Thomas Tuchel | Gone to & from Bayern (In Summer)

Mb194dc

Full Member
Joined
Dec 8, 2015
Messages
4,666
Supports
Chelsea
jderbyshire said:
I'm intrigued by this... Can you elaborate?
Click to expand...
It's hard to substantiate as no decent public sources apart from Twitter randoms and the odd shady article.

Definitely smoke with fire though I think.

He lost the dressing room due to his personal life and the rumours are it involved Werner's missus.

My guess is eventually the full story will come out.
 

Valencia Shin Crosses

Full Member
Joined
Sep 30, 2015
Messages
6,787
Location
"Martial...He's isolated Skrtel here..."
Mb194dc said:
It's hard to substantiate as no decent public sources apart from Twitter randoms and the odd shady article.

Definitely smoke with fire though I think.

He lost the dressing room due to his personal life and the rumours are it involved Werner's missus.

My guess is eventually the full story will come out.
Click to expand...
Honestly my experience with many of these things is that when you get enough random twitter/message board people insinuating stuff like this it tends to be rooted in truth. Hard to explain but it's I can clearly differentiate the BS rumors with those that might have some credibility.
 

rimaldo

All about the essence
Joined
Jan 10, 2008
Messages
40,965
Supports
arse
Mb194dc said:
It's hard to substantiate as no decent public sources apart from Twitter randoms and the odd shady article.

Definitely smoke with fire though I think.

He lost the dressing room due to his personal life and the rumours are it involved Werner's missus.

My guess is eventually the full story will come out.
Click to expand...
i heard he kept setting up christmas markets in the car park of chelsea’s cobham training ground.
 

Rojofiam

Full Member
Joined
May 11, 2017
Messages
3,417
He's a good manager but not as good as most of you claimed he was after the CL victory with Chelsea and a few wins in succession against Pep. He's also not as bad as most of you make it out right now, 3 years later.

Typical fickleness of football fans. Tuchel's reputation on here changed from "Pep and Klopp's rival" to "absolute fraud" in a very short amount of time, even though the Chelsea sacking wasn't fair and Bayern aren't doing as bad as you think, it's just Leverkusen doing an almost flawless league campaign with one of the best upcoming managers in charge.

He wouldn't be my first choice for United, but he wouldn't be the worst choice either. Far from it.
 

Rojofiam

Full Member
Joined
May 11, 2017
Messages
3,417
Mb194dc said:
It's hard to substantiate as no decent public sources apart from Twitter randoms and the odd shady article.

Definitely smoke with fire though I think.

He lost the dressing room due to his personal life and the rumours are it involved Werner's missus.

My guess is eventually the full story will come out.
Click to expand...
Is this similar to Zaha sleeping with Moyes' daughter or is there actually truth to this?
 

Hugh Jass

Shave Dass
Joined
Apr 16, 2016
Messages
11,298
Rojofiam said:
He's a good manager but not as good as most of you claimed he was after the CL victory with Chelsea and a few wins in succession against Pep. He's also not as bad as most of you make it out right now, 3 years later.

Typical fickleness of football fans. Tuchel's reputation on here changed from "Pep and Klopp's rival" to "absolute fraud" in a very short amount of time, even though the Chelsea sacking wasn't fair and Bayern aren't doing as bad as you think, it's just Leverkusen doing an almost flawless league campaign with one of the best upcoming managers in charge.

He wouldn't be my first choice for United, but he wouldn't be the worst choice either. Far from it.
Click to expand...
Yea same here.
 

Big Ben Foster

Correctly predicted Portugal to win Euro 2016
Joined
Mar 19, 2008
Messages
12,796
Location
BR -> MI -> TX
Supports
Also support Vasco da Gama
Rojofiam said:
He's a good manager but not as good as most of you claimed he was after the CL victory with Chelsea and a few wins in succession against Pep. He's also not as bad as most of you make it out right now, 3 years later.

Typical fickleness of football fans. Tuchel's reputation on here changed from "Pep and Klopp's rival" to "absolute fraud" in a very short amount of time, even though the Chelsea sacking wasn't fair and Bayern aren't doing as bad as you think, it's just Leverkusen doing an almost flawless league campaign with one of the best upcoming managers in charge.

He wouldn't be my first choice for United, but he wouldn't be the worst choice either. Far from it.
Click to expand...
IMO most of the (valid) concerns being brought up are more around personality and his propensity to fall out with everyone he works with, rather than coaching ability.
 

jderbyshire

Has anybody seen my fleshlight?
Joined
May 2, 2007
Messages
4,187
Mb194dc said:
It's hard to substantiate as no decent public sources apart from Twitter randoms and the odd shady article.

Definitely smoke with fire though I think.

He lost the dressing room due to his personal life and the rumours are it involved Werner's missus.

My guess is eventually the full story will come out.
Click to expand...
Hmmm... Interesting. Cheers!
 

Rojofiam

Full Member
Joined
May 11, 2017
Messages
3,417
Big Ben Foster said:
IMO most of the (valid) concerns being brought up are more around personality and his propensity to fall out with everyone he works with, rather than coaching ability.
Click to expand...
That's completely fair and makes him a risky appointment for anyone.

I personally wouldn't blame him for how his PSG and Chelsea tenures ended, though. Clowns in charge that don't know much about running a football club. Falling out with the likes of El-Khelaifi and Boehly are probably plus points on his CV for me. :lol:
 

TheMagicFoolBus

Full Member
Joined
Nov 5, 2016
Messages
6,598
Location
Lisboa, Portugal
Supports
Chelsea
Mb194dc said:
It's hard to substantiate as no decent public sources apart from Twitter randoms and the odd shady article.

Definitely smoke with fire though I think.

He lost the dressing room due to his personal life and the rumours are it involved Werner's missus.

My guess is eventually the full story will come out.
Click to expand...
All of this is absolute nonsense mate. He got divorced, end of story.
 

ForeverRed1

Full Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2013
Messages
5,483
Location
England UK!
Rojofiam said:
He's a good manager but not as good as most of you claimed he was after the CL victory with Chelsea and a few wins in succession against Pep. He's also not as bad as most of you make it out right now, 3 years later.

Typical fickleness of football fans. Tuchel's reputation on here changed from "Pep and Klopp's rival" to "absolute fraud" in a very short amount of time, even though the Chelsea sacking wasn't fair and Bayern aren't doing as bad as you think, it's just Leverkusen doing an almost flawless league campaign with one of the best upcoming managers in charge.

He wouldn't be my first choice for United, but he wouldn't be the worst choice either. Far from it.
Click to expand...
You can be excused for thinking that after winning the champions league with Chelsea, with the team they had might make a manager pretty decent.

he’s definatly been found out though. I really wouldn’t want him here, we’re trying to lose the toxic culture
 

frostbite

Full Member
Joined
Jun 28, 2021
Messages
3,246
Such a bad decision by Bayern to announce that he is sacked ... in the summer! Either sack him right now and get someone else for a few months, or just wait till the summer and announce his departure then. What do they gain from announcing this now? It is ineptitude! INEOS proved to be much smarter, they don't say anything about ETH.

(Obviously, the situation with Klopp is completely different. Or SAF back in the day. )
 

Hound Dog

Full Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2011
Messages
3,211
Location
Belgrade, Serbia
Supports
Whoever I bet on
Rojofiam said:
Typical fickleness of football fans. Tuchel's reputation on here changed from "Pep and Klopp's rival" to "absolute fraud" in a very short amount of time, even though the Chelsea sacking wasn't fair and Bayern aren't doing as bad as you think, it's just Leverkusen doing an almost flawless league campaign with one of the best upcoming managers in charge.
Click to expand...
Bayern are shocking and their point tally flatters them massively given their performances.
 

Pyrite

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Feb 26, 2024
Messages
15
Tuchel's problem is simply that his entire career is a lie.

In his previous clubs, he appeared to be a good tactician, but he had two important factors on his side that made him look way better than he actually is:

Field generals on the pitch: At Dortmund, he had Hummels and Gündogan. In PSG, he was lucky to have Verratti, Neymar and Thiago Silva. Same with Chelsea, where he benefitted from Silva (again), Azpilicueta, Jorginho AND Kanté. Some of them were amazing passers/creators and some were great defensively, but they all shared an extremely high level of football IQ and leadership qualities. They could coach their teammates without requiring Tuchel to micromanage them or come up with highly sophisticated tactics. At Bayern, Müller and de Ligt are the closest thing to field generals, but the former is too old and slow while not being "silky" enough as far as Tuchel is concerned, while de Ligt is also "too slow" and pretty injury prone.

Benjamin Weber: Believe it or not, this guy was the real brains behind Tuchel, even more so than his field generals. Just think about Tuchel's apparent greatest strengths: he was very flexible and reacted pretty quickly to what was happening on the pitch; moreover, his game plans/preparations in big games were usually extremely successful. Statisticians and video analysts have something to do with them, don't they? Fittingly enough, Benjamin Weber was his video analyst starting from his Mainz career all the way until he got sacked by Chelsea.

He coasted on these guys' talent and hard work throughout his entire career, shamelessly stealing credit from them like Gilderoy Lockhart from Harry Potter. And since he's a charismatic extrovert with a silver tongue, he knew how to compile their ideas into cool soundbytes to parrot the content to sound like a dashing genius instead of the utter fraud he is. That's why he still enjoys the reputation of being a highly intelligent and competent coach in footballing circles.

Being a man of limited ability and intelligence, he doesn't like it when he's called out on his BS either. Back in Dortmund, he ran the highly data-driven scout Sven Mislintat out of town because he found his scouting methods too technocratic. Mislintat made heavy use of stats and data when scouting players while Tuchel was in favor of divining their attitude from their video footages. Guess whose methods are better? Mislintat's work at Stuttgart, a club infamous for being a hopeless case, is finally getting results, with talented players bought for reasonable prices being coached by a talented manager. On the other hand, Tuchel almost always wants one-dimensional physical beasts, pace/flair merchants or mediocre old players just because they're "experienced".

At Bayern, he has Müller and de Ligt, but he prefers physically more gifted players than them, and doesn't appreciate their intelligence and opinionated personalities. That's why he always loses the respect of his players soon, because he's highly dependent on field generals to succeed, but it's only a matter of time before he's called out on his incompetence and stupidity by them.

Not only that, but he's also morally bankrupt. Back in Dortmund, he actually did want to play the Monaco tie right after the bus attack, but he then turned out and claimed he didn't but Watzke forced his hand to play the tie to save his own ass and paint Watzke as a monster at the same time. He even said "Am I supposed to beat Bayern with these wimps?" all the while being the biggest wimp of all by throwing others under the bus for his own misdeeds. Sure, Pit Gottschalk isn't known as a pillar of accurate reporting, but why would someone risk going to court and have his reputation utterly ruined by lying?

Not to mention he believes in ayurveda. Far be it from me to judge the personal spiritual beliefs of others, but ayurveda isn't just spirituality, it's a medical doctrine. It's nothing short of screwed up that someone responsible for the health, safety and performance of give-or-take 20 players actually believes in unscientific quack medicine that he probably doesn't bat an eye on having used on his players. If there's any sense left in society, such a person forfeits the right to practice his job and has his coaching license torn apart.

He embodies the currently popular fake-it-till-you-make-it culture, just like Elizabeth Holmes and Sam Bankman-Fried.
 
Last edited:

stefan92

Full Member
Joined
Feb 9, 2021
Messages
6,435
Supports
Hannover 96
Pyrite said:
Tuchel's problem is simply that his entire career is a lie.

In his previous clubs, he appeared to be a good tactician, but he had two important factors on his side that made him look way better than he actually is:

Field generals on the pitch: At Dortmund, he had Hummels and Gündogan. In PSG, he was lucky to have Verratti, Neymar and Thiago Silva. Same with Chelsea, where he benefitted from Silva (again), Azpilicueta, Jorginho AND Kanté. Some of them were amazing passers/creators and some were great defensively, but they all shared an extremely high level of football IQ and leadership qualities. They could coach their teammates without requiring Tuchel to micromanage them or come up with highly sophisticated tactics. At Bayern, Müller and de Ligt are the closest thing to field generals, but the former is too old and slow while not being "silky" enough as far as Tuchel is concerned, while de Ligt is also "too slow" and pretty injury prone.

Benjamin Weber: Believe it or not, this guy was the real brains behind Tuchel, even more so than his field generals. Just think about Tuchel's apparent greatest strengths: he was very flexible and reacted pretty quickly to what was happening on the pitch; moreover, his game plans/preparations in big games were usually extremely successful. Statisticians and video analysts have something to do with them, don't they? Fittingly enough, Benjamin Weber was his video analyst starting from his Mainz career all the way until he got sacked by Chelsea.

He coasted on these guys' talent and hard work throughout his entire career, shamelessly stealing credit from them like Gilderoy Lockhart from Harry Potter. And since he's a charismatic extrovert with a silver tongue, he knew how to compile their ideas into cool soundbytes to parrot the content to sound like a dashing genius instead of the utter fraud he is. That's why he still enjoys the reputation of being a highly intelligent and competent coach in footballing circles.

Being a man of limited ability and intelligence, he doesn't like it when he's called out on his BS either. Back in Dortmund, he ran the highly data-driven scout Sven Mislintat out of town because he found his scouting methods too technocratic. Mislintat made heavy use of stats and data when scouting players while Tuchel was in favor of divining their attitude from their video footages. Guess whose methods are better? Mislintat's work at Stuttgart, a club infamous for being a hopeless case, is finally getting results, with talented players bought for reasonable prices being coached by a talented manager. On the other hand, Tuchel almost always wants one-dimensional physical beasts, pace/flair merchants or mediocre old players just because they're "experienced".

At Bayern, he has Müller and de Ligt, but he prefers physically more gifted players than them, and doesn't appreciate their intelligence and opinionated personalities. That's why he always loses the respect of his players soon, because he's highly dependent on field generals to succeed, but it's only a matter of time before he's called out on his incompetence and stupidity by them.

Not only that, but he's also morally bankrupt. Back in Dortmund, he actually did want to play the Monaco tie right after the bus attack, but he then turned out and claimed he didn't but Watzke forced his hand to play the tie to save his own ass and paint Watzke as a monster at the same time. He even said "Am I supposed to beat Bayern with these wimps?" all the while being the biggest wimp of all by throwing others under the bus for his own misdeeds. Sure, Pit Gottschalk isn't known as a pillar of accurate reporting, but why would someone risk going to court and have his reputation utterly ruined by lying?

Not to mention he believes in ayurveda. Far be it from me to judge the personal spiritual beliefs of others, but ayurveda isn't just spirituality, it's a medical doctrine. It's nothing short of screwed up that someone responsible for the health, safety and performance of give-or-take 20 players actually believes in unscientific quack medicine that he probably doesn't bat an eye on having used on his players. If there's any sense left in society, such a person forfeits the right to practice his job and has his coaching license torn apart.
Click to expand...
What an amazing drivel. Really impressive how you can bend the truth in several aspects. Like for example, he didn't ran Mislintat out of Dortmund, in fact Mislintat stayed longer there than Tuchel. Still they apparently once clashed over a player, but that didn't stop them from working together. Also keep in mind that neither Tuchel nor Mislintat actually signed the players there but Zorc did, so that was at least a three way issue.
 

TheMagicFoolBus

Full Member
Joined
Nov 5, 2016
Messages
6,598
Location
Lisboa, Portugal
Supports
Chelsea
Pyrite said:
Tuchel's problem is simply that his entire career is a lie.

In his previous clubs, he appeared to be a good tactician, but he had two important factors on his side that made him look way better than he actually is:

Field generals on the pitch: At Dortmund, he had Hummels and Gündogan. In PSG, he was lucky to have Verratti, Neymar and Thiago Silva. Same with Chelsea, where he benefitted from Silva (again), Azpilicueta, Jorginho AND Kanté. Some of them were amazing passers/creators and some were great defensively, but they all shared an extremely high level of football IQ and leadership qualities. They could coach their teammates without requiring Tuchel to micromanage them or come up with highly sophisticated tactics. At Bayern, Müller and de Ligt are the closest thing to field generals, but the former is too old and slow while not being "silky" enough as far as Tuchel is concerned, while de Ligt is also "too slow" and pretty injury prone.

Benjamin Weber: Believe it or not, this guy was the real brains behind Tuchel, even more so than his field generals. Just think about Tuchel's apparent greatest strengths: he was very flexible and reacted pretty quickly to what was happening on the pitch; moreover, his game plans/preparations in big games were usually extremely successful. Statisticians and video analysts have something to do with them, don't they? Fittingly enough, Benjamin Weber was his video analyst starting from his Mainz career all the way until he got sacked by Chelsea.

He coasted on these guys' talent and hard work throughout his entire career, shamelessly stealing credit from them like Gilderoy Lockhart from Harry Potter. And since he's a charismatic extrovert with a silver tongue, he knew how to compile their ideas into cool soundbytes to parrot the content to sound like a dashing genius instead of the utter fraud he is. That's why he still enjoys the reputation of being a highly intelligent and competent coach in footballing circles.

Being a man of limited ability and intelligence, he doesn't like it when he's called out on his BS either. Back in Dortmund, he ran the highly data-driven scout Sven Mislintat out of town because he found his scouting methods too technocratic. Mislintat made heavy use of stats and data when scouting players while Tuchel was in favor of divining their attitude from their video footages. Guess whose methods are better? Mislintat's work at Stuttgart, a club infamous for being a hopeless case, is finally getting results, with talented players bought for reasonable prices being coached by a talented manager. On the other hand, Tuchel almost always wants one-dimensional physical beasts, pace/flair merchants or mediocre old players just because they're "experienced".

At Bayern, he has Müller and de Ligt, but he prefers physically more gifted players than them, and doesn't appreciate their intelligence and opinionated personalities. That's why he always loses the respect of his players soon, because he's highly dependent on field generals to succeed, but it's only a matter of time before he's called out on his incompetence and stupidity by them.

Not only that, but he's also morally bankrupt. Back in Dortmund, he actually did want to play the Monaco tie right after the bus attack, but he then turned out and claimed he didn't but Watzke forced his hand to play the tie to save his own ass and paint Watzke as a monster at the same time. He even said "Am I supposed to beat Bayern with these wimps?" all the while being the biggest wimp of all by throwing others under the bus for his own misdeeds. Sure, Pit Gottschalk isn't known as a pillar of accurate reporting, but why would someone risk going to court and have his reputation utterly ruined by lying?

Not to mention he believes in ayurveda. Far be it from me to judge the personal spiritual beliefs of others, but ayurveda isn't just spirituality, it's a medical doctrine. It's nothing short of screwed up that someone responsible for the health, safety and performance of give-or-take 20 players actually believes in unscientific quack medicine that he probably doesn't bat an eye on having used on his players. If there's any sense left in society, such a person forfeits the right to practice his job and has his coaching license torn apart.

He embodies the currently popular fake-it-till-you-make-it culture, just like Elizabeth Holmes and Sam Bankman-Fried.
Click to expand...
Wow, guess we've found Tuchel's ex-wife's Caf account
 

Dr Foo

Full Member
Joined
Jan 10, 2016
Messages
333
Location
Singapore
Pyrite said:
Tuchel's problem is simply that his entire career is a lie.

In his previous clubs, he appeared to be a good tactician, but he had two important factors on his side that made him look way better than he actually is:

Field generals on the pitch: At Dortmund, he had Hummels and Gündogan. In PSG, he was lucky to have Verratti, Neymar and Thiago Silva. Same with Chelsea, where he benefitted from Silva (again), Azpilicueta, Jorginho AND Kanté. Some of them were amazing passers/creators and some were great defensively, but they all shared an extremely high level of football IQ and leadership qualities. They could coach their teammates without requiring Tuchel to micromanage them or come up with highly sophisticated tactics. At Bayern, Müller and de Ligt are the closest thing to field generals, but the former is too old and slow while not being "silky" enough as far as Tuchel is concerned, while de Ligt is also "too slow" and pretty injury prone.

Benjamin Weber: Believe it or not, this guy was the real brains behind Tuchel, even more so than his field generals. Just think about Tuchel's apparent greatest strengths: he was very flexible and reacted pretty quickly to what was happening on the pitch; moreover, his game plans/preparations in big games were usually extremely successful. Statisticians and video analysts have something to do with them, don't they? Fittingly enough, Benjamin Weber was his video analyst starting from his Mainz career all the way until he got sacked by Chelsea.

He coasted on these guys' talent and hard work throughout his entire career, shamelessly stealing credit from them like Gilderoy Lockhart from Harry Potter. And since he's a charismatic extrovert with a silver tongue, he knew how to compile their ideas into cool soundbytes to parrot the content to sound like a dashing genius instead of the utter fraud he is. That's why he still enjoys the reputation of being a highly intelligent and competent coach in footballing circles.

Being a man of limited ability and intelligence, he doesn't like it when he's called out on his BS either. Back in Dortmund, he ran the highly data-driven scout Sven Mislintat out of town because he found his scouting methods too technocratic. Mislintat made heavy use of stats and data when scouting players while Tuchel was in favor of divining their attitude from their video footages. Guess whose methods are better? Mislintat's work at Stuttgart, a club infamous for being a hopeless case, is finally getting results, with talented players bought for reasonable prices being coached by a talented manager. On the other hand, Tuchel almost always wants one-dimensional physical beasts, pace/flair merchants or mediocre old players just because they're "experienced".

At Bayern, he has Müller and de Ligt, but he prefers physically more gifted players than them, and doesn't appreciate their intelligence and opinionated personalities. That's why he always loses the respect of his players soon, because he's highly dependent on field generals to succeed, but it's only a matter of time before he's called out on his incompetence and stupidity by them.

Not only that, but he's also morally bankrupt. Back in Dortmund, he actually did want to play the Monaco tie right after the bus attack, but he then turned out and claimed he didn't but Watzke forced his hand to play the tie to save his own ass and paint Watzke as a monster at the same time. He even said "Am I supposed to beat Bayern with these wimps?" all the while being the biggest wimp of all by throwing others under the bus for his own misdeeds. Sure, Pit Gottschalk isn't known as a pillar of accurate reporting, but why would someone risk going to court and have his reputation utterly ruined by lying?

Not to mention he believes in ayurveda. Far be it from me to judge the personal spiritual beliefs of others, but ayurveda isn't just spirituality, it's a medical doctrine. It's nothing short of screwed up that someone responsible for the health, safety and performance of give-or-take 20 players actually believes in unscientific quack medicine that he probably doesn't bat an eye on having used on his players. If there's any sense left in society, such a person forfeits the right to practice his job and has his coaching license torn apart.

He embodies the currently popular fake-it-till-you-make-it culture, just like Elizabeth Holmes and Sam Bankman-Fried.
Click to expand...
Did he actually use Ayurveda on his players or just himself? And this is a plus in my book. Different cultures have developed their own methods of medicine over centuries, even if some aspects are not scientifically proven in the west, they have been proven to work on their people and cultures, e.g Ayurveda or TCM. Do you count yoga as scientifically proven? Might be useful to keep an open mind, though going by your tone, these details don’t matter other than to nail your target
 

Marcelinho87

Full Member
Joined
Aug 4, 2010
Messages
7,232
Location
Barnsley
soapythecat said:
Pretty worrying that both Tommy here and Potter are most likely going to be free agents this Summer. I hope INEOS have a better plan than these two to replace ETH.
Click to expand...
I like to think Potter has been vindicated a little considering how the Caf darling Poch is doing in Chelsea.
 

DWelbz19

Correctly predicted Portugal to win Euro 2016
Joined
Oct 31, 2012
Messages
34,044
Pyrite said:
Tuchel's problem is simply that his entire career is a lie.

In his previous clubs, he appeared to be a good tactician, but he had two important factors on his side that made him look way better than he actually is:

Field generals on the pitch: At Dortmund, he had Hummels and Gündogan. In PSG, he was lucky to have Verratti, Neymar and Thiago Silva. Same with Chelsea, where he benefitted from Silva (again), Azpilicueta, Jorginho AND Kanté. Some of them were amazing passers/creators and some were great defensively, but they all shared an extremely high level of football IQ and leadership qualities. They could coach their teammates without requiring Tuchel to micromanage them or come up with highly sophisticated tactics. At Bayern, Müller and de Ligt are the closest thing to field generals, but the former is too old and slow while not being "silky" enough as far as Tuchel is concerned, while de Ligt is also "too slow" and pretty injury prone.

Benjamin Weber: Believe it or not, this guy was the real brains behind Tuchel, even more so than his field generals. Just think about Tuchel's apparent greatest strengths: he was very flexible and reacted pretty quickly to what was happening on the pitch; moreover, his game plans/preparations in big games were usually extremely successful. Statisticians and video analysts have something to do with them, don't they? Fittingly enough, Benjamin Weber was his video analyst starting from his Mainz career all the way until he got sacked by Chelsea.

He coasted on these guys' talent and hard work throughout his entire career, shamelessly stealing credit from them like Gilderoy Lockhart from Harry Potter. And since he's a charismatic extrovert with a silver tongue, he knew how to compile their ideas into cool soundbytes to parrot the content to sound like a dashing genius instead of the utter fraud he is. That's why he still enjoys the reputation of being a highly intelligent and competent coach in footballing circles.

Being a man of limited ability and intelligence, he doesn't like it when he's called out on his BS either. Back in Dortmund, he ran the highly data-driven scout Sven Mislintat out of town because he found his scouting methods too technocratic. Mislintat made heavy use of stats and data when scouting players while Tuchel was in favor of divining their attitude from their video footages. Guess whose methods are better? Mislintat's work at Stuttgart, a club infamous for being a hopeless case, is finally getting results, with talented players bought for reasonable prices being coached by a talented manager. On the other hand, Tuchel almost always wants one-dimensional physical beasts, pace/flair merchants or mediocre old players just because they're "experienced".

At Bayern, he has Müller and de Ligt, but he prefers physically more gifted players than them, and doesn't appreciate their intelligence and opinionated personalities. That's why he always loses the respect of his players soon, because he's highly dependent on field generals to succeed, but it's only a matter of time before he's called out on his incompetence and stupidity by them.

Not only that, but he's also morally bankrupt. Back in Dortmund, he actually did want to play the Monaco tie right after the bus attack, but he then turned out and claimed he didn't but Watzke forced his hand to play the tie to save his own ass and paint Watzke as a monster at the same time. He even said "Am I supposed to beat Bayern with these wimps?" all the while being the biggest wimp of all by throwing others under the bus for his own misdeeds. Sure, Pit Gottschalk isn't known as a pillar of accurate reporting, but why would someone risk going to court and have his reputation utterly ruined by lying?

Not to mention he believes in ayurveda. Far be it from me to judge the personal spiritual beliefs of others, but ayurveda isn't just spirituality, it's a medical doctrine. It's nothing short of screwed up that someone responsible for the health, safety and performance of give-or-take 20 players actually believes in unscientific quack medicine that he probably doesn't bat an eye on having used on his players. If there's any sense left in society, such a person forfeits the right to practice his job and has his coaching license torn apart.

He embodies the currently popular fake-it-till-you-make-it culture, just like Elizabeth Holmes and Sam Bankman-Fried.
Click to expand...
:lol: Your only ever post, too. My only wish in life is to have my positive energy at levels one-tenth as strong as your hating levels.
 

Scandi Red

Hates Music.
Joined
Sep 25, 2022
Messages
4,746
Pyrite said:
Tuchel's problem is simply that his entire career is a lie.
Click to expand...
Pyrite said:
He coasted on these guys' talent and hard work throughout his entire career, shamelessly stealing credit from them like Gilderoy Lockhart from Harry Potter. And since he's a charismatic extrovert with a silver tongue, he knew how to compile their ideas into cool soundbytes to parrot the content to sound like a dashing genius instead of the utter fraud he is.
Click to expand...
Pyrite said:
Being a man of limited ability and intelligence
Click to expand...
Pyrite said:
Not only that, but he's also morally bankrupt.
Click to expand...
:lol:
 
Last edited:

Gator Nate

Full Member
Joined
Jan 15, 2019
Messages
2,154
Location
Orlando, FL
Pyrite said:
Tuchel's problem is simply that his entire career is a lie.

In his previous clubs, he appeared to be a good tactician, but he had two important factors on his side that made him look way better than he actually is:

Field generals on the pitch: At Dortmund, he had Hummels and Gündogan. In PSG, he was lucky to have Verratti, Neymar and Thiago Silva. Same with Chelsea, where he benefitted from Silva (again), Azpilicueta, Jorginho AND Kanté. Some of them were amazing passers/creators and some were great defensively, but they all shared an extremely high level of football IQ and leadership qualities. They could coach their teammates without requiring Tuchel to micromanage them or come up with highly sophisticated tactics. At Bayern, Müller and de Ligt are the closest thing to field generals, but the former is too old and slow while not being "silky" enough as far as Tuchel is concerned, while de Ligt is also "too slow" and pretty injury prone.

Benjamin Weber: Believe it or not, this guy was the real brains behind Tuchel, even more so than his field generals. Just think about Tuchel's apparent greatest strengths: he was very flexible and reacted pretty quickly to what was happening on the pitch; moreover, his game plans/preparations in big games were usually extremely successful. Statisticians and video analysts have something to do with them, don't they? Fittingly enough, Benjamin Weber was his video analyst starting from his Mainz career all the way until he got sacked by Chelsea.

He coasted on these guys' talent and hard work throughout his entire career, shamelessly stealing credit from them like Gilderoy Lockhart from Harry Potter. And since he's a charismatic extrovert with a silver tongue, he knew how to compile their ideas into cool soundbytes to parrot the content to sound like a dashing genius instead of the utter fraud he is. That's why he still enjoys the reputation of being a highly intelligent and competent coach in footballing circles.

Being a man of limited ability and intelligence, he doesn't like it when he's called out on his BS either. Back in Dortmund, he ran the highly data-driven scout Sven Mislintat out of town because he found his scouting methods too technocratic. Mislintat made heavy use of stats and data when scouting players while Tuchel was in favor of divining their attitude from their video footages. Guess whose methods are better? Mislintat's work at Stuttgart, a club infamous for being a hopeless case, is finally getting results, with talented players bought for reasonable prices being coached by a talented manager. On the other hand, Tuchel almost always wants one-dimensional physical beasts, pace/flair merchants or mediocre old players just because they're "experienced".

At Bayern, he has Müller and de Ligt, but he prefers physically more gifted players than them, and doesn't appreciate their intelligence and opinionated personalities. That's why he always loses the respect of his players soon, because he's highly dependent on field generals to succeed, but it's only a matter of time before he's called out on his incompetence and stupidity by them.

Not only that, but he's also morally bankrupt. Back in Dortmund, he actually did want to play the Monaco tie right after the bus attack, but he then turned out and claimed he didn't but Watzke forced his hand to play the tie to save his own ass and paint Watzke as a monster at the same time. He even said "Am I supposed to beat Bayern with these wimps?" all the while being the biggest wimp of all by throwing others under the bus for his own misdeeds. Sure, Pit Gottschalk isn't known as a pillar of accurate reporting, but why would someone risk going to court and have his reputation utterly ruined by lying?

Not to mention he believes in ayurveda. Far be it from me to judge the personal spiritual beliefs of others, but ayurveda isn't just spirituality, it's a medical doctrine. It's nothing short of screwed up that someone responsible for the health, safety and performance of give-or-take 20 players actually believes in unscientific quack medicine that he probably doesn't bat an eye on having used on his players. If there's any sense left in society, such a person forfeits the right to practice his job and has his coaching license torn apart.

He embodies the currently popular fake-it-till-you-make-it culture, just like Elizabeth Holmes and Sam Bankman-Fried.
Click to expand...
Fool's Gold.
 

Robbie Boy

Full Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2010
Messages
28,202
Location
Dublin
Pyrite said:
Tuchel's problem is simply that his entire career is a lie.

In his previous clubs, he appeared to be a good tactician, but he had two important factors on his side that made him look way better than he actually is:

Field generals on the pitch: At Dortmund, he had Hummels and Gündogan. In PSG, he was lucky to have Verratti, Neymar and Thiago Silva. Same with Chelsea, where he benefitted from Silva (again), Azpilicueta, Jorginho AND Kanté. Some of them were amazing passers/creators and some were great defensively, but they all shared an extremely high level of football IQ and leadership qualities. They could coach their teammates without requiring Tuchel to micromanage them or come up with highly sophisticated tactics. At Bayern, Müller and de Ligt are the closest thing to field generals, but the former is too old and slow while not being "silky" enough as far as Tuchel is concerned, while de Ligt is also "too slow" and pretty injury prone.

Benjamin Weber: Believe it or not, this guy was the real brains behind Tuchel, even more so than his field generals. Just think about Tuchel's apparent greatest strengths: he was very flexible and reacted pretty quickly to what was happening on the pitch; moreover, his game plans/preparations in big games were usually extremely successful. Statisticians and video analysts have something to do with them, don't they? Fittingly enough, Benjamin Weber was his video analyst starting from his Mainz career all the way until he got sacked by Chelsea.

He coasted on these guys' talent and hard work throughout his entire career, shamelessly stealing credit from them like Gilderoy Lockhart from Harry Potter. And since he's a charismatic extrovert with a silver tongue, he knew how to compile their ideas into cool soundbytes to parrot the content to sound like a dashing genius instead of the utter fraud he is. That's why he still enjoys the reputation of being a highly intelligent and competent coach in footballing circles.

Being a man of limited ability and intelligence, he doesn't like it when he's called out on his BS either. Back in Dortmund, he ran the highly data-driven scout Sven Mislintat out of town because he found his scouting methods too technocratic. Mislintat made heavy use of stats and data when scouting players while Tuchel was in favor of divining their attitude from their video footages. Guess whose methods are better? Mislintat's work at Stuttgart, a club infamous for being a hopeless case, is finally getting results, with talented players bought for reasonable prices being coached by a talented manager. On the other hand, Tuchel almost always wants one-dimensional physical beasts, pace/flair merchants or mediocre old players just because they're "experienced".

At Bayern, he has Müller and de Ligt, but he prefers physically more gifted players than them, and doesn't appreciate their intelligence and opinionated personalities. That's why he always loses the respect of his players soon, because he's highly dependent on field generals to succeed, but it's only a matter of time before he's called out on his incompetence and stupidity by them.

Not only that, but he's also morally bankrupt. Back in Dortmund, he actually did want to play the Monaco tie right after the bus attack, but he then turned out and claimed he didn't but Watzke forced his hand to play the tie to save his own ass and paint Watzke as a monster at the same time. He even said "Am I supposed to beat Bayern with these wimps?" all the while being the biggest wimp of all by throwing others under the bus for his own misdeeds. Sure, Pit Gottschalk isn't known as a pillar of accurate reporting, but why would someone risk going to court and have his reputation utterly ruined by lying?

Not to mention he believes in ayurveda. Far be it from me to judge the personal spiritual beliefs of others, but ayurveda isn't just spirituality, it's a medical doctrine. It's nothing short of screwed up that someone responsible for the health, safety and performance of give-or-take 20 players actually believes in unscientific quack medicine that he probably doesn't bat an eye on having used on his players. If there's any sense left in society, such a person forfeits the right to practice his job and has his coaching license torn apart.

He embodies the currently popular fake-it-till-you-make-it culture, just like Elizabeth Holmes and Sam Bankman-Fried.
Click to expand...
This post is glorious.
 

ThierryHenry14

Full Member
Joined
Dec 30, 2015
Messages
4,202
Supports
Arsenal
I can't see him go back to Chelsea. In EPL other than Liverpool, potentially West ham and Newcastle may be in the market for a new head coach as well.
 

Pyrite

New Member
Newbie
Joined
Feb 26, 2024
Messages
15
Dr Foo said:
Did he actually use Ayurveda on his players or just himself? And this is a plus in my book. Different cultures have developed their own methods of medicine over centuries, even if some aspects are not scientifically proven in the west, they have been proven to work on their people and cultures, e.g Ayurveda or TCM.
Click to expand...
Some stuff works, but only by fluke or through the placebo effect. If something works, it just gets incorporated into "conventional" medicine sooner or later, but I just take issue with injecting metaphysics into medicine and expecting it to be a staple of it.
Do you count yoga as scientifically proven? Might be useful to keep an open mind, though going by your tone, these details don’t matter other than to nail your target
Click to expand...
I don't mind yoga in itself. Some people spiritually believe in it, some people do it for physical exercise and to improve their flexibility, and some do it to meditate and practice mindfulness. All valid reasons, but when someone actually thinks it will treat their [insert serious disease here] or it should be a vital part of life, it becomes delusional.
 

Zehner

Football Statistics Dork
Joined
Mar 29, 2018
Messages
8,112
Location
Germany
Supports
Bayer 04 Leverkusen
UnitedSofa said:
Pure shithousery.

would be the ultimate dick move from Xabi. Wins Bundesliga for Bayer Leverkuse & then fecks off to Bayern :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Click to expand...
I think most Leverkusen fans would be okay with him going whereever he pleases if he overcomes our league curse. But Bayern would really hurt, not gonna lie. It would also be devastating for the league image. Bayern should never complain about the bad international revenues of the Bundesliga if they pull this off.

Anyway, I still don't believe it will happen. Initially, Sky proclaimed that Alonso to Bayern was 'probable' in their headline and then clarified that this is based on Bayern being optimistic while Alonso blocks every future talks because he wants to focus on the title race. Then, they published a list which clubs Alonso preferred with Liverpool first, Madrid second and Bayern third. This was followed up by a report that Alonso rules out Bayern because of the chaos at the club. Now suddenly, they again deem it likely that he goes there.

Meanwhile, Rolfes is still optimistic he stays and Leverkusen employees report that he is very enthusiastic about the squad planning for next year. They say Alonso doesn't conduct himself like somebody who is about to move at all.

Still see Madrid in the pole position personally.
 

GhastlyHun

Full Member
Joined
Dec 19, 2015
Messages
12,795
Location
Bavaria
Supports
Bayern München
Just put him in a taxi to munich right after your championship celebrations.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.