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[Giggsy PO]

IDF recovers body of Cpl. Noa Marciano from Gaza, days after announcing her death
By EMANUEL FABIAN and TOI STAFF
Cpl. Noa Marciano (IDF)
The IDF says it has recovered the body of Cpl. Noa Marciano from the Gaza Strip, three days after announcing she had been killed in Hamas captivity.

Marciano’s body was recovered yesterday by troops of the 7th Armored Brigade’s 603rd Battalion from a building adjacent to Shifa Hospital, following intelligence information provided by the Shin Bet security agency.

Her body was then brought to Israel for identification. Her funeral is slated for later today.

The finding came as troops continue to search for terror infrastructure in the hospital complex.

Marciano, 19, of the Combat Intelligence Collection Corps 414th unit, was serving at the Nahal Oz IDF base when it was overrun by terrorists during their murderous onslaught on southern Israel on October 7. She lived in Modiin and was the oldest of three siblings.

On Monday evening, Hamas published a propaganda video of Marciano, showing her speaking to the camera four days after being taken hostage, identifying herself and reciting the names of her parents and her hometown. The video then cut to showing her body.

Terror groups in Gaza are believed to be holding some 240 people hostage after it took them captive in southern Israel on October 7. Hamas has repeatedly made unsubstantiated claims that some hostages have been killed by Israeli airstrikes on Gaza.

Yesterday, the IDF also recovered the body of Yehudit Weiss, who was abducted by Hamas on October 7, also near Shifa.

 

[Real Name]

Given the IDF are one of the least competent military forces going, I'd back the hospital.

But but but they're making sure there are few civilian casulties!!

 

[Real Name]

Hamas weapons found.

 

[stevoc]

Did Schmuley just launch into personal attacks and shout over everyone?

 

[2cents]

Some polling of Israeli opinion on the post-war plan. No consensus beyond agreement that continuing to “manage” the Palestinians is out:

“A majority of the Israeli public (52%) supports political measures at the end of the military campaign that entail a degree of recognition of independent Palestinian sovereignty. While 27% support a two-state agreement within the framework of the normalization process with the Arab world, 25% favor unilateral separation from the Palestinians in the Gaza Strip and West Bank. In contrast, 28% of the public (including a third of the Jewish public) supports Israeli annexation of Gaza and the West Bank. Only 5% support the pre-Oct. 7 policy of “managing” the conflict with Hamas and Hezbollah.”​

There are several other questions posed. Of course it acknowledges that in the midst of war public opinion can shift rapidly and frequently.

Full results: https://mitvim.org.il/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/Main20findings20English.pdf.pdf

 

[Murder on Zidanes Floor]

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[Iker Quesadillas]

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File under: clumsiness.

 

[Murder on Zidanes Floor]

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[WeePat]

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File under: clumsiness.

I can’t believe that Netanyahu advisor managed to keep a straight face while putting up that performance. It’s obvious he had one job to do here, to deny any wrongdoing on Israel’s part, and if unable to refute clear evidence of propaganda lies, claim it’s just a honest mistake by a good man whilst muddying the waters of what can and can’t believed about the atrocities Israel is committing in Gaza.

It felt like an utterly pointless interview but at the same time it’s important to expose the fact that they will obfuscate and outright lie about anything and everything that make Israel look bad.

 

[The Corinthian]

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[Dirty Schwein]

Did Schmuley just launch into personal attacks and shout over everyone?

All ad hominem from him and as soon as the other guy did it back, he threw a hissy fit.

You can't debate with Schmauley, he ignores the topic and just attempts to character assassinate and smear with false facts and anecdotal facts that can't be proven.

He on this show said the Palestinians in the West Bank want to have settlers there

 

[Murder on Zidanes Floor]

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[Murder on Zidanes Floor]

All ad hominem from him and as soon as the other guy did it back, he threw a hissy fit.

You can't debate with Schmauley, he ignores the topic and just attempts to character assassinate and smear with false facts and anecdotal facts that can't be proven.

He on this show said the Palestinians in the West Bank want to have settlers there

Horrible interview. Both screaming, no conversation

 

[Dirty Schwein]

Horrible interview. Both screaming, no conversation

Yeah they needed to do it on zoom and use the mute function.

 

[stevoc]

All ad hominem from him and as soon as the other guy did it back, he threw a hissy fit.

You can't debate with Schmauley, he ignores the topic and just attempts to character assassinate and smear with false facts and anecdotal facts that can't be proven.

He on this show said the Palestinians in the West Bank want to have settlers there

Yeah he's got a very problematic relationship with reality. And shouting over people and attacking them seems to be his modus operandi, the guy is an absolute wankstain. I've no idea why anyone invites him on their show if they expect any sort of useful debate.

 

[TwoSheds]

I for one am shocked that there is no Hamas command centre under the hospital

 

[Murder on Zidanes Floor]

Yeah they needed to do it on zoom and use the mute function.

In reality, two quite contemptible religious zealots shouting, hosted by a gammon faced loser.

 

[The Corinthian]

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[Kaos]

I for one am shocked that there is no Hamas command centre under the hospital

Haven't you heard? President Biden is absolutely, positively, undoubtedly sure there is one. He's seen the evidence. Can he disclose the source of this intel? Absolutely not.

 

[TwoSheds]

Haven't you heard? President Biden is absolutely, positively, undoubtedly sure there is one. He's seen the evidence. Can he disclose the source of this intel? Absolutely not.

Well in fairness I know someone with UK security clearance who said he knew it was there too. The intelligence services could be mistaken/lying, it's not necessarily all the politicians' fault.

 

[reelworld]

you really couldn't make it up

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[Kaos]

Well in fairness I know someone with UK security clearance who said he knew it was there too. The intelligence services could be mistaken/lying, it's not necessarily all the politicians' fault.

The issue is when they choose to be selective over what they constitute to be objective evidence and what to remain skeptical about. Case in point, Biden was all too happy to express doubts at the death toll figures coming from the Palestinians (despite it later shown to be smaller than the IDF's own predictions) while all too happy to recirculate alleged 'evidence' of hospitals being used as command bases without disclosing the source of this information. All it does it reinforce (or rather rubbish) the notion that the US, UK and others are impartial mediators in this conflict.

 

[TwoSheds]

The issue is when they choose to be selective over what they constitute to be objective evidence and what to remain skeptical about. Case in point, Biden was all too happy to express doubts at the death toll figures coming from the Palestinians (despite it later shown to be smaller than the IDF's own predictions) while all too happy to recirculate alleged 'evidence' of hospitals being used as command bases without disclosing the source of this information. All it does it reinforce (or rather rubbish) the notion that the US, UK and others are impartial mediators in this conflict.

I don't think anybody outside of those countries has ever been under any illusions about that though unfortunately.

 

[VorZakone]

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[MDFC Manager]

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No peace even in death. Barbarians.

 

[Dirty Schwein]

you really couldn't make it up

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So will they tell the Palestinians who are in the south/moved to the south to move into Egypt now?

 

[the_cliff]

So will they tell the Palestinians who are in the south/moved to the south to move into Egypt now?

The real HQ will suddenly appear in the Sinai...

 

[Redplane]

I've purposely decided to stay away from this thread since it seems like there is no winning argument anymore.

Having said that: as someone with no skin in the game either way I sometimes feel like it would be easiest to drop a bomb on that whole part of the world. I don't mean that quite as literally of course, but considering the sentiment being so strong all over without much interest in ever seemingly wanting to discuss the other sides' perspective - I don't see this ending in my lifetime or even the ones of my kids. How could you possibly reset this when you have Palestinian and Israeli youth see today's horrors being committed by either side. How could it not ensure that hatred will continue to live on?

 

[Raoul]

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They're probably still squabbling over how many hostages are released, how long the ceasefire would be for, and how many Palestinian prisoners are freed.

 

[Idxomer]

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It's one of the reasons Hamas have repeatedly asked for the dead Palestinians they have in exchange for hostages.

 

[The Corinthian]

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Modern day Nazis

 

[WeePat]

They're probably still squabbling over how many hostages are released, how long the ceasefire would be for, and how many Palestinian prisoners are freed.

Do we know what these Palestinians are in prison for? It’s interesting that they’re being called prisoners in this scenario.

 

[Raven]

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That is demonic, genuinely one of the most evil things I've ever heard.

 

[Raoul]

Do we know what these Palestinians are in prison for? It’s interesting that they’re being called prisoners in this scenario.

They are detainees in Israeli prisons. Whether the detention is administrative or otherwise is a different matter. They are almost certainly safer there than running around Gaza at the moment.

The broader issue is whether Hamas even have control over all 240ish Israeli hostages to be able to negotiate the return of Palestinians, and whether a swap would even make sense for both sides given that the Israelis will not end their ground war until Hamas are complete gone. What this would mean for any repatriated Palestinians affiliated with Hamas or PIJ, is they would almost certainly be killed after being sent back to Gaza.

 

[Pintu]

Do we know what these Palestinians are in prison for? It’s interesting that they’re being called prisoners in this scenario.

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[Murder on Zidanes Floor]

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Can you believe it, that rock chipped the paint on my Abraham's tank.

 

[Murder on Zidanes Floor]

I've purposely decided to stay away from this thread since it seems like there is no winning argument anymore.

Having said that: as someone with no skin in the game either way I sometimes feel like it would be easiest to drop a bomb on that whole part of the world. I don't mean that quite as literally of course, but considering the sentiment being so strong all over without much interest in ever seemingly wanting to discuss the other sides' perspective - I don't see this ending in my lifetime or even the ones of my kids. How could you possibly reset this when you have Palestinian and Israeli youth see today's horrors being committed by either side. How could it not ensure that hatred will continue to live on?

I understand your sentiment, almost like a hard reset. Obviously not literally, that would be obscene but the myopic worldview lacks the imagination to see a way through.

 

[Murder on Zidanes Floor]

That is demonic, genuinely one of the most evil things I've ever heard.

It's bleak but this 2009 news barely registered in the West. Just casually swept under the rug and ignored.

Shrug of the shoulders.

It was noted that Israel denied the reports and said it was antisemitism

 

[BootsyCollins]

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Really disappointning that they can go all the way. Sweden on other countires does, but we cant.

 

[Giggsy PO]

Excelent discussion between Sam Harris and Yuval Noah Harrari. Yuval made some excellent points.