Another EtH masterstroke.
‘Successful’ scenarios for Summer ‘23
- Thread starter Jericholyte2
- Start date
A successful summer is completely different to a perfect one.
A success would be a 1st choice striker and midfielder to play next to Casemiro for me, maybe with the addition of cover to Casemiro.
Perfect would be to add a GK, RB, and youngish CB to the above, but all are secondary concerns depending on outgoing transfers.
A success would be a 1st choice striker and midfielder to play next to Casemiro for me, maybe with the addition of cover to Casemiro.
Perfect would be to add a GK, RB, and youngish CB to the above, but all are secondary concerns depending on outgoing transfers.
Come on now, he's beyond help. He's finished here.
No glazers
Signings of Casemiro/Martinez level impact at striker and centre mid.
Those signings alone could propel us to challengers at all levels.
Much easier said that done though.
Those signings alone could propel us to challengers at all levels.
Much easier said that done though.
The grass is always greener, but I think there is a risk we go from the frying pan into the fire.
You look around at how many other clubs are run, and we are not so badly off - ranging from Barcelona's unsustainable wage structure, City's FFP breaches, PSG's galactico strategy which managed to lose a 1 horse race, and Chelsea strategy of spending £50m on anything with a pulse.
The Glazers have run the club for their personal profit, as any owner is entitled to do until football club ownership rules are changed. I appreciate they have taken out dividends, and not invested enough into the infrastructure (the stadium, etc.), but they have been willing to pay lots of money on transfers, we just never had a good manager to take advantage of the situation. On this forum many fans have been happy with previous appointments such as Moyes, Mourinho, Van Gaal and Solskjaer, and it is only with hindsight that we can see they were bad appointments. Lots of people wanted Pochetinho instead of ETH as well. Now we have a world class manager, who was backed in the summer by the Glazers, and suddenly we are winning again.
Personally, I would much rather we focus on ensuring we have all the other parts in place, DOF, scouting network, management, playing staff, etc., as rich owners do not guarantee success.
If the Glazers stay, which is looking more likely now, with a sensible structure in place and a genius coach, we will continue winning.
New contract to Phil Jones. That’s all we need, don’t get blinded by this Osimhen chat.
In Phil we trust.
In Phil we trust.
Oshimen, quality midfielder. I’d sign sabitzer too to be honest, we need more depth in this area
I think if we with Raya if De Gea moves on then De Jong as first choice/Bennacer as back up choice and one of Osimhen or Kane then we’d most likely win the league next season if everyone else is on the level if this season or better yet improves.
Obviously if Qatar take us over and clear our loan debts and outstanding transfers balance then its a different story as we could then upgrade at right back and another left footed centre back as well.
If we could move on Henderson, Williams, Bailly, Jones, Tuanzebe, Maguire, Telles, VDB, Martial and Elanga we’d free up a lot of space as well as a few quid in transfer fees and wages saved for complete deadwood that can’t stay fit or simply aren’t good enough.
Obviously if Qatar take us over and clear our loan debts and outstanding transfers balance then its a different story as we could then upgrade at right back and another left footed centre back as well.
If we could move on Henderson, Williams, Bailly, Jones, Tuanzebe, Maguire, Telles, VDB, Martial and Elanga we’d free up a lot of space as well as a few quid in transfer fees and wages saved for complete deadwood that can’t stay fit or simply aren’t good enough.
Aside from needing to keep within the constraints of homegrown rule..I edited my post to add 1 more (McTominay) - so that makes it 16
Unless we're looking to win the U21 league, if a young player doesn't look like making it, he most likely won't make it. There is no point keeping him hoping he will be brilliant one day (may happen but most likely won't). None of the outgoing players have added much to the current season, and IMHO, can be compensated by adding better incoming players.
You can’t just dump half your squad and replace them all in one go, forest have proven that type of movement doesn’t work.
we will get 5 carefully thought about players,
1 cm that can cover Casemiro
1 cm that’s more b2b
1 striker
1 gk to compete with DeGea
1 CB to replace one of the chuckle brothers
IF we’re really lucky, perhaps a young CF that can take a few games here and there
shipping out the ones with no future would be the best thing ten hag can do.
get a taller centre back in as martinez is too short to play premier league football.
casemiro is now mid 30s, that means he’ll be 40 come summer. replacement please.
it’s only just struck me how french varane is. door.
cash in on rashford whilst he’s in a rich vein of form and get someone in like neymar who the kids like.
keep mctominay as we’ll be losing a homegrown player in rashford.
get a taller centre back in as martinez is too short to play premier league football.
casemiro is now mid 30s, that means he’ll be 40 come summer. replacement please.
it’s only just struck me how french varane is. door.
cash in on rashford whilst he’s in a rich vein of form and get someone in like neymar who the kids like.
keep mctominay as we’ll be losing a homegrown player in rashford.
I think getting rid of Martial in this scenario would be stupid considering he's probably got 0 resale value and we'd be right back to square one with only one striker.
But other than that, absolutely this is an unbelievable window.
I think the base case for "successful" would be addressing AT MINIMUM either ball carrying CM or elite striker, and at least two out of the following: CDM understudy, 3rd choice CB understudy, GK. So basically 3 signings minimum with one of the three being the CM/Striker big name signing and I'd be happy.
We should absolutely get rid of Martial this summer if we can if only to get rid of the wages. We are not going to get much for him in any circumstance and he will be in his last season. Just get new striker so we won't have only 1. Hopefully he can stay fit long enough for someone take him off us.
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Mctominay is not good enough.
I’d like to see cover in midfield … and I think we need a striker to complement Rashford. Martial is injured too much
feck De Jong, get Barella
Nah we'd be pretty sane and trimming down on mediocrity. He is not as good as Nicky butt, Sabitzer has already shown he is better and can take his squad place. Personally I feel he has to go.
Its going to be difficult to sign players especially if this ownership change thing keeps dragging on. If a new owner comes in then I'd be happy with just 3 transfers ie a STK, a DM and a MC.
If we got a quality striker, signed Sabitzer and tied Rashford down on a new deal, I’d consider it a success.
Success would be 3 new signings with 2 that can go straight into the starting 11- CM and a no. 9, possibly a CB or full back as cover.
We can blow the summer out of the water by signing Osimhen and Bellingham OR De Jong. A lot will depend on the new owners, as we know how the glazers operate after the team has qualified for champions league football.
We can blow the summer out of the water by signing Osimhen and Bellingham OR De Jong. A lot will depend on the new owners, as we know how the glazers operate after the team has qualified for champions league football.
Sabitzer is better then McT but he's hardly Roy Keane either. We've got too many players in their late 20s or in their 30s in CM. I'd say if we've got the money then let's make a clean up of all squad players in that position and let's add some young players there. Assuming that we've got money to burn then Declan Rice and Ruben Neves would do the trick.
Eurgh, literally the definition of setting cash on fire.
The entire point was that the OP said to buy Osimhen and ditch Martial, but doing so doesn't make sense if we aren't getting another striker.
Yes if we buy two strikers then Martial can leave, but only getting one you'd be stupid to get rid of him.
I agree with the incomings. 5 sounds like a good number.
On the outgoings, all the players I've listed are all on loan or have barely contributed anything to the performance all season. A few like Amad and Hannibal could make it big, but we've made this mistake in the past of holding on to players for too long and see them depreciate in value (Tuanzebe, Henderson, Perreria come to mind). Best time to sell them is right after a successful loan when their stock is up.
In:
- top striker
- top midfielder
- young backup defensive mid to Casemiro
- young backup defender
- keep Weghorst as a backup striker
- promote a few youngsters
Out:
- Maguire
- Tuanzebe
- McTominay
- Henderson
- Bailly
- Jones
- Williams
- Donny
- Martial
- Elanga
Not too unrealistic I think. Those outgoing transfers, only Maguire and McTominay have featured regularly this season honestly.
- top striker
- top midfielder
- young backup defensive mid to Casemiro
- young backup defender
- keep Weghorst as a backup striker
- promote a few youngsters
Out:
- Maguire
- Tuanzebe
- McTominay
- Henderson
- Bailly
- Jones
- Williams
- Donny
- Martial
- Elanga
Not too unrealistic I think. Those outgoing transfers, only Maguire and McTominay have featured regularly this season honestly.
Aka who do we need.
Just merge
Just merge
Whilst I agree Geebs, that's a Forest side in 13th. Prior to their recruitment I think they'd have been a ton of folks favourites to babk down, maybe bottom?
Still only 4 points above the drop mind you.
Id kind of go with a success would be EtHs primary targets are bought whoever they may be. We can wishlist all day long but its not likely we will fill every gap in the squad in the summer regardless of the clubs ownership (or maybe especially because of the clubs ownership).
Im fully expecting another FdJ pursuit but I dont see us buying Kane/Osiheim.
We should be offloading a ton though.
Martial, one of Lindleof/Maguire, Bailly, DvB, Telles amongst others.
If a decent offer comes in for McTominay Id take it and replace him with Sabitzer. Only thing is I can see Bayern playing hardball there.
Im fully expecting another FdJ pursuit but I dont see us buying Kane/Osiheim.
We should be offloading a ton though.
Martial, one of Lindleof/Maguire, Bailly, DvB, Telles amongst others.
If a decent offer comes in for McTominay Id take it and replace him with Sabitzer. Only thing is I can see Bayern playing hardball there.
There is obviously priority on a couple of positions like ST, CM and CB, and I'm sure we would be able to get some great quality players to fill those gaps.
Think one of the key things in enabling us to do this financially both for fees and wage bills, is to get rid of some of the current filler in the squad that are just not up to the standard we're aiming for, or those who clearly want to leave. There is no need to keep players like Phil Jones (as much as I like the guy) sitting in the backroom while paying him the wages of a first team player, or to subsidise loan moves to other teams if we are partially doing this at all (not sure on the latter, but stand by the point).
Think one of the key things in enabling us to do this financially both for fees and wage bills, is to get rid of some of the current filler in the squad that are just not up to the standard we're aiming for, or those who clearly want to leave. There is no need to keep players like Phil Jones (as much as I like the guy) sitting in the backroom while paying him the wages of a first team player, or to subsidise loan moves to other teams if we are partially doing this at all (not sure on the latter, but stand by the point).
2 signings are must sign and two 2 signings are optional. Not an big issue but it should be done in future.
Absolute priority is a proven, world class striker. And not any striker. Not a young striker with high potential (like Nkunku) or striker from weaker league who will need time to adapt (like Nunez or something). We need a striker who will come and bang goals from day one. So it is Osimhen or Kane basically.
Second priority is playmaking midfielder who goes straight into first 11. Or at least rotates with Eriksen. Also a transfer where we must not take any risk and pay whatever is needed for a player who ETH wants (De Jong or Bellingham).
Optional signings are right back (as competition for Dalot) and backup left defender.
And all that should be done before season starts.
If we do all this then it is nearly perfect summer.
For 100% success; we get rid all players (for decent fees) who are not good enough for ETH and his system; Maguire, AWB (depending on new rb), McT, Henderson, Williams, Tuanzebe, Telles.
And Qatari owners
Absolute priority is a proven, world class striker. And not any striker. Not a young striker with high potential (like Nkunku) or striker from weaker league who will need time to adapt (like Nunez or something). We need a striker who will come and bang goals from day one. So it is Osimhen or Kane basically.
Second priority is playmaking midfielder who goes straight into first 11. Or at least rotates with Eriksen. Also a transfer where we must not take any risk and pay whatever is needed for a player who ETH wants (De Jong or Bellingham).
Optional signings are right back (as competition for Dalot) and backup left defender.
And all that should be done before season starts.
If we do all this then it is nearly perfect summer.
For 100% success; we get rid all players (for decent fees) who are not good enough for ETH and his system; Maguire, AWB (depending on new rb), McT, Henderson, Williams, Tuanzebe, Telles.
And Qatari owners
6 of your 7 outgoings are British players. Need to be mindful of the requirements for the squad
Kane
Bellingham
Raya
Out
Maguire
McTominay
Chatty Patty keeper.
Give Me that big ear trophy
Bellingham
Raya
Out
Maguire
McTominay
Chatty Patty keeper.
Give Me that big ear trophy
IN:
1. Osi or Kane
2. FdJ or Sabitzer if cheap
3. WW - if cheap
4. young high potential DM as a Casemiro backup and potential long term replacement
5. new deal for DDG (can't afford a new top class GK and the choices above have higher priority
OUT:
Trash (Jones, Telles, Bailly, Tuanzebe, Elanga, Williams), VDB, Martial, the you know who, Maguire if he does not want to be 4th choice (but we need a replacement then - any decent young promising player)
Whatever happens with Amad and Pellistri if the points above are sorted it is a great summer.
1. Osi or Kane
2. FdJ or Sabitzer if cheap
3. WW - if cheap
4. young high potential DM as a Casemiro backup and potential long term replacement
5. new deal for DDG (can't afford a new top class GK and the choices above have higher priority
OUT:
Trash (Jones, Telles, Bailly, Tuanzebe, Elanga, Williams), VDB, Martial, the you know who, Maguire if he does not want to be 4th choice (but we need a replacement then - any decent young promising player)
Whatever happens with Amad and Pellistri if the points above are sorted it is a great summer.
Maybe swap Kane for Osimhen,the problem we may have is finding someone who fits the profile of De Jong because has unique skillset
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I don’t know enough about the market but we need
- Definitely a playmaking number 8
- Possibly a backup DM
- Defintely an attacking RB
- Definitely a number 9
- Possibly a cheap young replacement of Maguire
- Definitely a ball playing keeper
- Possibly a second choice CF if Martial goes
Also I don’t think we should rush to sign Sabitzer and Weighorts. They should have to prove beyond doubt that they’re good enough for a Pl winning squad. Sabitzer I’d say seems a good player but I want to see more genuinely excellent performances as he’ll cost a decent fee and midfield is vital going forward. Weighorts is a stop gap - I would not sign him.
Aside from that it’s crucial that the Glazers feck off
- Definitely a playmaking number 8
- Possibly a backup DM
- Defintely an attacking RB
- Definitely a number 9
- Possibly a cheap young replacement of Maguire
- Definitely a ball playing keeper
- Possibly a second choice CF if Martial goes
Also I don’t think we should rush to sign Sabitzer and Weighorts. They should have to prove beyond doubt that they’re good enough for a Pl winning squad. Sabitzer I’d say seems a good player but I want to see more genuinely excellent performances as he’ll cost a decent fee and midfield is vital going forward. Weighorts is a stop gap - I would not sign him.
Aside from that it’s crucial that the Glazers feck off
I can't see us signing 3 midfielders in the summer if you see him as a rotational option
Backup DM
CM partner for Casa
Sabitzer
Only way it could happen is IF we manage to sell Donny & Scott this summer.
In regards to a top striker Kane is proven but despite the cost still intrigued what Erik's coaching could get out of Osimhen.
Struggling to come up with names for rotational CB but we could definitely do with one.
That is why we must buy Kane and Jude then
Same for me, but I definitely think we need a backup DM.
That's 7 guys, though, so we're probably not doing that. So where can we wait a year?
-Keeper, I trust Heaton as a #2 and De Gea will start. Maybe we sign a young #2 and loan them out or keep them here as #2
-#2 striker, we can sign up Weghorst on a 2+1 on not crazy wages and just sell him in 2024
-Attacking RB, I would say we could probably wait a year, though Wan-Bissaka has 2 years left (one plus option year) so selling him now that he's regained some value and buying an attacking RB makes sense
So, like this I guess, just plugging in some names that seem plausible, not saying I do or don't rate them:
2024:
Ramos - #9
De Jong or Sabitzer or other guy - #8
(Midtable guy) - Backup DM
Frimpong - Attacking RB
Lacroix - RCB
Weghorst stays - Backup #9
So, that would be 2 big buys, a #9 and #8, then Frimpong, the RCB and DM would all be like 20-30M.
Maguire, McTominay, Martial, Jones, Telles, Bailly, Tuanzebe, Williams and Pellistri all sold, and loans for Elanga, Alvaro, Iqbal, Hannibal. Amad comes back. Mainoo stays as he's too young to leave and can get some cup minutes here and play for the U-21 now that Ten Hag has overhauled how we teach mids since he didn't rate Garner and can't be impressed with anything but McTominay's physical qualities as given by god and not his sense of how to play midfield as taught by Manchester United.
The thing which worries me a lot is that we have biggest summer ahead in a while. We need to do 10 transfers (in and out). Also as this season proved, it is very important that those transfers are done in time.
I don't think that Murtough has ability to do all that.
I don't think that Murtough has ability to do all that.