Zlatan 7
We've got bush!
- Joined
- May 26, 2016
- Messages
- 11,882
My man. Speaks so well. Olegend
it comes across as young overhyped English player. Its mental after all the time chasing him nobody checked to see where he wanted to play, or how he fit in the teamI wish they pressed him more on the Sancho signing.
He said both him and the club really wanted Sancho, but also admits that Jadon prefers playing on the left, like Rashford.
We were crying out for a right winger that summer, and they spent 80m on someone who would essentially compete with Rashford…why?
Because they wanted to move into a different style of football, and thought that Jadon was a generational talent? To be fair, if he performed anywhere near his Dortmund level, he would have easily kept Rashford out of the team.I wish they pressed him more on the Sancho signing.
He said both him and the club really wanted Sancho, but also admits that Jadon prefers playing on the left, like Rashford.
We were crying out for a right winger that summer, and they spent 80m on someone who would essentially compete with Rashford…why?
Our approach to left inside fwds has been mental. We had Rashford (who at the time looked promising and even in the early days was never a striker)…but let’s sign Depay, Martial, Sanchez, Sancho all for crazy sums whose best career football has been in that same position…whilst completely neglecting the opposite sideit comes across as young overhyped English player. Its mental after all the time chasing him nobody checked to see where he wanted to play, or how he fit in the team
Oh we also brought in a no 10 from Chelsea and force him to play RW. When he sucked at it, we made him play there for another 8 years.O
Our approach to left inside fwds has been mental. We had Rashford (who at the time looked promising and even in the early days was never a striker)…but let’s sign Depay, Martial, Sanchez, Sancho all for crazy sums whose best career football has been in that same position…whilst completely neglecting the opposite side
ETH did exactly the opposite against City and has been slaughtered for it - the manager can't win!The main takeaway for me is the confirmation from Ole that this pattern many fans have noticed whereby we tear down any half-decent platform we build is basically due to pride, vanity and an unhealthy obsession with Manchester City amongst our executive leadership team.
If we had just continued to slowly build under OGS, playing relatively basic football and buying "best of British" and a smattering of young talents from overseas, I am convinced we would have been in a much, much better position that we are right now.
As usual, we tried to run before we could walk. Ole talks about "taking it" to Liverpool and City for no other reason that "we're Man Utd". We need to get over that mindset and fast. Look inward and focus on our own club and not what everybody else is doing all the time.
Yep I agree. Either he wasn't in the weeds as much as you'd expect a manager to be or he's NDA'd and was deliberately very tight-lipped. My read was that it's a bit of both but, unfortunately, maybe more the former.Was a good watch. The banter between them is always great… but thought he came across a bit vague. He’s obviously a decent man and didn’t want to name drop anyone and throw them under a bus…but from a club structure perspective I was hoping for more. Wonder if nda’s are in play. He talked a lot without really giving much away and struck me as a soft manager.
I mentioned this a bit earlier but I think the segment around minute 20 was most interesting: trying to be more aggressive with the players at his disposal was his ultimate undoing. EtH is falling into the exact same trap of trying to play more aggressively than the squad allows - we have a back line that can't press high enough (particularly without Martinez), a CDM without McFred's legs, and a forward three who don't work hard enough to press well (Rashy in particular).We owe an apology. Ole's defend and counter was a much better tactics than the current shit.
May I ask how someone who is ' completely out of his depth ' manages to get a second and third place in the best league in the world? And a Europa league final as well. Are the players that good? In that case, shouldn't Mourinho or ETH be even more out of their depth? How does this work?Completely agree. The segments about him as manager were painful to listen to. Ridiculously out of his depth.
So he should have guaranteed a 17 year old a set amount of playing time, a player that had never played at a club the size and level of United?Haaland stuff - depressing hearing really. I mean they listened to Ole to sign Dan James and Harry Maguire but didn’t listen to him to sign Haaland. Just sums up the state of those running the club during that period.
Ronaldo stuff - don’t really buy the stuff about our game changing out of possession. It’s not as if Cavani was going to play all season. Greenwood and Rashford had already began becoming lazy on the pitch.
A few people have commented how that Ronaldo signing changed things. Ignoring that the many other individuals in that team whom have since been on an insane downward trajection.
Pogba and Martial became cripples that season and Pogba has become a drug cheat. Greenwood was arrested for rape and Marcus Rashford has completely lost his way as a footballer on and off the field. And I definitely remember around that period people wanted the team built around Pogba, Martial, Rashford and Greenwood. So actually it made no difference to anything long term as the collapse was on its way.
Bellingham - yeah you fecked up here Ole I’m afraid.
Wait what? They refused to come out for 2nd half because they were grief stricken over his departure?People are making a big deal about who didn't way to play second half. Its pretty obvious from what gs said players knew he wwas set to be sacked and a number were upset. I refuse to hold it against any of them, personally
He was praising their attitude as much as anything else, and quite frankly, if we'd had Fred this season opposition teams wouldn't be running right thru our midfield all game, I'm pretty confident out losses column would be a lot less than it isI love him but I don't think he was cut out for it. Even in this interview with how he praises the likes of Maguire and Fred, you get the sense that he wasn't ruthless enough.
No, but he didn’t need to do that. I don’t think it was a slam dunk case of Bellingham saying “I must play every week”. He wasn’t even a guaranteed starter at Dortmund the first year he was there. Starting 19 league games and being a sub 10.So he should have guaranteed a 17 year old a set amount of playing time, a player that had never played at a club the size and level of United?
You know people can be upset without being grief stricken right?Wait what? They refused to come out for 2nd half because they were grief stricken over his departure?
Ole said there were tears at half time, showing some really are a bunch of wetwipesWait what? They refused to come out for 2nd half because they were grief stricken over his departure?
Bellingham was very certainNo, but he didn’t need to do that. I don’t think it was a slam dunk case of Bellingham saying “I must play every week”. He wasn’t even a guaranteed starter at Dortmund the first year he was there. Starting 19 league games and being a sub 10.
Don’t think it would have been too much to give him assurances of decent game time especially as we had woeful midfield options at the time. As manager he failed to get Bellingham over the line and he should take the L on that.
Except he did it the previous summer with Dan James. Who’d not made anywhere near the mark in the championship as Jude had. He signed Dan James after a season of first team football and played him in many many games.Bellingham was very certain
n on the number of first team mintues he needed to develop his career further in a specific period of time. There is no way he was going to fall for bluffs and bluster. Basically the only chance Ole had of getting him was promising him those minutes he has calculated. No manager at a a club like United could do that.
Ole mentioned it in the video, but don't remember the minute markeh? is there more to this than the clip where fergie was in private conversation?
Guarantee if Fred had gone City & Maguire for that matter, they’d be thought of much more favourably. Especially Fred, considering we took an attacking mid & tried to make him a DM. Much like we did with Anderson.You're not wrong, but those players' fees were tantamount to what you'd expect to pay for your very best players. Maguire is still the most expensive centre back in the world and Fred cost 50m-ish in 2018 (not sure what that would be in today's market, but Mahrez went for 60m that summer, Richarlison for 35m for comparison).
I think it speaks to one issue that we have which is the manager has to be somewhat responsible for the budget too, which brings to mind Antony as well.
This here. That was my take away, along with refusing interviews and captaincy. Those players don't have the mentally to play for united, no wonder we crumble under pressure.A lot of focus on the Ronaldo stuff, but he's gone and so has Ole. More interesting stuff about players crying and demanding to be taken off vs Watford at half time, refusing to talk to press, refusing captaincy... aren't those lads still here?
Ronaldo didn't work, we all know that. But some of this stuff he's said relevant to the players in the dressing room today is scandalous. I honestly don't get how any of the Ronaldo stuff is the lead here. Didn't work, big ego. If you're finding that out for the first time then welcome to planet earth.
The fact we have two players who burst into tears and asked to come off during a game still here, is surely the biggest thing to emerge.
He didn't say it was a problem though. So maybe he planned playing him left wing.He first says how our recruitment is very detailed, even too much sometimes. He says how our scouts, coach and CEO analyse every single detail before signing player.
And then he says that biggest problem with Sancho was that he (as Rashford) likes to play on the left.
So why the hell we chased him for two years then?
Ifs, buts and maybes, the guy spent £50m+ one summer on VdB, Amad and Pellistri instead of addressing the midfield issues.I enjoyed that epsiode.
Found it interesting what he was saying about trying to take the next step towards being more dominant in terms of controlling games. If he had to have sorted out the midfield with players who could actually control and pass a ball and dictate play, he might have stood a chance. But it was never going to work with the midfield options at the club.
That's been the biggest let down at the club over the last 10-15 years, totally ignoring the key area of the pitch that is probably the biggest determining factor in whether or not you will be successful.
The reason ole didn’t offer Bellingham the minutes to convince him is because Ole misidentified the abilities of Mctominay/ Pogba and Fred.
I mean did you hear him talking about Mcfred during the overlap? He held them in far too high regard.
It seems that United are the only beneficiaries of lockdowns and the top teams underperforming.I don't subscribe to the "oh we shrink in front of crowds" thing because it can't really be quantified. So yes it's a coincidence in my opinion. I don't think the lack of crowds turned Martial into the best all around striker for a season that we've had post RVP, or had Bruno and Pogba destroying teams creating in transition, or made Greenwood lethal in front of goal. The team just "clicked" mainly because of our attack and we were relatively injury free during lockdown.
That is harsh. Without the right structure in the club even Emery failed in Arsenal. I won't judge him as a manager only based on his experience in Man Utd. Hope he will get back to coaching soon.I can’t take Ole seriously as a manager. He wasn’t a failure and actually managed to stumble his way into a decent spell as manager but his ‘happy to be here’ demeanour as a manager just gives off a vibe of inferiority.
He goes on about not needing to rush to be in management after leaving United but what did he achieve here to have such a position. It makes perfect sense for someone like Zidane, he reached the absolute apex of club management and decided to take time out. Any other manager in Ole’s position is out there looking to get another job and doesn’t give a damn if it’s a level below the United job.
It shows that Ole thinks his United tenure is what ultimate success looks like to him. Managers love the thrill of coaching and being in the job, the good and bad that comes with it. Moyes and Mourinho have had some ultra lows but always come back looking to go again and be better. LVG too who coached at the World Cup at 70.
Ole is someone who knows he isn’t good enough which is why he went balls in on bringing the vibes back to the squad. It was a good strategy and worked for the period that it did but once that has been exhausted and more is needed, it’s no surprise he said he was unable to get them to believe. People will blame the players but as a squad when you see your rivals with better players and them being managed by Klopp and Pep then you look at your dressing room and see Ole spouting United way rhetoric, it’s easy to lose belief and be disheartened.
He had to go when he did, he took us as far as he could. Only thing I’d add is that the players who made up Oleball should have left with him as the ones that are still here have also proven they’ve gone as far as they can with us too.
Ooor maybe he doesn't necessarily want to be a manager, and won't take a job where his gut feeling tells him he doesn't 100% want to take it?I can’t take Ole seriously as a manager. He wasn’t a failure and actually managed to stumble his way into a decent spell as manager but his ‘happy to be here’ demeanour as a manager just gives off a vibe of inferiority.
He goes on about not needing to rush to be in management after leaving United but what did he achieve here to have such a position. It makes perfect sense for someone like Zidane, he reached the absolute apex of club management and decided to take time out. Any other manager in Ole’s position is out there looking to get another job and doesn’t give a damn if it’s a level below the United job.
It shows that Ole thinks his United tenure is what ultimate success looks like to him. Managers love the thrill of coaching and being in the job, the good and bad that comes with it. Moyes and Mourinho have had some ultra lows but always come back looking to go again and be better. LVG too who coached at the World Cup at 70.
Ole is someone who knows he isn’t good enough which is why he went balls in on bringing the vibes back to the squad. It was a good strategy and worked for the period that it did but once that has been exhausted and more is needed, it’s no surprise he said he was unable to get them to believe. People will blame the players but as a squad when you see your rivals with better players and them being managed by Klopp and Pep then you look at your dressing room and see Ole spouting United way rhetoric, it’s easy to lose belief and be disheartened.
He had to go when he did, he took us as far as he could. Only thing I’d add is that the players who made up Oleball should have left with him as the ones that are still here have also proven they’ve gone as far as they can with us too.
Aye, that's what I said, if he had at least tried to build a decent midfield he could have gone to that stage. He didn't, so trying to take that leap without having a midfield that was capable of controlling the game was a waste of time.Ifs, buts and maybes, the guy spent £50m+ one summer on VdB, Amad and Pellistri instead of addressing the midfield issues.
Hmm but he also named Scott as one of the players who gave him 7/10 every weekMay be reading too much into this but something that I thought was quite revealing was what he said at the very start. He knew he was done at half time of the Watford game, he said to the players who wants to give this a go.. who wants to go off, and the players that did raised their hands. Checked the game, and Rashford and McTominay were off at half time. Revealing to me.
Dan James was promised game-time or Dan James was given game-time because the other option was Jesse Lingard?Except he did it the previous summer with Dan James. Who’d not made anywhere near the mark in the championship as Jude had. He signed Dan James after a season of first team football and played him in many many games.
Bellingham was there. Our central midfield options were poor at the time. It was a noted weak spot in our team. The reason ole didn’t offer Bellingham the minutes to convince him is because Ole misidentified the abilities of Mctominay/ Pogba and Fred.
I mean did you hear him talking about Mcfred during the overlap? He held them in far too high regard. And that’s why he didn’t believe Bellingham would play a lot. Putting this on bullshit like no manager would play a player that age that much or that Bellingham was too demanding is a bullshit. Manchester United not giving young teenagers significant minutes ? Really? When was that a thing?
Yeah, absolute pisser that. Would have been incredible.Its such a shame he didnt win in Gdańsk.
Do we take every random story that pops in the press as gospel? Cmon. Ole to Bayern was never, ever going to happen. Same as Southgate to us. Football journalists will literally write anything.Ooor maybe he doesn't necessarily want to be a manager, and won't take a job where his gut feeling tells him he doesn't 100% want to take it?
He's a multi-millionaire, I'm pretty sure he can enjoy his life if he wants, instead of potentially wasting away years in a job that he wasn't fully sure about anyways, just so people like you won't make mean comments on the internet about how he believes failure is success, etc. Some of you read anything into a few words these days.
Btw, funnily enough his name came up at Bayern when they were considering sacking Tuchel immediately a few weeks ago, so just maybe they know better than you do?
Didn’t need to insinuate it. It’s the obvious conclusion to come to. As a previous poster said. He described Mctominay and Fred as 7/10 performers every week. If he believed that, it stands to reason he didn’t think that was an area that needed improving and it makes perfect sense because in his three years here he didn’t sign a central midfield player.
That is quite an exaggeration. He didn't insinuate that Bellingham could not be guaranteed minutes because of McFred.
Yeah Jesse lingard wasn’t a right winger and didn’t play right wing for United so not sure what relevance that has.Dan James was promised game-time or Dan James was given game-time because the other option was Jesse Lingard?
There's a big difference between asking a 22-year-old to play as a wide-forward (when he can be dropped at any time) and promising a guy who's just turned 17 that he's going to get significant minutes in the heart of your midfield.
It's very disappointing that we missed out on Bellingham, but I can see why any manager would have been wary of promising him significant game time (given that he also only had a single season in the Championship under his belt).
It's the same problem ten Hag is facing due to buying Casemiro, who doesn't have the legs to play as an 8. Add Bruno in the 8/10 role and its severely unbalanced.Aye, that's what I said, if he had at least tried to build a decent midfield he could have gone to that stage. He didn't, so trying to take that leap without having a midfield that was capable of controlling the game was a waste of time.