[Brightonian]

I think he's been ok, pretty much what we were expecting. He looks good next to Bruno and less good next to Casemiro. Obviously, because he's a specialist DM so he should play next to someone whose job is to progress the ball forwards, reducing the pressure on him to do it and letting him focus on defending and retaining possession.

Lyon wasn't his best game - missed a few tackles that usually he nails - but I'm still happy with him. Losing Fred and McT - two flawed #8s who various managers inexplicable thought could be played as #6s - and getting a proper defensive specialist instead is a good swap. We hadn't had someone who could actually provide a solid base since Carrick and it was getting silly.

 

[Mike Smalling]

With a really strong playmaker next to him, he would be an asset. Next to Casemiro we really lack ability in central midfield.

 

[Apokalips]

He is decent and not much more than was expected, but we shouldn't be spending such sums on players like this. He gets brought off at the hour mark in most games it seems and is a walking yellow card, while not offering much in possession. I think he would thrive in a team like Forest as opposed to a team that wants to control proceedings against good sides.

 

[LDUred]

I like him and he's a good addition but we did overpay and he shouldn't have been over 50 million. Berge for the money that was being bandied about was better value and had EPL experience. I can't understand why we didn't sign him, but I am still glad we have Ugarte as he is good defensively.

A Berge-Ugarte midfield would have been more complete.

 

[bgoodall]

He’s been amazing in my opinion. He provides a much needed level of aggressive play and composure defensively. Want to see him and Mainoo partner together more often now that the latter is healthy. They were really good in that Liverpool away match awhile back.

 

[PoTMS]

Problem is we keep paying £50m for £25m players. You can't just tell me it's United tax. We're not the only big club in the world, we've just been taken for a ride for the longest time.

 

[Regulus Arcturus Black]

Problem is we keep paying £50m for £25m players. You can't just tell me it's United tax. We're not the only big club in the world, we've just been taken for a ride for the longest time.

Not sure that holds up, as two clubs have now paid in excess of €50m for him.

We might have slightly overpaid but calling him a 25m player is pretty wrong, especially considering who we were buying from. Dorgu cost more than what you’re pretending Ugarte was worth.

 

[lex talionis]

Ugarte has been a solid addition to the squad but I feel like we should be getting better performances out of him. But he's been steady, which is more than we can say for most of the squad.

 

[Apokalips]

He’s been amazing in my opinion. He provides a much needed level of aggressive play and composure defensively. Want to see him and Mainoo partner together more often now that the latter is healthy. They were really good in that Liverpool away match awhile back.

I am confused at how someone can say he has been amazing when he averages 60 minutes per game? Surely amazing should be reserved for players that contribute greatly, not those that rarely complete games.

I know we have been starved of midfield talent but he has been a fraction of Casemiro's first season let alone anything that could be called amazing.

 

[sullydnl]

Definitely hasn't been amazing, but he has been decent. And signing a decent 24 year old in a problem position will likely prove to be a sound long-term buy, provided we don't decide to keep radically changing our supposed approach every few years.

But then I really don't think the fee is as big as some others seem to. It's a price-point a lot of B-list midfielders tend to go for, and that's what he is.

 

[Gandalf]

Definitely hasn't been amazing, but he has been decent. And signing a decent 24 year old in a problem position will likely prove to be a sound long-term buy, provided we don't decide to keep radically changing our supposed approach every few years.

But then I really don't think the fee is as big as some others seem to. It's a price-point a lot of B-list midfielders tend to go for, and that's what he is.

This is it exactly. Adding to that, B-List players are not going to make you better or worse on their own. He is a fine player who is not a liability and will be useful in a good side but is not going to take what is a fairly poor United side and make much difference on his own. If the team is playing better he will quietly go about his job and be a 7/10 most weeks and teams are built on having these players in the squad.

 

[Adnan]

I

He’s not even particularly dominant in his duels for a start, and his ability on the ball is inadequate really for a team that wants to play progressively. To me his strengths are pressing players, he’s decent at getting to a player higher up the pitch and nicking the ball or fouling them. But he’s often bypassed by decent players.

When he sits in and plays a more shielding role, like a typical DM, he’s non existent. He’s not got the ability or acceleration to cover areas and again is easily bypassed.

I think it’s been clear for quite a while that, the much complained about Casemiro, is actually still a far better player. The same Casemiro everyone is desperate to get rid of. That’s a problem. He has a little bit more mobility than him but that’s about it, and it’s not good enough.

All of this is why Casemiro is playing more than him, and why we have to sub him off to drop Bruno deeper every game to try to bring more quality into our play. He’s basically in there clog up the midfield for a bit until we’re ready to try to get on top of a game and go for the win, then we need to get him out of there.

I think you sum it up pretty well here.

Liverpool had two B grade midfielders (as someone else coined it) in Henderson and Wilnajdum. And both players were considerably better than Ugarte on the ball as far as passing the ball forward. Both players also provided a good level of defensive stability out of possession and were good all round midfielders who could contribute in all phases of play in a very attack minded approach.

We shouldn't be signing midfielders in the present day EPL who need to be carried in-possession. It's not difficult to sign a midfielder with a similar profile to Wilnaldum or Henderson who were both well rounded CMs. We're not asking for a Toni Kroos or Carrick but rather having a midfield composition where each component within that midfield contributes to all facets of the game.

If a team who harbours ambitions to win the league by beating out some of the best tactical minds in Europe you cannot have a midfielder who needs to be carried on the ball in the present day EPL.

 

[pocco]

I

I think you sum it up pretty well here.

Liverpool had two B grade midfielders (as someone else coined it) in Henderson and Wilnajdum. And both players were considerably better than Ugarte on the ball as far as passing the ball forward. Both players also provided a good level of defensive stability out of possession and were good all round midfielders who could contribute in all phases of play in a very attack minded approach.

We shouldn't be signing midfielders in the present day EPL who need to be carried in-possession. It's not difficult to sign a midfielder with a similar profile to Wilnaldum or Henderson who were both well rounded CMs. We're not asking for a Toni Kroos or Carrick but rather having a midfield composition where each component within that midfield contributes to all facets of the game.

If a team who harbours ambitions to win the league by beating out some of the best tactical minds in Europe you cannot have a midfielder who needs to be carried on the ball in the present day EPL.

Yeah I agree. It is a bit of a blemish against whoever was in charge of recruitment because the issues with his game were apparent. When a coach like Luis Enrique is ready to discard of him after one season, it should have had alarm bells ringing. I find it hard to believe that this conversation wasn’t had when we were looking at him. And I’m not being funny but even I could see the issues after one or two games, with how he goes hunting the ball and doesn’t actually protect well - which was a bigger issue under ETH after the season of basically having no midfield.

That Liverpool midfield gets a lot of stick on here but, as you said, both were miles better. In fact I don’t think I’d have Ugarte ahead of either in any aspect of the game. I felt both were more mobile, more robust in the tackle, and obviously far better on the ball too. To me even Casemiro feels like Paul Scholes compared to Ugarte.

It’s a big issue and one that needs sorting, but my fear is that we won’t touch the midfield this summer. Having spent big on Ugarte and having Casemiro refusing to leave, along with the option of a Bruno in there, I reckon we’ll ride it out a bit longer. I still can’t really make up my mind on Bruno and where I’d rather have him, but I think next season he’ll have to be considered as one of the midfield two, especially if we sign another no10.

 

[Bebe]

He's been fine, particularly considering this is his first year in the league and he doesn't have a real midfield partner. Solid building block, but probably someone we'd be looking to upgrade if we get back to a place where we're seriously competing for the league and CL.

 

[tomaldinho1]

Yeah he's been fine. Seems some folk are expecting him to win every challenge he goes for and ping the ball around like Kroos as well. He's not amazing, but we're not in a position for the best players to want to play for us at the moment.

It’s genuinely weird. But then looking at how some remember the game as if Lyon didn’t have the better chances seems like people just see what they want to see these days. He broke up play and stopped many counters, that’s really his primary job.

I think there’s a legitimate argument that him and Case are way too defensive as a pair (really seems overkill unless we’re at Anfield or similar) but he was decent.

 

[OverratedOpinion]

I think there’s a legitimate argument that him and Case are way too defensive as a pair (really seems overkill unless we’re at Anfield or similar) but he was decent.

It works alright when Casemiro has his excellent passing range. That only seems to show up 1 in every 2 matches at the moment.

 

[tomaldinho1]

It works alright when Casemiro has his excellent passing range. That only seems to show up 1 in every 2 matches at the moment.

I think that quite generous to Case.

 

[Adnan]

Yeah I agree. It is a bit of a blemish against whoever was in charge of recruitment because the issues with his game were apparent. When a coach like Luis Enrique is ready to discard of him after one season, it should have had alarm bells ringing. I find it hard to believe that this conversation wasn’t had when we were looking at him. And I’m not being funny but even I could see the issues after one or two games, with how he goes hunting the ball and doesn’t actually protect well - which was a bigger issue under ETH after the season of basically having no midfield.

That Liverpool midfield gets a lot of stick on here but, as you said, both were miles better. In fact I don’t think I’d have Ugarte ahead of either in any aspect of the game. I felt both were more mobile, more robust in the tackle, and obviously far better on the ball too. To me even Casemiro feels like Paul Scholes compared to Ugarte.

It’s a big issue and one that needs sorting, but my fear is that we won’t touch the midfield this summer. Having spent big on Ugarte and having Casemiro refusing to leave, along with the option of a Bruno in there, I reckon we’ll ride it out a bit longer. I still can’t really make up my mind on Bruno and where I’d rather have him, but I think next season he’ll have to be considered as one of the midfield two, especially if we sign another no10.

The reason Luis Enrique didn't want him was because he was limited in-possession. Any coach that wants to dominate the game starts by prioritising players who can first contribute at a good level in-possession. And that goes for any coach who wants to implement a attacking system which requires a good level of vertical passes/forward passing without sacrificing too much by the way of pass completion. I remember Wilnaldum at Liverpool had games where he'd have a 98% pass completion rate with over 86% of those passes being forward passes. And then he also had the pace and athleticism to be a key contributer out of possession which you have correctly pointed out in your posts.

We're not asking for Toni Kroos or Michael Carrick. We can't even manage to to get players like Wijnaldum or Henderson who provide good all-round box to box qualities. Why is it difficult to sign a midfielder who not only provides good defensive attributes but can also contribute in a positive way on the ball? This shouldn't be difficult and it seems we've completed ignored the player's in-possession deficiencies for what he (Ugarte) can potentially provide out of possession. And as you outlined in one of your posts, his game even in that phase becomes vulnerable when the space opens up and he comes up against players who can really hurt you in transition.

I'm hoping we sign a new midfielder with the qualities we're missing in midfield. Something that should've happened instead of signing Ugarte. And then my hope is that one of the youngsters really threatens Ugarte's position in the team in the coming seasons. Someone like Sekou Kone along with a more established central midfielder with the technical and physical level would be a possible way to rebuild the team to play a more dominant brand of football.

 

[Bobski]

One of problems with Ugarte in terms of squad composition is Mainoo, really hard to see how they work as a pair, not enough passing range there, which will mean Bruno having to drop deeper and deeper or Mainoo being switched to a more attacking role which he doesn't really have the running power for.

Mainoo needs to come back next season having taken steps forward physically and expanding his passing range.

 

[Bobski]

I still don't see it with him. He is combative and makes a high volume of defensive actions but also gets bypassed fairly easily at times. His inability to pass forward is a problem despite what people want to think, he can't progress the play and that was a part in 2 goals today.

And while energetic and reasonably mobile he is not a high level athlete.

 

[Godfather]

Getting worse and worse

 

[DWelbz19]

I’d be looking to move him on as soon as possible to retain transfer value.

 

[Based Adnan]

Such an obviously poor signing at the time. I pray for the day we stop signing midfielders incapable of playing with the ball.

 

[Leftback99]

I’d be looking to move him on as soon as possible to retain transfer value.

No one will pay anywhere near what we did. Such a limited player which was obvious in the summer.

 

[#07]

Ugarte simply doesn't want any responsibility for progressing play. He's basically a Uruguayan David Batty. He will rat around midfield but as soon as he wins it he wants a five yard option. He has the capability for more but he just does not want to do more. It's not enough. You can see why PSG got rid.

 

[FrankDrebin]

He occasionally does some nice little nimble footed moves but overall he's not exactly been this amazing, all conquering DM that he was hyped up to be.

It is amusing now seeing him constantly dismiss a forward passing opportunity. Sideways or back, that's generally his range.

 

[Bobski]

Ugarte simply doesn't want any responsibility for progressing play. He's basically a Uruguayan David Batty. He will rat around midfield but as soon as he wins it he wants a five yard option. He has the capability for more but he just does not want to do more. It's not enough. You can see why PSG got rid.

He has played some nice forward passes but they tend to be when he has a lot of time and space to assess his options and think about his technique. When he has to do it quickly the execution is not good.

 

[FrankDrebin]

Such an obviously poor signing at the time. I pray for the day we stop signing midfielders incapable of playing with the ball.

What was he ? 50 million ? It really is quite embarrassing.

 

[OverratedOpinion]

I wish he'd stop chewing gum whilst playing football.

 

[The Hilton]

Playing by himself in midfield again, showed his good ability in tight spaces, I think there's a solid system player there despite his progressive passing shortcomings but it doesn't work when none of his teammates can progress the ball either.

 

[LukeTheRed]

Until he has an athletic box to box player besides him I reserve judgement on him.

I think 95% midfielders would look rubbish in our setup.

 

[Valencia Shin Crosses]

Was so obviously a stupid target as our priority signing. He’s average as a dueler, and basically is Fred without the moments of brilliance. Gives you absolutely nothing in possession while being sneakily average out of possession. So we got rid of Fred and replaced him with a younger/worse Fred.

Awesome.

 

[Cassidy]

Until he has an athletic box to box player besides him I reserve judgement on him.

I think 95% midfielders would look rubbish in our setup.

He is one of the reasons 95% of midfielders would like rubbish in our side

 

[Ezkay]

Until he has an athletic box to box player besides him I reserve judgement on him.

I think 95% midfielders would look rubbish in our setup.

What a bizarre excuse. If you was making it for Pogba then fine I'd understand but Ugarte is one of the most talentless footballers I've ever seen in my life. The only move he has in his arsenal is to kick opposition shin at every opportunity

 

[flappyjay]

Was so obviously a stupid target as our priority signing. He’s average as a dueler, and basically is Fred without the moments of brilliance. Gives you absolutely nothing in possession while being sneakily average out of possession. So we got rid of Fred and replaced him with a younger/worse Fred.

Awesome.

It amazes how fans in this forum called out his ability on the ball before he was signed him. Then our club went ahead and got him for out technically inept squad.

 

[Lay]

We should have just kept Fred

 

[DWelbz19]

Until he has an athletic box to box player besides him I reserve judgement on him.

I think 95% midfielders would look rubbish in our setup.

Wasn’t he meant to be the athletic box to box player? He’s played beside Fernandes plenty and looked the same.

 

[Apokalips]

It amazes how fans in this forum called out his ability on the ball before he was signed him. Then our club went ahead and got him for out technically inept squad.

We continually sign players with concerns vital to their position, it's a joke.

 

[Bobski]

Wasn’t he meant to be the athletic box to box player? He’s played beside Fernandes plenty and looked the same.

The thing is you need a dedicated DM to to the smart defensive work, Ugarte is a ball chaser, it leads to plenty of stats but it not that effective defensively from what we have seen so far, but then you also need that DM to be good on the ball and the 3rd midfielder to drop in and help in that as well.

Players who need specific types around them to bring the best out of them have rarely been worth the trouble for Utd.

 

[MadDogg]

Was so obviously a stupid target as our priority signing. He’s average as a dueler, and basically is Fred without the moments of brilliance. Gives you absolutely nothing in possession while being sneakily average out of possession. So we got rid of Fred and replaced him with a younger/worse Fred.

Awesome.

Ugarte is a better pure defensive DM than Fred as he holds his position a bit more and I'm pretty sure wins more of his challenges. Fred comfortably provided more on the ball though, which is something he always got underrated on due to him also being good for a couple of horror passes a game. But there was a reason that even despite those couple of horror passes, Fred was used as our main playmaker out from the back for most of his time here. It wasn't his strongest position, but he was still better at it than our other options he played next to. From what we've seen so far Ugarte definitely doesn't have that in him as he really struggles to pass it forward.