Erik ten Hag - Manchester United manager / awaiting clarity from the club over his position

[frostbite]

Potato potato. By that logic they only needed an overseer prior and subsequent to ETH. Of course Overmars and VDS did good jobs in a structure that functioned well. But they did not manage the team or coach it. I just think your post is an extreme illustration of what many are now doing, surmising that ETH is in fact a shite manager and doesn't have a clue. Humour me for a minute, who would you want in (I assume immediately)?

Yes, he might have been good in the Ajax system, but I don't think he is good for us, I believe he has failed already. In everything. He doesn't have a good system, I am not even sure if he has any system at all, he has spent 400 million already but he did not solve any problems and he did not bring in any world-class players. We still have serious problems in all of our lines, we still need a top defender, we still need a top midfielder (or two!), we still need a top striker. We may even need a better goalkeeper if we are going to challenge for the title. On top of that, he has been terrible in man management, he picked up fights with players, and he favored his own guys who are not good enough (Wout, Antony).

It's a failure on all fronts. He is a sergeant, we need a general. I have no idea who will be the next manager but I don't think he will do any worse. Still, I think we should keep him for a few more months, till the Ratcliffe situation stabilizes.

 

[frostbite]

I’m going to be transparent and say from the off I think this is a really rubbish opinion.

However if you believe this to be the case then what you’re saying is Ten Hag has worked in various roles for 21 years and learnt very little… he has had the following career pathway:
https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/erik-ten-hag/profil/trainer/3816

I honestly think your opinion here is one of the worst I’ve seen about Ten Hag in the last few days. It goes way beyond reasonable criticism and implies he’s essentially got no clue.

Yes, perhaps my opinion is completely wrong. Perhaps ETH is a great manager, a world class manager.

However, the link you gave doesn't prove that. He only won the Eredivisie with Ajax three times, and Overmars was the guy who selected the players at Ajax. Also, please remember that ETH is actually one year older than Pep.

So, right now we know he is a good manager for Eredivisie. However, we do not need a good manager, we need a world-class manager. Is ETH a world class manager? Unfortunately, I don't think so. But yes, you are right, I may be wrong. We'll see.

 

[BenitoSTARR]

Yes, he might have been good in the Ajax system, but I don't think he is good for us, I believe he has failed already. In everything. He doesn't have a good system, I am not even sure if he has any system at all, he has spent 400 million already but he did not solve any problems and he did not bring in any world-class players. We still have serious problems in all of our lines, we still need a top defender, we still need a top midfielder (or two!), we still need a top striker. We may even need a better goalkeeper if we are going to challenge for the title. On top of that, he has been terrible in man management, he picked up fights with players, and he favored his own guys who are not good enough (Wout, Antony).

It's a failure on all fronts. He is a sergeant, we need a general. I have no idea who will be the next manager but I don't think he will do any worse. Still, I think we should keep him for a few more months, till the Ratcliffe situation stabilizes.

Yeah he completely failed to win us a trophy….
No I mean he completely failed to get us on a 30 game unbeaten run at home…..
No sorry I mean he completely failed to get us a top 3 finish…..
No sorry I mean he completely failed to perform well against top European opposition like Barcelona…..
feck sorry no I mean he completely failed to deal with Sancho, Ronaldo, Greenwood, Antony and Rashford issues… wait….

Yeah he’s absolutely shown no signs of being a competent manager let’s all fellate frostbite and make them
DOF/Supermanager.

Casemiro at the point of signing was widely considered a world class DM because he is/was.

I think your posts have been absolutely shocking on this issue a real world class car crash of a performance.

 

[BenitoSTARR]

Yes, perhaps my opinion is completely wrong. Perhaps ETH is a great manager, a world class manager.

However, the link you gave doesn't prove that. He only won the Eredivisie with Ajax three times, and Overmars was the guy who selected the players at Ajax. Also, please remember that ETH is actually one year older than Pep.

So, right now we know he is a good manager for Eredivisie. However, we do not need a good manager, we need a world-class manager. Is ETH a world class manager? Unfortunately, I don't think so. But yes, you are right, I may be wrong. We'll see.

It’s not only his trophies it’s his pathway to management. He’s got experience at all levels in different roles.

Honestly all you’ve done since arriving at the forum is moan moan moan do you have anything positive to add to the discussion? Any concession as to Ten Hag’s capabilities?

 

[Bastian]

Yes, he might have been good in the Ajax system, but I don't think he is good for us, I believe he has failed already. In everything. He doesn't have a good system, I am not even sure if he has any system at all, he has spent 400 million already but he did not solve any problems and he did not bring in any world-class players. We still have serious problems in all of our lines, we still need a top defender, we still need a top midfielder (or two!), we still need a top striker. We may even need a better goalkeeper if we are going to challenge for the title. On top of that, he has been terrible in man management, he picked up fights with players, and he favored his own guys who are not good enough (Wout, Antony).

It's a failure on all fronts. He is a sergeant, we need a general. I have no idea who will be the next manager but I don't think he will do any worse. Still, I think we should keep him for a few more months, till the Ratcliffe situation stabilizes.

There's quite a lot here to pick from. He's obviously made mistakes along the way and there are a number of things that I'm frustrated with. That being said, the money spent on players is on the club and its recruitment committee or whatever it is called. If you watched us last season you will have seen a gradual change in style which has regressed this season for a host of reasons. The players still needed is something Rangnick already identified publicly and the owners were never going to entertain that, because that is in effect admitting that we've been chasing our losses for years on end throwing more money down the drain. Rangnick obviously did say it might take a few transfer windows, but the important bit is shifting the players we already know not to be good enough and in order to do that whilst not buying 8-10 players expectations have to be tempered and we'll have to buy into a long-term approach. He's been tasked with a long-term change that is supposed to happen while he must deliver in the short-term (CL qualification). One of my criticisms of him is his willingness to echo that in conferences instead of downplaying that, but I guess that's how he is trying to motivate a mass of wasters earning being paid millions a year. The players he's made an example of or been willing to shift out have been either a) incredibly unprofessional and/or toxic or b) completely unsuitable to his way of playing. In my view he's not been harsh enough and he should have been demanding the club shift every single player the club briefed the media about this summer in a whislist of required transfer fees. That is on the club but he should be protecting his reputation and the project he's doing here, also with regards to pre-season ensuring that it is actually about the footballing side of this football club.

Anyhow, I guess there will be a lot of you looking at things out of context and deciding that somehow he's a shite manager. If we drop more points tomorrow I guess this group will quadruple.

 

[city-puma]

It's a payoff. There is no perfect coach in the world.
People call Pep a perfect coach, but he has always been showered in money and world class players. And still struggled for years at City in CL, before achieving "the ultimate success".

ETH has downsides, any coach has downsides. What matters is what he brings to the team.
At this point it's going south, everything is bad, but there are million reasons behind it. Calling him fraud and trying to downplay his achievements in Ajax is not just lazy criticism - it's simply stupid and hateful, something I'd expect to read on facebook.

I'd expect ETH to leave and be massively successful elsewhere, and the next coach under Glazers regime to be labeled "fraud" by redcafe posters.
And even then some people will refuse to be rational or logical.

At this point I don't see him turning this around anyway. Players look like they don't give a shit. And everything that happened in the last 5 years suggest that players are given way too much power, possibly way too good contracts. And it makes sense. United can't attract them with promise they'll be champions or they'll succeed in Champions league. But we can attract them with money and good contracts. Overpaying for players who just don't care at some point.

Maybe ETH will have to just go for the low block and counterattacking football and get some results with it. I don't know.

Nothing looks bright and the only good thing on the horizon is a possible takeover. New structure, new DNA.

And once again - we've had good managers since Fergie. Some were better than the others. But all of them were royally fecked. If you don't see it I don't know what to tell you. The next guy will come, we'll get good results between December and April, then we'll struggle until June, people will say "it's fatigue, after the summer preparations we'll be great", then we won't be etc. etc. etc. Keep telling yourself that every manager in existence is fraud if it makes you feel better.
It's obvious that even with all mistakes ETH made, there are many more things wrong at Manchester United.

Good post!
Ole is not the so-called elementary PE teacher, similarly ETH is not a fraud for sure. ETH just simply has his grand plan failed emphatically for whatever reason. But it doesn’t mean he won’t turn it around. The season probably has to be written off. That’s it. It’s now about what people’s tolerance and threshold are. I don’t care that much for this season anymore. Just hope they can find a way.

 

[RedStarUnited]

Regarding him saying he can’t play like his Ajax team because the squads different… did guardiola change the way he’s always played when he first took over at city? Or klopp at Liverpool. Yes they wouldn’t have been able to implement it successfully because of the players but they’d of still tried to play that way. Last season we seen glimpses of ETH football. We played some great stuff on the floor.

Pep and Klopp believe in their plans almost to a fault. I knew ETH wasnt cut from the same cloth last year when he signed Weghorst. There is no world were I see Pep signing Weghorst to play as a striker in his team no matter what is happening. When Pep didnt get Kane he went into the season without a main striker and waited for Haaland.

 

[The United]

This pretty much sums Bruno's and our shite style of football, and he is completely fine with it. Actually, he is the one who is forcing it.

Yeah, he is definitely another stubborn manager, it's pretty obvious why he won't last long(if we needed any proof apart from watching our games).

There is nothing wrong with that style, because I think Klopp at least used to do it. However, our front three are nothing like theirs back then.

 

[Lay]

The sad thing is if we lose to Copenhagen, the season is almost a write off before December. No UCL football next season unless there’s a massive turnaround which I don’t think he or the players are capable of. Especially considering the players fail at any challenge they are given.

 

[Frank Grimes]

Wasn't happy with Rashford going out after the city game. Said it was 'unacceptable'.

 

[Bastian]

Embargoed bit:



These bunch of cnuts are so desperate to trip him up during the conference. He really needs to learn to say a polite go feck yourself. And ban some of these utter cnuts.

 

[sparx99]

Ajax's last champions league season before joining us should be enough to show you that Ten Hag did plenty with that team. The issues we are experiencing are issues every Ajax fan warned us about. He's bad at recruiting (check), he has favorites (check), he will bring in usesless players he managed before (check), he can be excessively and counter productively strict (check).

How on earth our professional management team weren't aware of these issues, when Ajax fans were posting on here about it, is quite the indictment of their performance and due dilligence in the recruitment process.

People were warned about those issues but it was largely framed as those things will be moaned about but the success was worth it. Loads of stories did the rounds about how the Amsterdam media really didn't like Ten Hag at first because he was 'un-cultured' and had a rural accent.

It's been noticeable that his English isn't great and hasn't really gotten better. You wonder if some of the issues communicating with the media (Sancho before and the Rashford story today) is partly his inability to express more clearly what he is saying. Even his comments about playing like Ajax this week got blown up and misunderstood.

That all extends to the squad as well of course. Ten Hag doesn't seem to have an awful lot of charisma. Are the players getting motivated by a Ten Hag speech? Are they getting the clarity on the tactics? He has Steve Mclaren and others there too but other coaches like Ange and Klopp seem to have a great rapport with their squads. Guardiola obviously commands respect but you also see him laughing and joking with Haaland last week.

 

[Oranges038]

Yes, perhaps my opinion is completely wrong. Perhaps ETH is a great manager, a world class manager.

However, the link you gave doesn't prove that. He only won the Eredivisie with Ajax three times, and Overmars was the guy who selected the players at Ajax. Also, please remember that ETH is actually one year older than Pep.

So, right now we know he is a good manager for Eredivisie. However, we do not need a good manager, we need a world-class manager. Is ETH a world class manager? Unfortunately, I don't think so. But yes, you are right, I may be wrong. We'll see.

I think he is a top coach.

But the problem is, this club behind the scenes is a mess, can't shift players put, can't get players signed on time. There's not many top class coaches or managers who could survive and get results under such a cloud of toxicity as the one that currently hangs over OT. Not with this squad anyway.

For any manager or coach to stand a chance of being a success at Utd, the whole football structure needs to be rebuild and this current squad needs to be gutted and put back together bit by bit, with the unwanted parts fecked in the bin. It's got to be a ruthless process, with nobody guaranteed to be spared from the cull.

That's where it's at, unless all that is sorted we'll be going round and round in this never ending cycle of manager after manager every 18 months, he needs new players, he needs this, he needs time etc etc etc.

 

[tomaldinho1]

I still believe in him. I like the presser, meets stuff head on, I think we’ll turn up tomorrow with a point to prove and win.

 

[el3mel]

The word "fraud" is thrown around so much, it's disgusting.
Moyes the fraud, LVG the fraud, Jose the fraud, Ralf the fraud, ETH the fraud.

And somehow these frauds are successful outside of Manchester United.

Is it possible that maybe, just maybe, it's not as simple as calling every coach we've had "fraud"?

None of them achieved success post United, even Moyes had to drop to WHU level to get good results. Ten Hag will be the same. I'm ready to bet this will be his last big job. He will return to Netherlands after United.

 

[frostbite]

The word "fraud" is thrown around so much, it's disgusting.
Moyes the fraud, LVG the fraud, Jose the fraud, Ralf the fraud, ETH the fraud.

And somehow these frauds are successful outside of Manchester United.

Is it possible that maybe, just maybe, it's not as simple as calling every coach we've had "fraud"?

I think the problem is that most people express opinions that are either extremely positive or extremely negative. The truth is usually in between.

The managers you mention are all good managers. However, they are not exceptional, world-class managers. Or at least they are not anymore.

We do not need a good manager. We need a GREAT manager. We need the best manager in the world, in order to beat Pep and Klop and the oil money. And it is not easy to find an exceptional manager.

With a good manager we will be fighting for 6th to 4th. That's fantastic for most teams. It is not good enough for us.

 

[Cheimoon]

I am starting to believe that ETH did not really do much at Ajax, either!

Ajax had a set way to play, from the academies up, Overmars and Van der Sar brought in good players, and ETH was just like a sergeant in the army, barking simple commands without understanding anything about the big picture.

That's the reason he tried so hard to get the same players here... perhaps he felt that the players understood the system better than he did. That's the only reasonable explanation I can think of for spending so much on Antony. ETH thought that if Overmars wanted Antony, it means that Antony is good. How can a manager train Antony for years and still have no clue that Antony is not good enough for United? It makes no sense. The only explanation is that ETH cannot even understand how good or bad his own players are, that's why he was playing Wout every game last year.

This also explains why he looks so lost now...

It wasn't "his system", it was "the Ajax system". Now he is trying "the United system", and nobody knows what this is.

Others have also said it, but this post is really hilariously bad. Ajax was doing quite poorly when Ten Hag arrived and he completely turned that around (after needing a while to get going). In doing so, he did not simply implement 'the Ajax template'; his football was much more vertical and less possession-focused than is usual for Ajax. If that's all just Ajax being Ajax, then why wasn't Ajax being Ajax before as well? Or why weren't Overmars and Van der Sar hitting it out of the park already?

It's also an incredibly simplistic view of Antony. Unfortunately, it doesn't look like you meant it as funnily as it reads. Plus, Van der Sar was not much involved in the football side, and turned the club into a car crash after Overmars and Ten Hag left. So if anyone else deserves praise here for Ajax's successes, it's definitely not Van der Sar.

Clearly Ten Hag is doing poorly right now, and transfer strategy is probably not his forte (but why should it have to be? it shouldn't be the manager's role); but claiming he wasn't responsible for Ajax's football is, frankly, insane.

 

[el3mel]

I don't give a shit what he had at Ajax either good or not, that's for himself only. I only care about one thing and that he has been exposed as a fraud at Man United.

 

[frostbite]

Others have also said it, but this post is really hilariously bad. Ajax was doing quite poorly when Ten Hag arrived and he completely turned that around (after needing a while to get going). In doing so, he did not simply implement 'the Ajax template'; his football was much more vertical and less possession-focused than is usual for Ajax. If that's all just Ajax being Ajax, then why wasn't Ajax being Ajax before as well? Or why weren't Overmars and Van der Sar hitting it out of the park already?

It's also an incredibly simplistic view of Antony. Unfortunately, it doesn't look like you meant it as funnily as it reads. Plus, Van der Sar was not much involved in the football side, and turned the club into a car crash after Overmars and Ten Hag left. So if anyone else deserves praise here for Ajax's successes, it's definitely not Van der Sar.

Clearly Ten Hag is doing poorly right now, and transfer strategy is probably not his forte (but why should it have to be? it shouldn't be the manager's role); but claiming he wasn't responsible for Ajax's football is, frankly, insane.

Overmars was at Ajax from 2012 to 2022.
VDS was CEO at Ajax from 2016 to 2023.
ETH was manager from 2017 to 2022.

I have no idea how Ajax worked internally and who contributed more to their success. But I read that it was Overmars who found the players and assembled the squad.

This is from 2017, before ETH, it compares the 2017 Ajax squad (Overmars squad) to the 1995 Ajax squad!

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...ster-united-europa-league-final-a7749571.html

Marc Overmars has built the best Ajax team since 1995 - but before it comes to an end he knows they must win

Overmars’ Ajax team won one Champions League and Intercontinental Cup, and lost the Champions League final the following year, before they finally disbanded in 1996 and 1997


When Marc Overmars returned to Ajax in 2012 he had one goal. He had won the Champions League with Ajax in 1995, but since then the giant club had been dwarfed in the new financial landscape of the game. Overmars was the new technical director and he was desperate to drag his old team back into a European final.

On Wednesday night in Stockholm, Overmars’ ambition will be fulfilled. Ajax will play Manchester United for the Europa League. It is their first European final since they lost the Champions League to Juventus in 1996 in Rome, a game Overmars missed with injury. But for Overmars and the rest of the veterans of that great mid-1990s side, guiding this team back to the top is what it is all about.

“It makes me proud,” Overmars tells The Independent in his office at De Toekmost. “When I started here I wanted to do the same as I did as a player, and reach a final. Now to achieve it this year is fantastic for us.”

Football history does not repeat itself, but it often rhymes, and it does so very clearly in the case of Ajax then and now. The 1995 team, which Overmars played in, was a young side, mostly but not exclusively local, playing adventurous pressing football inspired by the values of Johan Cruyff. All of that is true now, and not by chance either. This team has been drawn up on the lines of the old one and it shows.

 

[USREDEVIL]

Let's go Erik, get the win and shut the doubters and chicken littles up!

 

[TMDaines]

Can’t believe he said what he did about Rashford in his embargoed bit when his media officer literally just told him it will be released at 10:30 PM tonight to make the headlines just before everyone goes to sleep for the early kickoff tomorrow. Just ignore the question, pillock.

 

[Rhyme Animal]

Let's go Erik, get the win and shut the doubters and chicken littles up!

Indeed, a result against Fulham is perfect for a Utd manager looking to silence the doubters…

Spoiler

 

[Cheimoon]

Overmars was at Ajax from 2012 to 2022.
VDS was CEO at Ajax from 2016 to 2023.
ETH was manager from 2017 to 2022.

I have no idea how Ajax worked internally and who contributed more to their success. But I read that it was Overmars who found the players and assembled the squad.

This is from 2017, before ETH, it compares the Ajax squad (Overmars squad) with the 1995 Ajax squad!

https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...ster-united-europa-league-final-a7749571.html

When Marc Overmars returned to Ajax in 2012 he had one goal. He had won the Champions League with Ajax in 1995, but since then the giant club had been dwarfed in the new financial landscape of the game. Overmars was the new technical director and he was desperate to drag his old team back into a European final.

On Wednesday night in Stockholm, Overmars’ ambition will be fulfilled. Ajax will play Manchester United for the Europa League. It is their first European final since they lost the Champions League to Juventus in 1996 in Rome, a game Overmars missed with injury. But for Overmars and the rest of the veterans of that great mid-1990s side, guiding this team back to the top is what it is all about.

“It makes me proud,” Overmars tells The Independent in his office at De Toekmost. “When I started here I wanted to do the same as I did as a player, and reach a final. Now to achieve it this year is fantastic for us.”

Football history does not repeat itself, but it often rhymes, and it does so very clearly in the case of Ajax then and now. The 1995 team, which Overmars played in, was a young side, mostly but not exclusively local, playing adventurous pressing football inspired by the values of Johan Cruyff. All of that is true now, and not by chance either. This team has been drawn up on the lines of the old one and it shows.

I have no idea what point you are trying to make with this post (or where your article quotes starts or stops). But yes, Overmars was their DoF and quite good at that job. But he didn't make the team play well or win. They didn't win the Dutch league a few years, and while Ajax won the league multiple years in a row before that under De Boer, fans deeply disliked the play style, and they were hopeless in the CL. It makes zero sense to suggest that Ten Hag was simply a puppet during his time at Ajax, and you will find no-one in the Netherlands who shares that view.

 

[frostbite]

I have no idea what point you are trying to make with this post (or where your article quotes starts or stops). But yes, Overmars was their DoF and quite good at that job. But he didn't make the team play well or win. They didn't win the Dutch league a few years, and while Ajax won the league multiple years in a row before that under De Boer, fans deeply disliked the play style, and they were hopeless in the CL. It makes zero sense to suggest that Ten Hag was simply a puppet during his time at Ajax, and you will find no-one in the Netherlands who shares that view.

The article above says that the 2017 Ajax squad that Overmars assembled has the same talent as the fantastic 1995 Ajax squad! The article anticipates that the 2017 squad will win one CL before the players were sold. This was before they hired ETH. The article doesn't focus on the manager, because the quality of these players was so high, and all these players were young and improving, that it was expected they would win a lot, with whoever manager.

Actually, ETH did not win the CL, he only won 3 times the Eredivisie. If you read the full article, this seems like an underachievement, given the quality of that squad.

 

[frostbite]

Oh, yes, the 2017 article also states:

"The 1995 team, which Overmars played in, was a young side, mostly but not exclusively local, playing adventurous pressing football inspired by the values of Johan Cruyff. All of that is true now, and not by chance either. This team has been drawn up on the lines of the old one and it shows. "


Even the playing style was trying to copy the 1995! This was before they hired ETH. The playing style had been already decided before they hired ETH. The players, the whole plan, was there in 2017, before they hired ETH.

ETH was the sergeant that executed the plan. He wasn't the master strategist.

 

[croadyman]

He won't turn around anything if the players give up, but to me it looks like some of them are still behind him, he should focus on them, and luckily this is a favourable set of games on paper

Who do you think is still behind him?

 

[croadyman]

I have to say, I'm in agreement with Goldbridge & Sam at United People that sacking wont help matters & we would undoubtedly suffer in the immediate aftermath.

Look, I've heard from a few usually reliable sources now that a bigger problem than ETH is actually STEVE MCCLAREN, hes created a toxic environment on the training ground & is something of an arsonist in that no sooner has Ten Hag stepped in to solve whatever problem exists between McClaren & a player, McClaren is off creating problems with another player & his ego is such he wont have his authority questioned. Alot of the players cant understand why Ten Hag has stuck with him especially as many people in the dressing room are aware that it is McClaren who is leaking the stories to the press - again causing trouble for the players who are under suspicion but completely innocent. Its really REALLY two faced & nasty of McClaren to go about things that way but the general consensus is that McClaren actually thinks he has a chance to replace Ten Hag one day, so much so that he is prepared to push the manager who brought him back to the club under a bus. McClaren needs to be gone & a new coach employed.

I repeat guys, its McClaren who is leaking stories to the press. Scumbag.

Anyone believe this has any legs?

 

[TheGodsInRed]

Anyone believe this has any legs?

No.

 

[Still ill]

McClaren is an arsonist? This is a serious issue. Let's get this one sorted first. No smoke etc.

 

[Freak]

Can’t believe he said what he did about Rashford in his embargoed bit when his media officer literally just told him it will be released at 10:30 PM tonight to make the headlines just before everyone goes to sleep for the early kickoff tomorrow. Just ignore the question, pillock.

What did he say?

 

[Freak]

I still believe in him. I like the presser, meets stuff head on, I think we’ll turn up tomorrow with a point to prove and win.

He will turn up with a point to prove. The players won’t.

 

[JB08]

Look, I've heard from a few usually reliable sources now that a bigger problem than ETH is actually STEVE MCCLAREN, hes created a toxic environment on the training ground & is something of an arsonist in that no sooner has Ten Hag stepped in to solve whatever problem exists between McClaren & a player, McClaren is off creating problems with another player & his ego is such he wont have his authority questioned.

I repeat guys, its McClaren who is leaking stories to the press. Scumbag.

If you’re going to say something like this please provide some proof. Hitchens’ razor and all that.

 

[Cheimoon]

The article above says that the 2017 Ajax squad that Overmars assembled has the same talent as the fantastic 1995 Ajax squad! The article anticipates that the 2017 squad will win one CL before the players were sold. This was before they hired ETH. The article doesn't focus on the manager, because the quality of these players was so high, and all these players were young and improving, that it was expected they would win a lot, with whoever manager.

Actually, ETH did not win the CL, he only won 3 times the Eredivisie. If you read the full article, this seems like an underachievement, given the quality of that squad.

Oh, yes, the 2017 article also states:

"The 1995 team, which Overmars played in, was a young side, mostly but not exclusively local, playing adventurous pressing football inspired by the values of Johan Cruyff. All of that is true now, and not by chance either. This team has been drawn up on the lines of the old one and it shows. "


Even the playing style was trying to copy the 1995! This was before they hired ETH. The playing style had been already decided before they hired ETH. The players, the whole plan, was there in 2017, before they hired ETH.

ETH was the sergeant that executed the plan. He wasn't the master strategist.

Sorry, but - it's not like just saying these things makes them true. Everything at Ajax is always based on Cruyff's ideas, and Ajax has had the same general approach for decades - except probably that Overmars decided to start buying some bigger names as well. Also, if that squad was so amazing, why did the next coach fail with it? Yes, there were some strong players there, but both Bosz and Ten Hag are just also very good coaches.

Anyway, that's fine, if you want to make up your own reality, then have at it. It's only football.

 

[Oranges038]

Embargoed bit:



These bunch of cnuts are so desperate to trip him up during the conference. He really needs to learn to say a polite go feck yourself. And ban some of these utter cnuts.

Bunch of snivelling cnuts.

He should just give them the Jim McLean treatment.

Anyone believe this has any legs?

Poster signed up, made one post and hasn't responded.

I bet it's ETH sneakily trying to blame everything on Steve, because he's jealous of his hair Island.

 

[Bondi77]

Bunch of snivelling cnuts.

He should just give them the Jim McLean treatment.





Poster signed up, made one post and hasn't responded.

I bet it's ETH sneakily trying to blame everything on Steve, because he's jealous of his hair Island.

 

[croadyman]

He will turn up with a point to prove. The players won’t.

Yeah it's debatable if they feel that same passion as him to turn things around. There is no doubt he has burnt £400m and no defined style of play which is why I can see why people want him sacked.

However he has suffered an unprecedented injury crisis in defence and never had a proper recruitment structure above him so can see why people want him to get more time.

 

[USREDEVIL]

Indeed, a result against Fulham is perfect for a Utd manager looking to silence the doubters…

Spoiler

It's a start.

 

[croadyman]

Are people bothered about the lack of personality or is it no issue if delivering results

 

[Bondi77]

Are people bothered about the lack of personality or is it no issue if delivering results

You don't think Erik has any personality?

 

[r0663664]

Fine. Sack him and then what? Rinse and repeat like we've done with everyone from Moyes to Rangnick?

It hasn't worked yet so what's the chance it's gon a work now? Until we have a proper structure up top getting in a new manager and players won't fix us.

Blame it on the structure and give the manager a pass. No matter how bad is the structure, United spend alot more than other clubs for the last 10 years. I think Erik was given his targets, he wanted Mount, Onana, Martinez, Antony, Hoijund, Malaccia, Erik and Amrabat. That's eight new players for Erik and he knows these players. This is not as if these are unknown quality to him. He should be able to put up a decent team but yet we get beaten by other teams easily. If structure will help us, then anyone can be a manager.