a top level game, the changes to various laws have hindered the refs. I have sympathy for the refs

 

[Gabriel Djemba-Bebe]

I dont know about the officials being much worse than we thought. It highlights how hard it is to referee a top level game, the changes to various laws have hindered the refs. I have sympathy for the refs

Part and parcel of any job is adapting to changes in the workplace. When they're getting paid top dollar to watch incidents over and over again on a monitor, and they're still coming to the wrong decision, then I have no sympathy for them whatsoever.

 

[Pogue Mahone]

Part and parcel of any job is adapting to changes in the workplace. When they're getting paid top dollar to watch incidents over and over again on a monitor, and they're still coming to the wrong decision, then I have no sympathy for them whatsoever.

The mistake you’re making there is thinking multiple replays will somehow uncover a definitive “right” decision, under immense pressure and with only a minute or two to make a call. If that was the case why is this place full of hundreds of threads about controversial decisions with split opinions on what the right decision is, despite infinite replays and weeks/months to make their mind up?

 

[Stack]

Part and parcel of any job is adapting to changes in the workplace. When they're getting paid top dollar to watch incidents over and over again on a monitor, and they're still coming to the wrong decision, then I have no sympathy for them whatsoever.

Im talking about the refs on the pitch and the difficulty of making the right decisions at top level football. The the reason VAR came into being was that the game is so much faster and difficult to ref because of the rule changes we have seen.
VAR itself is failing because its not being done very well.

 

[Gabriel Djemba-Bebe]

The mistake you’re making there is thinking multiple replays will somehow uncover a definitive “right” decision, under immense pressure and with only a minute or two to make a call. If that was the case why is this place full of hundreds of threads about controversial decisions with split opinions on what the right decision is, despite infinite replays and weeks/months to make their mind up?

That may be the case with some incidents, but there are plenty of examples of incidents where we can all agree VAR got it wrong. Not giving a penalty for Spurs' handball from Garnacho's shot is inexcusable. As is the most laughable one of all: VAR not telling the on-field ref about the Cucerella hair pull because Mike Dean didn't want his "mate" to get "any more grief".

 

[Red in STL]

I dont know about the officials being much worse than we thought. It highlights how hard it is to referee a top level game, the changes to various laws have hindered the refs. I have sympathy for the refs

On the field I do have a some sympathy but some of the VAR decsions have been so shockingly inept, VAR is, it;s killing the specatcle making it worse, I mean you "score" a goal and then wait for someone yes or no, it's killing the specatcle

 

[Sandikan]

VAR is shite and should be ditched. And it's unfortunate that McT had this goal chalked off as it's a great hit. But the situation here is clear. Hendry had his hands on and was trying to push the keeper having been offside, there was no other decision to make as he is clearly intefering.

Hadn't seen it but had heard the outrage.
But one view and it was pretty clear why it was ruled out like you say.

 

[Lyng]

The mistake you’re making there is thinking multiple replays will somehow uncover a definitive “right” decision, under immense pressure and with only a minute or two to make a call. If that was the case why is this place full of hundreds of threads about controversial decisions with split opinions on what the right decision is, despite infinite replays and weeks/months to make their mind up?

Spot on. And thats without getting in to the whole issue of something looking like a very different situation when its a still picture as opposed to there being movement.

 

[cj_sparky]

Cook, the assistant VAR during the Spurs v Liverpool match will be running the line for our game against Sheffield United...no pressure.

 

[Jippy]

Cook, the assistant VAR during the Spurs v Liverpool match will be running the line for our game against Sheffield United...no pressure.

Just saw that. Those guys are going to need a thick skin when they're running the lines.


Officials who made Luis Díaz VAR mistake return to Premier League

The officials at the centre of the VAR controversy in Liverpool’s defeat by Tottenham Hotspur will return to Premier League duty on Saturday.

Darren England has been appointed as fourth official for Brentford’s home game against Burnley, while Dan Cook will be an assistant referee when Sheffield United host Manchester United.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/...mier-league-saturday-darren-england-2qtjnrk93

 

[Zed is not dead]

Anyone wants to guess how many decisions will Liverpool get in their favour today?

 

[Pexbo]

Just saw that. Those guys are going to need a thick skin when they're running the lines.


Officials who made Luis Díaz VAR mistake return to Premier League

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/...mier-league-saturday-darren-england-2qtjnrk93

A dark day for football.

 

[njred]

Anyone wants to guess how many decisions will Liverpool get in their favour today?

Hopefully a lot. We deserve some calls finally.

 

[duffer]

They may as well give Liverpool a ton of decisions today, in a game where they won't need them. Who cares if they win 3-0 or 5-0.

 

[cyberman]

Hopefully a lot. We deserve some calls finally.

Brought to you by the club who had their VAR go down just as Wolves scored a goal that was wrongfully disallowed on the pitch.
Fantastic stuff

 

[90 + 5min]

They may as well give Liverpool a ton of decisions today, in a game where they won't need them. Who cares if they win 3-0 or 5-0.

Lets start with a red first.

 

[Di Maria's angel]

Referees once again showing how fecking awful they are.

 

[Baxter]

Even if it’s soft, if the ref sees Konate as committing a foul he has to give a yellow

 

[Shane88]

That's why I don't ascribe to the notion of "Respect refs", not PL refs anyway.

They simply don't deserve respect. They are spineless cowards.

Rugby refs rule with an iron fist and players fear them. Football refs are wimps and want to be friends with the top players/teams.

 

[90 + 5min]

When rules are different depending on teams.

 

[Ludens the Red]

We could not even make it past the 1230 game on the Saturday without one of them being a shit cnut.
Probably bottled it because of the incorrect decisions that went against Liverpool v spurs. And there in lies the problem with how they behave. Constantly trying to balance things out etc.

 

[IRELANDUNITED]

That’s gonna be given

 

[90 + 5min]

Of course they give it. It is Liverpool.

Shocking decisions once again against one team. Everton should go all out in their press conference and I hope they make official statement about this game.

 

[Longshanks]

So proximity for handball dosent matter then, unless your playing against Man United that is.

If I was dyche I would be asking for a replay in the post match press conference.

 

[cj_sparky]

I think that was a pen, however similar haven't been given so far this season and the ref is never normally seems to be sent to check.

Again, we never have any consistency.

 

[Santos J]

it was a blatant pen come on

 

[PoTMS]

They've decided the outcome of a game again. Every fecking week.

 

[cyberman]

it was a blatant pen come on

I think it’s a pen but it goes against every reason as to why our pen v Spurs wasn’t given

 

[90 + 5min]

If I was Dyche I would pull out all players. There is no point of playing when you don't get any fair chance. Just leave, go home and let Liverpool get their 3 points. Because they will get it one way or other.