There's a first for everything but @Dumbstar was right.
Israel - Palestine Discussion | Post Respectfully | Discuss more, tweet less
- Thread starter esmufc07
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Would you stop. Israel backed Hamas because they're politically very useful to the Israeli regime.
You're right in saying that Israel left Gaza 20 years ago but they also put a complete blockade into place, denied them statehood, denied them the right to leave and periodically go back in to "mow the lawn".
It's really nice of Israel to allow Gazans out to work for Israel, further humiliating them.
Israel has never done the right thing in regards to Gaza and for you to say they have is insulting to anyone with a brain.
No, it is not human nature to subjugate an entire population, that is the nature of a fecking psycho.
Just coming at this from a technical angle, we know that Israel has incredibly accurate munitions, that can hit targets to within a couple of metres. We also know they have incredibly accurate surveillance/targeting equipment, that can accurately tell them exactly what person is where, at a given time.
If those 2 statements can be considered true, can you really say that the IDF haven't knowingly been killing civilians directly?
He's come back in here with a renewed zest for Israel, that's for sure.
I promised I won't comment earlier. Don't want @That_Bloke getting upset again, he's a very intelligent guy and I enjoy reading his stuff. A bit naive but I'm sure he won't be bit twice.
Do you genuinely believe anything this guy has said?
I give him some kudos for reeling in a couple of posters.
Reading back his woe us points and some of what others have rationalized EVERYTHING is justified because "poor me".
Schumer Urges New Leadership in Israel, Calling Netanyahu an Obstacle to Peace
https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/14/us/politics/schumer-netanyahu-israel-elections.html
You forgetting something? between the rockets falling and Israel "leaving" Gaza, a tiny detail.
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ahhh but but but but, ah..
disgusting people. What a punchable face.
He also said the Muslim Council of Britain are an extremist organisation under his new definition of extremism released today. Lovely bloke.
What Hamas did on Oct 7th, what Hezbollah is doing, what ISIS has been doing, what the Houthis are doing, what the Taliban are doing, what the numerous terrorist groups in Africa are doing ... ... ... well, sorry, but I can't see anything funny about all that.
There is an obvious pattern here, and the West should not bury their heads in the sand.
Mostly, yes. I'm sure there are soldiers who have been extremely trigger happy and don't care who they shoot. But I don't think the IDF as an organization planned to directly targett civilians.
Israeli settlers then continued to colonize the west bank, even when claiming not too.
Honestly, the misrepresentation is wild.
No, it did not start on October 7. And there are people who will say it did not start in 1948 either, but previously.
But what has October 7 achieved other than tell Israelis they have a major threat right next to them, which inevitably forced them to respond in order to try and remove that threat?
Yes, they did. They did not continue to colonize the Gaza strip, though. And Gaza then became a huge hub of terror and weapons.
The IDF has clearly attacked at times knowing civilians could and will be harmed, as Gaza is very densed and crowded, with Hamas terrorist assimilated within the general population, public infrastructure, etc.
I'd say it's not exactly like going into a town, kibbutz or party - where only civilians will be around - and start firing.
I'm not. My point is that while Israel has normally not done enough, whenever it did try to do something positive and correct - the reponse was more terror.
This is why Israelis have no faith in the peace proccess, in the Palestenians, in the two-state solution. And why after being shocked and horrored following October 7, a lof ot them want the threat removed and don't care about the cost.
The IDF had a very broad ROE at the beginning of the invasion, which they've been under pressure to tighten up.
https://www.jns.org/us-pressure-causes-israel-to-tighten-rules-of-engagement-report/
Throughout this period, I'm sure there have been many instances where individuals opened fire on Palestinians when they didn't need to, and weren't subsequently disciplined because they're at war. Its doubtful they will be punished after the fighting stops either.
Like I previous said, I can't win here.
I'm against 90% of what Israel did and has been doing, but if I try and explain my position about the other 10%, I'm portrayed as some sort of a blind Israel supporter.
Yeah, I agree with all that. It's 100% correct.
Because countries are led by idiots who don't learn from history. And in Israel's case, are led by idiots who are only interested in themselvews and their own sectors in society.
I get that Hamas are bad and have done atrocities too, just I get the context and understand why they were able to take power.
Because of the continued historical injustice.
Bring back imperialism
Yeah, I agree. And now what do we do about that?
Like I previously wrote - when Israel signed the Olso accords in the 90s, it was Hamas who responded by sending suicide bombers and killing hundreds of Israelis. So if trying to bring peace doesn't satisfy Hamas, what can we do?
Kind of hilarious seeing Israelis asking American politicians to stay out of their business when they have been meddling with American politics for decades through AIPAC.
Not to mention Netanyahu making a speech in congress over Obama's head.
After all we've seen, I'm sorry but that's just willful ignorance. They have been directly targeting civilians since the beginning. Just read about all the ngo workers leaving gaza and the stories they tell. It's a fact at this point.
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The politicians openly talk about it, the soldiers tik-tok and make a joke of it. The IDF is an army of terrorists led by terrorists.
Just today I read a UN report about how a AP journalist was intentionally targetted and killed by the IDF and how it's leadership lied about it afterwards. It's not a few rogue soldiers, it's systemic from the top to the bottom.
Maybe. We can all agree terrible things are being done, whether it comes as a direct order from the top or not.
Why don't you stop being beating around the bush and just say what you want to say?
It would probably get him banned.
Nearly 50 dead so far after the IOF opened fire on starving people again.
Here’s an excerpt I’ve edited together from Robert Fisk’s classic Pity the Nation where Fisk, having experienced the Israeli bombing of West Beirut, seeks out an Israeli Air Force commander for his thoughts on the process and consequences of the bombing campaign - https://jumpshare.com/s/ioejRyp2LsWiyOLxwImA
Did Israel expected that Palestinians would be satisfied with being handed 3% of the area of the occupied territories and quietly watch Israel colonize the rest?
Good god
Amalek, mate
I don't know if this is you just burying your head in the sand with your fingers in your ears, plain simple delusion or you're on the payroll but it's devoid of the truth and the reality on the ground. You're clearly not discussing this in good faith anymore.
We've had countless instances where IDF have intentionally targeted civilians.
We have genocidal rhetoric coming straight from members of your knesset.
You can't wave away 12,000 kid deaths and 11,000 women deaths.
The IDF are barbaric and worse terrorists than Hamas.